MHV9218 Posted October 14, 2013 Share #176 Posted October 14, 2013 +1 to both comments because thats exactly how I feel about this. I have to ask myself regarding this: How far do either parties have to take this before they are forced to come to a compromise, Democrat and Republican alike? To the point they destroy America with the infighting? What is the point of the debating and infighting on this one taking political sides? Is that benefiting us as Americans as a whole? I'd wished many of the hardline liberals or the stanch conservatives either way would realize that if this continues, as is, without an agreement to stop this stalemate, it will bring dire results on the American people. If this is not rectified we will seriously harm this economy with severe long terms consequences almost to the point of no return. You know, usually I think that political bickering is idiotic and both parties hold some fault, but I honestly think this is a new level of pointlessness, and it falls entirely on the Republicans. The sole reason for this government shutdown and the impending default is that the Republicans are trying one last time to stop Obamacare. That is not a reasonable idea: the American people support Obamacare by every measure recorded, and they wouldn't have voted Obama back in if they didn't. At this point, the Republicans are in the minority here and are working directly against the American people to repeal Obamacare. So honestly, is this political bickering? No, I don't think it is. There is no compromise; the Democrats do not want anything new. This is just conservative minority idiocy in direct contradiction to the popular vote of America -- look at the numbers, the vast majority of Americans blame the Republicans for this shutdown, and rightfully so. Obama had nothing to compromise on: he is not at fault here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MHV9218 Posted October 14, 2013 Share #177 Posted October 14, 2013 Saw this just now. http://news.yahoo.com/portman-predicts-debt-deal-by-thursday-154726226.html Not sure why that's a story. Portman is a moron who knows nothing more than anybody else in charge. This is going to continue be a problem until Republicans give up the idiotic and politically poisonous goal of repealing Obamacare. No other way around it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted October 14, 2013 Share #178 Posted October 14, 2013 Not sure why that's a story. Portman is a moron who knows nothing more than anybody else in charge. This is going to continue be a problem until Republicans give up the idiotic and politically poisonous goal of repealing Obamacare. No other way around it. Yeah because we both know that the Democrats have been so great these last two terms... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted October 14, 2013 Share #179 Posted October 14, 2013 Yeah because we both know that the Democrats have been so great these last two terms... The House passed a bill preventing any rank-and-file member from taking up the Senate bill and putting it to a vote (which would pass if it was done.) The fact that our legal representatives are no longer allowed to bring a specific piece of legislation to the floor is a sad reminder of how far our legislative system has fallen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted October 14, 2013 Share #180 Posted October 14, 2013 If only people knew the plans in store for if we do default. One of which is axing the 16 states where most people in the country are on government assistance. New York is one of those states. In about 9 days, if nothing is done, Obama could declare a National State of Emergency. This would lead to the Continuity of Government plan in which he, himself, would have supreme command over the country. BUT. Even if something IS done about the debt ceiling, we're still screwed just slower. Raising the debt ceiling could cause the credit rating of the US to drop again. THEN, we may start to see the effects such as quicker inflation. Not as fast as a default, but still inflation. New York (and most of the other big blue states) are donor states. It's primarily because most of the money is made in urban areas, which tend to lean Democratic. The effects of this will be muted at first, since the capital rules for large financial institutions and pension funds often list holding US Treasuries as a set-in-stone investment that is a very liquid way to move capital, fast. No other financial instrument has come close to this level of security - of all the internationally used currencies, only the Yen and Swiss Franc would be suitable, and both economies are rapidly trying to inflate their way out of overpriced currencies already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R10 2952 Posted October 14, 2013 Share #181 Posted October 14, 2013 Both sides are to blame. That said, I can't seem to shake off the feeling that this country is disintegrating... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted October 14, 2013 Share #182 Posted October 14, 2013 I wish they can just resolve this before the deadline. Rediculous how this is going down. The only way this would've gone resolved quicker was if they didn't get their paychecks for the whole time the government was shutdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted October 14, 2013 Share #183 Posted October 14, 2013 I talked to a bunch of people Sunday night and people were minimally aware that the threat of a US default was very real. Heck, it wasn't even in the Daily News that day (or shoved into a corner that I couldn't find). Nobody did anything to prepare. Nobody thought it was a serious problem and that things would likely work out in Congress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MHV9218 Posted October 14, 2013 Share #184 Posted October 14, 2013 Both sides are to blame. That said, I can't seem to shake off the feeling that this country is disintegrating... Why are both sides to blame? One side wants to repeal something that the American people support. The other side wants to enact something the American support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted October 14, 2013 Share #185 Posted October 14, 2013 Why are both sides to blame? One side wants to repeal something that the American people support. The other side wants to enact something the American support. Again, I don't support necessarily the Republican stance, consider me an independant. But really, both parties needs to come to terms on this policy. We are several triilions of dollars in debt here. If Congress cannot come to terms to resolve the national debt we are in for a whole world of hurt financially, forget the global economy with the investements they had mae to secure their assets with US bonds, I am not even concerned about that right now... what about whats happening on our own soil, and for the record speaking as a so called non conservatibe liberal here as I am not even one. Even financial grants for those in school will be cut if this country cannot resove this in a matter of a wek now. I am reading on the internet they may reduce staff at the US Dept of Education by 97 % ! Many FASLA grants will be delayed! New applicants may also experience a delay. This is not a simple shutdown over issues as experienced during the Clinton administration. This is something much more serious. Again both parties must come to a resolution. At least delay the pending decision. I have heard both arguements. Quite frankly as an American: I dont care...... I wish for the shutdown to be lifted, thats what counts. Who cares right now which party has to yield? I talked to a bunch of people Sunday night and people were minimally aware that the threat of a US default was very real. Heck, it wasn't even in the Daily News that day (or shoved into a corner that I couldn't find). Nobody did anything to prepare. Nobody thought it was a serious problem and that things would likely work out in Congress. ^^^^^^^^ ...and note where he is coming from as someone trying to be neutral as to political affilation. This is where I am coming from. That is a minor issue at this point. Again both parties has to come to some sort of compromise. This goes beyond a mere political standoff, this is an economically dangerous situation here. I wish they can just resolve this before the deadline. Rediculous how this is going down. The only way this would've gone resolved quicker was if they didn't get their paychecks for the whole time the government was shutdown. Pretty much.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lance Posted October 15, 2013 Share #186 Posted October 15, 2013 Recent developments for those unaware: The Senate has been working on a bill that would open the government through mid-January and raise the debt ceiling through mid-February. Leaders in the Senate say it has bipartisan support and is likely to pass. However, within the last half hour or so, GOP members in the House are pushing their own bill through. And coming as a surprise to absolutely no one, it includes provisions tied to the Affordable Care Act, provisions not included in the Senate bill. Details to follow after House press conference, but in all likelihood, this means the Senate bill won't pass the House and vice-versa. The stalemate continues with everyone outside of Congress feeling the pinch. No update yet, but answering an ongoing query, I think most people are unaware or unfazed by the potential of a default because this shit has been going on for a while. Whether it's raising the debt ceiling or funding the government, this crap comes up every few months or so, so it becomes the norm, as sad as that sounds. Also, I think most people are hoping that this "doomsday" doesn't come to pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted October 15, 2013 Share #187 Posted October 15, 2013 Recent developments for those unaware: The Senate has been working on a bill that would open the government through mid-January and raise the debt ceiling through mid-February. Leaders in the Senate say it has bipartisan support and is likely to pass. However, within the last half hour or so, GOP members in the House are pushing their own bill through. And coming as a surprise to absolutely no one, it includes provisions tied to the Affordable Care Act, provisions not included in the Senate bill. Details to follow after House press conference, but in all likelihood, this means the Senate bill won't pass the House and vice-versa. The stalemate continues with everyone outside of Congress feeling the pinch. No update yet, but answering an ongoing query, I think most people are unaware or unfazed by the potential of a default because this shit has been going on for a while. Whether it's raising the debt ceiling or funding the government, this crap comes up every few months or so, so it becomes the norm, as sad as that sounds. Also, I think most people are hoping that this "doomsday" doesn't come to pass. Bear with me, long winded post, with something in answer to your point about what may be inevitable. I think one of the reasons that they are not aware of the default and the consequences as it happens is because they do not realize that the Tea Party aligned Republican hardliners are dead set committed on defaulting the national debt. Thi may not be an attempt to simply take the US Congress 'hostage' but to literally carry through with their ideas. We already see the devestating effects of the shutdown with hundreds of goverment employees out of work. Imagine this on a national scale as the businesses in the private sector will be felt as many people end up unemployed, morgage rates and rent goes up, and market shares plummet, and levels of unemployment rises significantly, as the debt ceiling hits a concrete wall. Wake up call America, hello! This is what the elitist minorty wants! A default, it came out the hardliners themselves people! Why are both sides to blame? One side wants to repeal something that the American people support. The other side wants to enact something the American support. And now I take what I said back. But keep in mind, many repulbican voters are equally scared shitless and do not support this political move by their own in Congress as well according to polls, this speaks volumes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTARegional Bus Posted October 15, 2013 Share #188 Posted October 15, 2013 oh Great, U.S well get destroy by a Canadian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trainmaster5 Posted October 16, 2013 Share #189 Posted October 16, 2013 It's a shame that for all my lifetime the country has been defending itself from foreign threats. Communists from the Soviet Union, "Red" China, Islamic terrorists, you name it. Turns out that the real enemy of the American people comes from within and wears an American flag lapel pin. An enemy who declares that a government default would be a good thing. Government would be shrunk and cut. You can't make this stuff up. Too bad they can't be taken out and shot for treason. There are ignorant people even in Congress. Carry on . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted October 16, 2013 Share #190 Posted October 16, 2013 Well, there is one more day until the things start to become bad (if the government doesn't get its act together). I'm hoping this lack of concern comes from "wisdom of the masses" since even Wall Street folks don't appear to give a damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted October 16, 2013 Share #191 Posted October 16, 2013 Well, there is one more day until the things start to become bad (if the government doesn't get its act together). I'm hoping this lack of concern comes from "wisdom of the masses" since even Wall Street folks don't appear to give a damn. Perhaps there may be a light at the end of the tunnel, we may not default, yet, after Oct 17th or 18th. Plus I have a feeling that the parties are calling bluff, there may be a resolution in the works even as there were rejections on bills regarding this to be passed into law within the past few days as we are seeing. D-Day for the actual default in the worst case scenario may not be Oct 17th or even Oct 19th after all. But it will be very likely if payments are not due by Nov 1st. Financial analysts keeping track of daily government spending identified that that Social Security Administration must pay $12 billion in benefits by Oct 23rd. The US Treasury owes $6 billion in interest on the public debt on Oct 31st. The government must pay out more than $55 billion on Nov. 1. Lew estimated that he’d be down to his last $30 billion dollars by Thursday in the 'extraordinary measures' action initiated by the agency only on the basis of rough estimates not caculations that are down to the last penny. Therefore, D-Day may not be Oct 17th or 18th. But if the payments are not made by Nov 1st at the absolute latest, we are in for a huge world of hurt, literally. I can't say if this is enough to quell the tensions among the members here but at least its good to know that even if we pass the date and no resolution follows we may have a two week window more or less, and the Republicans know this so does the Democrats in office. Personally speaking my eyes are glued to the screen on the news sites, I am obviously very concerned about this. Edit: ....and this is the source I have read: http://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2013/10/15/u-s-may-not-actually-default-friday-but-that-doesnt-mean-washington-has-wiggle-room/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted October 16, 2013 Share #192 Posted October 16, 2013 oh Great, U.S well get destroy by a Canadian Well if disaster happens and the shit hits the fan I am moving to Montreal I swear. Watch.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted October 16, 2013 Share #193 Posted October 16, 2013 I would like to add this link which includes live coverage of the situation which is updated up to the minute with live streaming video footage in real time regarding proceedings in the US Senate and House. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-24552841 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted October 16, 2013 Share #194 Posted October 16, 2013 The Senate has struck a deal. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/16/senate-leaders-strike-debt-ceiling-deal-shutdownThis basically shows how inept Boehner and Cantor are. If you cannot seriously get your own caucus to back your own deal, you have serious leadership issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTARegional Bus Posted October 16, 2013 Share #195 Posted October 16, 2013 it was close again lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted October 17, 2013 Share #196 Posted October 17, 2013 The Senate has struck a deal. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/16/senate-leaders-strike-debt-ceiling-deal-shutdown This basically shows how inept Boehner and Cantor are. If you cannot seriously get your own caucus to back your own deal, you have serious leadership issues. *whew* Thats all I can say. Excellent news! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreeddekalbL Posted October 17, 2013 Share #197 Posted October 17, 2013 passed both houses now on the way to obama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted October 17, 2013 Share #198 Posted October 17, 2013 I will headdesk if Obama ends up saying "no" to the bill. But we all know he won't… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted October 17, 2013 Share #199 Posted October 17, 2013 Yeah so that being said we should be OK at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trainmaster5 Posted October 17, 2013 Share #200 Posted October 17, 2013 Yeah so that being said we should be OK at this point. OK being somewhat relative at this point. My personal take on this shutdown/default "show" is that there are many people in one party who are ignorant beyond belief. They may wear the American flag lapel pins but they have made the US government look inept in the eyes of the world. The financial world looks upon the US government as a bunch of bozos whom would bring financial ruin on the country and world economy just to prove a point. Senator Cruz and the nitwits who followed his lead in trying to defund " Obamacare" didn't have a snowball's chance in Hades in achieving that outcome yet for 16 days they drove the reputation of the USA into the ground. Tea Party and patriot should never be used together as synonyms, ever. The outcome of this display of stupidity was a foregone conclusion, IMO. Numbers don't lie. They (Cruz and company) never had the votes to start with. The funny/sad part of the whole debacle is that every employee will be paid for the time they didn't work. I refuse to condemn the whole GOP but, to me anyway, Tea Party=Stupid. I can't wait to head south and argue politics . I have a Tea Party neighbor in NC that I've told time and time again that my Mom's cat has a higher IQ than many people in the GOP. Just my opinion. Carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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