R188 Discussion Thread

[Princelex]

No, Kawasaki wouldn't think that because Kawasaki would be out of business then.

 

Theres a reason for the warranty. Your not going to build a new train and then just let it loose. Its like when you get a new dog, you wouldn't want to get it and let it loose unleashed.

 

Kawasaki is doing the same, keeping the trains on a leash for now so that MTA personnel and mechanics can learn see how to fix a specific problem when need be.

 

Also, these trains have new technology that need to be on check everytime since again, its new technology.

 

Theres a first to everything and it takes a few tries to get things right.

 

Nothing new is always perfect and thats how some you act, as if the train is perfect upon delievery, thats not how things go.

 

Really, get over it and try to at least accept this.

 

You people are lucky there are laws around here, that subway cars have to be replaced every 40 years or so, if not the subway would be much more problematic than it already is.

 

NTT = New Techonology Trains

Remember, New Techonology......

 

I couldn't agree with you more. All new equipment has bugs that need to be dealt with. I think a lot of the reason why people are so quick to dismiss these trains is because they don't want to let go of the past because for most of us, we grew up riding on R40 Slants or R32's or whatever car you can think of but sooner or later, the trains we ride on have to be scrapped. Once a lot of railfans accept this, maybe, just maybe they'll be able to enjoy riding on the New Technology Trains.

[trainfan22]

The R142/A and R143's are seven to eight years old, thats NOT new anymore. They ran fine for a few years now there running like POS. Bumassardier 142's are poorly built and their trucks are starting make a bunch of weird noises, not to mention their frames are starting to creak. R142A's voient bucking when leaving the station, when they were new they didn't buck. The R143's drop motors like flies their motors are so unreliable that the TA wants to GOH them to have new motors (If the MTA has enough money to do that). Right now their breaking down like crazy and theres like seven to eight 160A's covering for the OOS 143's. Another bad thing is the A/C and the computer systems shutting it off when it gets to a certain temputure. Wheres R32-68A don't those cenors and SMEE's A/C's tend to be better. Also from what ive heard the NTT don't operate good in bad weather 142's can't operate good in drizzling/misty rain. And none of the new techs can't operate good on wet leaves.

 

Also kawasaki even said it themselves the NTT are only made to last 35 years. Wheres MOST of the SMEE and prewar cars lasted longer than 35 years.

[R32 3348]

Older cars had a service life of 35 years but lasted longer because of the GOH.

[Pablo M 201]

It seem alot don't notice a pattern with the MTA and these NTTs, after warranty is done and over, the train went on a downslide. Wanna know why? MALMAINTENANCE on part of the MTA.

 

The MTA just let out to run and then they don't take care of them.

 

Thats it for me about this, its tiring to read some people's post about how bad NTTs are and making themselves look like idiots in the end because they bad mouth and don't have much a clue....

[via White Plains Road]

It seem alot don't notice a pattern with the MTA and these NTTs, after warranty is done and over, the train went on a downslide. Wanna know why? MALMAINTENANCE on part of the MTA.

 

The MTA just let out to run and then they don't take care of them.

 

Thats it for me about this, its tiring to read some people's post about how bad NTTs are and making themselves look like idiots in the end because they bad mouth and don't have much a clue....

 

 

To add to what you are saying. I'm getting tired of ppl dissing the R-142A's....1st of all I rode them numerous of times and they don't break down on me. I get a comfort ride....yes it jerks and the brakes may sound horrible. just like Pablo said "MALMAINTENANCE". Westchester Yard is not taking care of their trains. As for the R-160B's so what the FIND is screwed up, the destination signs are not scrolling and brakes screech alot...it doesn't mean its a bad train. We may joke about the R-160's acting up but it is what it is. When you have new technology you have glitches and problems.....you get the experts to fix them properly they would work fine. For the R-142's on the yes they having problems wrong strip maps or wrong destination scroll signs. Again they never broke down on me, I may joke about them a lot. But the East 180th Street and Unionport Yards play a part in it....if they not fixing their trains properly its going to break down. If the C/R doesn't program the destination signs properly its not going to work or say the wrong annoucements. I've had problems with the older trains no A/C's, can't understand the announcements when the C/R's are saying, some of sound they about to jump the tracks when they run, some of them are real slow when are going express and they have broke down on me several times. Do I want to get some of them....not really. Do I want every line to have a NTT yes I do IMO, but I know its not going to happen no time soon and I will settle for the older trains.

[error46146]

No, Kawasaki wouldn't think that because Kawasaki would be out of business then.

 

Theres a reason for the warranty. Your not going to build a new train and then just let it loose. Its like when you get a new dog, you wouldn't want to get it and let it loose unleashed.

 

Kawasaki is doing the same, keeping the trains on a leash for now so that MTA personnel and mechanics can learn see how to fix a specific problem when need be.

 

Also, these trains have new technology that need to be on check everytime since again, its new technology.

 

Theres a first to everything and it takes a few tries to get things right.

 

Nothing new is always perfect and thats how some you act, as if the train is perfect upon delievery, thats not how things go.

 

Really, get over it and try to at least accept this.

 

You people are lucky there are laws around here, that subway cars have to be replaced every 40 years or so, if not the subway would be much more problematic than it already is.

 

NTT = New Techonology Trains

Remember, New Techonology......

then explain why R143s and R160's are getting squeaky brakes while some of the R32's don't?

 

that law is ridiculous, the MTA's spending worthless money then the R32's and all the older trains are fine, so what if their old at least they work properly unlike the R160's

 

the MTA should have slowed down on the R160 order and only ordered a few, then tested it until every single flaw is fix before ordering like 5000 of them, it would be a lot better to have 5 trains with broken FINDS then the 5000 we have now

 

im not saying the R160 has to be perfect, im only ticked off cause their replacing good trains with bad trains

[tripleeye49]

The R142As on the you can tell are slightly better than their counterparts on the and , as for the R160s, give them a chance. Remember now we are dealing with computers and at times operators who don't know what they are doing yet.

[DOB2RTO]

Geez, this was suppose to be about the future R188, and turned into NTT vs. OTT.

 

I have only got to do a few stops with the R142 (Bombs), and a few moves up and down the yard tracks with the 142A (Sakis). The only thing I hand them (for the operator), is a cab that doesn't have peeling paint, a smooth and quiet ride (it is super quiet in the cab), and a semi-comfortable operator seat (even though some have good old MTA duct tape on them now). This comes from other operators, not shoddy equipment. On the outside, I love the fact the A/C does shut off at a certain temperature, cause I'm tired of freezing my a$$ off, in the morning, on that 1 and 3 train, whose A/Cs doesn't shut off. Meat locker cold. Yesterday, I had to thaw out my nipples with a lighter, after I got off the train.

 

As for the OTT R62 and R62A (I'm only talking about A Div now), well they do have the coldest A/Cs I have felt yet, and again from an operators P.O.V., I do love fact of the brake handle and master controller. I love the sound of the air brakes, applying and releasing. It's the train I have uncoupled with the best (only made a 6 inch cut, when they give you 1 foot to move back), and I have a better handle on that than the A Div NTT trains. All the OTT in the A Sub-Div. need, is a paint job inside the cabs (for those that didn't get it), a better seat, better operator A/C, and more insulation around the cab storm door (some have it now). Overall, I prefer the old dawgs, the baby heepos.......

 

 

 

My new cellphone (LG Dare) takes a far better picture, as it auto adjusts, etc....

[trainfan22]

Older cars had a service life of 35 years but lasted longer because of the GOH.

The R1/9's lasted 48 years and they didn't have a GOH.

To add to what you are saying. I'm getting tired of ppl dissing the R-142A's....1st of all I rode them numerous of times and they don't break down on me. I get a comfort ride....yes it jerks and the brakes may sound horrible. just like Pablo said "MALMAINTENANCE". Westchester Yard is not taking care of their trains. As for the R-160B's so what the FIND is screwed up, the destination signs are not scrolling and brakes screech alot...it doesn't mean its a bad train. We may joke about the R-160's acting up but it is what it is. When you have new technology you have glitches and problems.....you get the experts to fix them properly they would work fine. For the R-142's on the yes they having problems wrong strip maps or wrong destination scroll signs. Again they never broke down on me, I may joke about them a lot. But the East 180th Street and Unionport Yards play a part in it....if they not fixing their trains properly its going to break down. If the C/R doesn't program the destination signs properly its not going to work or say the wrong annoucements. I've had problems with the older trains no A/C's, can't understand the announcements when the C/R's are saying, some of sound they about to jump the tracks when they run, some of them are real slow when are going express and they have broke down on me several times. Do I want to get some of them....not really. Do I want every line to have a NTT yes I do IMO, but I know its not going to happen no time soon and I will settle for the older trains.

 

You call loud HAVC noise, A/C's that have a mind of their own and annoying populsion sounds comfort? The best trains in terms of comfort are the 75ft cars, not the NTT. I was on an 160 on the line today and it was HUMID inside the car, also i been on R142's in the past with broken A/C's. Old trains go slow on express runs???? Those old R40's barrel down the brighton express. Same goes for those old R32's,R42's R46's, R62/A's and R68/A's.

 

I don't know what subway lines your riding on, but those SMEE's fly on express runs. Also theres timer signals the train can't go fast if theres timer signals. And not all SMEE's have bad PA systems the R44's and R68A's have pretty good PA systems.

[7LineFan]

The R1/9's lasted 48 years and they didn't have a GOH.

 

Well, isn't that true for all trains, now, that they are lasting longer than their nominal service lives? We can't expect the same from the NTTs?

[Pablo M 201]

Yesterday, I had to thaw out my nipples with a lighter, after I got off the train.

ROFLMFAO!!!!

 

BWHAHAHAHAHA! Man, that one had me rolling.

 

And you took those pics with the LG Dare? Well gotdamn, I'm impressed.

[via White Plains Road]

The R1/9's lasted 48 years and they didn't have a GOH.

 

 

You call loud HAVC noise, A/C's that have a mind of their own and annoying populsion sounds comfort? The best trains in terms of comfort are the 75ft cars, not the NTT. I was on an 160 on the line today and it was HUMID inside the car, also i been on R142's in the past with broken A/C's. Old trains go slow on express runs???? Those old R40's barrel down the brighton express. Same goes for those old R32's,R42's R46's, R62/A's and R68/A's.

 

I don't know what subway lines your riding on, but those SMEE's fly on express runs. Also theres timer signals the train can't go fast if theres timer signals. And not all SMEE's have bad PA systems the R44's and R68A's have pretty good PA systems.

 

Who said I was reffering to the SMEE trains when I older trains? I wasn't talking about those trains @ all. Also I didn't say all older trains have bad PA's....I just wasn't being real specific. I know the R-32, R-40S, R-42, R-62 have good speed when going express. The R-68 is slow when its going express I have seen proff of that on YouTube when the run express via Brighton. I know what subway lines I've been riding on. I've been riding the subways since I was 6 years old, by myself when I was 11 years old. If you were on the R-160A-1 and it was humid, you can simply move into another car (not trying to be rude).....on the SMEE trip, several ppl and I took a R-62A train it had no A/C, we simply moved into another car where it was freezing cold. The NTT HVAC is loud??....it not that loud when I ride on it. The HVAC maybe loud when you look @ it over a bridge like platform, but its not going to make you deaf.

[Orion]

 

To add to what you are saying. I'm getting tired of ppl dissing the R-142A's....1st of all I rode them numerous of times and they don't break down on me. I get a comfort ride....yes it jerks and the brakes may sound horrible. just like Pablo said "MALMAINTENANCE". Westchester Yard is not taking care of their trains. As for the R-160B's so what the FIND is screwed up, the destination signs are not scrolling and brakes screech alot...it doesn't mean its a bad train. We may joke about the R-160's acting up but it is what it is. When you have new technology you have glitches and problems.....you get the experts to fix them properly they would work fine. For the R-142's on the yes they having problems wrong strip maps or wrong destination scroll signs. Again they never broke down on me, I may joke about them a lot. But the East 180th Street and Unionport Yards play a part in it....if they not fixing their trains properly its going to break down. If the C/R doesn't program the destination signs properly its not going to work or say the wrong annoucements. I've had problems with the older trains no A/C's, can't understand the announcements when the C/R's are saying, some of sound they about to jump the tracks when they run, some of them are real slow when are going express and they have broke down on me several times. Do I want to get some of them....not really. Do I want every line to have a NTT yes I do IMO, but I know its not going to happen no time soon and I will settle for the older trains.

I agree completely, I been on enough Bombardier R142s on the and that broke down on me. I can't count them on one hand anymore. The R142As are much more reliable, if the TO put less pressure on the brakes, maybe they would be more quiet and last longer. I also agree with your R68 statement. GOD it's so slow! Those R160s ACs aren't even that bad, I rode on alot of them and have no problem whatsoever, perfect temperature, not too hot, not too cold. On the old trains they are willing to turn your nipples into traffic cones...Does an AC really need to be that cold?

[NYCboy]

now i see why the MTA isnt planning to out R142A;s on the line

[trainfan22]

Who said I was reffering to the SMEE trains when I older trains? I wasn't talking about those trains @ all. Also I didn't say all older trains have bad PA's....I just wasn't being real specific. I know the R-32, R-40S, R-42, R-62 have good speed when going express. The R-68 is slow when its going express I have seen proff of that on YouTube when the run express via Brighton. I know what subway lines I've been riding on. I've been riding the subways since I was 6 years old, by myself when I was 11 years old. If you were on the R-160A-1 and it was humid, you can simply move into another car (not trying to be rude).....on the SMEE trip, several ppl and I took a R-62A train it had no A/C, we simply moved into another car where it was freezing cold. The NTT HVAC is loud??....it not that loud when I ride on it. The HVAC maybe loud when you look @ it over a bridge like platform, but its not going to make you deaf.

 

The last time i tried switching cars on an R160, these undercover cops pulled me off the train and said its against the law to switch between the cars. I would try that but you don't who's watching you.

 

When i said loud HAVC's i was talking about bombarider R142's. Come on now those HAVC's are really loud!!

 

I agree completely, I been on enough Bombardier R142s on the and that broke down on me. I can't count them on one hand anymore. The R142As are much more reliable, if the TO put less pressure on the brakes, maybe they would be more quiet and last longer. I also agree with your R68 statement. GOD it's so slow! Those R160s ACs aren't even that bad, I rode on alot of them and have no problem whatsoever, perfect temperature, not too hot, not too cold. On the old trains they are willing to turn your nipples into traffic cones...Does an AC really need to be that cold?

 

Yes!! The A/C needs to be that cold!! Esp when your sitting in a hot station with nothing to drink and your sweating like crazy. Feeling that ice cold A/C hit you feels really good!! Also manhttan to flatbush ain't exactly the shortest ride, esp that hell ride on the (Q6) and between canal/grand st and PP stations. I don't know how many times im going to say this... THE R68's ARE NOT SLOW! Its been proven that all subway cars can go to the same speed.

[7LineFan]

The last time i tried switching cars on an R160, these undercover cops pulled me off the train and said its against the law to switch between the cars. I would try that but you don't who's watching you.

 

When i said loud HAVC's i was talking about bombarider R142's. Come on now those HAVC's are really loud!!

 

Technically it is against the law. However, people do it left and right every day, even employees.

 

And the R142 HVAC is loud. Very loud.

[via White Plains Road]

The last time i tried switching cars on an R160, these undercover cops pulled me off the train and said its against the law to switch between the cars. I would try that but you don't who's watching you.

 

When i said loud HAVC's i was talking about bombarider R142's. Come on now those HAVC's are really loud!!

 

Well I really didn't mean walk to another subway car and trust me I know about the undercover cops they did that to me and my friend last year @ the Woodlawn station almost got a ticket. Trust me when I say the HVAC isn't that loud.

[Pablo M 201]

 

The last time i tried switching cars on an R160, these undercover cops pulled me off the train and said its against the law to switch between the cars. I would try that but you don't who's watching you.

Uh, how about you just exit the car and walk to the next via the platform, and not through the storm doors.

[metsfan]

Uh, how about you just exit the car and walk to the next via the platform, and not through the storm doors.

 

I didn't see it in the (NYCT) rules that you can't. I will look again. To me, going to the next car via side doors means you could be left on the platform. As long as the train is stationary it's totally fine. I think i've moved between cars on all most every train type they have in NYC except path, SIR and MNRR. They really just don't want people in between there hanging out.

 

- Andy

[7LineFan]

I didn't see it in the (NYCT) rules that you can't. I will look again. To me, going to the next car via side doors means you could be left on the platform. As long as the train is stationary it's totally fine. I think i've moved between cars on all most every train type they have in NYC except path, SIR and MNRR. They really just don't want people in between there hanging out.

 

- Andy

 

It says on the storm doors that it's illegal to move between cars via the storm doors. But you're right. They don't want anyone trainsurfing or riding between cars. Of course, the doors are unlocked in case of emergency, defeating the whole purpose...

[metsfan]

It says on the storm doors that it's illegal to move between cars via the storm doors. But you're right. They don't want anyone trainsurfing or riding between cars. Of course, the doors are unlocked in case of emergency, defeating the whole purpose...

 

On PATH you can do it as long as the train is stopped.

 

With the the only excuseable time you can do it is if you're on the and getting off at south ferry. I think those cops were just being overly cautious.

 

End doors are not even on some railcars at one end. Amtrak still runs cars that have through end doors, but not side exiting end doors on one end.

 

I think cars should be safe to pass between and people should be able to do it if they don't like the vibe someone in the car they are in is giving them etc.

 

- Andy

[7LineFan]

On PATH you can do it as long as the train is stopped.

 

With the the only excuseable time you can do it is if you're on the and getting off at south ferry. I think those cops were just being overly cautious.

 

End doors are not even on some railcars at one end. Amtrak still runs cars that have through end doors, but not side exiting end doors on one end.

 

I think cars should be safe to pass between and people should be able to do it if they don't like the vibe someone in the car they are in is giving them etc.

 

- Andy

 

Oh, I was talking about only. And yeah, I agree with the last statement, with the exception of the 75 foot cars (which are locked anyway).

[SubwayGuy]

I didn't see it in the (NYCT) rules that you can't. I will look again. To me, going to the next car via side doors means you could be left on the platform. As long as the train is stationary it's totally fine. I think i've moved between cars on all most every train type they have in NYC except path, SIR and MNRR. They really just don't want people in between there hanging out.

 

- Andy

 

Section 1050.9

 

Restricted areas and activities.

 

d. No person may ride on the roof, platform between subway cars or on any other area outside any subway car or bus or other conveyance operated by the Authority. No person may use the end doors of a subway car to pass from one subway car to another except in an emergency or when directed to do so by an Authority conductor or a New York City police officer.

[metsfan]

Section 1050.9

 

Restricted areas and activities.

 

d. No person may ride on the roof, platform between subway cars or on any other area outside any subway car or bus or other conveyance operated by the Authority. No person may use the end doors of a subway car to pass from one subway car to another except in an emergency or when directed to do so by an Authority conductor or a New York City police officer.

 

Thank you for clearing that up.

 

- Andy

[East New York]

So...... any idea on when this R188 could arrive??