Fleet Swap Discussion Thread

[Bill from Maspeth]

Let's not ruin this thread with speculation.  The fact of the matter is nobody knows what the assignment of cars will really be until NYCT makes it official.  No inside information, no I heard this and I heard that. Proposals made here always get out of hand.   It will have a lot to do with how many R32/42 are kept for the L shutdown and when all the R179's are here and how many are available for service.

The word is "patience".  Let's just wait and see what transits' final decision will be.  I'm sure a lot of ideas are being bounced around at 2 Broadway.  Let's wait for their ideas to become final, distributed in a way like at an MTA board meeting like how the modification of the R179 order was announced.

Edited January 23, 2018 by Bill from Maspeth

[RR503]

12 minutes ago, Coney Island Av said:

Transit actually means way more than you think. It doesn't come from JUST the chairman.

The whole organization includes the chairman, employees, operators, conductors, motormans, and finally Car Equipment/Ops Planning.

@Dj Hammers IS an MTA employee, and part of transit. So when you say "it's transit's final decision" that means that it's Car Equipment's final decision, Ops Planning's final decision, the chairman's final decision, the MTA president's final decision, and EVERYONE who works in MTA is part of the final decision. 

 

I doubt Lhota cares which cars run where. That's just us. 

I have a strong feeling that transit has already come up with fleet assignment plans for the next few years. They obviously have all the parameters and events of the next few years laid out (shutdown, addition of the 179s, full length , 480' , etc), and it'd frankly not make sense for them not to begin to strategize as to which cars need to go where in preparation for all those things. Fleet swaps take time, especially when more than one line is involved, and you'll want all the moving parts in their final places by next March -- only 14 mos away. I just don't think transit feels the need to make their plans public -- so few people care. 

Just feel lucky that we know what we do. 

Edited January 23, 2018 by RR503

[LTA1992]

Question. So I'm clear as I haven't been as active lately. What is the plan for the R32? How many are to be retired when the R179s come in? How many are to remain? 

Last I heard was about half. Has that changed? I can care less about assignments.

[Bill from Maspeth]

1 hour ago, Coney Island Av said:

Transit actually means way more than you think. It doesn't come from JUST the chairman.

The whole organization includes the chairman, employees, operators, conductors, motormans, and finally Car Equipment/Ops Planning.

@Dj Hammers IS an MTA employee, and part of transit. So when you say "it's transit's final decision" that means that it's Car Equipment's final decision, Ops Planning's final decision, the chairman's final decision, the MTA president's final decision, and EVERYONE who works in MTA is part of the final decision. 

 

Everyone who works in MTA is NOT part of the final decision.  That is a ridiculous statement you made.  That means your telling me that the Dept. of Buses , Dept. of Security, Maintenance of Way and others have a hand in this? No hourly employee is involved in the decision making process either, and that's from every department! That's what you said!

Finally the TA president and the MTA President have nothing to do with car assignments either!  They just want full scheduled service!

[U-BahnNYC]

6 hours ago, Bill from Maspeth said:

The fact of the matter is nobody knows what the assignment of cars will really be until NYCT makes it official.  No inside information, no I heard this and I heard that.

Well, the "inside information" has been right about many things, most recently the additional B cars, but I won't go on about that.

Curious as to where you think they will make it official? It's not like enough people care for them to put on their website "Fleet Change: Line (X) to get RXXX"

 

6 hours ago, VIP said:

The  is not getting the R179’s. In fact Coney Island is not getting them. East New York and 207 Street yards are getting them. 

207th? Wouldn't it make more sense for Pitkin, since 207th already has two types of cars?

[Jemorie]

2 hours ago, Coney Island Av said:

Transit actually means way more than you think. It doesn't come from JUST the chairman.

The whole organization includes the chairman, employees, operators, conductors, motormans, and finally Car Equipment/Ops Planning.

@Dj Hammers IS an MTA employee, and part of transit. So when you say "it's transit's final decision" that means that it's Car Equipment's final decision, Ops Planning's final decision, the chairman's final decision, the MTA president's final decision, and EVERYONE who works in MTA is part of the final decision. 

 

You're very naïve lol.

[LTA1992]

1 hour ago, Bill from Maspeth said:

Everyone who works in MTA is NOT part of the final decision.  That is a ridiculous statement you made.  That means your telling me that the Dept. of Buses , Dept. of Security, Maintenance of Way and others have a hand in this? No hourly employee is involved in the decision making process either, and that's from every department! That's what you said!

Finally the TA president and the MTA President have nothing to do with car assignments either!  They just want full scheduled service!

Not to mention, DJ Hammers, who I know of personally, is a recent addition compared to posters who have been on the money for years now.

Until they make their announcements, I'll take things with three grains of salt.

[Lance]

14 hours ago, LTA1992 said:

Question. So I'm clear as I haven't been as active lately. What is the plan for the R32? How many are to be retired when the R179s come in? How many are to remain? 

Last I heard was about half. Has that changed? I can care less about assignments.

My sentiments exactly. Over the years, I've noticed I don't really give much thought on which cars run on a line anymore. I'll take note of the rarities I come across, like the 62s on the or the 142As on the , but in terms of general car assignments, that doesn't get me hyped up like I was when I first joined this forum back in '08.

To answer your question, I think that's still the plan as the order is completed. However, I believe more of the 32s will be retained through the duration of the Canarsie shutdown starting next year. Following that, we should see a reduction in the 32s' fleet numbers if all goes according to plan.

[Around the Horn]

21 hours ago, VIP said:

The  is not getting the R179’s. In fact Coney Island is not getting them. East New York and 207 Street yards are getting them. 

I would not be so quick to say that...

[R32 3838]

3 hours ago, Around the Horn said:

I would not be so quick to say that...

That's what im saying, honestly it would make more sense to give the R160's but they have to install cbtc kits in them for the for future cbtc. So the 8 car R179's are the only choice with the R32's (48-64) cars supplementing those R179's. 

 

 

This is why once ENY gets their 8th set of R179s the real shit will start to go down in terms of swaps if ENY is getting only 64 cars.

[U-BahnNYC]

2 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

That's what im saying, honestly it would make more sense to give the R160's but they have to install cbtc kits in them for the for future cbtc. So the 8 car R179's are the only choice with the R32's (48-64) cars supplementing those R179's. 

Okay, can someone please explain to me where this crazy idea about QBL CBTC being ready during the shutdown is coming from? Last time I heard the earliest date is 2021 and knowing the MTA, it'll probably be later.

So what gives?

[U-BahnNYC]

2 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

That's what im saying, honestly it would make more sense to give the R160's but they have to install cbtc kits in them for the for future cbtc. So the 8 car R179's are the only choice with the R32's (48-64) cars supplementing those R179's. 

Okay, where is this crazy idea about QBL CBTC being ready during the shutdown coming from?? Officially 2021 has been given as the date by the MTA, and knowing them, it will probably encounter a myriad of delays.

So what gives?

[R32 3838]

They want to have all the required R160's ready before the cbtc starts. That's why Jamaica is becoming all R160 in the future It makes sense.

[U-BahnNYC]

1 minute ago, R32 3838 said:

They want to have all the required R160's ready before the cbtc starts. That's why Jamaica is becoming all R160 in the future It makes sense.

Right, but having R160s during the shutdown doesn't prevent that from happening. The 's fleet isn't going anywhere then, rather it'll be the R160s that go to the if it will use a small handful of R160s.

Also, what's stopping them from retrofitting R179s for CBTC? They'll have to do it eventually.

I just don't get why the CBTC thing (still literally ages away) is even remotely an issue.

[Art Vandelay]

The Queens Boulevard CBTC contract is for R160s only. 

What is the point in moving the R160s elsewhere if they are just going to have to move back? 

[U-BahnNYC]

3 hours ago, Art Vandelay said:

The Queens Boulevard CBTC contract is for R160s only. 

What is the point in moving the R160s elsewhere if they are just going to have to move back? 

Really? I find that very hard to believe. At some point in the future surely other rolling stock will use QBL.

Again, the point I'm making is QBL CBTC has no impact on R160s theoretically going on the because those R160s would be from the / lines, nothing at all from the . How is that a problem?

[Around the Horn]

14 minutes ago, U-BahnNYC said:

Really? I find that very hard to believe. At some point in the future surely other rolling stock will use QBL.

Again, the point I'm making is QBL CBTC has no impact on R160s theoretically going on the because those R160s would be from the / lines, nothing at all from the . How is that a problem?

What you are not understanding is that the CBTC installation contract does not leave enough unmodified R160s for the instead leaving the non CBTC equipped R179s.

Even most of the R160s on the would have CBTC so they can also run on the

[R32 3838]

3 hours ago, Around the Horn said:

What you are not understanding is that the CBTC installation contract does not leave enough unmodified R160s for the instead leaving the non CBTC equipped R179s.

Even most of the R160s on the would have CBTC so they can also run on the

Plus they already run cbtc R160's on the (J).

[bobtehpanda]

3 hours ago, Around the Horn said:

What you are not understanding is that the CBTC installation contract does not leave enough unmodified R160s for the instead leaving the non CBTC equipped R179s.

Even most of the R160s on the would have CBTC so they can also run on the

You can run CBTC equipped cars on non-CBTC track, can't you?

[Fan Railer]

7 hours ago, bobtehpanda said:

You can run CBTC equipped cars on non-CBTC track, can't you?

lol happens every day on the J/Z

[RailRunRob]

7 hours ago, bobtehpanda said:

You can run CBTC equipped cars on non-CBTC track, can't you?

Yep, Just run them in code manual. 

[Around the Horn]

No my point was, you'd want all the CBTC equipped cars at the same yard as the CBTC equipped route. For example, you never see CBTC equipped cars on the . 

[RailRunRob]

14 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

No my point was, you'd want all the CBTC equipped cars at the same yard as the CBTC equipped route. For example, you never see CBTC equipped cars on the . 

Gotcha, Well ENY is a Hybrid yard. CBTC rollout on the real system meaning besides the  and  are going to roll out in segments.  So a train would run in ATO mode for a portion of it's run and then manual as well. I guess what I'm trying to get at it doesn't matter to the Train. If it's manual and standard fix block is in place she going to do as told. Nothing stopping it from running on the   if they needed it there. Now maintenance, asset location, and operations that's another story.

[VIP]

Never knew the  has assigned R32 cars. For example; the sets are the same (car numbers). So those R32’s are from Pitkin?? 

[Bill from Maspeth]

1 hour ago, VIP said:

Never knew the  has assigned R32 cars. For example; the sets are the same (car numbers). So those R32’s are from Pitkin?? 

Are you aware the C has some R46 cars too?  It was a swap to start getting 600' trains to the C line.