7LineFan Posted February 20, 2009 Share #26 Posted February 20, 2009 You couldnt even test ATO without a fire an the Times Square Shuttle. I don't think that was the automated system's fault. The automated shuttle was working fine before the fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTR Admiralty Posted February 20, 2009 Share #27 Posted February 20, 2009 I don't think that was the automated system's fault. The automated shuttle was working fine before the fire. The fire was probably set by someone, deliberately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7LineFan Posted February 20, 2009 Share #28 Posted February 20, 2009 The fire was probably set by someone, deliberately. Actually: On April 21st, 1964, a small but intense fire engulfed a manually operated train on track 3 and melted it away. Steel beams holding up the station roof actually buckled and 42nd Street was closed for a time. There was fear that the street would collapse into the station. R-17 Cars 6595, 6597, 6601 and R-22 car 7740 were carted away from the station as scrap. The automated train was sitting on track 4 and was significantly damaged. Ironically, the wayside / relay equipment, a short distance away from the train, was not touched at all. The fire started in electrical equipment in the dispatcher's office at the western end of the platform between tracks 1 and 3. There was no sign of arson or sabotage. The flames reached the laid-up train on track 3 and ingnited the grease and oil under the train, and the seats inside the train. This in turn touched off the "temporary" wooden platform. The fire grew to six alarms. As the fire raged, the last train from Times Square, the 4:57am, arrived on track one. The motorman, Patsy De Sena, discharged the passengers from the train, then operated the train light back to Times Square. Firefighters were unable to fight the fire from the mezzanine level of the station due to the intense heat, so they were forced to drag their hoses from manhole covers on the west side of the station, and through the connecting passageway between the East Side IRT and the shuttle station. It took a number of days to restore shuttle service to normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32 3348 Posted February 20, 2009 Share #29 Posted February 20, 2009 Who cares about age? CBTC is a setup for disaster. You couldnt even test ATO without a fire an the Times Square Shuttle. Besides, to test it out, you'll have to close an entire line after hours. It happened a while ago, i think before the R160s were on the line. P.S. 64 R160s will be retrofitted with CBTC to run with the R143s. That's just how the went about it on the . It'd have begun more smoothly if R42s didn't have to be used on the line, and if they fix the bugs faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTR Admiralty Posted February 20, 2009 Share #30 Posted February 20, 2009 Actually: Still, there was no fault with the ATO system then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INDman Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share #31 Posted February 20, 2009 Still, there was no fault with the ATO system then. Yea, no fault except that it would have cut jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelham Bay Dave Posted February 21, 2009 Share #32 Posted February 21, 2009 The ATO won't cut T/O jobs since they want the T/O there in case of an emengency. ATO will start on the Line Feb 24th in Customer service 24/7 on all train operating in CBTC mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INDman Posted February 22, 2009 Author Share #33 Posted February 22, 2009 The ATO won't cut T/O jobs since they want the T/O there in case of an emengency. ATO will start on the Line Feb 24th in Customer service 24/7 on all train operating in CBTC mode. Good to know, but I had been refering to ATO on the Grand Central which did not have a T/O or C/R on the train. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 22, 2009 Share #34 Posted February 22, 2009 Good to know, but I had been refering to ATO on the Grand Central which did not have a T/O or C/R on the train. Since when?! Every time i take the 42nd st there is always someone in the cab, gets out, walks to other end, gets in..... - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maserati7200 Posted February 22, 2009 Share #35 Posted February 22, 2009 Since when?! Every time i take the 42nd st there is always someone in the cab, gets out, walks to other end, gets in..... - A I think he's talking about the 60's. In the 60's The Grand Central Shuttle ran ATO for a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7LineFan Posted February 22, 2009 Share #36 Posted February 22, 2009 I think he's talking about the 60's. In the 60's The Grand Central Shuttle ran ATO for a few years. And it apparently worked fine until the fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTR Admiralty Posted February 22, 2009 Share #37 Posted February 22, 2009 You think the TWU will get upset with the new set-up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7LineFan Posted February 22, 2009 Share #38 Posted February 22, 2009 You think the TWU will get upset with the new set-up? They can't complain, because as of now there are no jobs being cut or anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INDman Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share #39 Posted February 23, 2009 But they had to fight to keep both the T/O and C/R on the train. The original plan was to only have the T/O on the train, but imagine trying to evac almost 1000 people in case of a fire with only 1 employee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelham Bay Dave Posted February 23, 2009 Share #40 Posted February 23, 2009 Last I checked TWU got no issues since both T/O and C/R will be on the train. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INDman Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share #41 Posted February 23, 2009 Last I checked TWU got no issues since both T/O and C/R will be on the train. I thought a few years ago that had been a problem since the wanted to remove the C/R from trains, but they dropped that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelham Bay Dave Posted February 23, 2009 Share #42 Posted February 23, 2009 The only issue was about the C/R OPTO not the CBTC or ATO. Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 6.0; SLCC1; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; Media Center PC 5.0; eSobiSubscriber 2.0.4.16; .NET CLR 3.5.30729; .NET CLR 3.0.30618; .NET CLR 1.1.4322) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INDman Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share #43 Posted February 23, 2009 Oh ok, I guess I read something wrong somewhere. Thanks for clearing it up for me. Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 8.0; Windows NT 6.0; Trident/4.0; GTB5; SLCC1; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; Media Center PC 5.0; .NET CLR 1.1.4322; .NET CLR 3.5.21022; .NET CLR 3.0.30618; .NET CLR 3.5.30729) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTR Admiralty Posted February 24, 2009 Share #44 Posted February 24, 2009 I thought a few years ago that had been a problem since the wanted to remove the C/R from trains, but they dropped that. No, because that is OPTO, one person train operation. The TWU did have a big deal about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTA1992 Posted February 24, 2009 Share #45 Posted February 24, 2009 Like i said, id personally drive the train than have a computer do it for me, wheres the fun in that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTR Admiralty Posted February 24, 2009 Share #46 Posted February 24, 2009 Like i said, id personally drive the train than have a computer do it for me, wheres the fun in that? That is true. However don't forget that the T/O is still there. The T/O is only serving as a "monitor", just overseeing the system and the train. If the system is FUBAR'd, then the T/O takes over and goes back to manual train operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoot178 Posted February 25, 2009 Share #47 Posted February 25, 2009 I'd ride a train with a computer at the wheel but I do hope they don't make this system wide as that would put a damper on me becoming a t/o! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 25, 2009 Share #48 Posted February 25, 2009 Autopilot can land a huge airliner filled with passengers and cargo. I'm not scared of that putting pilots out of work. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Julio Posted February 25, 2009 Share #49 Posted February 25, 2009 Autopilot can land a huge airliner filled with passengers and cargo. I'm not scared of that putting pilots out of work. - A If you were a pilot, you would be singing a different song. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelham Bay Dave Posted February 25, 2009 Share #50 Posted February 25, 2009 Ok as a former Line T/O I am quilified for CBTC/ATO and I loved ATO just hit a button just to make sure the T/O is still in the cab and didn't leave. The downside was I noticed the train stopped short and enabled the C/R at Bway Juction. I trust they did fix that problem. Maybe I'll pick back the Line I am looking at that option besides staying in QNS or back to the BX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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