Bronx Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

[Via Garibaldi 8]

13 hours ago, Mtatransit said:

Talk about the Bronx, I recently rode the Bx46 bus, I don't understand why the MTA still have 2 buses running on this route. It is completely dead, and the areas it serve seems to have no hope of ever generating meaningful ridership

It's really just a bus to help people get to the subway, so I would imagine it is needed in some capacity.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

It's really just a bus to help people get to the subway, so I would imagine it is needed in some capacity.

It has potential, as there are residential areas in which it goes to. The thing is, that bus just doesn't do much for anyone there. The subway is within walking distance of the residential areas (both the  and the ), and the only group of riders you can guarantee on getting are industrial workers. However, except for shift changes, you don't even see much of them on the bus (most tend to gun for the Bx6). It's a feeder, yes, but it's a horrible one at it. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 minutes ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

It has potential, as there are residential areas in which it goes to. The thing is, that bus just doesn't do much for anyone there. The subway is within walking distance of the residential areas (both the  and the ), and the only group of riders you can guarantee on getting are industrial workers. However, except for shift changes, you don't even see much of them on the bus (most tend to gun for the Bx6). It's a feeder, yes, but it's a horrible one at it. 

So who asked for it then? I thought the  created it due to some demand or request.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

9 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

So who asked for it then? I thought the  created it due to some demand or request.

It was created to serve areas which are far away from any public transportation (primarily the Bx6). Some of the residential area falls under that, but a large part of that is industrial jobs. The only potential ridership generator which can provide consistent loads on buses would be Barretto Point Park. Most people would have to take the Bx19 or the  to get to the Bx46 (since it only stays within Hunts Point, save the short segment between the  and the ). Even then, with the headways, most people just walk from the (6). 

The problem is that the MTA filled the gap with the shortest possible bus route that they can get away with. 

Edited July 31, 2018 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[B35 via Church]

17 hours ago, AlgorithmOfTruth said:

In an effort to provide more bus and subway connections for the purpose of improving public transportation between The Bronx and Queens in general, I feel the Q44–SBS route should be moderately restructured. As it stands, the Q44–SBS route utilizes the Cross Bronx Expressway Service Road for approximately 50% of its mileage in The Bronx. Other than providing bus connections to the Bx4/Bx4A, Bx5, and Bx22, it serves predominantly residential neighborhoods located along and around the Cross Bronx Expressway, which I feel is in effort to maintain the "straight-shot" approach to the Bronx Zoo. What I propose may be controversial, but I feel aligning the Q44–SBS route with the Bx36–LTD route starting at the Cross Bronx Expressway Service Road and 174th Street, ending at Tremont Avenue and the Grand Concourse, will increase the number of bus and subway connections, in addition to enhancing the Q44–SBS coverage area in The Bronx.

Under the provisions of this proposal, the Q44–SBS would provide passengers with access to the following bus routes (not previously possible) – Bx1/Bx1–LTD, Bx2 (at Tremont Avenue and Grand Concourse), Bx15/Bx15–LTD (at East 180th Street and 3rd Avenue), Bx17 (at East 180th Street and Crotona Avenue), Bx19 (at East 180th Street and Southern Boulevard), and the Bx41, Bx41–SBS (at Webster Avenue and East 180th Street or at Tremont Avenue and Webster Avenue).

Also, passengers would have access to the * and  subway lines at the Tremont Avenue Station. *Connection to the  subway line available during rush hours only.

If implemented efficiently, I'd be interested in knowing how this works out.

Q44 itself doesn't need to serve that much of the Bronx & the last thing the Bx36 needs is a supplement....

Forget about any efficient implementation of a route that would align itself with the most meandrous portion of the route you're suggesting it be aligned with !

The concern you bring up (stymied catchment area in the Bronx) is the very reason that S94 super express or whatever was proposed by the MTA about a decade or so ago....

[Future ENY OP]

2 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Q44 itself doesn't need to serve that much of the Bronx & the last thing the Bx36 needs is a supplement....

Forget about any efficient implementation of a route that would align itself with the most meandrous portion of the route you're suggesting it be aligned with !

The concern you bring up (stymied catchment area in the Bronx) is the very reason that S94 super express or whatever was proposed by the MTA about a decade or so ago....

In full agreement with this. I didn’t really want to chime in on this b/c I know for a fact that the Q44 and SBS works itself out along the Cross Bronx. Why have a supplement like the Bx36. 

The 36 has its own issues and plus terminating the Q44 at E. Tremont & Concourse for the  and  creates other issues. Let the other interborough Bronx lines deal with that. 

[bobtehpanda]

21 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Q44 itself doesn't need to serve that much of the Bronx & the last thing the Bx36 needs is a supplement....

Forget about any efficient implementation of a route that would align itself with the most meandrous portion of the route you're suggesting it be aligned with !

The concern you bring up (stymied catchment area in the Bronx) is the very reason that S94 super express or whatever was proposed by the MTA about a decade or so ago....

Q94 was Fordham-Flushing, which is 10 miles. That's shorter than the current Q44, which is almost 13 miles. But I would imagine that Bronx traffic from the Zoo to Fordham Plaza is much slower than Main St.

[B35 via Church]

20 minutes ago, bobtehpanda said:

Q94 was Fordham-Flushing, which is 10 miles. That's shorter than the current Q44, which is almost 13 miles. But I would imagine that Bronx traffic from the Zoo to Fordham Plaza is much slower than Main St.

Yes - with the idea that xfers would be made at Flushing (for the Q94) for more general coverage in the Bronx than what the Q44 accomplishes... E. Tremont/GC for the Q44 to me comes off as random/specific/suspicious to begin with - but even if I were to run with that, said Q94 can always be shifted from Fordham plz., to parallel the Bx36 b/w WPR & GC) or whatever.... That's not my issue....

....My argument is predicated on the notion that having the Q44 do what dude is suggesting would be plain old ignorant & irresponsible (which correlates to that last point Future ENY OP made there) - even for the sake of increased coverage.... It would cause more problems than it would solve.....

Leave the Q44 alone & have a variant from Flushing covering more of the Bronx (if need be) & call it a day.

[Future ENY OP]

1 hour ago, bobtehpanda said:

Q94 was Fordham-Flushing, which is 10 miles. That's shorter than the current Q44, which is almost 13 miles. But I would imagine that Bronx traffic from the Zoo to Fordham Plaza is much slower than Main St.

That traffic is pretty stupid if you ask me. Plus, you have to deal with Southern Boulevard + Bx19. If I’m not mistaken Crotona Avenue // Bx17 is in the vicinity near Fordham Plaza (correct me here) and Webster Avenue. 

However, Main Street takes the cake b/c you talking at least 10 bus lines or more converging into and out of Main Street and the side blocks. 

[B35 via Church]

43 minutes ago, Future ENY OP said:

That traffic is pretty stupid if you ask me. Plus, you have to deal with Southern Boulevard + Bx19. If I’m not mistaken Crotona Avenue // Bx17 is in the vicinity near Fordham Plaza (correct me here) and Webster Avenue. 

However, Main Street takes the cake b/c you talking at least 10 bus lines or more converging into and out of Main Street and the side blocks. 

I believe he was talking about the Q44's entire trek along Main st, not just within the heart of Flushing....

....as if to say, the [Q44 via Main st.] is much quicker than [Southern blvd. & Fordham rd.] to get to/from Fordham plz.....
(which I don't think anyone that knows any better would argue against that... Lol.)

He's trying to make the point that, even though the Q94 would be shorter (mileage-wise) than the current Q44, it wouldn't be commensurate in terms of runtime....

Edited August 1, 2018 by B35 via Church

[bobtehpanda]

7 hours ago, Future ENY OP said:

That traffic is pretty stupid if you ask me. Plus, you have to deal with Southern Boulevard + Bx19. If I’m not mistaken Crotona Avenue // Bx17 is in the vicinity near Fordham Plaza (correct me here) and Webster Avenue. 

However, Main Street takes the cake b/c you talking at least 10 bus lines or more converging into and out of Main Street and the side blocks. 

Main St is really bad, but the badness only really stretches from like Northern to Sanford, which is a relatively small portion of the route.

[Axis]

On ‎8‎/‎1‎/‎2018 at 1:23 PM, B35 via Church said:

Leave the Q44 alone & have a variant from Flushing covering more of the Bronx (if need be) & call it a day.

Maybe a possible restoration of the X32 (but as a full-time limited stop route, as opposed to a peak-only premium express route)?

[Axis]

So, after seeing how the Queens Division tends to have local routes to serve major roads also served by the closed-door NICE Bus routes (i.e.; Q12), one idea that comes to mind is a possible open-door route operating along Fordham Road & Boston Road between Fordham Plaza & Pelham-Ropes Avenue (Bx16 terminus) as a means of taking some load/delays off the W60/W61/W62 by allowing them to operate completely closed-door in the Bronx. As it stands, the three aforementioned Bee-Line routes tend to be subject to frequent delays, resulting in delays/bunching, since there are currently no NYCT-based routes that operate along the entirety of Boston Road the way the W60/61/62 does, forcing these three routes to be open-door in that segment of their routing. Imagine if there was no Q12, and the n20G had to be open-door along Northern Boulevard.

Then again, this comparison may be faulty (considering Boston Road from White Plains Road to Ropes Avenue is nowhere near as long or ridership-heavy as Northern Boulevard from Flushing to Glenwood Street), and sincerest apologies in advance for any ignorance/insolence this idea may give off (especially considering I've rarely used the W60/61/62 along the entire Boston Road segment of their routing). But nonetheless, curious as to what you guys think of this idea.

[B35 via Church]

12 hours ago, Axis said:

So, after seeing how the Queens Division tends to have local routes to serve major roads also served by the closed-door NICE Bus routes (i.e.; Q12), one idea that comes to mind is a possible open-door route operating along Fordham Road & Boston Road between Fordham Plaza & Pelham-Ropes Avenue (Bx16 terminus) as a means of taking some load/delays off the W60/W61/W62 by allowing them to operate completely closed-door in the Bronx. As it stands, the three aforementioned Bee-Line routes tend to be subject to frequent delays, resulting in delays/bunching, since there are currently no NYCT-based routes that operate along the entirety of Boston Road the way the W60/61/62 does, forcing these three routes to be open-door in that segment of their routing. Imagine if there was no Q12, and the n20G had to be open-door along Northern Boulevard.

Then again, this comparison may be faulty (considering Boston Road from White Plains Road to Ropes Avenue is nowhere near as long or ridership-heavy as Northern Boulevard from Flushing to Glenwood Street), and sincerest apologies in advance for any ignorance/insolence this idea may give off (especially considering I've rarely used the W60/61/62 along the entire Boston Road segment of their routing). But nonetheless, curious as to what you guys think of this idea.

I get your point & this has been brought up many times in the past on here (about not leaving Boston rd. to the mercy of a separate transportation provider)...

If I were to create an (MTA operated) Boston Rd. service, I'd also have it running from Fordham Plz. to the shopping center over there along Boston Rd out by Ropes.... However, it wouldn't just run straight up Boston rd. after turning off Fordham rd.... It'd run via Fordham rd, to Boston rd, to Gun Hill, to Bartow, to Baychester, via Dreiser, Co-op city blvd, Peartree, Conner, back onto Boston rd, to end with the Bx16.... This would eliminate the need to xfer b/w the Bx16 & the Bx30 to get to Co-op from that shopping ctr (or walking along that overpass to get to/from the Bx30 from there), and have the Bx38 take on a new routing - reverting the Bx28 to how it used to run..... In other words, I would call this Boston rd. service the Bx38....

[Gotham Bus Co.]

16 hours ago, Axis said:

Maybe a possible restoration of the X32 (but as a full-time limited stop route, as opposed to a peak-only premium express route)?

 

The 2008 proposal for a "Q94" included a part-time extension to BHSOS to replace the X32.

[MysteriousBtrain]

Not too familiar with express bus ridership but I have two routes in mind from Riverdale:

1. BxM13: via Henry Hudson from W 232 St to 57th St, then down 8/9 Avs to PABT and Penn Station weekdays.

2. BxM14: Rush hour route via Henry Hudson as well but via Dyckman and via BxM1 to Midtown.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

18 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

Not too familiar with express bus ridership but I have two routes in mind from Riverdale:

1. BxM13: via Henry Hudson from W 232 St to 57th St, then down 8/9 Avs to PABT and Penn Station weekdays.

2. BxM14: Rush hour route via Henry Hudson as well but via Dyckman and via BxM1 to Midtown.

Back in the day some rush hour trips started from 239th and Independence (most people either take Metro-North or the express buses in that part of Riverdale), which is where the ridership generally picks up at, so having it start at 232nd wouldn’t make sense. The way the trips are set up now make sense. Super Express down Riverdale Avenue to pick up the riders in Central Riverdale and provide a quicker commute. The other buses continue along Henry Hudson Parkway and into Spuyten Duyvil. 

I would leave the BxM2 as is. Having it terminate at Penn Station it has a easy layover and quick turnaround. Most people go shopping or to events in the area or work near Penn Station so it’s very central. Anyone who needs PABT can simply get off at 42nd and 7th (stop already exists and is a big one).

Not sure why there would be a BxM14 stopping in Inwood. Inwood only gets those BxM1 trips because it lacks East Side subway access and that service is limited at that (as it should be). I wood has two subways so they don’t need express bus service like that, not to mention Metro-North in Marble Hill.

Edited August 18, 2018 by Via Garibaldi 8

[MysteriousBtrain]

3 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

 Back in the day some rush hour trips started from 239th and Independence (most people either take Metro-North or the express buses in that part of Riverdale), which is where the ridership generally picks up at, so having it start at 232nd wouldn’t make sense. The way the trips are set up now make sense. Super Express down Riverdale Avenue to pick up the riders in Central Riverdale and provide a quicker commute. The other buses continue along Henry Hudson Parkway and into Spuyten Duyvil.

 

I had 232 in mind since that's where the last entrance to the parkway is to/from Manhattan. Again not to familiar with express routes like that but I wonder if there can be a market for Riverdale riders to get to west midtown.

Edited August 18, 2018 by MysteriousBtrain

[Via Garibaldi 8]

3 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

I had 232 in mind since that's where the last entrance to the parkway is from Manhattan. Again not to familiar with express routes like that but I wonder if there can be a market for Riverdale riders to get to west midtown.

Huh? There already is a market... The BxM2 stops all along Henry Hudson Parkway. 239th, 236th, 232nd and the two stops along Kappock generate a big chunk of the ridership on the BxM2. Lots of condos and co-ops in that area.

Edited August 18, 2018 by Via Garibaldi 8

[MysteriousBtrain]

27 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Huh? There already is a market... The BxM2 stops all along Henry Hudson Parkway. 239th, 236th, 232nd and the two stops along Kappock generate a big chunk of the ridership on the BxM2. Lots of condos and co-ops in that area.

Don't know how the BxM2 slipped my mind 😅😅. But I was more thinking of areas south of 57th Street and was thinking of a bypass of the upper west/east side, but I guess the BxM2 is good by itself then. 

Edited August 18, 2018 by MysteriousBtrain

[Via Garibaldi 8]

11 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

Don't know how the BxM2 slipped my mind 😅😅. But I was more thinking of areas south of 57th Street and was thinking of a bypass of the upper west/east side, but I guess the BxM2 is good by itself then. 

The BxM2 depends on the Upper East Side. Mount Sinai (lots of doctors and RNs) is a big stop in the mornings and so is The Museum of Natural History. Without that stop at 99th ridership would be tough shape during the morning rush. After that 81st and Central Park West and 72nd and Columbus are hit and miss, but 63rd and Broadway is a big one and 57th and 50th and 7th.

Edited August 18, 2018 by Via Garibaldi 8

[WestFarms36]

On 7/30/2018 at 10:32 PM, Mtatransit said:

I would rather have the Q44 stay the way it currently is for reliability reasons. It preserves the Queens-Bronx connection, and people needing further connection should transfer to the subway or other buses in the Bronx. Staying on the Cross Bronx, ensures that the route doesn't suffer from further reliability issues

Talk about the Bronx, I recently rode the Bx46 bus, I don't understand why the MTA still have 2 buses running on this route. It is completely dead, and the areas it serve seems to have no hope of ever generating meaningful ridership

The Bx46 serves the non existant crowds of Hunts Point, as well as scrap and body work shops... Those mechanics have more parts than what they need. 😂

[GreatOne2k]

Bx46 also serves Barretto Point Park and replaces the Pool Shuttle (Bx24 2nd version)

[Gotham Bus Co.]

On 8/17/2018 at 11:03 PM, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

The BxM2 depends on the Upper East Side. Mount Sinai (lots of doctors and RNs) is a big stop in the mornings and so is The Museum of Natural History. Without that stop at 99th ridership would be tough shape during the morning rush. After that 81st and Central Park West and 72nd and Columbus are hit and miss, but 63rd and Broadway is a big one and 57th and 50th and 7th.

 

Why should a Riverdale-to-West-Side route depend so heavily on an East Side stop? Is Mount Sinai not good enough for the ?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

53 minutes ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

 

Why should a Riverdale-to-West-Side route depend so heavily on an East Side stop? Is Mount Sinai not good enough for the ?

5th Avenue is neither east NOR west, as 5th is in the middle. The  naturally will have less ridership than the  because of the  serving the West Side. The closest subway providing service to the East Side from Riverdale is the  at Mosholu Parkway, a rather long and annoying bus ride away. Having the  helps keep the  from having to add even more  service. The earlier express buses certainly have riders that go all the way down to 34th street. The issue is that congestion has eroded ridership from the  in the mornings so that it depends more and more on the doctors and other staff from Mount Sinai as it is quick from Riverdale (20 minutes or so). The congestion in Midtown is where it has been seeing issues. People either have been switching to Metro-North and walking from Grand Central or taking the , which stops further south on 5th from 56th down and then walking west. 

The  would be overcrowded, not to mention the additional meandering that would be needed. Northbound the  can be very quick to Riverdale. Having it have to make its way over to Madison would make no sense, especially the ones that have to run through Inwood.

Edited August 26, 2018 by Via Garibaldi 8