Burrstone Posted August 24, 2013 Author Share #26 Posted August 24, 2013 Not only could they have got 500 new buses by now, they could have replaced with the 1000's of late models that are up for sale across North America Every state has different specs, you'd be amazed like in NY the air release for the push button doors cannot be in certain places, one of the biggest differences between NY and many other states is that the school bus sign, it must be illuminated in NY and other states just slap "School Bus" up there. It is an easy enough fix where I have seen AE cut the school bus sign out, put plexi glass up there, run wires and bulbs... The point is after Sandy NY should relaxed the rules for school bus specs and allowed any states specs to be in service so school bus companies and districts could borrow, rent, and lease buses from around the Country for an certain amount of time so no company or district would have to be put in the posting of coming with the funds right off the bat for new buses. Regarding the contracts for school buses: why does it smell like Veolia all of a sudden? Veolia did just win the contract in Boston to handle their school bus system... I was surprised Veolia didn't go after any of the NYC DOE contracts that came up... Would Veolia have an equipped subdivision similar to First (Transit/Student) to bid? Honest question as I never looked to much into that. Not only could they have got 500 new buses by now, they could have replaced with the 1000's of late models that are up for sale across North America If they wanted to they easily could buy school buses. They have a school bus divison in Quebec Canada. Like theaveragejoe said those buses could be bought, also never count a big company like Veolia or Durham School Services could easily buy an operator, their location, contracts... As mac said Atlantic Express has sold some contracts, it could happen, Durham and Veolia both love buying out existing operators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac5689 Posted August 24, 2013 Share #27 Posted August 24, 2013 I know some EBT drivers and am always interested in the bus business and it's history... I found out that EBT was founded by the Corr family, at some point in time they won the Massapequa, Farmingdale, and Lindenhurst contract (among others) what the "history" doesn't tell is that the K Corr yard was sold to Atlantic Express. lol Interesting, I wish there was a documentary on this or book I could read on this. Corr probably sold their yard when they brought out Bornscheuer Bus Company and took over their yard, since EBT's current location in Copiague was owned by Bornscheuer Bus Company. First Student has a location in Amityville right down the road from the AE Raybern Yard in Farmingdale... I didn't know First Student had a yard in that area. An interesting note is that the Raybern property is not owned by AE, they lease the yard, building, etc from the guy (or family) they bought the Raybern operation from.. If AE did something bold like sell of the raybern location and contracts it could be anybody, anyone with the huger and money. If AE leases the yard then my guess is that, if they indeed pull out of Suffolk completely, they will either break the lease or probably transfer the lease to another company or to someone else. Not only could they have got 500 new buses by now, they could have replaced with the 1000's of late models that are up for sale across North America If I remember correctly, the damage AE suffered during Sandy was somewhere close to a couple million dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted August 24, 2013 Author Share #28 Posted August 24, 2013 I didn't know First Student had a yard in that area. It's mostly vans and a handful of transit style school buses... I have no idea what they do or service out of that yard, no districts def, probably a lot of special needs and wheelchair work. If AE leases the yard then my guess is that, if they indeed pull out of Suffolk completely, they will either break the lease or probably transfer the lease to another company or to someone else. I doubt they will pull out of Amityville just because it is in Amityville,... Besides you have to remember that yard also serves 3 other districts in Nassau, so they wouldn't close it just because the yard is in Suffolk. Selling the Amityville contract would only shoot themselves in the foot considering how close that yard is to Amityville, they'd ave to layoff drivers and have to pay more towards unemployment. School bus drivers LOVE unemployment in the summer, if they get word in the summer their position no longer exists they don't have to go back to work and can sit at home for the next school year and collect unemployment. I really don't see AE closing the Raybern Yard in Farmingdale because it is in Suffolk because they serve 3 Nassau contracts from that yard... I don't see them selling the Amityville contract because there are far more reasons to keep it than to sell it just because it is in Suffolk. The only thing that I could see happening is AE selling the entire Raybern operation. If that happened the lease would be included because it is part of the business unless other arraignments are made but there are many possibilities. I was told a couple of years ago that the Raybern Yard is very bad condition because the owner refuses to fix anything (holes in the yard, everything has been hit 100x, etc.) because it is the responsibility of the tenant (which is the case with most commercial leases) and AE refused to put a dime into improving someone else's property (such as paving the lot). I heard this has been a very heated situation between the owners and AE... BUT this comes from what a driver told me, so who knows if it;s truth or rumors... lol If I remember correctly, the damage AE suffered during Sandy was somewhere close to a couple million dollars. It was! Atlantic Express even predicted they would not recover and this would shortly be the end of them because of a goof in renewing their insurance they weren't covered for the loss... I wonder if they got some some sort of funding or recovery money, I haven't heard anything as I'm a politician would be using this as a platform to get his/her face on TV bragging they got AE funding to keep them in business after getting devastated by the storm. I really do wonder as they predicted their end a couple of months later they are buying 100 buses from Blue Bird, easily a $4 million order... Unless they got some sort of financing.,,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac5689 Posted August 24, 2013 Share #29 Posted August 24, 2013 I doubt they will pull out of Amityville just because it is in Amityville,... Besides you have to remember that yard also serves 3 other districts in Nassau, so they wouldn't close it just because the yard is in Suffolk. Selling the Amityville contract would only shoot themselves in the foot considering how close that yard is to Amityville, they'd ave to layoff drivers and have to pay more towards unemployment. School bus drivers LOVE unemployment in the summer, if they get word in the summer their position no longer exists they don't have to go back to work and can sit at home for the next school year and collect unemployment. Unemployment rules seem to always be changed. My mother collects Unemployment mostly the summer because she works for a company that handles the lunches for the local school district, and this year for the first time in ten years she received papers, that use to be given to people who are looking for a job, earlier in the summer from the Department of Labor. Also according to the state they are cutting a couple of dollars from unemployment. Besides if the company taking over is hiring the bus drivers that drove the school district, like Suffolk Transportation Service is doing, then they don't really have a reason not to be working. (Especially if the other company may pay you better.) I doubt they will pull out of Amityville just because it is in Amityville,... Besides you have to remember that yard also serves 3 other districts in Nassau, so they wouldn't close it just because the yard is in Suffolk. Selling the Amityville contract would only shoot themselves in the foot considering how close that yard is to Amityville, they'd ave to layoff drivers and have to pay more towards unemployment. School bus drivers LOVE unemployment in the summer, if they get word in the summer their position no longer exists they don't have to go back to work and can sit at home for the next school year and collect unemployment. United Bus Corp was going to lay off bus drivers if they lost the Pat-Med contract, which they did then sued and I guess got it back, and they ran three contracts (One for mini buses only, and two for both large and mini buses.) out of their yard. I didn't say they have to close the yard if they stop serving Suffolk Schools. if AE continues to operate their Nassau contracts and they operate some of those contracts out of that yard then they could keep the yard. Like I said though I don't know what they are doing with their Nassau contracts, or with their other Suffolk contracts. I just know what that guy from Three Village SD said that I guess either he was told or had heard that AE was pulling out of all their Suffolk Contracts. I was told a couple of years ago that the Raybern Yard is very bad condition because the owner refuses to fix anything (holes in the yard, everything has been hit 100x, etc.) because it is the responsibility of the tenant (which is the case with most commercial leases) and AE refused to put a dime into improving someone else's property (such as paving the lot). I heard this has been a very heated situation between the owners and AE... BUT this comes from what a driver told me, so who knows if it;s truth or rumors... lol I could see that happening. If AE's lease specifies that the owner of the yard is responsible for the upkeep of the yard then they shouldn't pay for it. However if the condition of the yard is that bad where it may be damaging the buses, then AE should just pay for the work to be done and then either send the bill to the owner of the yard or sue the owner for reimbursement. (Or better yet deduct the money they spent on the repairs from the rent.) It's mostly vans and a handful of transit style school buses... I have no idea what they do or service out of that yard, no districts def, probably a lot of special needs and wheelchair work. I think each company has contracts for special needs either through School Districts/ Private schools, and BOCES. I know both Baumann and Sons and Suffolk Transportation Service lay claim to a contract with Eastern Suffolk BOCES and I believe Western Suffolk BOCES. Though neither says what type of buses they provide.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted August 24, 2013 Author Share #30 Posted August 24, 2013 I didn't say they have to close the yard if they stop serving Suffolk Schools. if AE continues to operate their Nassau contracts and they operate some of those contracts out of that yard then they could keep the yard. Like I said though I don't know what they are doing with their Nassau contracts, or with their other Suffolk contracts. I just know what that guy from Three Village SD said that I guess either he was told or had heard that AE was pulling out of all their Suffolk Contracts. They would be shooting themselves in the foot by pulling out of Amityville just because it's in Suffolk County considering keeping the contract does more for that yard than the yard would gain by getting rid of it. Let's just see what the vision of the new CEO of Atlantic Express is considering he just took office, everything could change... Besides if the company taking over is hiring the bus drivers that drove the school district, like Suffolk Transportation Service is doing, then they don't really have a reason not to be working. (Especially if the other company may pay you better.) That is not how unemployment works when a driver is laid off for the summer they have no work "through no fault of their own" if AE sold off the contract they would have to lay off the least senior drivers so now these drivers will not have work due to a layoff so come school time they would have been laid off by the company "through no fault of their own," they have no job to go back to, they can collect unemployment for 52 weeks (assuming the state still allows 52 weeks)... "Then they really have no reason not to be working" is not a valid reason because their job was gone, just because it went to another operator doesn't require them to apply or accept a job with the new company. I'm not saying everyone would do this but many would take advantage of a paid years vacation... $405 a week (state maximum for unemployment the last time I checked) is not that far what a driver would be making a week after taxes... I don't know about you but I'd rather sit on my couch and make that money than make about the same money dealing with all the shit driving a school bus on long Island, especially in Amityville. Another thing to keep in mind is that, like I said a lot of people are put into Amityville when they first start, putting up with it because they want Massapequa, Seaford, or Wantagh, if you take this opportunity away from them they might not be interested in working fir the new company. A lot of drivers live in Amityville, Massapequa, Seaford, and, Wantagh, are these people going to want to want to drive to Bayshore or Copiauge? Even if they were offered a job, the job being too far away is a valid reason to turn down a job and continue collecting unemployment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yardlet6 Posted November 15, 2013 Share #31 Posted November 15, 2013 Actually Baumann & Sons serves Lindenhurst I'm not sure when that happened but I know last year or the year before I was driving in Lindenhurst just as schools got out and I saw all Baumann & Sons Buses on the road, I was like "huh." lol I thought EBT served them, but haven't paid much attention to it and have gotten Copiague and Lindenhurst in more ways than one. lol I know some EBT drivers and am always interested in the bus business and it's history... I found out that EBT was founded by the Corr family, at some point in time they won the Massapequa, Farmingdale, and Lindenhurst contract (among others) what the "history" doesn't tell is that the K Corr yard was sold to Atlantic Express. lol Interesting, I wish there was a documentary on this or book I could read on this. I don't think that'll happen, I know Atlantic Express has been downsizing it's operations for a while but I don't think they would get rid of Amityville just because it is in Suffolk... I mean the yard that covers it (Raybern in Farmingdale) is closer than the other districts it serves (Massapequa, Seaford, and Wantagh) and it would really shake things up in that yard as one of the four districts they served would be gone and they would have to layoff drivers. If a company only did Amityville they would have a hard time attracting drivers as the district has a "reputation" wild children and even parents trying to start fights bc their child got disciplined on the bus. Don't get me wrong there are also a lot who love driving in Amityville, have done it for years, and wouldn't have it any other way. New drivers usually end up in Amityville and put up with it because they want to put in their and hope a year or two later they can get into Seaford or Wantagh. What I could realistically see happening is that AE sees the Raybern yard (the whole package, buses, contracts, drivers who are ready) to a company looking to expand their brand and presence on the island. But who knows what the future of AE holds with the Founder retiring and new CEO named, will the new CEO expand or decrease its school bus business? on the Island? I can't wait to see what happens! First Student has a location in Amityville right down the road from the AE Raybern Yard in Farmingdale... An interesting note is that the Raybern property is not owned by AE, they lease the yard, building, etc from the guy (or family) they bought the Raybern operation from.. If AE did something bold like sell of the raybern location and contracts it could be anybody, anyone with the huger and money. Durham School Services is not on the island (that I know of) with AE selling off these contracts I am surprised Durham hasn't tried to get into the game on Long Island! Are you a member of the Motor Bus Society? They could use you to write articles about the local systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted November 15, 2013 Share #32 Posted November 15, 2013 They would be shooting themselves in the foot by pulling out of Amityville just because it's in Suffolk County considering keeping the contract does more for that yard than the yard would gain by getting rid of it. Let's just see what the vision of the new CEO of Atlantic Express is considering he just took office, everything could change... That is not how unemployment works when a driver is laid off for the summer they have no work "through no fault of their own" if AE sold off the contract they would have to lay off the least senior drivers so now these drivers will not have work due to a layoff so come school time they would have been laid off by the company "through no fault of their own," they have no job to go back to, they can collect unemployment for 52 weeks (assuming the state still allows 52 weeks)... "Then they really have no reason not to be working" is not a valid reason because their job was gone, just because it went to another operator doesn't require them to apply or accept a job with the new company. I'm not saying everyone would do this but many would take advantage of a paid years vacation... $405 a week (state maximum for unemployment the last time I checked) is not that far what a driver would be making a week after taxes... I don't know about you but I'd rather sit on my couch and make that money than make about the same money dealing with all the shit driving a school bus on long Island, especially in Amityville. Another thing to keep in mind is that, like I said a lot of people are put into Amityville when they first start, putting up with it because they want Massapequa, Seaford, or Wantagh, if you take this opportunity away from them they might not be interested in working fir the new company. A lot of drivers live in Amityville, Massapequa, Seaford, and, Wantagh, are these people going to want to want to drive to Bayshore or Copiauge? Even if they were offered a job, the job being too far away is a valid reason to turn down a job and continue collecting unemployment. Dude can't the LIRR cater to this market? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted November 18, 2013 Author Share #33 Posted November 18, 2013 Are you a member of the Motor Bus Society? They could use you to write articles about the local systems. Are you being serious or mean to me? If serious I love learning about local systems and would love to write about what I've learned... Dude can't the LIRR cater to this market? What are you talking about? In the proposed situation drivers living in Amityville, Massapequa, Seaford, Wantagh, taking the LIRR to Bayshore? As far as I know the Bayshore LIRR isn't that close tp the yard (sure they could offer a shuttle) BUT the LIRR schedule online the LIRR doesn't offer a train going eastbound to get these drivers into Bayshore early enough to accomodate these drivers as the last train before for the gap is 1:52AM and the next train to arrive is 8:01AM... Def wouldn't work for school bus drivers, especially not doing the Amityville District. Drivers Would Probably have to pull out of a yard in Bayshore to cover Amityville by 5:40am... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac5689 Posted November 18, 2013 Share #34 Posted November 18, 2013 What are you talking about? In the proposed situation drivers living in Amityville, Massapequa, Seaford, Wantagh, taking the LIRR to Bayshore? As far as I know the Bayshore LIRR isn't that close tp the yard (sure they could offer a shuttle) BUT the LIRR schedule online the LIRR doesn't offer a train going eastbound to get these drivers into Bayshore early enough to accomodate these drivers as the last train before for the gap is 1:52AM and the next train to arrive is 8:01AM... Def wouldn't work for school bus drivers, especially not doing the Amityville District. Drivers Would Probably have to pull out of a yard in Bayshore to cover Amityville by 5:40am... The LIRR buffers SBC/STS's Bay Shore yard, though I'm not sure where the station is to the yard. However it wouldn't be a problem since if STS were to get the Amityville or any school bus contract out that way, they would more likely either build a yard or take over an existing on or company. They wouldn't run a contract out of Bay Shore because it would be to far and the company prides itself on having their school buses close to the district. (Ie Coarm Yard - Port Jefferson, Three Villiage, Comsewogue, and Longwood School Districts. Ronkonkoma Yard - Central Islip School District. Bay Shore Yard - Bay Shore, East Islip, Islip, and West Islip School Districts. Brentwood - Brentwood School District. I have no idea if STS took over A/E's Hauppauge Contract which A/E was said to have gotten rid of, if they did it would probably be run out of the Ronkonkoma yard as well.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted November 19, 2013 Share #35 Posted November 19, 2013 Are you being serious or mean to me? If serious I love learning about local systems and would love to write about what I've learned... What are you talking about? In the proposed situation drivers living in Amityville, Massapequa, Seaford, Wantagh, taking the LIRR to Bayshore? As far as I know the Bayshore LIRR isn't that close tp the yard (sure they could offer a shuttle) BUT the LIRR schedule online the LIRR doesn't offer a train going eastbound to get these drivers into Bayshore early enough to accomodate these drivers as the last train before for the gap is 1:52AM and the next train to arrive is 8:01AM... Def wouldn't work for school bus drivers, especially not doing the Amityville District. Drivers Would Probably have to pull out of a yard in Bayshore to cover Amityville by 5:40am... LIRR can add an early train or sct getting ballsy and haveing a bus from bayshore via sunrise highway to wantagh Freeport during rush hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Sith Posted November 19, 2013 Share #36 Posted November 19, 2013 Are you being serious or mean to me? If serious I love learning about local systems and would love to write about what I've learned... I would assume he's being serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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