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mark1447

New York City mayor wants to ban Styrofoam

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I'd quite honestly like to see it happen. Styrofoam is a non-biodegradable product and unless someone can create a cheap, safe and biodegradable type of foam, I think this ban would be good for the environment.

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I'd quite honestly like to see it happen. Styrofoam is a non-biodegradable product and unless someone can create a cheap, safe and biodegradable type of foam, I think this ban would be good for the environment.

You are correct. That environment is in despair and with styrafoam that doesnt biodegrade, it is far worse. I remember one day almost a year ago I threw some styrafoam packaging outside and forgot to put it in the trash. If you look closely, especially around trees nearby, small styrafoam pellets are on the ground. They sit there, and wait for the day to be blown someplace else. That is just a fraction to this expansive and massive issue.

 

Styrafoam is thrown away too much. First of America is stubborn, admit it. America doesn't give a flying shit about recycling. Each year us Americans throw away 25,000,000,000 styrafoam cups, which will sit in a landfill and will never degrade for thousands of years. Look at the ratio of biodegrading to how much we throw away. At the current pace were moving at the world will be one big landfill in 100 years. Were on a steep decline that we must leave, the ban is a huge step torwards that exit.

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You know, Bloomberg could really take the first step by phasing out Styrofoam lunch trays in public schools...

That being said, Styrofoam does have its uses - it makes a really cheap impromptu building material :D For things like utensils, though, most styrofoam things should be replaced by paper versions.

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You know, Bloomberg could really take the first step by phasing out Styrofoam lunch trays in public schools...

 

That being said, Styrofoam does have its uses - it makes a really cheap impromptu building material :D For things like utensils, though, most styrofoam things should be replaced by paper versions.

You know what is also good to secure fragile packages, other than styrofoam, AIR. Air with some plastic around it is commonly used, and that plastic can go back to square one, where air is put back into it.

 

As for it being a cheap building material, you said yourself, they can be replaced by paper versions. The cheaper cost in dollars ends up costing our planet. Look at it, landfills in America contain approxamately 35% of styrofoam. That is ridiculous. The best solution would be to cut down on our consume-hungry side and look at reality. People need to stop consuming all this styrofoam and a ban would help that signifagantly.

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Air would definitely be a good packaging alternative. Just look at how well Nitrogen [N] or Argon (Ar) work with potato chips. The gas prevents foodborne bacteria from growing and also cushions chips from smashing.

 

Cornstarch packing peanuts, which are biodegradable and not a choke hazard (they would just dissolve in the mouth(, would also be a great replacement for styrofoam packing peanuts. If more Americans begin resisting against GMO corn, then at least all that genetically modified corn could be made into packing peanuts...

Edited by YankeesPwnMets
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Next thing you know pulling fat wedges in public may become a punishable offense enforced by means of fines. I'm sure Dictator BloombergTM would make a killing in revenue establishing something like that. Let me not jinx it he might actually see this post and establish the new rule for the lutz.

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Adolf Bloomberg, Food Nazi at it again.

Edited by rr4567
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In NYC, you reap what you sow.  Is anyone else surprised that this nonsense is even seeing the light of day there?

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Pretty much. This is what the majority of NYC among the upper and lower middle class wanted and now they are paying the consequences for such a move at the polls. You made your bed now lie in it.

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You know what is also good to secure fragile packages, other than styrofoam, AIR. Air with some plastic around it is commonly used, and that plastic can go back to square one, where air is put back into it.

 

As for it being a cheap building material, you said yourself, they can be replaced by paper versions. The cheaper cost in dollars ends up costing our planet. Look at it, landfills in America contain approxamately 35% of styrofoam. That is ridiculous. The best solution would be to cut down on our consume-hungry side and look at reality. People need to stop consuming all this styrofoam and a ban would help that signifagantly.

 

I meant as an actual construction material - it comes in handy when you need to build something temporary really, really quickly and all you have is a drill and a styrofoam block. I don't know if they sell paper pulp or something similar in block form...

 

My point was that if Bloomberg really cared, he could phase out use of styrofoam in agencies that he has direct control over, rather than forcing it onto all of us immediately and acting like his s**t don't stink. At the very least, it should turn out better than the other changes to the school lunch program he made (school lunches were apparently in violation of a 550 calorie minimum imposed by the feds, and before someone here starts going on and on about kids being fat, the purpose of the lunch program is to feed starving children, many of whom still exist in this day and age.)

 

Bloomberg and the Chancellor should be forced to lunch on the inedible school lunches they force on kids citywide, but that's another story for another time.

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Next thing you know pulling fat wedges in public may become a punishable offense enforced by means of fines. I'm sure Dictator BloombergTM would make a killing in revenue establishing something like that. Let me not jinx it he might actually see this post and establish the new rule for the lutz.

 

Dictator... huh? Have actually seen a dictator ship? For example, look at the old Libya. If you don't like it, you are allowed to speak against, unlike North Korea and the many other corrupt democracies.

 

 

No offense, but by your logic, any place where a governor, mayor, etc. says something or wants to implement something is a democracy.

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Dictator... huh? Have actually seen a dictator ship? For example, look at the old Libya. If you don't like it, you are allowed to speak against, unlike North Korea and the many other corrupt democracies.

 

Yes. Right here in the states. The rich get's richer and the poor becomes poorer. Fun fact: President Bush Sr. signed the PATRIOT ACT into office which was a fundamental violation of human rights. With that bill signed intooffice, the US authorities can instill martial law on the nation if they wanted to, or inprison people without a trial. Hmmm sounds like tactics Stalin would use does'nt it? Thank goodness that has'nt happened as of yet.......

 

Lets not forget other issues such as the unlawful incarceration of the Japanese in WW2, the disaproprtionate incarceration of blacks in prisons, police brutality and racial profiling, the bloodshed of millions of civilians the military has caused in its wars, black aparthied in the 20th century and many other examples such as media misinformation to this day. Tell tale signs that we are having problems in this country.

 

Now to get back to the point Mr. Quill, that was a figure of speech. Don't take it to heart. I'm going to speak my mind and if some disagree then so be it, it's not my problem.

Edited by realizm

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Nothing's wrong on this end. Yes some of the "smart" men up there can be corrupt, and biased to the rich, but that's another story.

 

Were talking about something that doesn't biodegrade and sits all over NYC sidewalks and streets as little pellets. I don't think that makes much sense. A ban would stop this city-wide eyesore.

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Nothing's wrong on this end. Yes some of the "smart" men up there can be corrupt, and biased to the rich, but that's another story.

 

Indeed my friend. +1.

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Dictator... huh? Have actually seen a dictator ship? For example, look at the old Libya. If you don't like it, you are allowed to speak against, unlike North Korea and the many other corrupt democracies.

 

People who call Bloomberg a "dictator" really have no idea what a real dictator is. Dictators throw people into jail without trails, oppress and slaughter minorities, and tend to have a cult of personality based on themselves. Bloomberg has done nothing like this. The sole fact that Bloomberg has supported things like same-sex marriage shows how much of a dictator he is.

 

And he is not.

 

Yes. Right here in the states. The rich get's richer and the poor becomes poorer. Fun fact: President Bush Sr. signed the PATRIOT ACT into office which was a fundamental violation of human rights. With that bill signed inot office, the US authorities can instill martial law on the nation if they wanted to, or inprison people without a trial. Hmmm sounds like tactics Stalin would use does'nt it? Thank goodness that has'nt happened as of yet.......

 

Now to get back to the point Mr. Quill, that was a figure of speech. Don't take it to heart. I'm going to speak my mind and if some disagree then so be it, it's not my problem.

 

I may not exactly agree with Bloomberg with some things, or that much, like the education reforms (my teachers always griped about that). But dictator he is not, and there's no justification for calling him that.

 

Fun Fact: Bloomberg is not the first mayor to propose a ban on styroam. Ed Koch, another 3-term mayor, did the same in '87:

 

http://www.nytimes.com/1987/12/30/nyregion/koch-faults-mcdonald-s-packaging.html

 

 

Koch Faults McDonald's Packaging
By MICHEL MARRIOTT

Published: December 30, 1987

Mayor Koch, citing concern over the environment, announced a drive yesterday against one of the most familiar of packaging materials, polystyrene foam.

He singled out the fast-food giant, the McDonald's Corporation, as one of the biggest users of the substance.

''I'm asking McDonald's to give us a break today and discontinue its use of polystyrene foam,'' he said.

''These products have only a very short span of usefulness yet remain with us in nondegradable form for hundreds of years,'' he said at a City Hall news conference. Threat to Earth's Atmosphere

In doing so, the Mayor joined a campaign mounted by New York State consumer officials and several localities around the nation that are worried about dwindling landfill space. Berkeley, Calif., and Suffolk County in New York are considering banning the use of some plastic packaging by fast-food restaurants. The City of Seattle is seeking a broader change, calling for a statewide ban in Washington on nonrecyclable material.

Environmentalists say polystyrene foam, which is usually produced with a gas called chlorofluorocarbon, or CFC, is breaking down the earth's protective ozone layer and is partly responsible for a global warming trend that is gradually raising ocean levels.

The Mayor said he had taken steps to halt the city's purchasing of polystyrene foam materials.

City schools and the Department of Corrections, for example, buy large amounts of the material, commonly referred to by the trade name Styrofoam. No Suitable Substitutes

The Mayor pointed out that a McDonald's competitor, Burger King, packs its foods in biodegradable paper cartons.

Richard Christian, a regional vice president for McDonald's in New York City, said that the company was willing to explore alternative methods of packaging its foods, but that it was not now considering abandoning the use of polystyrene foams.

He said the containers provide the best quality of service to McDonald's customers. No suitable substitutes have been found, he said.

McDonald's, after intense national pressure from environmental groups, announced last August that it would begin phasing out polystyrene foam that includes chlorofluorocarbons, which are the agents believed to deplete ozone. Berkeley, Calif., has already passed a measure banning fast-food containers containing the substance, effective Jan. 31, but is considering a broader measure. No 'Meaningful Impact'

Richard M. Kessel, executive director of the State Consumer Protection Board, acknowledged that McDonald's had been phasing out containers made with CFC, but added ''that they still have Styrofoam that does have them.'' He added, ''We want that eliminated immediately.''

Additionally, polystyrene foam products present a disposal problem because they do not compress well in landfills and resist breaking down like paper products do, said Sanitation Commissioner Brendan Sexton.

As for landfill problems, ''plastics account for less than one percent of the total garbage waste,'' Mr. Christian said.

 

Sure, go ahead and dump on Koch(RIP) like you're doing on "Fuhrer" Bloomberg. 

Edited by GojiMet86
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People who call Bloomberg a "dictator" really have no idea what a real dictator is. Dictators throw people into jail without trails, oppress and slaughter minorities, and tend to have a cult of personality based on themselves. Bloomberg has done nothing like this. The sole fact that Bloomberg has supported things like same-sex marriage shows how much of a dictator he is.

 

 

 

 

I may exactly agree with Bloomberg with some things, or that much, like the education reforms (my teachers always griped about that). But dictator he is not, and there's no justification for calling him that.

Wait a minute.... The teachers have an absolute right to gripe about that!

 

So if I may ask.... it's OK to have hard working teachers fired by means of attrition? What?  Did I hear this correctly? With no way to dispute the unjustifiable firing of such dedicated teachers in such a manner? With no teacher's union (The UFT who are dragging their feet on this) to back them up? Ask me is that ethically right on Bloomberg's part? Is'nt it really the educrats on top in the NYDOE that is misallocating appropriate funds that placed the NYDOE in a deficit in the first place? Why in the world is it that the teachers who actually care for their students have to take the hit? Is that fair?

 

The Coalition for the Homeless is starting a petition because Bloomberg had set a mandate to turn away needy families from appropriate housing back into dangerously cold weather. Is that right GojiMet?

 

So going back to the styrofoam issue, yes of course I realize it is harmful to the enviorment. I took 3 chemistry classes towards my major. I know how destructive it can be to the enviorment. I also realize that Bloomberg is trying to invent new civil violations to create more revenue by collecting fines that goes back to the city with these bans on a plethora of things.  I strongly believe that is his real intentions, not for the sake of the enviorment in itself.

 

Bloomberg caters to the elite. The negative reactions from the public shows and it speaks volumes.

 

Sure, go ahead and dump on Koch(RIP) like you're doing on "Fuhrer" Bloomberg. 

 Beyond ridiculous. Don't insinuate that I have qualms about Koch, don't you dare. I had nothing but praise for Koch, if you would read my previous posts from a related thread on a similar subject.

 

 

I liken him to the late Ed Koch, another great mayor that despite certain scandals that can be overlooked did alot for this city, setting the standards for successors such as the late Mayor Dinkens who IMHO did have that same attitude albeit with mistakes too. He also did what he had to do, tirelessly wotking with the needs with the lower middle class. Big time contrast to Bloomberg.

Edited by realizm

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Wait a minute.... The teachers have an absolute right to gripe about that!

 

So if I may ask.... it's OK to have hard working teachers fired by means of attrition? What?  Did I hear this correctly? With no way to dispute the unjustifiable firing of such dedicated teachers in such a manner? With no teacher's union (The UFT who are dragging their feet on this) to back them up? Ask me is that ethically right on Bloomberg's part? Is'nt it really the educrats on top in the NYDOE that is misallocating appropriate funds that placed the NYDOE in a deficit in the first place? Why in the world is it that the teachers who actually care for their students have to take the hit? Is that fair?

 

The Coalition for the Homeless is starting a petition because Bloomberg had set a mandate to turn away needy families from appropriate housing back into dangerously cold weather. Is that right GojiMet?

 

So going back to the styrofoam issue, yes of course I realize it is harmful to the enviorment. I took 3 chemistry classes towards my major. I know how destructive it can be to the enviorment. I also realize that Bloomberg is trying to invent new civil violations to create more revenue by collecting fines that goes back to the city with these bans on a plethora of things.  I strongly believe that is his real intentions, not for the sake of the enviorment in itself.

 

Bloomberg caters to the elite. The negative reactions from the public shows and it speaks volumes.

 

 

 Beyond ridiculous. Don't insinuate that I have qualms about Koch, don't you dare. I had nothing but praise for Koch, if you would read my previous posts from a related thread on a similar subject.

 

I meant to write "I may not agree exactly with Bloomberg with some things" etc. Too hasty on my part. Post edited to reflect that. Of course "I may agree" does not make sense when the thing following is "My teachers griped about it".

 

So why is Bloomberg's plan for styrofoam a way to get more violations, but not Koch's? As far as I'm concerned, Bloomberg is just as sincere as Koch on environmental concerns. And if Bloomberg created these bans for gov't revenue, then so would Koch.

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Those +1's was in error GojiMet. Obviously I dont agree with your attitude. So you're condoning Bloomber's actions against hard working civil servants particularly in  the DOE? I would think that a downvote would ensue an explaination. Answer my question instead of dodging as a debate tatic.

 

Let's throw in the turning away of needy families. So it's OK too? I guess so as it reflects in your posts.



I meant to write "I may not agree exactly with Bloomberg with some things" etc. Too hasty on my part. Post edited to reflect that. Of course "I may agree" does not make sense when the thing following is "My teachers griped about it".

 

And that's my point. Don't twist my words.

Edited by realizm

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Those +1's was in error GojiMet. Obviously I dont agree with your attitude. So you're condoning Bloomber's actions against hard working civil servants particularly in  the DOE? I would think that a downvote would ensue an explaination. Answer my question instead of dodging as a debate tatic.

 

And I don't agree with that "Fuhrer" Bloomberg attitude of yours, hence the downvote. The fact that people here seem content abouthaving obesity and a polluted environment, and are willing to go to the extreme lengths of calling this liberal mayor a "dictator"(figurative or not) because they can't take care of themselves or the environment is concerning.

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And I don't agree with that "Fuhrer" Bloomberg attitude of yours, hence the downvote. The fact that people here seem content abouthaving obesity and a polluted environment, and are willing to go to the extreme lengths of calling this liberal mayor a "dictator"(figurative or not) because they can't take care of themselves or the environment is concerning.

 

Perhaps many who are poor cannot take care of themselves because they are in poverty and don't have the financial resources or needed help to get themselves back on their feet.

 

Another fun fact for you: He violated a court order to allow Occupy protesters to return to the parks to protest against the problems with this economy. And therefore instigated police britality against such protestors who was voicing out in a peceful manner. Did'nt this happen before during the days of apartheid and Vietnam with other such authorities?

 

It's not that I don't like you of course, and that I can respect your viewpoint, it's just that I don't appreciate the fact that I don't like your disrespect for my right to share my viewpoints. There's a way to speak constructively. Care to respond?

 

Oh yes, I'm still waiting on your view on the attrition of our hard working teachers. So well, what is your POV on that one? What about the turning away of the homeless? Care to edify me with your opinions on this?

Edited by realizm

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I will not share my opinions on those issues, because the issue at hand is whether or not a ban on styrofoams should be allowed, and I proudly say yes, it should be allowed.

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I will not share my opinions on those issues, because the issue at hand is whether or not a ban on styrofoams should be allowed, and I proudly say yes, it should be allowed.

 

Right. I would imagine it is on topic since we are discussing the Mayor's current policies.

 

But OK we can agree to disagree. But just keep in mind I am not jaded like the masses. I am not easily fooled by misinformation and propaganda. Which is why that even as it is indeed in itself a good move to ban styrofoam just as it was a good move to ban asbestos I distrust his intentions. Is he genuinely concerned about the enviorment or for people's health? Or are these nothing but power moves to apease his supporters like all polititions do?

 

Good job in sidetracking my message about the corrupt nature of the Bloomberg administration BTW. You refused to own up to my factual information on the mistakes Mr. Bloomberg has made. Have a nice day.

Edited by realizm

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No, this actually is a good ban. Styrofoam is not biodegradable meaning that it does not just rot away. Also a lot of it winds up in our oceans and landfills, which are near capacity, harming the animals in the local ecosystem because it is slightly toxic. For humans on the other hand Styrofoam is believed to be a carcinogen.*  Something should be done about a lot of the crap that is going into the trash don't you think? 

It is not a good ban, i just think people should stop littering and throwing styrofoams in the air just like my neighbors, banning styrofoams could damage the delivery packages that are delicate such as Computers, Laptops, Game Systems, Gadgets, Antiques, and other expensive examples.

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Dictator... huh? Have actually seen a dictator ship? For example, look at the old Libya. If you don't like it, you are allowed to speak against, unlike North Korea and the many other corrupt democracies.

 

 

No offense, but by your logic, any place where a governor, mayor, etc. says something or wants to implement something is a democracy.

Just a side note: democracy works only with the full participation of every individual. We as a nation have become very lazy and the barrier to entry into a position of influence is just so damn high, no one bothers. We just vote for the same old. Few powerful political influences, few powerful corporations make for a very bad democracy.

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Dictator... huh? Have actually seen a dictator ship? For example, look at the old Libya. If you don't like it, you are allowed to speak against, unlike North Korea and the many other corrupt democracies.

 

 

No offense, but by your logic, any place where a governor, mayor, etc. says something or wants to implement something is a democracy.

Consider this: If he's not a dictator then why did he increase the term limit to 3 just to bring it back down to 2 right after he got into office? What other mayor has something built anyway when nearly everyone said no? (<pedestrian plazas) What other mayor do you know that wants to ban sodas over 16oz in restaurants?* Smells like a potential dictator to me.

 

(*Not counting Washington D.C., because they're just a bunch of pussy followers anyway)

 

We may be able to speak against it, but that's doing shit all if they don't listen and just carry on anyway.

Edited by rr4567
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