Fleet Swap Discussion Thread

[darkstar8983]

13 minutes ago, T to Dyre Avenue said:

Fine by me if Pitkin and Jamaica get them first. Hey, then I can ride them on a semi-regular basis. I guess installing CBTC on QBL and being able to run more trains frequently than once every two minutes already isn’t going to be enough to handle  crowds? And doesn’t the R211 base order call for only 20 open-gangway cars in order to test the feasibility of running open gangway cars?

right, but if the test is successful, then up to 750 cars will be open gangway.

Edited December 7, 2019 by darkstar8983

[Jemorie]

1 hour ago, T to Dyre Avenue said:

Fine by me if Pitkin and Jamaica get them first. Hey, then I can ride them on a semi-regular basis. I guess installing CBTC on QBL and being able to run more trains frequently than once every two minutes already isn’t going to be enough to handle  crowds? And doesn’t the R211 base order call for only 20 open-gangway cars in order to test the feasibility of running open gangway cars?

It’s physically impossible to run a train more than every 2 minutes (30 times an hour).

[Union Tpke]

34 minutes ago, Jemorie said:

It’s physically impossible to run a train more than every 2 minutes (30 times an hour).

Not true! We used to run 33 TPH on the , and 40 TPH can be run with CBTC.

[LGA Link N Train]

1 minute ago, Union Tpke said:

Not true! We used to run 33 TPH on the , and 40 TPH can be run with CBTC.

Make that 36TPH in the 1960’s. 
 

I was doodling on a piece of paper one time and calculated how many trains would run if the  ran on 1:30 Minute headway’s from Willets Point. I think I calculated about 40 or so TPH as a result. It’d be nice if this was the case with a 9-car  service. 

[Union Tpke]

1 minute ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

Make that 36TPH in the 1960’s. 
 

I was doodling on a piece of paper one time and calculated how many trains would run if the  ran on 1:30 Minute headway’s from Willets Point. I think I calculated about 40 or so TPH as a result. It’d be nice if this was the case with a 9-car  service. 

I don't trust that figure.

[LGA Link N Train]

4 minutes ago, Union Tpke said:

I don't trust that figure.

I might have to recalculate that sometime soon then. 

[Union Tpke]

1 minute ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

I might have to recalculate that sometime soon then. 

It's not that. It's that 36 was scheduled, but I don't think that it was actually reached. I need to go to bed, but when I have time, I will post a relevant article that I have mentioned a few times.

[Jemorie]

7 hours ago, VIP said:

It literally makes no sense to send back Coney Island’s R160’s when the 211’s arrive. Nobody in car assignment said anything about that and I highly doubt that they have the budget or mental capacity to do such an unnecessary swap. That’s as asinine as for example; the A division getting R262’s and putting those new cars on the  and giving the  back it’s former R142A’s. 

 

5 hours ago, T to Dyre Avenue said:

Wouldn’t it just be easier for the R211s to replace both the Pitkin/207th and the CI R46s directly? Why even send the R160s back to CI? Seems wasteful to have to spend all that time transferring so many subway cars back to their former yard after already sending them up there for CBTC operations on Queens Blvd. Just give those 211s to CI.

The former  and  swap is also another example of this, when the R32s could have simply stayed on the  (running exclusively to/from the Rockaways) till retirement and the  would have been full-length using R46s exclusively from the get-go; half of the 's fleet would have still been R46s anyways so it's not like it was the end of the world. This could have easily avoided the constant attention from the local news media that occurred in the middle of this era about the  being the worst line in the system due to old cars and all (anybody remembered all that btw?) But then again, the  has always had a habit of not thinking ahead of time and moving cars here and there every now and then, which I agree, is a waste of time and money spent. The  is not as simplistic as some of us like to think they are and look where we at now.

Anyway, while you both are not entirely in the wrong, however, keep in mind that the  are relatively busier than the  and this has nothing to do with their hours of operation. Even the  need the R211s more, not because they've been stuck with old cars for years on end, but because of growing ridership, and the  maintains 6 tph all day and evening long due to the overall current signaling system and capacity issues at Hoyt/Canal, where the two-track segment between those two stations can only maintain as far as 26 tph. Until CBTC fixes this issue, the  will be stuck with 10-minute intervals all day and evening long unless they slightly reduce  service in order to fit more s, and the  has had mostly crappy 75 footers in its fleet for a long time now.

[Calvin]

If in the future CBTC is on Queens Blvd, when it leaves Roosevelt Av in Jackson Heights or Queens Plaza/21 St-Queensbridge, does all the 160s go on CBTC bypass?

Edited December 8, 2019 by Calvin

[Railfanner Mario]

22 hours ago, subwayfan1998 said:

This year or next year? i know it suppose to be complete on fall 2021.

this year

[m2fwannabe]

On 12/6/2019 at 9:51 PM, Railfanner Mario said:

On 12/6/2019 at 9:47 PM, subwayfan1998 said:

December 23, 2019 or December 23, 2020?

CBTC on QBL suppose to be completed on fall of 2021

I heard it’s supposed be to establish by The 23rd from Jackson Heights to 71ave

First phase of CBTC HOPEFULLY Dec 2019.

Cannot no longer use non-CBTC equipment on Queens IND anywheres after that unless problems arise, but NTT's can run with or without just for the switch of a breaker(s).

Usually the reconfiguration of signals had not gone smoothly elsewhere, so may not again.

If ALL is complete by end of 2021 they'd be doing well.

Not still completely sure about Flushing Line CBTC do you?

As I recall (best trying I can) QBL is 3rd Generation.  Canarsie was 1st Gen, Flush was 2nd Gen.  Not necessarily all universal.

[RedLine]

They are only activating the express tracks so they might not need to swap all R46 trains by 12/23.

[Trainmaster5]

23 hours ago, Jchambers2120 said:

@TM5 my first time hearing this also.

I have no clue why that site refers to it as that however we officially don't refer to the A division as the northern division. We do have two 'districts' within the A div East side   GC  and West side  but that's mainly for job picking purposes. The B div does have a "North" district though. 

 

Drifting back to topic, just as I was thinking about drifting over to the B div to work the  &  lines they want to put that junk back on those lines . Grrr

We had the Lenox ,  and and the Eastern , . Broadway was by itself and the was sometimes added to the Eastern section. My whole passenger service ,  up front or in the middle,  was done in the Lenox district.  Thanks for the heads up. BTW, I'm not sure if I would base every thing that I see posted on any site that can't spell miscellaneous correctly. Carry on 

Edited December 8, 2019 by Trainmaster5

[U-BahnNYC]

On 12/6/2019 at 10:24 PM, R32 3838 said:

Also the 10 car R179's were always planned to go to the

 

I don't know why y'all want them to go to CI when they don't have the parts for the cars. 130 cars would be an oddball fleet, with a chunk of 8 car R179's on the with the 130 for the it make the most logical sense to keep an on there. 

If it's that bad, they can put the R32's on the and restrict them to rush hour use only since it's a 60 foot car. 

 

I'm tired of the we need to f**k the line over and give them hand me downs. The R46's are 45 years old, the majority of the fleet is R46's. The R32's and R179's make a small chunk of the line's fleet.

 

The hasn't gotten a full fleet of new cars since the R44's. 

 

 

Yes. The has not see a new fleet in decades. Gotta love the hypocrisy when everyone cries about every other line getting old cars.

 

On 12/6/2019 at 8:24 PM, Jemorie said:

Same.

Deal with it. It's temporary and if an old train offends you take a nice uber 🤠

[U-BahnNYC]

22 hours ago, Jemorie said:

It’s physically impossible to run a train more than every 2 minutes (30 times an hour).

It is completely possible given modern technology, all it takes is will. In Moscow and Tokyo 1 minute intervals are the norm during rush period.

[Jemorie]

15 minutes ago, U-BahnNYC said:

Yes. The has not see a new fleet in decades. Gotta love the hypocrisy when everyone cries about every other line getting old cars.

 

Deal with it. It's temporary and if an old train offends you take a nice uber 🤠

The  already has new cars. They're called R179 and soon to be R211s.

Funny how you come at me and not the other person who spent all his time spamming this thread out of everyone else. I don't even ride the  regularly anyway so I could care less. Who looks hypocritical now. You should have took your own advice all this time you've grown up on the  line. If you also read my other posts in this thread, you'd see I don't personally mind the  being R46s for the moment.

Edited December 8, 2019 by Jemorie

[U-BahnNYC]

2 minutes ago, Jemorie said:

The  already has new cars. They're called R179 and soon to be R211s.

Funny how you come at me and not the other person who spent all his time spamming this thread out of everyone else. I don't even ride the  regularly anyway so I could care less. Who looks hypocritical now.

I never singled you out on hypocrisy, and was referring to the other comments before. Yours just happened to be recent. Apologies for the lack of clarity.

[LGA Link N Train]

I’m actually glad that this swap is happening, because that means more capacity for QBL in a way. 
 

Now if only the  could get their act together when it comes to G.O.’s along QB. I had to hop on a Q60 bus just now cause Manhattan bound  Service is delayed and there’s no Queens Bound Service either, so that’s great.

[Train92]

Sorry if this was stated/asked before, but is CI only going to be keeping 7.5 R160 sets? Looking at the latest fleet assignment before the swap, JA has 396 cars of R46 (49.5 sets) and CIY has 570 cars of R160s (57 sets).

[Jemorie]

1 minute ago, Train92 said:

Sorry if this was stated/asked before, but is CI only going to be keeping 7.5 R160 sets? Looking at the latest fleet assignment before the swap, JA has 396 cars of R46 (49.5 sets) and CIY has 570 cars of R160s (57 sets).

110 cars.

[darkstar8983]

32 minutes ago, Jemorie said:

110 cars.

sounds like the R160As/R160Bs from 8653-8772 may be kept temporarily in CI until the extra cars are needed for full CBTC cutover and service increases.

[Calvin]

6 minutes ago, darkstar8983 said:

sounds like the R160As/R160Bs from 8653-8772 may be kept temporarily in CI until the extra cars are needed for full CBTC cutover and service increases.

Makes sense, since 8773 is a refurbished unit. We'll see in the future. 

Edited December 9, 2019 by Calvin

[trainfan22]

It wouldn't be surprised if those leftover 160s get sent to Jamaica anyway, just so they don't have to stock parts for three fleets at CI barn.... Just like they sent leftover 142A's on the  to the  line... still bummed about that particular swap lol. 

[Jemorie]

8 minutes ago, trainfan22 said:

It wouldn't be surprised if those leftover 160s get sent to Jamaica anyway, just so they don't have to stock parts for three fleets at CI barn.... Just like they sent leftover 142A's on the  to the  line... still bummed about that particular swap lol. 

Some members here claimed that once the R211s hit the rails, the R160s would be sent back from Jamaica to CI so that Jamaica can be mostly or fully R211s for reasons mention. In that case, I don’t see the point in moving the leftover R160s from CI to Jamaica then.

Edited December 9, 2019 by Jemorie

[JeremiahC99]

2 hours ago, U-BahnNYC said:

Deal with it. It's temporary and if an old train offends you take a nice uber 🤠

I’ve heard of people who are planning to take ubers more regularly because they hate new trains. Even if the trains run every 5 minutes, they wouldn’t give a crap.

On 12/7/2019 at 8:22 PM, Jemorie said:

Even the  need the R211s more, not because they've been stuck with old cars for years on end, but because of growing ridership, and the  maintains 6 tph all day and evening long due to the overall current signaling system and capacity issues at Hoyt/Canal, where the two-track segment between those two stations can only maintain as far as 26 tph. Until CBTC fixes this issue, the  will be stuck with 10-minute intervals all day and evening long unless they slightly reduce  service in order to fit more s, and the  has had mostly crappy 75 footers in its fleet for a long time now.

Rhe 10-minute  interval is exactly why I (and  another user) proposed that Broadway-Fulton  train connection a while back on the subway proposals thread. However, CBTC does appear to be the fastest alternative to a new tunnel.
 

And yes, as a user of the  lines every day, they really need new cars, and more service. I’m on the  at 7:20 and I’ve been on trains that were extremely crowded.