RollOver Posted April 27, 2014 Share #51 Posted April 27, 2014 For me, quite frankly, no line is the worst in the system. Every trains and buses have their ups and downs. If any line has a reliability problem, then efforts should be made to solve that reliability problem. However, given the current ridership levels and constant construction work during the off-peak hours, adding more service won't solve nothing at all. It would only lead to more empty than crowded trains/buses as well as more delays and congestion along the way. Best case is to not add more service during this point of time and leave well enough alone. Now, I'll gladly give out my reasons of why I care about the current service patterns on each line for what they are. This is actually my 'best/positive' list (or whatever you wanna call it...). Any who... : I love the Broadway Bridge crossing, the elevated portion of its route and its southern terminal at South Ferry. I'm glad they got rid of the 1/9 skip-stop because they only skip about 3-4 stations and ran local for the rest of its run. It was completely pointless and almost every local station north of 96th Street have very higher usage. : the IRT White Plains Road corridor has some interesting-built features and the express run in Manhattan is quite fast. : is one of the 7 part-time lines in the system, serving as a additional service for the Lenox/7th Avenue and Eastern Parkway/Livonia Avenue corridors without having to run more 2 and 4 services, respectively. It provides a connection between the West Side, Manhattan and Brownsville/East New York, Brooklyn. : the IRT Jerome Avenue corridors offers nice views of the surrounding areas in the Bronx, as well as Yankee Stadium. It is also one of the most crowded lines and one of the only three lines to currently directly serve the East Side, Manhattan. : is one of the 7 part-time lines in the system, serving as an additional service to the White Plains Road/Lexington Avenue and Nostrand Avenue corridors without having to run more 2 and 4 services, respectively. It provides a connection via the East Side, Manhattan between Eastchester/Wakefield, Bronx and Flatbush, Brooklyn. : one of the most crowded lines in the system and one of the only three lines to currently directly serve the East Side, Manhattan. : the IRT Flushing corridor offers nice views of the surrounding areas in Queens and the express run relieves crowding for long-distance riders traveling between Flushing, Queens & Midtown Manhattan. / : The former is the system's longest route. Its express run relieves crowding for long-distance riders traveling to/from the central business districts between Upper Manhattan and eastern Brooklyn & Queens respectively. The views across Jamaica Bay, Atlantic Ocean and the Rockaway peninsula are amazing. The latter is basically the shorten version of the former that serves all local stations on the 8th Avenue/Fulton Street corridor, originating & terminating at 168th Street and Euclid Avenue, respectively. : Its express run relieves crowding for long-distance riders traveling between eastern Queens and Midtown & Downtown Manhattan. : one of the 7 part-time lines in the system, supplementing/evening out loads with the D in the Bronx and Manhattan, and the Q in Brooklyn. : Its express run relieves crowding for long-distance riders traveling to/from Midtown Manhattan between the Bronx and South Brooklyn. The Grand Concourse corridor is very unique and the West End corridor offers nice views of South Brooklyn. : Its express run on the northern side of its route relieves crowding for long-distance riders traveling between eastern Queens and Midtown & Downtown Manhattan. The elevated portion of the Culver corridor is very unique. : one of the 7 part-time lines in the system, supplementing four other lines along its run. : only line in the system to not serve Manhattan and is a crosstown route between Queens & Brooklyn. The only reason why it is 300 feet units instead of 600 feet units is because its current ridership levels can handle it. / : Skip-stop makes service attractive to long-distance riders traveling between Jamaica, Queens and Lower Manhattan, enticing them to use these two instead of the E. It has two letters so riders can tell the two skip-stop variants apart. The Jamaica corrdior and the Williamsburg Bridge offers amazing views in the northern Queens & Brooklyn. : first line in the system to use automatic train operation and its ridership grew heavily over the years. : Its express run relieves crowding for long-distance riders traveling between Midtown & Chinatown Manhattan and South Brooklyn. The views in Astoria, Queens is cool and the Sea Beach corridor looks beautiful in the winter. : It gives both Astoria and Brighton local customers direct Midtown & Chinatown Manhattan access. The Brighton corridor offers great views of southern Brooklyn, especially at Sheepshead Bay, Brighton Beach, New York Aquarium and Coney Island. : one of the 7 part-time lines in the system. It is basically a local counterpart and feeder line, as the Queens Boulevard, Broadway and 4th Avenue local tracks feed onto each other. It also allows four to five other lines to run express instead of local, so that they relieve crowding for long-distance riders traveling to/from Midtown & Downtown Manhattan between eastern Queens and southern Brooklyn, respectively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfanrod Posted April 27, 2014 Author Share #52 Posted April 27, 2014 I hate the it's a supplement but not always reliable and is always stuck ppl rather the and often switch to in Brooklyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S78 via Hylan Posted April 28, 2014 Share #53 Posted April 28, 2014 I hate the it's a supplement but not always reliable and is always stuck ppl rather the and often switch to in BrooklynFor me, the is better. I'm not saying the sucks, but at least on the , I can almost always get a seat even during rush hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biGC323232 Posted April 28, 2014 Share #54 Posted April 28, 2014 For me, the is better. I'm not saying the sucks, but at least on the , I can almost always get a seat even during rush hour. I like the also..Just the other day like three (5)'s came in before one ...i was shocked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted April 28, 2014 Share #55 Posted April 28, 2014 I agree. The is not as heavily used as the . It seems to be this way even on the Brooklyn IRT. I'm not exactly clear on why because the TPH should be the same: 15 TPH rush hours, 7.5 TPH middays. Could it be because of the differences in passenger demands from the outlying neighborhoods the two routes serve? From what I've seen from in the Bronx and Brooklyn alike, the is crowded but not crushloaded like the sister route. Totally stumped on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S78 via Hylan Posted April 28, 2014 Share #56 Posted April 28, 2014 Like you said, it could be passenger demands. As a response to trainfanrod, it usually depends on what shows up first. Say at Franklin Avenue, if people coming off of a or want to go to Flatbush, they will hop on a if it were the next arriving train. Now if the clocks show that a is 10 minutes away and a is 3 minutes away, then they will go with the latter. I've seen this happen at Nevins St too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted April 28, 2014 Share #57 Posted April 28, 2014 Like you said, it could be passenger demands. As a response to trainfanrod, it usually depends on what shows up first. Say at Franklin Avenue, if people coming off of a or want to go to Flatbush, they will hop on a if it were the next arriving train. Now if the clocks show that a is 10 minutes away and a is 3 minutes away, then they will go with the latter. I've seen this happen at Nevins St too. I see what trainfanrod means too upon rethinking it. What you stated are good points, thats exactly what happened on the Brooklyn IRT because I do that as a Brooklyn commuter lol. I just wanted to add that the spur @ 149 Grand Concourse limits the frequency of trains accessing the Lexington Ave line from Jerome or the WPR. The engineers who built the spur (during the Dual Contract days for the IRT when the Lexington Ave line to 125th was constructed and incorporated it into the Lafayette Street subway to make todays complete MTA NYC Transit Lexington Ave Line), actually made an oversight in its design. They should have infrastructure wise made it a better suited junction for future needs. Its really a tight squeeze and I believe that forces the T/D's to coordinate the trains in such a way that the service patterns can be thrown off sometimes. Its similar in scope of a problem to how the Dual Contract engineers screwed up on the Dekalb Ave interlocking on the BMT, its actually the same problem and it creates a train dispatcher nightmare daily. You can't fit 8 tracks from BMT 4th Ave and Brighton into a six track station then over a bridge! Not happening. Same with the IRT 149th Street/GC spur. Two tracks cannot accommodate proper service on the WPR or Dyre. Not happening. Plus it mitigates flow on the from Jerome into 125th from 149th, upper level. For this reason, I used to experience horrendous delays on the when I used to come into Manhattan from the Bronx before I relocated to Brooklyn. The City Of New York knew this, they should have pushed the SAS a long time ago with the Bronx spur to solve the problem. The updated FEIS study in progress will include the blueprints for SAS phase 2 with a Bronx spur provision. That seems to be the only solution to this problem we are all seeing in regards to the IRT H system, its feeder lines into it from the Bronx and Brooklyn and the problems with service. So I guess what this comes down to is an antiquated subway system against the growing passenger needs of today which it may not be able to continue to handle? Thats what I am beginning to think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted April 28, 2014 Share #58 Posted April 28, 2014 I see what trainfanrod means too upon rethinking it. What you stated are good points, thats exactly what happened on the Brooklyn IRT because I do that as a Brooklyn commuter lol. I just wanted to add that the spur @ 149 Grand Concourse limits the frequency of trains accessing the Lexington Ave line from Jerome or the WPR. The engineers who built the spur (during the Dual Contract days for the IRT when the Lexington Ave line to 125th was constructed and incorporated it into the Lafayette Street subway to make todays complete MTA NYC Transit Lexington Ave Line), actually made an oversight in its design. They should have infrastructure wise made it a better suited junction for future needs. Its really a tight squeeze and I believe that forces the T/D's to coordinate the trains in such a way that the service patterns can be thrown off sometimes. Its similar in scope of a problem to how the Dual Contract engineers screwed up on the Dekalb Ave interlocking on the BMT, its actually the same problem and it creates a train dispatcher nightmare daily. You can't fit 8 tracks from BMT 4th Ave and Brighton into a six track station then over a bridge! Not happening. Same with the IRT 149th Street/GC spur. Two tracks cannot accommodate proper service on the WPR or Dyre. Not happening. Plus it mitigates flow on the from Jerome into 125th from 149th, upper level. For this reason, I used to experience horrendous delays on the when I used to come into Manhattan from the Bronx before I relocated to Brooklyn. The City Of New York knew this, they should have pushed the SAS a long time ago with the Bronx spur to solve the problem. The updated FEIS study in progress will include the blueprints for SAS phase 2 with a Bronx spur provision. That seems to be the only solution to this problem we are all seeing in regards to the IRT H system, its feeder lines into it from the Bronx and Brooklyn and the problems with service. So I guess what this comes down to is an antiquated subway system against the growing passenger needs of today which it may not be able to continue to handle? Thats what I am beginning to think. The MTA will soon realize (if it hasn't already) it has no choice but to connect the 2 Avenue line to one of the Bronx elevated lines. It's cheaper than creating a new tunnel up the Bronx, and as the plan currently stands, you basically have the entirety of the Bronx feeding into 4 tracks (the only 4 which serve the east side of Manhattan) with the and diverting some of the load away to the west side and central Manhattan. The transfer from the , , , and MetroNorth to the 2 Avenue line isn't going to cut it because by 125 Street, all of the Bronx passengers are concentrated inside one station complex creating a chokepoint! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priincenene Posted April 28, 2014 Share #59 Posted April 28, 2014 For me, the is better. I'm not saying the sucks, but at least on the , I can almost always get a seat even during rush hour. The is actually better. Because the doesn't really come that fast and the sometimes replaces the . The isn't that crowded as the tho, the is also crowded because it runs express and the not as much crowded Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfanrod Posted April 28, 2014 Author Share #60 Posted April 28, 2014 its just weird to me but growing up i see that the coming from into brooklyn is the least respected i guess because it dont always run to flatbush and only during the day so others rather take the since its always running probably similar along white plains rd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S78 via Hylan Posted April 28, 2014 Share #61 Posted April 28, 2014 Well during the midday, the isn't that crowded in Brooklyn, but during rush hours, noticeably PM commute, I've seen the crowded even past Franklin Av. Not to mention, I've lived near the and and used them both for three years. Both are used very well. You should ride the line during the AM rush. You'll see how bad it gets. Since you grew up riding the , you probably didn't see the being used often in Brooklyn, because it only used to go there during rush hours, but ever since it began running to Brooklyn all day, ridership has definitely increased. It really helps when the is delayed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfanrod Posted April 28, 2014 Author Share #62 Posted April 28, 2014 Yeah that can be it since its not my home line the and is my home lines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollOver Posted April 28, 2014 Share #63 Posted April 28, 2014 Normally the are always slightly less crowded/frequent than the every rush hour. During the AM peak, the two Brodway-7th Avenue routes always fill up from their southernmost branches, but many of the riders are headed towards East Midtown and/or the Upper East Side. The few that do want the west side of Manhattan remain on the two Broadway-7th Avenue routes respectively. They fill up again by the time they get to Alantic/Nevins and then the crowds are all gone again by at least either Chambers Street or 42nd-Times Square. Anyways, like you guys said, the do a job-well-done in supplementing the for many reasons. No way should a part-time line get cut for the sake of improving service on a full-time line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missabassie Posted May 1, 2014 Share #64 Posted May 1, 2014 While it is by no means the worst line, I must say the definitely needs improvements in headways, especially on weekends. Might as well add the to that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosskin92 Posted May 1, 2014 Share #65 Posted May 1, 2014 R32s are the worst simply because they attract foamers wherever they go. So the are the worst. These comments piss me off. You're in, what, Toronto, and you're trying to tell me how these lines are just filled with foamers? Here's a secret, I commuted on the for years and I was on the / frequently during the R32 swap last summer and it was an incredibly rare occasion to see a railfan. Even in the first week it was truly a rarity. This isn't Tokyo; there aren't crowds at stations except for extremely rare events. "Foamer" is a stupid term anyway that this whole community could do without. I agree, i take pictures all the time. Actually , here is one i took a few days ago. I only so it because i find the city and transit so cool! Also, imo the worst train is no train. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted May 1, 2014 Share #66 Posted May 1, 2014 While it is by no means the worst line, I must say the definitely needs improvements in headways, especially on weekends. Might as well add the to that... Totally agree. As far as the is concerned while there are many impediments infrastructure-wise that slows down IND 6th Ave Local/Queens Blvd Exp service such as the inadequate layout of the Bergen St interlocking the main problem is that they need to up the TPH on weekends. I fail to understand why operations planning are not considering this at this time when the IND Queens Blvd Line is second in highest ridership in the US, only to fall second place to the IRT Lexington Ave Line. I imagine that a good alternative is to let the fly all the way to Forest Hills on weekends, instead of just Essex St as they are planning to implement soon. It just makes no sense to me. Als agreed on the on weekends. On weekdays the Concourse/6th Ave Exp runs very well with some exceptions (it often gets held up at 145th St and the merge with the Washington Heights Line or the fact that 205th Street offers poor turnaround times as it was not meant to be built as a terminal) on weekends the waits can be annoying. The trains can become crushloaded coming down from the Bronx, even if there isnt a GO. As we all discussed this before, many of us came to the agreement that the answer is to up CPW express service service on weekends to accommodate Bronx residents when compared to the weekend option that can cause problems on the weekends. I mean I'm sure the Sith Ave Line can clearly handle the capacity on weekdays so why not weekends with the bump in these two services? Maybe the MTA simply doesnt want to pay for it as usual? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfanrod Posted May 1, 2014 Author Share #67 Posted May 1, 2014 i dont ride it often but the is the most express train next to the and in Qns is it me or do they make IND skip more stops than BMT n IRT All trains do have its pros n cons i guess its all different from what trains you need to use and wha stops theres trains i never rode in bx qns because i dont need those routes so ya input give me a visual Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollOver Posted May 1, 2014 Share #68 Posted May 1, 2014 The , , , and have the longest express runs. You could also say the too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traingoat Posted May 2, 2014 Share #69 Posted May 2, 2014 The flushing line between Queens Plaza and Woodside is a good run in distance and while in stations is not that large. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjbr40 Posted May 2, 2014 Share #70 Posted May 2, 2014 Rollover don't forget the had good stretch from chambers to 96 street Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biGC323232 Posted May 2, 2014 Share #71 Posted May 2, 2014 Rollover don't forget the had good stretch from chambers to 96 street Right on.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjbr40 Posted May 2, 2014 Share #72 Posted May 2, 2014 I have to say this right now. The train is the worst. They keep getting @@k up a lot. With derailment today, derailment near 7 ave and Prospect Park. Tons of delays along the brooklyn and queens corridors. The other days i waited like 15 minutes around 11 am for a Brooklyn bound train at West $ street. it was actually 14 Street but i got on the because that stop is so smelly to breathe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missabassie Posted May 2, 2014 Share #73 Posted May 2, 2014 I have to say this right now. The train is the worst. They keep getting @@k up a lot. With derailment today, derailment near 7 ave and Prospect Park. Tons of delays along the brooklyn and queens corridors. The other days i waited like 15 minutes around 11 am for a Brooklyn bound train at West $ street. it was actually 14 Street but i got on the because that stop is so smelly to breathe. It's not the worst line, it just has many issues.... IMO the gets dumped on more than most, but that's for another discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfanrod Posted May 3, 2014 Author Share #74 Posted May 3, 2014 the is always bad because its the only line on the east side Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfanrod Posted May 4, 2014 Author Share #75 Posted May 4, 2014 THEY JUST NEED TO Make the run longer run cuz its the only train that runs for like 2 hrs a day which is useless but i doubt the mta got space to supply the with more trains since they come out and go into ENY/bway junction yard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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