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cotb16

Bronx Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

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in a sense you make a point but if BX36 ltds were to reroute via a faster routing it may work claremont parkway you know more than me in that regard.

 

 

 

 

The BLW well @cot16 try the W60 many ppl on boston road do DIRECTLY TO WESTCHESTER forcing then to a BX local instead of giving em a fast closed door route would piss em off and connections would be missed. Bx30 to boston is taking a hit in speed so the W60 can move faster to westchester and actually DO WHAT IT IS SUPPOSED TO DO!!!!! SERVE WESTCHESTER TRAVEL NEEDS NOT BRONX MTA is for bronx local service NOT beeline.

Edited by qjtransitmaster

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If you cut Bx34, Woodlawn residents will be angry.

Everytime on weekend when I'm there, there's people still doesn't know Bx34 don't run on weekend anymore.

 

I think Bx34 needs to restore on Weekend b/c Bx34 riders are not happy with no Weekend Service.

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If you cut Bx34, Woodlawn residents will be angry.

Everytime on weekend when I'm there, there's people still doesn't know Bx34 don't run on weekend anymore.

 

I think Bx34 needs to restore on Weekend b/c Bx34 riders are not happy with no Weekend Service.

 

or merge with bx16 and call it done OR extreme measures to boost ridership insert evil laugh queens cough queens WESTERN THAT IS

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My reasons to your replies:

 

1. For the Bx13's extension to Hunts Point, most of the Bx6's crowds are from Yankee Stadium to Southern Blvd. If the Bx13 ended at 3rd Av, too many riders would pile up the Bx6 to head east. Most of them are either heading to catch the Bx5 for service to Soundview or to reach some of the housing projects and high schools located uphill from 3rd Avenue.

 

2. For the Bx11, I did it to prevent too many buses from being on 181st Street. In addition, it would provide Morris Heights with a more frequent bus route.

 

3. The only reason why the M100 is heading to 262nd is to appease folks who would complain about the lack of service along Broadway (save for the (1)). Broadway is also the same reason why the Bx26 would be extended there.

 

4. In regards to the Bx10, it would provide a faster ride to Montefiore Hospital since it would now bypass the congested Jerome Avenue and make less turns. In addition, it would provide a connection between heavily-elderly Woodlawn with the many senior centers in Riverdale.

 

5. The idea for the Bx30 was to be a crosstown route of its own in the Northeast Bronx instead of following the Bx28 or the Bee-Lines. Edenwald would now be able to reach the (2) at a stop closer to Manhattan and have first-time access to the (D) and (4), which are key to reaching the West Bronx.

 

6. I only did the Bx23 to Nereid to allow more consistent service on the Bx16. Co-op City riders would be able to reach northern areas like Wakefield and Mount Vernon thanks to the Bx23. As for the Q50 to Dyre, I sent it up there to provide Co-op City an alternative to the (6) and the Bx28.

 

7. For the Bx31's extension, it would provide Soundview/Castle Hill riders access to the hospitals in Morris Park, something Soundview/Castle Hill lacks (which is why Pedro Espada's clinics are so popular over there).

 

8. To clear up confusion for the Bx36, here are the specifics for the route.

 

Eastbound: 180th St, Tremont Av, Taylor Av, 174th St, Rosedale Av, Randall Av, Soundview Av

 

Westbound: Soundview Av, Randall Av, Rosedale AV, 180th St

 

-It would change east of Boston Rd by continuing on East 180th St, connecting to the (2) and (5) at E 180th St, thus giving Clason's Point/Rosedale riders with a connection to the express (5) train.

 

-Having the Bx36 running on Rosedale would create a north-south route west of White Plains Rd in Soundview.

 

My reply:

 

1) I'm not implicating that the MTA's way of handling crowd control on the Bx6 is the best way (by extending 13's to 3rd to pick up some of the slack).... What I'm saying is, your method of having the 13 supplement most of the Bx6 in the bronx isn't the way to go either.... You're basically minimizing the 13's importance b/w the stadium & washington hgts.....

 

What should happen is, more service should be added to the Bx6 where/ when/ in what direction the usage it at its highest.....

 

2) Give me your opinion on the five [bronx - W 181st st] routes from highest to least utilized....

 

3) about the M100, yeh I figured that much.... Since you want to cut the 9 back to the mall on 225th, you needed something to cover the current 9's portion along broadway..... that is how that part of your plan came off to me.....

 

As for the Bx26, Broadway b/w 242nd (1) & county line doesn't need 2 bus routes though (your M100 & your extended Bx26).....

 

4) Yeh, I agree w/ the removal of the Bx10 along Jerome av to speed it up....

 

However, I don't get the sense that there's much travel between Woodlawn & Riverdale enough to extend the 10 up there.... The route won't benefit from an extension to Woodlawn... The 10 is more heavily used west of the reservoir than it is on the eastern side of it.... an extension to Woodlawn would only garner but so many riders anyway - at the detriment of the folks that use that route the most...

 

I still say it's good on 205th....

 

6) Ok, so you would do things differently.... I would simply branch the Bx16 out b/w serving 233rd & 238th (nereid), instead of having the 16 serve 233rd & extending the Bx23 to cover 238th (nereid)....

 

The 23 is a feeder route to PBP (6) serving co-op, and is necessary since the 50 runs LTD w/i co-op (and is coming from Queens, to boot).... You are changing the purposes of both the Bx23 & Q50 with your plans (really to botch up the Bx30).... I would leave the 30 as being the only route entering/leaving co-op from the north.....

 

8) I would just shorten the current Bx36 to Lafayette/WPR & have the LTD's take the Q44 routing b/w WPR & E tremont av... then from there, make its way to boston rd & E 180th st....Then you could have that "Bx37" of yours act as a part time route b/w Castle Hill & Fordham plz....

 

What I'm saying here:

* Bx36 LTD's: Lafayette > WPR > cross bx serv. rd > 177th > devoe > E tremont > boston > E 180th... then regular route to Washington Hgts...

 

* Bx36 locals: current Bx36 route b/w Lafayette/WPR & university av/174th

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The Q44 - leave it the way it is, no need for more conjestion and crowds, or I'd just say screw it, and split it into two routes meeting in either Flushing or Parkchester...

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For the Bx10 removal on Jerome Avenue, if this were to happen, I would suggest that Bee-Line Route 4 / 20 / 21 would be allowed to do pick ups an drop offs entirely in the Bronx. Because there are people who use the Bx10 to get to/from the stores between Mosh and Gun Hill.

 

or merge with bx16 and call it done OR extreme measures to boost ridership insert evil laugh queens cough queens WESTERN THAT IS

 

 

Doing that would add extra time since you would need the bus to go up Katonah Avenue then via Van Cortlandt Pk Ave down. Its possiable, but idk whats the ridership number between Katonah & Van Cortlandt Pk Ave E on 233rd.

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or merge with bx16 and call it done OR extreme measures to boost ridership insert evil laugh queens cough queens WESTERN THAT IS

 

 

What are you smokin'? The Bx16 and Bx34 doesn't go anywhere near Queens, or even the RFK Bridge in this matter, this'll totally screw up the service and riders wouldn't like the delays this will cause on the Bx16 & Bx34. :face-palm:

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In my opinion, what NYC should need is a better traffic light system and clearer "solid/no passing" lanes, as well as some lane geometry overhauled, common cause of conjestion is due to lane switches, irregularly drawn lanes and busses and trucks being blocked by lane switches, double parking and more. Maybe, we should learn some stuff from Weehawken, New Jersey.

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For the Bx10 removal on Jerome Avenue, if this were to happen, I would suggest that Bee-Line Route 4 / 20 / 21 would be allowed to do pick ups an drop offs entirely in the Bronx. Because there are people who use the Bx10 to get to/from the stores between Mosh and Gun Hill.

 

That's how it should be anyway, with or without the removal of the Bx10.....

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wouldnt know I meant to say express between bronx and queens like a queens version of bxm4/11 but not directly

 

 

Not gonna happen, the X32 failed, so this will fail too...

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That's how it should be anyway, with or without the removal of the Bx10.....

 

 

I would love for this to happened, but its not allowed. They just want people to use the Bx16 / Bx34 or the Bx10. I even wish Bee-Line were allowed to do drop offs along Fordham for the 60/61/62 NorthBound.

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never gonna happen W60 does not need more delays if anything it should never dropoff in bronx on northbound trips according to beeline bus OPS that is the main reason why W60/61 is so late. keystone the reason why x32 failed it only had one trip and it was geared for just students

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For the Bx6/13, I had the Bx13 go to Lafayette to get to Tiffany St and serve Barretto Point Park, silencing Hunts Point residents who cry of the lack of access to the park.

 

With the Bx15, I always felt that the 125th St traffic has hurt the route's performance. For a first-hand look, try using the Bx15 on weekends. The Bx15 arrives in 2's or 3's after a 20-minute wait along 3rd Avenue. Besides, there's plenty of buses and the (2) and (5) to reach Harlem from the South Bronx.

 

I reduced the Bx19's route in order to improve its performance, same reason why Bx41 service was cut north of Gun Hill in 2010.

 

Remember, the Bx26 serves Broadway, a different part of Riverdale than the Bx10.

 

As for the Bx28 LTD, I was thinking about it strongly. It would make limited stops between Section 5 and Paul AV, then local to 225th St.

 

The Bx16 would go to Fordham and the Bx10 to Woodlawn to allow for the elimination of the Bx34. With the latter, politics can also play a pivotal role as Woodlawn and Riverdale are often in the same political districts and district offices there would usually be in Riverdale.

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My reply:

 

1) I'm not implicating that the MTA's way of handling crowd control on the Bx6 is the best way (by extending 13's to 3rd to pick up some of the slack).... What I'm saying is, your method of having the 13 supplement most of the Bx6 in the bronx isn't the way to go either.... You're basically minimizing the 13's importance b/w the stadium & washington hgts.....

 

What should happen is, more service should be added to the Bx6 where/ when/ in what direction the usage it at its highest.....

 

2) Give me your opinion on the five [bronx - W 181st st] routes from highest to least utilized....

 

3) about the M100, yeh I figured that much.... Since you want to cut the 9 back to the mall on 225th, you needed something to cover the current 9's portion along broadway..... that is how that part of your plan came off to me.....

 

As for the Bx26, Broadway b/w 242nd (1) & county line doesn't need 2 bus routes though (your M100 & your extended Bx26).....

 

4) Yeh, I agree w/ the removal of the Bx10 along Jerome av to speed it up....

 

However, I don't get the sense that there's much travel between Woodlawn & Riverdale enough to extend the 10 up there.... The route won't benefit from an extension to Woodlawn... The 10 is more heavily used west of the reservoir than it is on the eastern side of it.... an extension to Woodlawn would only garner but so many riders anyway - at the detriment of the folks that use that route the most...

 

I still say it's good on 205th....

 

6) Ok, so you would do things differently.... I would simply branch the Bx16 out b/w serving 233rd & 238th (nereid), instead of having the 16 serve 233rd & extending the Bx23 to cover 238th (nereid)....

 

The 23 is a feeder route to PBP (6) serving co-op, and is necessary since the 50 runs LTD w/i co-op (and is coming from Queens, to boot).... You are changing the purposes of both the Bx23 & Q50 with your plans (really to botch up the Bx30).... I would leave the 30 as being the only route entering/leaving co-op from the north.....

 

8) I would just shorten the current Bx36 to Lafayette/WPR & have the LTD's take the Q44 routing b/w WPR & E tremont av... then from there, make its way to boston rd & E 180th st....Then you could have that "Bx37" of yours act as a part time route b/w Castle Hill & Fordham plz....

 

What I'm saying here:

* Bx36 LTD's: Lafayette > WPR > cross bx serv. rd > 177th > devoe > E tremont > boston > E 180th... then regular route to Washington Hgts...

 

* Bx36 locals: current Bx36 route b/w Lafayette/WPR & university av/174th

 

With the Bx36 LTD, don't underestimate its 174th St ridership. There's a high school and students who live in the Bronx River Houses go to junior high school in West Farms (since there's no JHS in Bronx River).

 

As for the current Bx13, most riders use it between the Stadium and 168th St. North of it, the Bx11 dominates due to its frequency and reliability. I cut the Bx11 to eliminate redundancy on Ogden Av and to get more ridership onto the Bx13 between 168th St and the Heights.

 

As for 181st st, the Bx13 has the least ridership on 181st St, then the Bx11, Bx35, Bx36, and Bx3.

 

Speaking of the Bx10, there's another benefit to my plan -- a quicker ride to the (D) since it would now transfer to the Bedford Park Blvd/Grand Concourse station.

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With the Bx36 LTD, don't underestimate its 174th St ridership. There's a high school and students who live in the Bronx River Houses go to junior high school in West Farms (since there's no JHS in Bronx River).

 

As for the current Bx13, most riders use it between the Stadium and 168th St. North of it, the Bx11 dominates due to its frequency and reliability. I cut the Bx11 to eliminate redundancy on Ogden Av and to get more ridership onto the Bx13 between 168th St and the Heights.

 

As for 181st st, the Bx13 has the least ridership on 181st St, then the Bx11, Bx35, Bx36, and Bx3.

 

Speaking of the Bx10, there's another benefit to my plan -- a quicker ride to the (D) since it would now transfer to the Bedford Park Blvd/Grand Concourse station.

 

- Well now wait a second.... By you suggesting moving Bx36's off 174th west of rosedale av, you're doing the exact same thing (underestimating).... From what I'm reading here of yours, only difference between what you're suggesting & what I'm suggesting is that I would still have Bx36 (locals) serving 174th (along with your "Bx37")..... Whereas you'd just have your "Bx37" serving that area....

 

- About the Bx13 & the removal of the Bx11 off ogden/plimpton, that much I figured out when I first read your plans (to boost usage on the 13)....

It was (and still is) the extending of it to out to Hunts Point I find that isn't justified - Even if Bx6's are being bombarded.....

 

- What you gave an answer to, wasn't really what I was asking about those 5 routes..... I wasn't talking about just it's usages to/from/along W. 181st.....

Anyway, I would stop to say the Bx13 is the least used, then the 11, then the 35, then the 3, with the 36 being the most used of the 5 routes in their totalities...... Just from my vantage points anyway... Someone posted the ridership stats not too long ago, so I'm sure someone would double check to see how accurate my visual assessments are.....

 

- lol.... about the Bx10, I thought that (benefit) was obvious.....

Edited by B35 via Church

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- Well now wait a second.... By you suggesting moving Bx36's off 174th west of rosedale av, you're doing the exact same thing (underestimating).... From what I'm reading here of yours, only difference between what you're suggesting & what I'm suggesting is that I would still have Bx36 (locals) serving 174th (along with your "Bx37")..... Whereas you'd just have your "Bx37" serving that area....

 

- About the Bx13 & the removal of the Bx11 off ogden/plimpton, that much I figured out when I first read your plans (to boost usage on the 13)....

It was (and still is) the extending of it to out to Hunts Point I find that isn't justified - Even if Bx6's are being bombarded.....

 

- What you gave an answer to, wasn't really what I was asking about those 5 routes..... I wasn't talking about just it's usages to/from/along W. 181st.....

Anyway, I would stop to say the Bx13 is the least used, then the 11, then the 35, then the 3, with the 36 being the most used of the 5 routes in their totalities...... Just from my vantage points anyway... Someone posted the ridership stats not too long ago, so I'm sure someone would double check to see how accurate my visual assessments are.....

 

- lol.... about the Bx10, I thought that (benefit) was obvious.....

 

I would have my Bx37 run slightly more frequent than the Bx36 locals during rush hours.

Headways for Bx37: 6 mins during rush hrs, 8 mins during middays, 10 mins during weekends/evenings, no late nights

 

Not to mention, taking the bx36 off 174th would eliminate a good chunk of the turns, and bypass traffic at West Farms Square and along the 174th St bridge.

Edited by cotb16

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never gonna happen W60 does not need more delays if anything it should never dropoff in bronx on northbound trips according to beeline bus OPS that is the main reason why W60/61 is so late. keystone the reason why x32 failed it only had one trip and it was geared for just students

 

 

 

Bee-Line should consider a 60 Limited, has thats pretty long. Especially with heavy ridership along US Route 1.

 

 

For the Bx6/13, I had the Bx13 go to Lafayette to get to Tiffany St and serve Barretto Point Park, silencing Hunts Point residents who cry of the lack of access to the park.

 

With the Bx15, I always felt that the 125th St traffic has hurt the route's performance. For a first-hand look, try using the Bx15 on weekends. The Bx15 arrives in 2's or 3's after a 20-minute wait along 3rd Avenue. Besides, there's plenty of buses and the (2) and (5) to reach Harlem from the South Bronx.

 

I reduced the Bx19's route in order to improve its performance, same reason why Bx41 service was cut north of Gun Hill in 2010.

 

Remember, the Bx26 serves Broadway, a different part of Riverdale than the Bx10.

 

As for the Bx28 LTD, I was thinking about it strongly. It would make limited stops between Section 5 and Paul AV, then local to 225th St.

 

The Bx16 would go to Fordham and the Bx10 to Woodlawn to allow for the elimination of the Bx34. With the latter, politics can also play a pivotal role as Woodlawn and Riverdale are often in the same political districts and district offices there would usually be in Riverdale.

 

 

 

-For the Bx15, I understand there is a traffic problem, but the Bx15 is not the only route that deals with traffic issues, you also got the M60, M100, M101 dealing with it too. The M101 is much longer then the Bx15 which deals with a lot more traffic when it hits Midtown. The solution to 125th Streets issue is installing bus lanes and enforcement.

 

-For the Bx13, then I would suggest artics or additional buses. This route gets pretty packed at River Avenue going Northbound. Who knows if it gets much more heat if it were extended.

 

-For the Bx19, there are people who ride to Manhattan with it north of Westchester Avenue. People will surely not be pleased with the loss of the Bx19. An alternative would be to send up the Bx27 which might help in passenger numbers for the Bx19 if traveling between Fordham and Westchester Ave.

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Bee-Line should consider a 60 Limited, has thats pretty long. Especially with heavy ridership along US Route 1.

 

 

 

 

-For the Bx15, I understand there is a traffic problem, but the Bx15 is not the only route that deals with traffic issues, you also got the M60, M100, M101 dealing with it too. The M101 is much longer then the Bx15 which deals with a lot more traffic when it hits Midtown. The solution to 125th Streets issue is installing bus lanes and enforcement.

 

-For the Bx13, then I would suggest artics or additional buses. This route gets pretty packed at River Avenue going Northbound. Who knows if it gets much more heat if it were extended.

 

-For the Bx19, there are people who ride to Manhattan with it north of Westchester Avenue. People will surely not be pleased with the loss of the Bx19. An alternative would be to send up the Bx27 which might help in passenger numbers for the Bx19 if traveling between Fordham and Westchester Ave.

 

 

A good chunk of the Bx13's crowd at Yankee Stadium (heading to Highbridge) come from the Bx6.

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A good chunk of the Bx13's crowd at Yankee Stadium (heading to Highbridge) come from the Bx6.

 

 

From which direction? West or Eastbound Bx6 Customers?

 

I do agree that the Bx13 could get extended, even if its up to 3rd Avenue. That AM Rush only service i don't get the point.

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From which direction? West or Eastbound Bx6 Customers?

 

I do agree that the Bx13 could get extended, even if its up to 3rd Avenue. That AM Rush only service i don't get the point.

 

Westbound. As for the Bx13 to 3rd Av, it should run more often than just AM Rush hours. The Bx6 is crowded during most of the weekday as those getting out of court hearings or the social services (like Welfare or Social Security) use it during middays.

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How about swapping the M2 & Bx6 north of 155th.....

 

The increase in pax that would come from Bx6's at 168th st could very well justify an increase in service....

Instead of having to bother with extending Bx13's to supplement the Bx6.....

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How about swapping the M2 & Bx6 north of 155th.....

 

The increase in pax that would come from Bx6's at 168th st could very well justify an increase in service....

Instead of having to bother with extending Bx13's to supplement the Bx6.....

 

 

It would be a longer ride for Bx6 riders to either the (1) at Broadway or the M100/101 at Amsterdam Avenue. Besides, taking the M2 from Edgecombe would mean Harlem riders losing access to Columbia Presbyterian.

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It would be a longer ride for Bx6 riders to either the (1) at Broadway or the M100/101 at Amsterdam Avenue.

 

Besides, taking the M2 from Edgecombe would mean Harlem riders losing access to Columbia Presbyterian.

...and extending the Bx13 would make for a (much) longer wait for a bus to washington heights....

 

 

In any event:

1) At the expense of Bronx patrons having a chance to catch the (A) express, I'd say it's well worth it.....

 

2) The M2 takes an indirect path to Columbia Presbyterian as it is... It takes Edgecombe b/c the M3 runs on Amsterdam (that wasn't done by accident either)...

- Harlem riders can (and do) take the 100/101 there, for a number of reasons...

- Madison av riders (those south of 110th, that is) seeking that area can take the M3... Come to think of it, if the M2 continued west on 155th, then you could have M3's short turn on 168th....

 

...then you can instantiate M3 LTD's (which I think should happen anyway).... LTD service would run the full route from 191st to E. village (LTD's make all local stops b/w 191st & 168th)... M3 locals would start at 168th.... M3 LTD service would run the same way M2 LTD's do..... M2 LTD's would run the same way M1 LTD's do (which is rush hrs. only).....

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...and extending the Bx13 would make for a (much) longer wait for a bus to washington heights....

 

 

In any event:

1) At the expense of Bronx patrons having a chance to catch the (A) express, I'd say it's well worth it.....

 

2) The M2 takes an indirect path to Columbia Presbyterian as it is... It takes Edgecombe b/c the M3 runs on Amsterdam (that wasn't done by accident either)...

- Harlem riders can (and do) take the 100/101 there, for a number of reasons...

- Madison av riders (those south of 110th, that is) seeking that area can take the M3... Come to think of it, if the M2 continued west on 155th, then you could have M3's short turn on 168th....

 

...then you can instantiate M3 LTD's (which I think should happen anyway).... LTD service would run the full route from 191st to E. village (LTD's make all local stops b/w 191st & 168th)... M3 locals would start at 168th.... M3 LTD service would run the same way M2 LTD's do..... M2 LTD's would run the same way M1 LTD's do (which is rush hrs. only).....

 

 

Love the M2/3 idea, just that this is the Bronx proposal thread, not Manhattan... but, the M3 should have been the full time 5th Avenue LTD, considering it's length.

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