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Fleet Swap Discussion Thread

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Dope that the 32s are returning to service, as long as they go back into retirement when the 179s come back, it's fine by me😁

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As much as I love R32s, and would do almost anything to ride them again, I am not railfanning due to the pandemic. I do not recommend that you guys go out fanning, for the safety of essential workers and train crews. Crowding at the front is not safe for anyone, and makes trains unnecessarily crowded. There is no way to railfan things like this and be socially distant. STAY HOME. STAY SAFE.

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Union Tpke said:

As much as I love R32s, and would do almost anything to ride them again, I am not railfanning due to the pandemic. I do not recommend that you guys go out fanning, for the safety of essential workers and train crews. Crowding at the front is not safe for anyone, and makes trains unnecessarily crowded. There is no way to railfan things like this and be socially distant. STAY HOME. STAY SAFE.

 

you know that we are in phase 2 going into phase 3 right. lots of people are outside and going to work and etc. While i do agree with the crowding at the front but you can't tell people to stay home. we have stayed in for 3 whole months, That whole essential worker stuff is out the window since non essential jobs are back open. It's the summer and its 80+ degrees outside. no one is staying in. as long as people wear a mask and socially distance themselves, It should be fine. Railfans are gonna fan, as long as they do right by wearing a mask and socially distance themselves from others, It should be fine.

 

Plus Beaches are opening for swimming on the 1st so you gonna have crowds regardless.

Edited by R32 3838
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1 minute ago, Union Tpke said:

As much as I love R32s, and would do almost anything to ride them again, I am not railfanning due to the pandemic. I do not recommend that you guys go out fanning, for the safety of essential workers and train crews. Crowding at the front is not safe for anyone, and makes trains unnecessarily crowded. There is no way to railfan things like this and be socially distant. STAY HOME. STAY SAFE.

The city is pretty much back to normal, many stores are reopen, restaurants have outdoor dining, beaches are officially reopening in a couple of days. Even then, CI beach was busy the two times I went there this season.

 

I agree with you that they shouldn't crowd the first car, the RFW is roped off  but I have a feeling buffs will crowd the first car anyway. Also I assume multiple sets will be in service at the same time so that should help a bit.

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1 minute ago, trainfan22 said:

The city is pretty much back to normal, many stores are reopen, restaurants have outdoor dining, beaches are officially reopening in a couple of days. Even then, CI beach was busy the two times I went there this season.

 

I agree with you that they shouldn't crowd the first car, the RFW is roped off  but I have a feeling buffs will crowd the first car anyway. Also I assume multiple sets will be in service at the same time so that should help a bit.

 

If they do that then they're dumb, The area is roped off for a reason, It's supposed to be up to 12 trains in total and from what i heard they might start tomorrow.

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, Lawrence St said:

Ahh, I love being right! Lol. But this is exactly what a few of us have been saying since the beginning. There was no other way around it, pure mathematical reality.

14 minutes ago, Union Tpke said:

As much as I love R32s, and would do almost anything to ride them again, I am not railfanning due to the pandemic. I do not recommend that you guys go out fanning, for the safety of essential workers and train crews. Crowding at the front is not safe for anyone, and makes trains unnecessarily crowded. There is no way to railfan things like this and be socially distant. STAY HOME. STAY SAFE.

The good news about the J/Z though is that it's possible to fan without going into the underground system. You've got a majority of above-ground platforms for this who wish to swipe (though I wouldn't recommend riding), and you've even got a number of photo ops in areas outside of the system (Williamsburg Bridge, other elevated stations).

Edited by MHV9218

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2 minutes ago, trainfan22 said:

The city is pretty much back to normal, many stores are reopen, restaurants have outdoor dining, beaches are officially reopening in a couple of days. Even then, CI beach was busy the two times I went there this season.

 

I agree with you that they shouldn't crowd the first car, the RFW is roped off  but I have a feeling buffs will crowd the first car anyway. Also I assume multiple sets will be in service at the same time so that should help a bit.

COVID19 cases are going up around the country. You should not be out unless YOU HAVE TO BE OUT. Cases will go up in New York soon.

 

3 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

 

you know that we are in phase 2 going into phase 3 right. lots of people are outside and going to work and etc. While i do agree with the crowding at the front but you can't tell people to stay home. we have stayed in for 3 whole months, That whole essential worker stuff is out the window since non essential jobs are back open. It's the summer and its 80+ degrees outside. no one is staying in. as long as people wear a mask and socially distance themselves, It should be fine. Railfans are gonna fan, as long as they do right by wearing a mask and socially distance themselves from others, It should be fine.

 

Plus Beaches are opening for swimming on the 1st so you gonna have crowds regardless.

Yes you can. Do you want more people killed? It is not a great sacrifice to stay home for longer to make sure vulnerable do not die.

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Union Tpke said:

COVID19 cases are going up around the country. You should not be out unless YOU HAVE TO BE OUT. Cases will go up in New York soon.

 

Yes you can. Do you want more people killed? It is not a great sacrifice to stay home for longer to make sure vulnerable do not die.

Yeah but at some point I need to make income, I stayed in long enough with no unemployment. each phase I went to see how the system was before i make judgement on when I can return to making deliveries. So far trains have been somewhat packed . we only had 5 deaths today, While I understand how you feel, Nobody is gonna want to stay in. I do agree with fans crowding the front, That part they shouldn't do. But you can't force people to stay home after staying in for almost 4 months.

 

we have had protests from the start of this month and after the 18th, No new cases were recorded to the point people had had to be hospitalized in ICU. That was the whole point of doing PAUSE.

10 minutes ago, MHV9218 said:

Ahh, I love being right! Lol. But this is exactly what a few of us have been saying since the beginning. There was no other way around it, pure mathematical reality.

The good news about the J/Z though is that it's possible to fan without going into the underground system. You've got a majority of above-ground platforms for this who wish to swipe (though I wouldn't recommend riding), and you've even got a number of photo ops in areas outside of the system (Williamsburg Bridge, other elevated stations).

 

Yeah I knew this was gonna happen

 

I don't see nothing wrong with riding, As long as they social distance it shouldn't be an issue.

Edited by R32 3838
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Posted (edited)

I remember seeing an article a couple days ago that the various NYC protests did not cause a spike in Covid-19 cases in NYC.

 

Those states where cases are going up, they opened too early and that's why they are spiking in cases. NY/NJ/CT handled this situation very well.

 

Also I don't have an A/C at home, so hot and humid days are miserable to me. Quarantining during the spring was easy peasy due to the trash weather well into May. On hot and humid days it's more comfortable to be on an NTT with it's cool A/C than being at home burning up with only a tower fan to keep cool. Or hanging out in the park or beach to keep cool as at times it's cooler outside than it is inside my apartment during warm weather days.

Edited by trainfan22
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There's only so long that you can keep people cooped up in their houses, eventually they will start going out regardless of what the law says. And I think three months is so long.

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1 minute ago, trainfan22 said:

I remember seeing an article a couple days ago that the various NYC protests did not cause a spike in Covid-19 cases in NYC.

 

Those states where cases are going up, they opened too early and that's why they are spiking in cases. NY/NJ/CT handled this situation very well.

 

Also I don't have an A/C at home, so hot and humid days are miserable to me. Quarantining during the spring was easy peasy due to the trash weather well into May. On hot and humid days it's more comfortable to be on an NTT with it's cool A/C than being at home burning up with only a tower fan to keep cool. Or hanging out in the park or beach.

 

This is what I was explaining to people, Not everyone has an AC and on top of that the people who do isn't gonna be able to afford a high electric bill. Not everyone got unemployment so the aftermath is gonna be alot worse economic wise. people don't think, They rather kiss ass or they live in a house with space.

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5 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

 

This is what I was explaining to people, Not everyone has an AC and on top of that the people who do isn't gonna be able to afford a high electric bill. Not everyone got unemployment so the aftermath is gonna be alot worse economic wise. people don't think, They rather kiss ass or they live in a house with space.

You realize that your statements are implicit criticisms of the government, right?

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1 hour ago, RapidoNewLook said:

How did they work it out with the union?

Two conductors per train, extra pay for conductors operating the R32 or maybe using them only during rush hour are some possibilities of what the union allowed but im not completely sure.

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5 minutes ago, happy283 said:

Two conductors per train, extra pay for conductors operating the R32 or maybe using them only during rush hour are some possibilities of what the union allowed but im not completely sure.

Anyone know which of the above the (MTA) chose?

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1 hour ago, Lawrence St said:

Do you think some R160A-1 cars will be shifted to the (C) again, to increase the spare factor of R46s at Pitkin/207 St?

what helps currently is the reduced (F) train frequency due to CBTC installation. But the R179s have to be prepared for service when the (F) is ready to resume full service

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1 hour ago, Union Tpke said:

COVID19 cases are going up around the country. You should not be out unless YOU HAVE TO BE OUT. Cases will go up in New York soon.

 

Yes you can. Do you want more people killed? It is not a great sacrifice to stay home for longer to make sure vulnerable do not die.

My nephew fled to FL at the beginning of the pandemic. His job allowed him to transfer and gave him the tools to work from his temporary home. He’s seen what reopening the economy is doing firsthand. He said that he wouldn’t be surprised if NYC screws up and has to stay in Phase 2 or reverts back to Phase 1. Judging by the responses nationwide the younger people are restless but they are more likely to be spreading the virus than the older people. Just our observations, he’s under 35 in Florida and I’m the ancient New Yorker. Carry on.

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1 hour ago, RapidoNewLook said:

Anyone know which of the above the (MTA) chose?

I dont know if they chose any. I was just guessing but it would surprise me if one of those were the case.

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1 hour ago, darkstar8983 said:

Do you think some R160A-1 cars will be shifted to the (C) again, to increase the spare factor of R46s at Pitkin/207 St?

what helps currently is the reduced (F) train frequency due to CBTC installation. But the R179s have to be prepared for service when the (F) is ready to resume full service

More likely to send more Jamaica R160s to pitkin then R160s from ENY to try and reduce the usage of the R32.

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38 minutes ago, Trainmaster5 said:

My nephew fled to FL at the beginning of the pandemic. His job allowed him to transfer and gave him the tools to work from his temporary home. He’s seen what reopening the economy is doing firsthand. He said that he wouldn’t be surprised if NYC screws up and has to stay in Phase 2 or reverts back to Phase 1. Judging by the responses nationwide the younger people are restless but they are more likely to be spreading the virus than the older people. Just our observations, he’s under 35 in Florida and I’m the ancient New Yorker. Carry on.

As much as I hate the notion, I can't say it's completely unfounded. The past couple of times I went out (the first one was the first time I did at all since I went to the dentist in March -- and all I did was check my MetroCard -- while the second was to go vote, no thanks to the Board of Elections for incompetence), I saw a bunch of people improperly wearing or simply not wearing masks. Many appeared to be around my age or younger (for context, I'm 25).

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2 hours ago, Union Tpke said:

COVID19 cases are going up around the country. You should not be out unless YOU HAVE TO BE OUT. Cases will go up in New York soon.

Yes you can. Do you want more people killed? It is not a great sacrifice to stay home for longer to make sure vulnerable do not die.

That ship sailed as soon as the government failed to pass recurring stimulus checks or hazard pay for essential workers. The financial reality for many people (including railfans that I know personally) is that they have to be out there working and earning money so might as well do some fanning while they're at it.

1 hour ago, Lex said:

You realize that your statements are implicit criticisms of the government, right?

I would imagine that criticism of the government for putting us in this position was the point, especially when it takes minimal effort to go on social media and see what measures other countries (especially South Korea) are doing to encourage quarantining, especially early on in the pandemic to crush the virus. Meanwhile at least a third of our country thinks its all hoax and if the government here to were to propose the same effective measures, it would be derided as socialism.

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3 hours ago, Union Tpke said:

As much as I love R32s, and would do almost anything to ride them again, I am not railfanning due to the pandemic. I do not recommend that you guys go out fanning, for the safety of essential workers and train crews. Crowding at the front is not safe for anyone, and makes trains unnecessarily crowded. There is no way to railfan things like this and be socially distant. STAY HOME. STAY SAFE.

 

3 hours ago, Union Tpke said:

COVID19 cases are going up around the country. You should not be out unless YOU HAVE TO BE OUT. Cases will go up in New York soon.

 

Yes you can. Do you want more people killed? It is not a great sacrifice to stay home for longer to make sure vulnerable do not die.

i can understand your current mentality with the situation at hand but the pandemic isn't as severe here like it was back in march. if you said this back in march or april even i would definitely agree considering how traumatic the spread of the virus was back then. but now things are a lot safer than before and while we do have to wear face coverings the city is basically almost back to normal. and just because the virus is spreading in other parts of the country doesn't mean we cannot take protective measures to prevent it from coming back here again as we already know how the virus can get widely transmitted. 

convincing new yorkers to hide indoors for the entire summer is definitely not happening. while the city was basically nothing but empty during march, now, more people are starting to go outside again and enjoy themselves because they are tired of being miserable and staying indoors. being indoors can induce a severe mental toll on the body, like anxiety, depression, or being miserable in general. no one wants to value logic over their own emotions during this time especially since they've been carrying an emotional and psychological burden for more than three months now. and given that the city is now slowly easing the lockdown restrictions, unlike in florida, texas, or arizona where they opened everything too early or quickly, this will only further motivate and justify the need for people to be outside now. 

and as for the railfanning part, as long as you wear a mask or face shield, avoid touching poles as much as you can, and fan alone, you should be fine when riding and/or fanning the subway. i recently started railfanning again in early june when i got word of the R160s being moved to the (A), wore proper face coverings, and it went just fine given that i was fanning alone. while you are correct that railfanning isn't essential, and i do agree with that, the best way to fan is to simply be more spread out and socially distant than usual. 

but in the end, its all your choice as for whether you want to go out or not. i'm just saying that because the effects of the pandemic have gradually lessened here, it partly justifies the need for more people to start going outside again. 

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4 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

 

This is what I was explaining to people, Not everyone has an AC and on top of that the people who do isn't gonna be able to afford a high electric bill. Not everyone got unemployment so the aftermath is gonna be alot worse economic wise. people don't think, They rather kiss ass or they live in a house with space.

Thank you for bringing this up.  Some people want to talk about the statistics for COVID deaths, but seemingly none of the other circumstances.  To them I say- what about the people dying on the street of starvation due to losing their jobs? What about the unemployed who committed suicide? And the small business owners who did the same? What about the people who died because medical attention was diverted away from their physical ailments in the name of focusing on coronavirus? That last scenario has happened often enough that several close friends are now mourning relatives who died of non-COVID related causes and complications, because they couldn't get the attention they need.  Because they didn't have coronavirus, ironically enough.

At what point does it become okay to ignore everything else? And at what point does the cure become worse than the illness itself? Not saying the Republicans in Redneckistan are doing the right thing, but I am saying that two kinds of wrongs do not make one kind of right.  There has to be a middle ground somewhere in all of this.

I'm sure if Cuomo wants, he can move stuff back to Phase 1; re-declare an emergency or whatever.  But remember folks, he's not going to have to worry about putting food on his family's table.

3 hours ago, Lex said:

You realize that your statements are implicit criticisms of the government, right?

Well, it's a democracy, so....

3 hours ago, happy283 said:

Two conductors per train, extra pay for conductors operating the R32 or maybe using them only during rush hour are some possibilities of what the union allowed but im not completely sure.

The union's just trying to protect their members' interests; I don't think anyone sensible will question that.  Unfortunately, I can see the Post, the News, and other tabloids trying to spin this against the TWU if the MTA comes up short on other cars.  Interesting to see how it will play out I guess. 

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21 minutes ago, R10 2952 said:

Thank you for bringing this up.  Some people want to talk about the statistics for COVID deaths, but seemingly none of the other circumstances.  To them I say- what about the people dying on the street of starvation due to losing their jobs? What about the unemployed who committed suicide? And the small business owners who did the same? What about the people who died because medical attention was diverted away from their physical ailments in the name of focusing on coronavirus? That last scenario has happened often enough that several close friends are now mourning relatives who died of non-COVID related causes and complications, because they couldn't get the attention they need.  Because they didn't have coronavirus, ironically enough.

At what point does it become okay to ignore everything else? And at what point does the cure become worse than the illness itself? Not saying the Republicans in Redneckistan are doing the right thing, but I am saying that two kinds of wrongs do not make one kind of right.  There has to be a middle ground somewhere in all of this.

I'm sure if Cuomo wants, he can move stuff back to Phase 1; re-declare an emergency or whatever.  But remember folks, he's not going to have to worry about putting food on his family's table.

Well, it's a democracy, so....

The union's just trying to protect their members' interests; I don't think anyone sensible will question that.  Unfortunately, I can see the Post, the News, and other tabloids trying to spin this against the TWU if the MTA comes up short on other cars.  Interesting to see how it will play out I guess. 

Perhaps if we had an intelligent National response from Day 1 this discussion wouldn’t be needed. Unfortunately we have an uncoordinated hodgepodge of actions statewide and locally. Look at New Zealand, South Korea, Singapore for example. Masks, distance restrictions and even lockdowns were effective means of combating the virus. Some people in this country seemed to put the economy over human life . Simply put if your population is worried about their own health and that of their loved ones the economy will never fully recover because we will be doing things in fits and starts. I understand both sides of the argument but when it comes down to the nitty gritty I’m gonna listen to the medical experts before any economists , especially the political hacks on television. If a medical professional warned me about riding mass transit because of typhoid or leprosy I’d take the advice to heart. It’s all about how much risk one is willing to take. Feeding your family is one thing but riding for the heck of it is something that wouldn’t do. Just my opinion. YMMV. Carry on.

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8 hours ago, trainfan22 said:

I remember seeing an article a couple days ago that the various NYC protests did not cause a spike in Covid-19 cases in NYC.

 

Those states where cases are going up, they opened too early and that's why they are spiking in cases. NY/NJ/CT handled this situation very well.

 

Also I don't have an A/C at home, so hot and humid days are miserable to me. Quarantining during the spring was easy peasy due to the trash weather well into May. On hot and humid days it's more comfortable to be on an NTT with it's cool A/C than being at home burning up with only a tower fan to keep cool. Or hanging out in the park or beach to keep cool as at times it's cooler outside than it is inside my apartment during warm weather days.

NY did not handle the situation well. Tens of thousands of deaths would not have happened had Cuomo shut things down earlier. He has blood on his hands.

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7 hours ago, Lex said:

As much as I hate the notion, I can't say it's completely unfounded. The past couple of times I went out (the first one was the first time I did at all since I went to the dentist in March -- and all I did was check my MetroCard -- while the second was to go vote, no thanks to the Board of Elections for incompetence), I saw a bunch of people improperly wearing or simply not wearing masks. Many appeared to be around my age or younger (for context, I'm 25).

Most young people are not wearing masks. While they are less likely to get the worst symptoms, since they are more likely to "hang out" and see other people, they will get more people infected.

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