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R188 Discussion Thread


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There is somewhat a solution for (2) and (5) using  R62A. Just like the (6) and (7) they have two strips for local / express. They COULD do that with one strip as the (2) and one strip as the (5). Now the only hassle is rollsign business..

That's where the hassle is. That's why Transit doesn't want R62As on the (2) and/or (5) and I don't blame them. Same goes for R68s on the (N) and/or (Q) because those two lines have the same issue at Ditmars Blvd that the 2 and 5 have at Flatbush Ave.

 

Yep. Installing any new electronic signs on the older trains outside of the 46s would require rewiring the entire train. That's why the proposal also included redoing the PA system as well.

If so, then didn't they have to do that when they installed the digital front route signs on the R32s and 38s during GOH? I really don't like those tiny digital route signs. They're much harder to see than the front roll signs the R32s and 38s had pre-GOH and they ruined the classy look of those cars up front. Anyone know why the Redbirds got to keep their front rolls and marker lights after GOH, while the R32s and 38s had to lose theirs?

Edited by T to Dyre Avenue
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That's where the hassle is. That's why Transit doesn't want R62As on the (2) and/or (5) and I don't blame them. Same goes for R68s on the (N) and/or (Q) because those two lines have the same issue at Ditmars Blvd that the 2 and 5 have at Flatbush Ave.

At least with the N and Q, they really only have to change the route letter, which are right next to each other on the 68s, as opposed to changing both the north terminal as well as the route sign.

 

 

If so, then didn't they have to do that when they installed the digital front route signs on the R32s and 38s during GOH? I really don't like those tiny digital route signs. They're much harder to see than the front roll signs the R32s and 38s had pre-GOH and they ruined the classy look of those cars up front. Anyone know why the Redbirds got to keep their front rolls and marker lights after GOH, while the R32s and 38s had to lose theirs?

The 32s and 38s received the flipdot signs because the air conditioner components in the front of the train's interior made it difficult to change the overhead signs. If that wasn't the case, we'd likely still see standard rollsigns on those cars. For what it's worth, I'm in complete agreement concerning the legibility of the older rollsigns over the flipdots.

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Does anyone know why when your in a 7 Express train, the display still says (7)? On the 6 it says

 

<6> PELHAM BAY PARK etc, but on the 7 Express it still says (7), not <7>.

When the LEDs were still being installed, the front rollsign would be changed also, but once they were fully installed, many instances with needing to get the trains out, the front and the side LEDs were often mismatch with express in the front and side local and it was actually a local train and with local front and side express with it actually being a local train, etc. TA just felt it was better to let the LEDs tell the story of the train and they handed out pamphlets saying to check the LEDs for what train it is instead of the front signs. On the (6) they are changed probably due to the destination differences unlike the (7) with the same ones and just different stops.

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The Remaining R142A's are going to the 4 because Westchester Yard don't want them and don't wanna have to maintain them , so while those go to the 4 , to fill the void on the missing R142A's on the 6 will be R62A's from the 1 , those broadway sets you see on the 6 aren't there because flushing cant send more R62As its to replace the R142A's that have started going to the 4  , and to replace the missing R62As on the 1 will be R62s from the 3 . The reason for those new R188s is because eventually they will be C cars once all the converted R188s are in service. 

 

As others have said, this is nonsense. There's no room for more 4 trains on Lex, so there's no point in increasing the fleet size on the 4. At the same time, you're shorting the 3.

 

There are only two options that would have made any sense: either the R62A's go from the 7 to the 6, or the R62A's go from the 7 to the 4. We all know which of those two options was chosen.

 

Anyways, a member has just said that he heard it as well but a member on this forum came on chat one night and announced this and he explained that the (MTA) has been getting complaints from passengers about the R142's on the (2) (which is true, there is some probs) with the R142 on the (2) and either this is a command from the (MTA) itself or Westchester decided to swap their R62A's from the (7) with 239th St.

 

The overwhelming majority of subway riders don't care about one car class as opposed to another, as long as the air conditioning is working. And to the extent that some riders do have preferences, NYCT has never had a policy of assigning cars based on those preferences. Car assignments are based on what makes the most operational sense.

 

And individual shops don't get to decide what cars they're assigned. Those decisions are made on a systemwide basis.

 

That I didn't know, I thought flushing had more cars which is why I thought those extra sets 7811-7898 were for.

 

http://www.thejoekorner.com/carassignments/irt-2014-06-16.html

 

The 6 runs 40 trains (400 cars); the 7 runs 32 trains (352 cars) - and don't forget that the 7 is getting 126 new cars in addition to the cars transferred from the 6.

 

I'm getting information (again NOT ACCURATE, I'm not saying that I KNOW of it, as I'm clearly saying that I HEARD OF IT before any accusations start) from people that I know SHOULD NOT be trusted. I only share it for a confirmation. And I won't be afraid to release who the people are. 

 

Let me clear this up:

I WILL NOT RELEASE THE NAMES HERE, I WILL IF IT DOES HAVE AN IMPACT ON ME.

- One person has told me they got notified by a motorman that works the (6) that he laid up R142s 6661-6670 one day. Again, have no clue if this is true or false.

- Another person is stating that the R142A's will be going to the (4) and that westchester HATES R62A because they are lazy & don't want to change signs. That comes to the statement by another person that R142 from the (2) will be going to the (6) and that R62A will be heading to the 7th Ave Line.

- Another person states that all R142A will be converted for fleet compatibility. Again, I highly doubt it was true although he did seem like a worker. That is why I didn't share it until now. 

- They are also stating that an R62 from the (3) was once on the (6) .

 

ONCE AGAIN, I AM NOT THE ONE WHO IS MAKING THIS UP, I AM THE ONE WHO IS SHARING THIS TO GET FURTHER INFORMATION ON WHETHER THIS IS RELEVANT OR IRRELEVANT INFORMATION I WILL BE SHARING THEIR NAMES (in which I really don't want to) IF I POSSIBLY GET INVOLVED OR ACCUSED FOR FALSE INFO

 

An isolated sighting of a foreign car class is meaningless. Maybe a 5 train was diverted up the Pelham line (to fill a gap in 6 service or because of a blockage on the Jerome or WPR line) and it ran in 6 service for a trip or two and was laid up at Westchester temporarily.

 

If the crews on the 6 line are too lazy to do their jobs, they should be disciplined or fired. Wholesale car fleets are not reassigned to accommodate somebody's desire to not do his or her job.

 

Converting all of the R142A's to R188's would be an incredible waste of money. The R188 contract doesn't call for it, nor is it funded. It's not happening.

 

I guess it's possible that some people find unsubstantiated rumors interesting or exciting. I suspect that you're making them up to try to fool others (it doesn't seem to be working well), or maybe your friends made them up and fooled you.

 

The (2) and   (5) are staying with what they have just due to the fact that there isn't enough R62A's to cover service and that they also swap cars at flatbush constantly so the crew there wouldn't wanna have to go back to constantly changing rollsigns when with an R142 just press a button and change the route for the train .

 

It has nothing to do with what the crew wants and everything to do with the need to pump trains through Flatbush Avenue terminal as fast as possible in order to maintain the intense rush hour service there. (Even the midday service there is incredibly intense - aside from Brooklyn Bridge, which doesn't really count, I can't think of any other terminal that runs a 4 minute headway straight through the midday.) Holding the train at the terminal for five or ten minutes as the crew cranks the signs from 2 to 5 just isn't an option. If the 2 were to get any R62A's, they simply wouldn't be reassigned as 5's at Flatbush (barring a massive gap in service). Back in the redbird days, 2-5 swaps were uncommon.

 

There is somewhat a solution for (2) and (5) using  R62A. Just like the (6) and (7) they have two strips for local / express. They COULD do that with one strip as the (2) and one strip as the (5). Now the only hassle is rollsign business..

 

The strip maps aren't the issue. (When R142 2 trains and R142 5 trains swap places, the strip maps are all wrong.) The issue is that the trains don't spend enough time at the terminal to have all of the signs cranked from 2 to 5 or 5 to 2.

 

Yup. They claim its impossible because of the aged space age era technology in circuits incorporated into the boards. Then again they did do it with the R44's/46's. I remember that study.

 

The R44 and R46 originally came with rollsigns remote-controlled from the cabs. The wiring for that system was recycled into the digital signs when they were installed.

 

The R62 and R68 never had such wiring.

 

In any case, the idea to retrofit the R62/R68 with digital signage was Jay Walder's. When he left, the idea died.

 

So I'm being told that there is literally NOTHING in the CBTC box right now? True or false?

 

Kawasaki is producing CBTC-ready cars in the R188 contract. Thales (the CBTC contractor) will come in at a later date and install the CBTC equipment.

 

The 32s and 38s received the flipdot signs because the air conditioner components in the front of the train's interior made it difficult to change the overhead signs. If that wasn't the case, we'd likely still see standard rollsigns on those cars. For what it's worth, I'm in complete agreement concerning the legibility of the older rollsigns over the flipdots.

 

Difficult? I think you're understating the case. The R32/R38 air conditioning unit completely blocked the panel that needed to be opened in order to crank the rollsign.

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When the LEDs were still being installed, the front rollsign would be changed also, but once they were fully installed, many instances with needing to get the trains out, the front and the side LEDs were often mismatch with express in the front and side local and it was actually a local train and with local front and side express with it actually being a local train, etc. TA just felt it was better to let the LEDs tell the story of the train and they handed out pamphlets saying to check the LEDs for what train it is instead of the front signs. On the (6) they are changed probably due to the destination differences unlike the (7) with the same ones and just different stops.

I meant an R188 7 Express Train. Sorry.

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Difficult? I think you're understating the case. The R32/R38 air conditioning unit completely blocked the panel that needed to be opened in order to crank the rollsign.

 

Is THAT what the low ceiling at the front and back of various cars is for??? I've been confused by it for the longest time... this makes a lot of sense. :D

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Was this said in a document of some sort? Very surprising that they managed to fit R44/46s with digital signs, but not R62/68. Hell, they even managed to do it with the R32s/R38s, I don't understand why it wouldn't be possible on the 62/68.

The original R44s and R46s had rollsigns that were electrically controlled from the conductors cab. It was found that the intercar wiring that supported this functionality was suitable for the implementation of those LCD signs on the rebuilt R44s and R46s. They just took the old sign units out and hooked up the LCD units to the existing wiring.

The R62/As and R68/As don't have this intercar wiring as they were built with rollsigns.

 

That luminator flipdot sign on the R32s and R38s is standalone. Changing the flipdot on one end of the train will not change the flipdot on the other end. all the wiring apparatus to support this functionality is contained in the bulkhead of the cars, which was done during GOH.

Edited by Dj Hammers
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The person who is stating that all R142A will be converted for fleet compatibility is a former motorman, so this is pretty confusing...

LOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

No that's not the confusing part. The confusing part is why you would take the word of anyone who's not on the property anymore. I don't take the word of a majority of the people who are still active employees and wait to see things happen with my own eyes yet you take the word of someone who's not active. Now that's the confusing part.

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LOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

No that's not the confusing part. The confusing part is why you would take the word of anyone who's not on the property anymore. I don't take the word of a majority of the people who are still active employees and wait to see things happen with my own eyes yet you take the word of someone who's not active. Now that's the confusing part.

 

And that's why I can no longer trust any statement from the internet pretty much...

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And that's why I can no longer trust any statement from the internet pretty much...

That's why you stop believing everything that's being posted in that MTA Transit Photos & Videos page on Facebook...

 

...I know where you heard it from, I believe nothing that guy (or what anyone else in that group) says

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Is THAT what the low ceiling at the front and back of various cars is for??? I've been confused by it for the longest time... this makes a lot of sense. :D

 

For reference, consider the redbirds. R33s never had a big box-like fixture, they had A/C units mounted in the car.

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Difficult? I think you're understating the case. The R32/R38 air conditioning unit completely blocked the panel that needed to be opened in order to crank the rollsign.

Thanks for the clarification as I was not aware of that. What little information I found was vague at best.

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BTW, to note one thing I saw yesterday... On one of the conversion sets (I think 7231-7240), I spotted graffiti on it (spray paint graffiti). Not sure if they used white spray paint, gray spray paint, silver spray paint, or any spray paint that matches with the train or if it was graffiti that was failed to clean up. It was on the side of the train, and it was the first time I've seen something like that happen to those things.......

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The person who is stating that all R142A will be converted for fleet compatibility is a former motorman, so this is pretty confusing...

Former motormen don't decide these things. Even current motormen don't decide these things. I think someone was pulling your leg.

 

And that's why I can no longer trust any statement from the internet pretty much...

A simple sanity check can work wonders. If somebody is telling you that something totally irrational is about to happen, he's probably mistaken or lying.

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I meant an R188 7 Express Train. Sorry.

Ah, that's just a bug. Somebody mentioned this awhile back, maybe they will update it at some point, who knows. While they are at it, might as well update the announcements in Manhattan from this is a Queens Bound (7) train to this is a Queens Bound (7) local/express train since the regular announcements are pretty worthless with the bug in the signs at the moment.

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7881-7885 is in service. Saw it on a <7> this morning. Not sure what it was linked up to.

 

Also 1961-1962-1963-1964-1965 are hooked up in consecutive order on the South end of a (7) train. 1961 has a full cab. They are NOT linked but coupled.

That set entered service July 17th. And it's 7877-7881, 7882-7887.

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