Fare-beaters are feeling the burn after crackdown on local bus service begins

[qjtransitmaster]

Mostly always? Very questionable...

dude just stop.

[Culver]

Keep in mind that hiring tons of new Eagle Team members would cost a lot of money in salary and benefits. I wonder how many tickets they need to write per day just to break even. Now if they wanted to flood the system to change the mentality of the riding public, it could be like a long term investment, but trying to change the habits of NEw Yorkers is a tough, tough job. 

Flood it and change the mentality. I want people to know that there is no such thing as a free ride.

[QM1to6Ave]

Flood it and change the mentality. I want people to know that there is no such thing as a free ride.

Lol. People will never learn that--some people think they are entitled to get everything handed to them 

[qjtransitmaster]

Mostly always? Very questionable...

I have unlimited metrocard so I have my fare ready. However some times rarely my card would eff up so the B/Os would let me on as they know I usually always pay the fare what are you trying to say kid.

 

Lol. People will never learn that--some people think they are entitled to get everything handed to them 

smack em down HARD.

[Turbo19]

I have unlimited metrocard so I have my fare ready. However some times rarely my card would eff up so the B/Os would let me on as they know I usually always pay the fare what are you trying to say kid.

 

 

smack em down HARD.

I could respond to you with a post that will most likely ban me, but you aren't worth my time

 

Enjoy your night..

[qjtransitmaster]

I could respond to you with a post that will most likely ban me, but you aren't worth my time

 

Enjoy your night..

dude I am not trying to start a fight unlike you. you need to sometimes not waste my time or start shit for nothing.

[Grand Concourse]

Keep in mind that hiring tons of new Eagle Team members would cost a lot of money in salary and benefits. I wonder how many tickets they need to write per day just to break even. Now if they wanted to flood the system to change the mentality of the riding public, it could be like a long term investment, but trying to change the habits of NEw Yorkers is a tough, tough job. 

if they concentrate on a certain area, I'm sure eventually people will start to take the hint. It's that or the mta should just threaten to pull service in areas of hi fare evasion. If people don't want to pay for their ride, then they can take the unsafe dollar vans that hovers around the area. They deserve each other.

[qjtransitmaster]

if they concentrate on a certain area, I'm sure eventually people will start to take the hint. It's that or the mta should just threaten to pull service in areas of hi fare evasion. If people don't want to pay for their ride, then they can take the unsafe dollar vans that hovers around the area. They deserve each other.

Yeah not gonna lie MTA should try that. I wonder if the M35 would be a great first target?  LOL at bold.

[QM1to6Ave]

if they concentrate on a certain area, I'm sure eventually people will start to take the hint. It's that or the mta should just threaten to pull service in areas of hi fare evasion. If people don't want to pay for their ride, then they can take the unsafe dollar vans that hovers around the area. They deserve each other.

I like the idea of pulling service from these areas. That would save the most money, but so unlikely to happen for a variety of reasons, unfortunately. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

if they concentrate on a certain area, I'm sure eventually people will start to take the hint. It's that or the mta should just threaten to pull service in areas of hi fare evasion. If people don't want to pay for their ride, then they can take the unsafe dollar vans that hovers around the area. They deserve each other.

 

 

I like the idea of pulling service from these areas. That would save the most money, but so unlikely to happen for a variety of reasons, unfortunately. 

Careful now... I made that statement and I was called a racist and an elitist because most of the fare evasion happens in minority neighborhoods...    As if it's my fault that the farebeating happens in minority neighborhoods... I'm sorry but I stand by my statement... The areas with high farebeating should NOT have more service at the sake of other communities which is exactly what is happening because you have overnight service yanked in Gerritsen Beach while rampant farebeating goes on on a route like the B46 which other B46 riders have confirmed, but people will do anything to try to make the situation seem non problematic.   Now a route like the B41 could use better service along the Veterans Av branch and quite frankly could be better if not for a route like the B46 where so many people are stealing service, but it's not a problem and it's essentially okay that they're doing that... *Sarcasm* 

[B35 via Church]

Careful now... I made that statement and I was called a racist and an elitist because most of the fare evasion happens in minority neighborhoods...    As if it's my fault that the farebeating happens in minority neighborhoods... I'm sorry but I stand by my statement... The areas with high farebeating should NOT have more service at the sake of other communities which is exactly what is happening because you have overnight service yanked in Gerritsen Beach while rampant farebeating goes on on a route like the B46 which other B46 riders have confirmed, but people will do anything to try to make the situation seem non problematic.   Now a route like the B41 could use better service along the Veterans Av branch and quite frankly could be better if not for a route like the B46 where so many people are stealing service, but it's not a problem and it's essentially okay that they're doing that... *Sarcasm* 

You're being disingenuous here on a couple of fronts.... I'm only gonna point out the ones relevant to the topic.....

 

Who said it's your fault farebeating happens in minority neighborhoods....

Better yet, who said farebeating is not a problem on a route "like" the B46.....

 

I like the idea of pulling service from these areas. That would save the most money, but so unlikely to happen for a variety of reasons, unfortunately. 

I don't, because I don't see it stopping farebeating... At all.

 

if they concentrate on a certain area, I'm sure eventually people will start to take the hint. It's that or the mta should just threaten to pull service in areas of hi fare evasion. If people don't want to pay for their ride, then they can take the unsafe dollar vans that hovers around the area. They deserve each other.

I agree that the Eagle Team should concentrate on certain areas, I just don't agree that the MTA should threaten (or actually) pull service....

The people that don't pay can get around however they like (that includes taking dollar cabs), as long as it doesn't involve theft (carjackings, etc.) or theft of services.....

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You're being disingenuous here on a couple of fronts.... I'm only gonna point out the ones relevant to the topic.....

 

Who said it's your fault farebeating happens in minority neighborhoods....

Better yet, who said farebeating is not a problem on a route "like" the B46.....

It's been put out there before as if it isn't a problem, as if so many people are indeed paying the fare on that line, which is a flat out lie. You see I was the only one previously to make this argument before and so rather than put the blame on those who are stealing service, I get slammed, not that I'm surprised, but the reality is lines with high farebeating are costing the more because they don't have a clue as to how much additional service they are adding solely because people aren't paying and know they can simply hop on for a free ride.  I would even go one step further and say that if routes like the B46 had more fare enforcement that crowding wouldn't be as big of a problem as it is.

 

http://www.nyctransitforums.com/forums/topic/35015-brooklyn-bus-proposalsideas-thread/page-37?do=findComment&comment=540944

 

Here's an example... Less than half of the riders farebeat on the B46, as if that's supposed to be "normal"?? Are you kidding me?? On the one hand he claims the line has a high percentage of farebeaters, but in that same sentence he says LESS than half as if it isn't that big of a problem.... Even if that's 20  - 30% of the riders, the B46 is one of the busiest lines in the city, and the busiest in Brooklyn, so you can see how many riders 20 - 30% is when we're talking about a route that carries over 10 million riders a year... 15,360,359 to be exact in 2011, so twenty percent of 15,360,359 is 3,072,071 MILLION FOLKS STEALING SERVICE and 30% of that is 4,608,107 MILLION FOLKS STEALING SERVICE... Not exactly chump change... That's what some routes carry for a whole year and that money could be used to keep or restore quite a bit of service across the city rather than having it be used on one line.

[B35 via Church]

It's been put out there before as if it isn't a problem, as if so many people are indeed paying the fare on that line, which is a flat out lie. You see I was the only one previously to make this argument before and so rather than put the blame on those who are stealing service, I get slammed, not that I'm surprised, but the reality is lines with high farebeating are costing the more because they don't have a clue as to how much additional service they are adding solely because people aren't paying and know they can simply hop on for a free ride.  I would even go one step further and say that if routes like the B46 had more fare enforcement that crowding wouldn't be as big of a problem as it is.

 

http://www.nyctransitforums.com/forums/topic/35015-brooklyn-bus-proposalsideas-thread/page-37?do=findComment&comment=540944

 

Here's an example... Less than half of the riders farebeat on the B46, as if that's supposed to be "normal"?? Are you kidding me?? 

I'm not interested in your strawmanning... Considering how many paying riders even take the route, it would be silly to expect anything close to half that number of farebeating on that route... Hell, he even said "it does have a high fare-beat percentage".... So Threxx's statement isn't stating that farebeating isn't a problem.....

 

You implicitly said "now a route like the B41 could use better service along the Veterans Av branch and quite frankly could be better if not for a route like the B46 where so many people are stealing service, but it's not a problem and it's essentially okay that they're doing that..."

 

So again, show me the post where someone is saying farebeating is NOT a problem (or anything close to stating farebeating being essentially okay) on the B46....

 

 

On the one hand he claims the line has a high percentage of farebeaters, but in that same sentence he says

LESS than half as if it isn't that big of a problem.... Even if that's 20  - 30% of the riders, the B46 is one of the busiest lines

in the city, and the busiest in Brooklyn, so you can see how many riders 20 - 30% is when we're talking about a route that carries over 10 million riders a year...

He's not saying farebeating isn't a problem though..... He's not saying there aren't a lot of riders stealing service.....

Of course 20-30% of all the riders the route gets (that farebeats) isn't chump change...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'm not interested in your strawmanning... Considering how many paying riders even take the route, it would be silly to expect anything close to half that number of farebeating on that route... Hell, he even said "it does have a high fare-beat percentage".... So Threxx's statement isn't stating that farebeating isn't a problem.....

 

You implicitly said "now a route like the B41 could use better service along the Veterans Av branch and quite frankly could be better if not for a route like the B46 where so many people are stealing service, but it's not a problem and it's essentially okay that they're doing that..."

 

So again, show me the post where someone is saying farebeating is NOT a problem (or anything close to stating farebeating being essentially okay) on the B46....

I just did... The fact that in that same sentence he essentially tries to understate the problem by putting LESS in caps is the point.  On the one hand he's saying that farebeating is a problem, but downplaying the problem at the same time, essentially saying that it really isn't a problem or rather not that serious of a problem when in fact it is.  Like I said, even if it's 20 - 30% not paying that's still 3 - 4 MILLION riders NOT paying on ONE line every year.  Hardly a drop in the bucket.  Hell the fact that he says LESS than half is being generous because he could be implying that it's even more than 20 - 30 percent...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'm not interested in your strawmanning... Considering how many paying riders even take the route, it would be silly to expect anything close to half that number of farebeating on that route... Hell, he even said "it does have a high fare-beat percentage".... So Threxx's statement isn't stating that farebeating isn't a problem.....

 

You implicitly said "now a route like the B41 could use better service along the Veterans Av branch and quite frankly could be better if not for a route like the B46 where so many people are stealing service, but it's not a problem and it's essentially okay that they're doing that..."

 

So again, show me the post where someone is saying farebeating is NOT a problem (or anything close to stating farebeating being essentially okay) on the B46....

 

 

He's not saying farebeating isn't a problem though..... He's not saying there aren't a lot of riders stealing service.....

Of course 20-30% of all the riders the route gets (that farebeats) isn't chump change...

Oh please the way he downplays the problem he might as well be and you know it.  He put LESS in caps because he was doing just that... Trying to imply that the farebeating on the B46 isn't that big of a problem.  There's no "strawmanning" in that statement at all... Just me pointing out the utter BS of that post and you know it.

 

It's okay to pull service from routes where people pay though.... Folks have no problem with that because "they can take a cab" per Shortline Bus...   The hypocrisy is amazing, but not surprising.  Let's keep serving the needs of these farebeaters who are plentiful and cut service for those who are paying because their numbers aren't as big...

[B35 via Church]

Oh please the way he downplays the problem he might as well be and you know it.  He put LESS in caps because he was doing just that... Trying to imply that the farebeating on the B46 isn't that big of a problem.  There's no "strawmanning" in that statement at all... Just me pointing out the utter BS of that post and you know it.

 

It's okay to pull service from routes where people pay though.... Folks have no problem with that because "they can take a cab" per Shortline Bus...   The hypocrisy is amazing, but not surprising.  Let's keep serving the needs of these farebeaters who are plentiful and cut service for those who are paying because their numbers aren't as big...

You're strawmanning as we speak.... pulling service from routes where people pay? talking about someone bringing up taking cabs? This is about farebeating, try to stay on track here....

 

It's not my problem if you can't show & prove these people on here that are blatantly stating that farebeating is not a problem on the route & that it's essentially okay to do so.... Those were your words & you knew exactly what you were implicating when you made that point the way you did in that particular post.... Your pulling of Threxx's post to try to illustrate that point of yours was a very poor attempt at doing so.... Now you're backtracking & talking about (his illustration of) it not being that big of a problem & he's downplaying the problem.... Way I saw it, his capitalizing of the word half isn't portraying that he thinks farebeating is not a problem on the route...

 

Again, show me where anyone is saying that farebeating is not a problem on the B46.... You have yet to do so.

You can't do it, hence this latest reply coming from you....

 

Look, we're not saying farebeating isn't a problem on the route....

This is the problem it's looking like you're having with anyone that isn't seeing 100% eye to eye with you on this.....

[Grand Concourse]

My main point was to just threaten, whether or not the mta could actually stop running service in a certain area is another story. Point is people need a reminder that if they don't want to pay then they shouldn't act surprised if the mta were to say 'eff it' and say 'no more service for you'. Yes to some ppl it may seem like $2.50 is too much to ask for, but if they can find ways to get the latest Nike shoes, then they should be paying the fare.

 

So as expensive as it maybe to fund the eagle team, I do think it is worth it if it can change the mindset of people that they need to pay the fare or pay the fine.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You're strawmanning as we speak.... pulling service from routes where people pay? talking about someone bringing up taking cabs? This is about farebeating, try to stay on track here....

 

It's not my problem if you can't show & prove these people on here that are blatantly stating that farebeating is not a problem on the route & that it's essentially okay to do so.... Those were your words & you knew exactly what you were implicating when you made that point the way you did in that particular post.... Your pulling of Threxx's post to try to illustrate that point of yours was a very poor attempt at doing so.... Now you're backtracking & talking about (his illustration of) it not being that big of a problem & he's downplaying the problem.... Way I saw it, his capitalizing of the word half isn't portraying that he thinks farebeating is not a problem on the route...

 

Again, show me where anyone is saying that farebeating is not a problem on the B46.... You have yet to do so.

You can't do it, hence this latest reply coming from you....

 

Look, we're not saying farebeating isn't a problem on the route....

This is the problem it's looking like you're having with anyone that isn't seeing 100% eye to eye with you on this.....

Oh really? Then explain to me why he capitalized less then? As far as I'm concerned downplaying the issue is pretty much saying that the problem doesn't exist and that's my point.  I'm well on track on here... To elaborate on my point about Shortline's comment about routes losing service that don't have high ridership but are essential to the neighborhoods that they serve and folks on those routes being told to take car service, my point is if there's money to consider boosting overnight service on the B46, which is what some in here have said should happen, on a route with farebeating problems nevertheless, then there should be money on routes to provide overnight service on lines where people do pay but there isn't tons of ridership, esp. since we don't know how much of that B46 ridership is actually from legitimate people paying vs people beating the fare.  The way I see it, having a route that is crowded with people stealing the fare is just the same as the spending money on a route that doesn't have the greatest ridership.

 

My main point was to just threaten, whether or not the mta could actually stop running service in a certain area is another story. Point is people need a reminder that if they don't want to pay then they shouldn't act surprised if the mta were to say 'eff it' and say 'no more service for you'. Yes to some ppl it may seem like $2.50 is too much to ask for, but if they can find ways to get the latest Nike shoes, then they should be paying the fare.

 

So as expensive as it maybe to fund the eagle team, I do think it is worth it if it can change the mindset of people that they need to pay the fare or pay the fine.

I wouldn't outright pull all service from the line, but I would cut runs to send a message.  Service is NOT an entitlement and is NOT automatic though some folks seem to think that.

[B35 via Church]

Oh really? Then explain to me why he capitalized less then? As far as I'm concerned downplaying the issue is pretty much saying that the problem doesn't exist and that's my point.

Yeah, really....

 

...and Of course you're gonna equate the two because you can't point out the post where anyone have said farebeating is not a problem on the B46 - And that's my point.... Nobody's stance on here is one of "but it's not a problem and it's essentially okay that they're doing that"... Which is why that post of yours is disingenuous....

 

The word "HALF" was capitalized in regards to the total amount of riders that ride the B46 - compared to the amount of farebeaters there are on the route...Dude was making the point that the majority DO pay their fare, not that farebeating isn't a problem...  That comment of his was in response to your comment saying:

 

"If they cared so much about their service, then they'd pay for it instead of stealing it."

 

Now you tell me what you meant by that statement.... and don't try to lie & say you were solely referring to just the farebeaters on the B46 b/c you know that's a load of crap..... the farebeaters on the route aren't representative of all the riders that take the route (yet you wanna, for whatever reason, try to make like it is - and that much was apparent in the majority of your replies in that particular discussion)....

 

Again, we're not stating that farebeating is "not a problem" on the B46....

Not letting you off the hook with that deliberate & gross misrepresentation of the stance about farebeating on the B46 because you want to tie that into your point about other riders getting screwed.... As if the MTA puts as much service on the B46 just for farebeaters.....

 

Stop it.

 

 

My main point was to just threaten, whether or not the mta could actually stop running service in a certain area is another story. Point is people need a reminder that if they don't want to pay then they shouldn't act surprised if the mta were to say 'eff it' and say 'no more service for you'. Yes to some ppl it may seem like $2.50 is too much to ask for, but if they can find ways to get the latest Nike shoes, then they should be paying the fare.

 

So as expensive as it maybe to fund the eagle team, I do think it is worth it if it can change the mindset of people that they need to pay the fare or pay the fine.

To be fair, he's not saying stop running all service.... But regardless, I'm not seeing how cutting runs in any aspect is supposed to send the message to farebeaters that - Aye, you MF-ers are gonna stop farebeating one way or another....

 

Eagle team OTOH definitely sends that message....

 

Yeah, I made the point earlier about muggs finding money for whatever it is they want to possess.... I don't wanna hear someone talking about *where we 'posed to find money for that* when it comes down to paying the fine for getting caught farebeating......

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Of course you're gonna equate the two because you can't point out the post where anyone have said farebeating is not a problem on the B46 - And that's my point.... Nobody's stance on here is one of "but it's not a problem and it's essentially okay that they're doing that"... Which is why that post of yours is disingenuous....

 

The word "HALF" was capitalized in regards to the total amount of riders that ride the B46 - compared to the amount of farebeaters there are on the route...Dude was making the point that the majority DO pay their fare, not that farebeating isn't a problem...  That comment of his was in response to your comment saying:

 

"If they cared so much about their service, then they'd pay for it instead of stealing it."

 

Now you tell me what you meant by that statement.... and don't try to lie & say you were solely referring to just the farebeaters on the B46 b/c you know that's a load of crap..... the farebeaters on the route aren't representative of all the riders that take the route (yet you wanna, for whatever reason, try to make like it is - and that much was apparent in the majority of your replies in that particular discussion)....

 

Again, we're not stating that farebeating is "not a problem" on the B46.... Not letting you off the hook with that deliberate & gross misrepresentation of the stance....

Hmm... Well I'll give him that, but then to go on and say that the route should have more service is extremely troubling when the root of the problem on that line has not been addressed.  Like I said before, even with the majority of the riders paying their fare on that line (let's say that's the case since the doesn't seem to have a real clue about how many folks are stealing service, but it's evident that there's quite a bit of folks doing so), even with just 20% of those riders on the B46 stealing service, that's still 3 million riders NOT paying, which is an extremely high number, which is 7.5 MILLION dollars in lost revenue for the for one friggin' line not including any other operating costs!! That is insane!! That's enough lost revenue to probably provide service restorations for one or two routes, so yeah I have a problem with the notion of giving that line more service overnight, which was the original argument when that line is costing the MILLIONS of dollars in lost revenue to begin with with just with fare evasion alone.

 

Like I said 3 million in some cases is representative of the ridership of entire bus lines, so pardon me for reacting in a way in which the numbers seem so large with that quote of mine that you posted, because quite frankly they are.  

[B35 via Church]

Hmm... Well I'll give him that, but then to go on and say that the route should have more service is extremely troubling.  Like I said before, even with the majority of the riders paying their fare on that line (let's say that's the case since the doesn't seem to have a real clue about how many folks are stealing service, but it's evident that's quite a bit of folks doing so), even with just 20% of those riders on the B46, that's still 3 million riders NOT paying which is an extremely high number, which is 7.5 MILLION dollars in lost revenue for the for one friggin' line not including any other operating costs!! So yeah I have a problem with the notion of giving that line more service overnight, which was the original argument when that line is costing the MILLIONS of dollars in lost revenue to begin with just with fare evasion alone.

 

Like I said 3 million in some cases is representative of the ridership of entire bus lines, so pardon me for reacting in a way in which the numbers seem so large, because quite frankly they are.  

I understand that 3 million+ riders isn't a fart in the wind (or as you put it, a drop in the bucket).....

Again, nobody is construing otherwise  - You are commenting as if it's the contrary....

 

This is why I'm on here saying nobody is trying to convey that it's not a problem on the B46.... Hell, on these parts, I'd venture to say that "B46" and "farebeating" tend to go hand in hand.... So I really didn't understand where you were coming from to begin with, with that sarcastic conjecture..... It wasn't predicated on truth.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I understand that 3 million+ riders isn't a fart in the wind (or as you put it, a drop in the bucket).....

Again, nobody is construing otherwise  - You are commenting as if it's the contrary....

 

This is why I'm on here saying nobody is trying to convey that it's not a problem on the B46.... Hell, on these parts, I'd venture to say that "B46" and "farebeating" tend to go hand in hand.... So I really didn't understand where you were coming from to begin with, with that sarcastic conjecture..... It wasn't predicated on truth.

And that's why I don't see why folks like yourself are so up in arms with the idea of others suggesting that runs be cut or saying that no more service should be added (i.e. example during the overnight hours).... I'd make that argument at least until the Eagle Team comes in and cleans up that line, THEN if they want to add more service, by all means they should because then it would be obvious if the service needs are bloated with people stealing service or if there's a legitimate need from paying passengers.

 

As it is right now, the fact is the doesn't have a real idea as to how many folks on that line are stealing services and how many are actually paying passengers and I think they have a responsibility to the taxpayers and the paying public that use their services to be fiscally responsible and resolve this problem and ensure that they're not squandering even more monies on a route with rampant farebeating.

[realizm]

Stop guys and listen.

 

Saying this objectively subjectively (everyone else is posting subjectively) and this is as a general response. I read all the posts and everyone is entitled to their opinion to be fair about it. Let me say my piece on that.....

 

...... Yes fare evasion will tend to occur in poorer neighborhoods where there are mostly minorities but as a no brainer, many people are desperately poor in those areas and even as I myself will not condone that it will happen frequently. It is what it it. I know this as fact because I am living in the Boogie Down Bronx, the poorest borough of the five in the Big Apple. I also was chillin' in ENY at one point. So this is not about race.

 

However on the flip side:

 

Surprise! Shocker!

 

This happens in more wealthy residential neighborhoods as well!! I've seen fare beaters pull their stunts in areas like Bay Ridge for example (Yes I used to live close to Bay Ridge along the and at the BMT South Brooklyn Division Sea Beach and Bay Ridge Lines to be exact and the buses that run in the area so I know) , and hey for the record these fare beaters in this case are not necessarily Black, Asian, or Latino. Jumping turnstiles, sneaking in the bus through the back door sort of speak and all of that. So again I would imagine this is not about race.

 

All people straight across the board all ppl of all races are farebeating and I'm not trying to paint a rainbow here and no I don't own a rose pair of glasses. I don't even wear glasses. I have 20/20 vision and I seen it all on farebeating as a law abiding straphanger who even takes the bus at times, if not hitting the highway by car altogether if I'm really in a rush.

 

So obvious....

 

Nuff said!

[QM1to6Ave]

Careful now... I made that statement and I was called a racist and an elitist because most of the fare evasion happens in minority neighborhoods...    As if it's my fault that the farebeating happens in minority neighborhoods... I'm sorry but I stand by my statement... The areas with high farebeating should NOT have more service at the sake of other communities which is exactly what is happening because you have overnight service yanked in Gerritsen Beach while rampant farebeating goes on on a route like the B46 which other B46 riders have confirmed, but people will do anything to try to make the situation seem non problematic.   Now a route like the B41 could use better service along the Veterans Av branch and quite frankly could be better if not for a route like the B46 where so many people are stealing service, but it's not a problem and it's essentially okay that they're doing that... *Sarcasm* 

 

I'm not saying this about any neighborhood in specific. I simply mean that if an area has been found to have high levels of farebeating, cut service. 

[B35 via Church]

And that's why I don't see why folks like yourself are so up in arms with the idea of others suggesting that runs be cut or saying that no more service should be added (i.e. example during the overnight hours).... I'd make that argument at least until the Eagle Team comes in and cleans up that line, THEN if they want to add more service, by all means they should because then it would be obvious if the service needs are bloated with people stealing service or if there's a legitimate need from paying passengers.

 

As it is right now, the fact is the doesn't have a real idea as to how many folks on that line are stealing services and how many are actually paying passengers and I think they have a responsibility to the taxpayers and the paying public that use their services to be fiscally responsible and resolve this problem and ensure that they're not squandering even more monies on a route with rampant farebeating.

Already answered that in the other thread where that as a solution was brought up.....

 

I'm "up in arms" as you say, because cutting runs is not a punishment to stopping/limiting farebeating (even if the MTA doesn't have an exact #/general idea of how many are doing so)... It's a detriment to the paying passengers !....

 

Cutting service from [x] minutes to [x - y] minutes solves nothing as it pertains to farebeating.....

Less buses to farebeat on isn't a remedy for farebeating; all it does is lessen that person's chances to catch a bus to farebeat on.....

(unless we're talking about getting rid of the route outright [which I know no one's saying on here, but I'm still gonna make the point], which would be a default argument because there'd be nothing to farebeat on, which would be nothing short of stupid to actually consider as a remedy)....

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What I'm not seeing (the logic of) is this continuance of drawing of a parallel by you, to the service that the B46 gets, to the farebeaters the B46 gets, to the service that other routes don't get..... They're non sequiturs & are separate issues...... Again, the route doesn't have the service that it does, due to the farebeaters on the line..... Your logic is not making sense here; telling me you'd make the argument of [not cutting service on the line as a remedy to farebeating] until Eagle team cleans up the line, is much ado about nothing - because the farebeating problem would have been resolved in such a scenario.....

 

This discussion here aint about service levels on the B46....

"THEN if they want to add more service", is not the issue here....