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Turbo19

MTA should use its $40-million surplus to benefit Staten Island commuters

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One sure sign that the economy is getting better in New York is that tax revenues have been exceeding past tax revenue projections . . . by a lot.

 

It means that tax revenues that are earmarked for certain expenditures, notably mass transit, are also exceeding the amounts forecast months ago.

 

Even the notoriously broke Metropolitan Transportation Authority is benefiting from this "bonus" revenue.

The MTA anticipated getting $318 million from tax revenue dedicated to mass transit in the 2013-14 state budget. Instead, the agency is now saying it expects to receive $358 million — 11 percent higher than expected.

 

Staten Island member Allen Cappelli introduced a motion at last month's MTA board meeting to plow that surprise surplus back into service improvements.

 

And, he says, that should start with restoring service on the bus lines that were eliminated or severely curtailed as part of $93 million in bus and subway service reductions imposed in 2010.

 

On Staten Island, these cuts included the elimination of the X6 express bus, the consolidation of X13 and X14 service, the elimination of the S67, and service reductions on the S54, S57, S66 and S76 lines. Service on some other lines was cut back or absorbed by other routes. All these moves inconvenienced thousands of riders to varying degrees.

 

Read More: SILive

 

So, I assume the main question here is, are the requests of Staten Island residents reasonable at this point in time?

Edited by Turbo19

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For the S54 and S76, I can somewhat vouch for that, those lines took a pretty hard hit in reductions when the service cuts came through. The S66...would be a hit or miss, I've heard passengers wanting weekend service but my question is how much do they really want it. Those Grymes Hill residents do not like the fact that it goes straight to Port Richmond as the S60 was a basically a Wagner College shuttle to and from St. George. I can't speak for the S57 since I've never once took the route.

One line I say that SHOULD come back is the x18, contrary to popular belief, that line carried pretty much the 2nd most to the x17A/x19 which are easily the most crowded of the Downtown route variations. The x18 was much more instrumental than the counterparts that went down with it. I've been on really packed x18s before and I tell you, that line was and IS necessary.

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For the S54 and S76, I can somewhat vouch for that, those lines took a pretty hard hit in reductions when the service cuts came through. The S66...would be a hit or miss, I've heard passengers wanting weekend service but my question is how much do they really want it. Those Grymes Hill residents do not like the fact that it goes straight to Port Richmond as the S60 was a basically a Wagner College shuttle to and from St. George. I can't speak for the S57 since I've never once took the route.

 

One line I say that SHOULD come back is the x18, contrary to popular belief, that line carried pretty much the 2nd most to the x17A/x19 which are easily the most crowded of the Downtown route variations. The x18 was much more instrumental than the counterparts that went down with it. I've been on really packed x18s before and I tell you, that line was and IS necessary.

I agree. Both the S54 and S76 should be restored to pre 2010 service levels. In addition I feel the S67 should be restored as well, on weekdays at least.

 

Regarding the S66, I personally believe it would preform best omitting Grymes Hill and continuing to Port Richmond. Service to Grymes Hill could be provided by either a part time branch of the S42 or another nearby route.

 

Lastly, I'm not all that familiar with X18 ridership, but I know for sure the X16 should return to extend options on Forest Ave.

 

Thanks for your input.

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They should also put the money into making a decent bus stop for the X22 because on that picture I would've never guess that was a bus stop lol. It should at least differentiate a bit to indicate it's a bus stop.

 

I also vouch for at least the S54 and S76 to restore it to pre 2010 service levels.

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They should also put the money into making a decent bus stop for the X22 because on that picture I would've never guess that was a bus stop lol. It should at least differentiate a bit to indicate it's a bus stop.

 

I also vouch for at least the S54 and S76 to restore it to pre 2010 service levels.

I should take the time to mention that's one of the better bus stops in Staten Island. You're usually lucky to get some shade, let alone a sidewalk.

 

And a bench? Forget about it!

Edited by Turbo19

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On Staten Island, these cuts included the elimination of the X6 express bus, the consolidation of X13 and X14 service, the elimination of the S67, and service reductions on the S54, S57, S66 and S76 lines. Service on some other lines was cut back or absorbed by other routes. All these moves inconvenienced thousands of riders to varying degrees.

 

Ya gotta love the SI Advance.

 

The S76 is essentially the same as it was pre-2010. They cut weekend service, but then they brought it back.

 

The reductions on the S57 & S66 were just a slight reduction in the span. Doesn't make much of a difference either way. The S54 saw a slight span reduction weekdays (I think service used to end at 11:00 or 11:30PM, and they cut it back to 10:00PM), and obviously, saw its weekend service eliminated.

 

For the S54 and S76, I can somewhat vouch for that, those lines took a pretty hard hit in reductions when the service cuts came through. The S66...would be a hit or miss, I've heard passengers wanting weekend service but my question is how much do they really want it. Those Grymes Hill residents do not like the fact that it goes straight to Port Richmond as the S60 was a basically a Wagner College shuttle to and from St. George. I can't speak for the S57 since I've never once took the route.

 

One line I say that SHOULD come back is the x18, contrary to popular belief, that line carried pretty much the 2nd most to the x17A/x19 which are easily the most crowded of the Downtown route variations. The x18 was much more instrumental than the counterparts that went down with it. I've been on really packed x18s before and I tell you, that line was and IS necessary.

 

The S60 didn't go to St. George, and that was one of the main causes of its low ridership. It was a shuttle to Victory & Clove where they could take other buses, but it didn't do anything to get to the ferry. 

 

As for the X18, their own damn numbers showed that it was necessary (the cost per rider was $8.76, compared to the average NYCT route being $8.64). Their logic was that people could just take the bus to the ferry (S74, S76, S51, etc), but by that logic, you could eliminate a whole bunch of express buses and have people take the bus to the subway. But I've definitely seen decent loads on X18s while I was waiting (or passing by on) other buses. 

 

I agree. Both the S54 and S76 should be restored to pre 2010 service levels. In addition I feel the S67 should be restored as well, on weekdays at least.

 

Regarding the S66, I personally believe it would preform best omitting Grymes Hill and continuing to Port Richmond. Service to Grymes Hill could be provided by either a part time branch of the S42 or another nearby route.

 

Well, as I've said many times, the problem is that a lot of these routes are outdated. The last major overhaul was in the mid-1980s, which was about 30 years ago. But even then, it wasn't as extensive as it should've been. 

 

That's why I made the proposal that I did, regarding the S66. The route was established before the 1930s if I understand correctly, back when Port Richmond was a major hub (not only did it have a ton of shopping, but it had a train station and a ferry line). There was a much stronger connection between Port Richmond and the areas down by Victory. Then the area began to decline as Staten Island became more suburbanized (development moved down to Forest Avenue, and eventually down to the SI Mall). Nowadays, it's picking up and more people and businesses are moving in, but in terms of relative importance (compared to other shopping districts), it doesn't need so many bus lines ending there. 

 

Meanwhile, my neighborhood was mostly developed in the late 1960s and throughout the 1970s (though it has continued to develop since then, though at a slower rate), and while service has gradually expanded (S44 extended to the SI Mall in the early 1980s, S46 extended to the Teleport & WSP in the mid-1990s, additional express service being added), there's still a major gap in service over here, while Port Richmond has an additional route that it doesn't need.

 

Of course, it has its own issues like the east-west routes (S4X routes) being overcrowded and slow at times (to varying degrees, and that's partially due to the North Shore Rail Line being abandoned), and a huge gap in weekend north-south service (between Decker Avenue & Broadway). So there's too much service in some corridors, but not enough service in others.

 

The same thing with the S54. Back in the day, there used to be a lot of shipping along that part of Richmond Terrace, but nowadays, everybody's too busy packing onto the S4X routes and S53 to even notice the S54. It needs to be extended to St. George to boost ridership and relieve some of the other routes. The southern part could be covered by an S79A, bringing people to the SI Mall, ETC, and shopping along Hylan Blvd, which are more popular destinations (for people in Great Kills) than places on the other side of SI.

 

So in other words, outright restoration of these routes will help people, but not as many as they should be helping, because some routes are based on outdated travel patterns.

 

I should take the time to mention that's one of the better bus stops in Staten Island. You're usually lucky to get some shade, let alone a sidewalk.

 

And a bench? Forget about it!

 

The sidewalk part is a little bit of an exaggeration. Unless you're far out in the deep South Shore or something, most stops have a sidewalk.

 

And ya gotta do it with a NY accent. ;) Fugettaboutit!

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Ya gotta love the SI Advance.

 

The S76 is essentially the same as it was pre-2010. They cut weekend service, but then they brought it back.

 

The reductions on the S57 & S66 were just a slight reduction in the span. Doesn't make much of a difference either way. The S54 saw a slight span reduction weekdays (I think service used to end at 11:00 or 11:30PM, and they cut it back to 10:00PM), and obviously, saw its weekend service eliminated.

Keep in mind that the article is an opinion piece, but I do agree with that statement.

 

And personally I saw the reductions as drastic. Example, the aforementioned routes had at least four early morning and/or late evening trips cancelled, which affected the most dependent riders. Surely cuts could have been made elsewhere. Regardless, that's all in the past.

 

 

The S60 didn't go to St. George, and that was one of the main causes of its low ridership. It was a shuttle to Victory & Clove where they could take other buses, but it didn't do anything to get to the ferry. 

 

As for the X18, their own damn numbers showed that it was necessary (the cost per rider was $8.76, compared to the average NYCT route being $8.64). Their logic was that people could just take the bus to the ferry (S74, S76, S51, etc), but by that logic, you could eliminate a whole bunch of express buses and have people take the bus to the subway. But I've definitely seen decent loads on X18s while I was waiting (or passing by on) other buses. 

Now that you mention it, didn't the S60 also service Little Clove prior to serving Wagner College?

 

As for the X18, I did mention I was unaware of the situation there. Nonetheless I'm sure the service was vital to supplement the X17 and X19.

 

 

Well, as I've said many times, the problem is that a lot of these routes are outdated. The last major overhaul was in the mid-1980s, which was about 30 years ago. But even then, it wasn't as extensive as it should've been. 

 

That's why I made the proposal that I did, regarding the S66. The route was established before the 1930s if I understand correctly, back when Port Richmond was a major hub (not only did it have a ton of shopping, but it had a train station and a ferry line). There was a much stronger connection between Port Richmond and the areas down by Victory. Then the area began to decline as Staten Island became more suburbanized (development moved down to Forest Avenue, and eventually down to the SI Mall). Nowadays, it's picking up and more people and businesses are moving in, but in terms of relative importance (compared to other shopping districts), it doesn't need so many bus lines ending there. 

 

Meanwhile, my neighborhood was mostly developed in the late 1960s and throughout the 1970s (though it has continued to develop since then, though at a slower rate), and while service has gradually expanded (S44 extended to the SI Mall in the early 1980s, S46 extended to the Teleport & WSP in the mid-1990s, additional express service being added), there's still a major gap in service over here, while Port Richmond has an additional route that it doesn't need.

 

Of course, it has its own issues like the east-west routes (S4X routes) being overcrowded and slow at times (to varying degrees, and that's partially due to the North Shore Rail Line being abandoned), and a huge gap in weekend north-south service (between Decker Avenue & Broadway). So there's too much service in some corridors, but not enough service in others.

 

The same thing with the S54. Back in the day, there used to be a lot of shipping along that part of Richmond Terrace, but nowadays, everybody's too busy packing onto the S4X routes and S53 to even notice the S54. It needs to be extended to St. George to boost ridership and relieve some of the other routes. The southern part could be covered by an S79A, bringing people to the SI Mall, ETC, and shopping along Hylan Blvd, which are more popular destinations (for people in Great Kills) than places on the other side of SI.

 

So in other words, outright restoration of these routes will help people, but not as many as they should be helping, because some routes are based on outdated travel patterns.

While I agree that the bus route network in Staten is dated, that issue continues to exist and plague other boroughs as well. And from what I've seen the MTA propose for Staten Island and other boroughs it doesn't look like major changes will take place in the near future, and those that will likely won't benefit many passengers.

 

So while I agree that service restorations don't remedy the problem entirely, they are better than nothing at all. And again, have you seen the agency's plans for Staten Island, the proposals still don't reflect the travel patterns of residents, so restructuring isn't all that better.

 

 

 

The sidewalk part is a little bit of an exaggeration. Unless you're far out in the deep South Shore or something, most stops have a sidewalk.

 

And ya gotta do it with a NY accent. ;) Fugettaboutit!

Please, surely you've traveled Forest west of South, or even Victory west of Arlene. There some other pockets out there as well but I can't name them off hand.

 

And New York accent? If anything I've developed a valley accent as a result all my time in Cali.

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Keep in mind that the article is an opinion piece, but I do agree with that statement.

 

And personally I saw the reductions as drastic. Example, the aforementioned routes had at least four early morning and/or late evening trips cancelled, which affected the most dependent riders. Surely cuts could have been made elsewhere. Regardless, that's all in the past.

 

Well, I guess they covered themselves by saying "to varying degrees". Cutting weekend service is different than ending service an hour later, but in both cases, riders are still affected.

 

Now that you mention it, didn't the S60 also service Little Clove prior to serving Wagner College?

 

As for the X18, I did mention I was unaware of the situation there. Nonetheless I'm sure the service was vital to supplement the X17 and X19.

 

Yeah, Little Clove Road was basically used as a way to get over to Petrides. So it started at Victory & Clove, served Petrides, then went up Grymes Hill, looped around on Arlo, then came back down and went straight to Victory & Clove.

 

The X18 didn't do anything for X17/19 riders because it served an entirely different neighborhood. It's just that ridership was high, just like the X17/19.

 

While I agree that the bus route network in Staten is dated, that issue continues to exist and plague other boroughs as well. And from what I've seen the MTA propose for Staten Island and other boroughs it doesn't look like major changes will take place in the near future, and those that will likely won't benefit many passengers.

 

So while I agree that service restorations don't remedy the problem entirely, they are better than nothing at all. And again, have you seen the agency's plans for Staten Island, the proposals still don't reflect the travel patterns of residents, so restructuring isn't all that better.

 

That's what I'm saying: Restructuring in a way that reflects current travel patterns is better. I don't think anybody can really dispute that. If it's 2013, buses should be adjusted to 2013 travel patterns, not 1930 travel patterns.

 

If the MTA restructures services based on some faulty assumption of current travel patterns, or if they have their own agenda to fill in which the riders themselves are a secondary (or tertiary or worse) concern, then "restructuring isn't all that [much] better".

 

I mean, the S54 on the weekends cost almost $8 per passenger, and buses served very few riders. As a taxpayer and fare-paying rider, I want to make sure that money is used efficiently. Does that mean every bus has to be packed? Of course not, but they should be carrying reasonable loads unless there's absolutely no alternative to serving the neighborhoods involved, which isn't the case for the most part.

 

Please, surely you've traveled Forest west of South, or even Victory west of Arlene. There some other pockets out there as well but I can't name them off hand.

 

And New York accent? If anything I've developed a valley accent as a result all my time in Cali.

 

Well, that's why I said "deep South Shore or something". I mean, I could add other areas like the stops in the Greenbelt (the S54/57 along Rockland), and probably some parts of Richmond/Arthur Kill Road by the cemetary, but my point is that most areas do have a sidewalk by the stops.

 

BTW, the S40 along Forest has sidewalks by the stops (it's just that in some portions, there's no sidewalk between the stops, but at the stops themselves, there's a sidewalk). With the S62, the only portion that I can think of offhand without a sidewalk is that stretch across from Top Tomato. The stops in Travis itself have a sidewalk (except for maybe those last couple of stops west of the WSE. I don't know offhand), and those few stops between Arlene & Signs have a sidewalk (with the exception of the westbound stops at Arlene & Signs themselves). 

 

But even then, those areas are far out and isolated, but they don't represent the average bus stop on Staten Island.

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The S60 didn't go to St. George, and that was one of the main causes of its low ridership. It was a shuttle to Victory & Clove where they could take other buses, but it didn't do anything to get to the ferry.

 

Oh wow, the video I shot had an S60 leaving St. George too, oops.

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I personally think the 40 million dollars should be used for some SI commutes, and other boroughs as well. Regarding the X22, why dont we just give it it's own midday service instead of having an extended X17 (long enough pre-extention).

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I personally think the 40 million dollars should be used for some SI commutes, and other boroughs as well. Regarding the X22, why dont we just give it it's own midday service instead of having an extended X17 (long enough pre-extention).

 

Benefits for Downtown service.

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They should also put the money into making a decent bus stop for the X22 because on that picture I would've never guess that was a bus stop lol. It should at least differentiate a bit to indicate it's a bus stop.

 

I also vouch for at least the S54 and S76 to restore it to pre 2010 service levels.

That's another thing I hate about Staten Island.  The sidewalks are so narrow and sometimes you're forced to stand in the grassy areas (even when it's raining) to get the express bus.  Really annoying. Not much you can do about it since everyone has to have friggin' grass in front of their house.  <_<

 

They don't care about where people have to stand.  It's all about the car on Staten Island.  Public transit takes a back seat out there. 

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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Benefits for Downtown service.

Dude last I checked the SIR to the ferry is quicker for getting to downtown. However at rush X19 wins hands down or neck and neck sort of. I see some of your point.

 

That's another thing I hate about Staten Island.  The sidewalks are so narrow and sometimes you're forced to stand in the grassy areas (even when it's raining) to get the express bus.  Really annoying. Not much you can do about it since everyone has to have friggin' grass in front of their house.  <_<

 

They don't care about where people have to stand.  It's all about the car on Staten Island.  Public transit takes a back seat out there. 

Dude you do realize people can't use transit that doesn't exist right? Many SI residents travel to and from NJ via the gothels and outerbridge crossing bridges more than the bayonne bridge that is so deserted you barely see cars ironically that was the part of NJ MTA decided to serve how is that S89 working for ya MTA? Nuff said.

 

I personally think the 40 million dollars should be used for some SI commutes, and other boroughs as well. Regarding the X22, why dont we just give it it's own midday service instead of having an extended X17 (long enough pre-extention).

You do realize the X22 in-spite of high ridership still has very high operating costs?

 

Ya gotta love the SI Advance.

 

The S76 is essentially the same as it was pre-2010. They cut weekend service, but then they brought it back.

 

The reductions on the S57 & S66 were just a slight reduction in the span. Doesn't make much of a difference either way. The S54 saw a slight span reduction weekdays (I think service used to end at 11:00 or 11:30PM, and they cut it back to 10:00PM), and obviously, saw its weekend service eliminated.

 

 

The S60 didn't go to St. George, and that was one of the main causes of its low ridership. It was a shuttle to Victory & Clove where they could take other buses, but it didn't do anything to get to the ferry. 

 

As for the X18, their own damn numbers showed that it was necessary (the cost per rider was $8.76, compared to the average NYCT route being $8.64). Their logic was that people could just take the bus to the ferry (S74, S76, S51, etc), but by that logic, you could eliminate a whole bunch of express buses and have people take the bus to the subway. But I've definitely seen decent loads on X18s while I was waiting (or passing by on) other buses. 

 

 

Well, as I've said many times, the problem is that a lot of these routes are outdated. The last major overhaul was in the mid-1980s, which was about 30 years ago. But even then, it wasn't as extensive as it should've been. 

 

That's why I made the proposal that I did, regarding the S66. The route was established before the 1930s if I understand correctly, back when Port Richmond was a major hub (not only did it have a ton of shopping, but it had a train station and a ferry line). There was a much stronger connection between Port Richmond and the areas down by Victory. Then the area began to decline as Staten Island became more suburbanized (development moved down to Forest Avenue, and eventually down to the SI Mall). Nowadays, it's picking up and more people and businesses are moving in, but in terms of relative importance (compared to other shopping districts), it doesn't need so many bus lines ending there. 

 

Meanwhile, my neighborhood was mostly developed in the late 1960s and throughout the 1970s (though it has continued to develop since then, though at a slower rate), and while service has gradually expanded (S44 extended to the SI Mall in the early 1980s, S46 extended to the Teleport & WSP in the mid-1990s, additional express service being added), there's still a major gap in service over here, while Port Richmond has an additional route that it doesn't need.

 

Of course, it has its own issues like the east-west routes (S4X routes) being overcrowded and slow at times (to varying degrees, and that's partially due to the North Shore Rail Line being abandoned), and a huge gap in weekend north-south service (between Decker Avenue & Broadway). So there's too much service in some corridors, but not enough service in others.

 

The same thing with the S54. Back in the day, there used to be a lot of shipping along that part of Richmond Terrace, but nowadays, everybody's too busy packing onto the S4X routes and S53 to even notice the S54. It needs to be extended to St. George to boost ridership and relieve some of the other routes. The southern part could be covered by an S79A, bringing people to the SI Mall, ETC, and shopping along Hylan Blvd, which are more popular destinations (for people in Great Kills) than places on the other side of SI.

 

So in other words, outright restoration of these routes will help people, but not as many as they should be helping, because some routes are based on outdated travel patterns.

 

 

The sidewalk part is a little bit of an exaggeration. Unless you're far out in the deep South Shore or something, most stops have a sidewalk.

 

And ya gotta do it with a NY accent. ;) Fugettaboutit!

Dude not even close currently very few if any express buses are as close to the ferry as the X18 was so that logic would truncate lines like X30 but won't be enough to eliminate them why because the local buses are so slow by the time they reach the ferry halfway into the ferry ride the same express bus from that area the local bus served is already in manhattan. If one were to use the X14 instead of S48 to the ferry they would shave off a good 30 mins off their trip. X12/42 are way faster than their local bus counterparts don't be fooled by that logic it only applied to the X18 where the local bus ride was so short that the ferry commute was time competitive with the X18. Almost all express buses leave the local bus/ferry commuters in the dust. The only thing they can cut with that logic is truncate X30 at broadway and that's it. That logic will definitely not fly in the bronx except in the case of the BXM4 other than that that logic would be very hard to apply if not impossible. Only a handful of QM buses fall under that category QM10/QM21/X68 and QM4. Only the BM2 and 3 would fall under that logic category in brooklyn.

 

Very few express buses can be fully replaced by a local bus to subway commute or even LIRR or in rare cases MNRR commute without drastically increasing travel time for those people.

Edited by qjtransitmaster

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I should take the time to mention that's one of the better bus stops in Staten Island. You're usually lucky to get some shade, let alone a sidewalk.

 

And a bench? Forget about it!

Ha, we got shelters at pretty much every stop going to NY along Route 9 (NJT 139 & Academy Wall Street) and some of them are HUGE like you've never seen. A few of the park and rides even have indoor waiting areas. Fancy huh?

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Ha, we got shelters at pretty much every stop going to NY along Route 9 (NJT 139 & Academy Wall Street) and some of them are HUGE like you've never seen. A few of the park and rides even have indoor waiting areas. Fancy huh?

I hope you're not referring to those hideous outdated black shelters that I see along the 162 and 163. If so they're anything but fancy.

 

Dude you do realize people can't use transit that doesn't exist right? Many SI residents travel to and from NJ via the gothels and outerbridge crossing bridges more than the bayonne bridge that is so deserted you barely see cars ironically that was the part of NJ MTA decided to serve how is that S89 working for ya MTA? Nuff said.

What does that have to do with the sidewalks being narrow or almost non-existent in some areas??  <_<

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I hope you're not referring to those hideous outdated black shelters that I see along the 162 and 163. If so they're anything but fancy.

 

What does that have to do with the sidewalks being narrow or almost non-existent in some areas??  <_<

you have a point but then again some NJT stops are like that. 

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Dude last I checked the SIR to the ferry is quicker for getting to downtown. However at rush X19 wins hands down or neck and neck sort of. I see some of your point.

 

 

From Tottenville....to St. George to Manhattan is almost doubled the time than it is on the Express Bus.... -___-

 

And you clearly missed my point.

Edited by Cait Sith
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From Tottenville....to St. George to Manhattan is almost doubled the time than it is on the Express Bus.... -___-

 

And you clearly missed my point.

It's a good 45 minutes on the SIR alone if there's no express service, then the ferry ride and any other connections that have to be made... I have a friend that lives down in Tottenville. I told her to just take the X22 because she was going to start working in Midtown.  It would've been almost two hours each way using the SIR to the ferry to the subway and then the walk to her office.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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Dude last I checked the SIR to the ferry is quicker for getting to downtown. However at rush X19 wins hands down or neck and neck sort of. I see some of your point.

 

Dude you do realize people can't use transit that doesn't exist right? Many SI residents travel to and from NJ via the gothels and outerbridge crossing bridges more than the bayonne bridge that is so deserted you barely see cars ironically that was the part of NJ MTA decided to serve how is that S89 working for ya MTA? Nuff said.

 

You do realize the X22 in-spite of high ridership still has very high operating costs?

 

Dude not even close currently very few if any express buses are as close to the ferry as the X18 was so that logic would truncate lines like X30 but won't be enough to eliminate them why because the local buses are so slow by the time they reach the ferry halfway into the ferry ride the same express bus from that area the local bus served is already in manhattan. If one were to use the X14 instead of S48 to the ferry they would shave off a good 30 mins off their trip. X12/42 are way faster than their local bus counterparts don't be fooled by that logic it only applied to the X18 where the local bus ride was so short that the ferry commute was time competitive with the X18. Almost all express buses leave the local bus/ferry commuters in the dust. The only thing they can cut with that logic is truncate X30 at broadway and that's it. That logic will definitely not fly in the bronx except in the case of the BXM4 other than that that logic would be very hard to apply if not impossible. Only a handful of QM buses fall under that category QM10/QM21/X68 and QM4. Only the BM2 and 3 would fall under that logic category in brooklyn.

 

Very few express buses can be fully replaced by a local bus to subway commute or even LIRR or in rare cases MNRR commute without drastically increasing travel time for those people.

But people prefer to go there way like they've done always. You arent gonna have people paying a higher fare even though its faster, or a lower fare and be slower. The LIRR costs more than the Express Bus, and only is catered to Penn Station. The MNRR only caters to Grand Central, and Harlem, which is a long strech, and wouldn't be so inconvienent for riders. As for the BxM4, they didnt eliminate it because of Woodlawn Oppostion IIRC. 

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From Tottenville....to St. George to Manhattan is almost doubled the time than it is on the Express Bus.... -___-

 

And you clearly missed my point.

If your going to midtown yes I meant downtown.  But I will try X17 to find out soon.

 

But people prefer to go there way like they've done always. You arent gonna have people paying a higher fare even though its faster, or a lower fare and be slower. The LIRR costs more than the Express Bus, and only is catered to Penn Station. The MNRR only caters to Grand Central, and Harlem, which is a long strech, and wouldn't be so inconvienent for riders. As for the BxM4, they didnt eliminate it because of Woodlawn Oppostion IIRC. 

They could have easily eliminated it all they needed to do was reroute BXM11 to woodlawn past 233rd street and cross honor express bus pass on peak hour manhattan bound MNRR trains then the Bxm4's remaining ridership would either take the Bxm11 or MNRR. Not much in wakefield most Bxm11 riders are off before 233rd street. Only the QM21 and QM3 directly duplicate the LIRR and if MTA made it so it is not more expensive to use LIRR then those lines would be toast. Most of Bxm11's ridership is not walking distance from MNRR and no Bxm line completely duplicates MNRR directly but the Bxm4's trip can theoretically be done with local bus to MNRR not that it is the most practical the way it is now.

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If your going to midtown yes I meant downtown.  But I will try X17 to find out soon.

 

The x17 is far better than those options, take it from someone that has utilized its Tottenville variant....take a minute and think about this.

 

SIR = 45 to an hour

S74 and S78 = An hour plus

Staten Island Ferry = 30 to 45.

x17 to Downtown from Tottenville and vice-versa? 30-45.....an hour at most.

Edited by Cait Sith

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The x17 is far better than those options, take it from someone that has utilized its Tottenville variant....take a minute and think about this.

 

SIR = 45 to an hour

S74 and S78 = An hour plus

Staten Island Ferry = 30 to 45.

x17 to Downtown from Tottenville and vice-versa? 30-45.....an hour at most.

WHAT THAT FAST?? With it's meandering route in tottenville it manages to reach downtown in 45 mins???!!!! How are the drivers that quick? I doubt anybody uses S74 /78 all the way like that.

Edited by qjtransitmaster

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WHAT THAT FAST?? With it's meandering route in tottenville it manages to reach downtown in 45 mins???!!!! How are the drivers that quick? I doubt anybody uses S74 /78 all the way like that.

 

It's the midday....no traffic

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I hope you're not referring to those hideous outdated black shelters that I see along the 162 and 163. If so they're anything but fancy.

 

Well you can't expect those CEMUSA shelters to be everywhere, I don't know what you're talking about but each town is responsible for their own stops/shelters. Some are nicer than others, some are "outdated", but still maintained well and at nearly every stop going towards the city.

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Well you can't expect those CEMUSA shelters to be everywhere, I don't know what you're talking about but each town is responsible for their own stops/shelters. Some are nicer than others, some are "outdated", but still maintained well and at nearly every stop going towards the city.

I agree that they're well maintained but they're really outdated.  It's 2013... Time to get something more modern that looks more attractive. Quite frankly I'd say most of them need to be replaced just due to everyday wear and tear.

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