ConcourseExp Posted December 30, 2014 Share #1 Posted December 30, 2014 Ok, I have put a lot of thought into this, but what do you guys think will happen when the 2nd Avenue Subway is fully operational and the M15 SBS will no longer be useful when people start using the subway to Lower Manhattan. The future is not part of this conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FamousNYLover Posted December 30, 2014 Share #2 Posted December 30, 2014 I think both M15 Local and M15 SBS still might be useful because some people prefers buses as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted December 30, 2014 Share #3 Posted December 30, 2014 It's so far away so it's not like it will matter.... But I think that the M15 would likely stay unaffected if the is completed or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted December 30, 2014 Share #4 Posted December 30, 2014 Ok, I have put a lot of thought into this, but what do you guys think will happen when the 2nd Avenue Subway is fully operational and the M15 SBS will no longer be useful when people start using the subway to Lower Manhattan. The future is not part of this conversation. In 2257 I doubt buses will exist the same way they do now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted December 30, 2014 Share #5 Posted December 30, 2014 But then again, every station will be ADA accessible... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotham Bus Co. Posted December 30, 2014 Share #6 Posted December 30, 2014 In 2257 I doubt buses will exist the same way they do now. Didn't you know... The is required to assume that the exact same ridership patterns (and maybe even the exact same riders) that prevail today will still prevail at any randomly chosen time in the future, just as they have prevailed from any given time in the past. Nobody moves in or moves out or grows up or graduates or changes jobs or retires or dies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeesPwnMets Posted December 30, 2014 Share #7 Posted December 30, 2014 Well, even though the will get you to places much faster than the M101/102/103, they're still plenty of riders on all three buses. I don't think the will affect the M15 that much. Some people (elderly and handicap) also prefer the bus instead of the subway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QM1to6Ave Posted December 30, 2014 Share #8 Posted December 30, 2014 Well, even though the will get you to places much faster than the M101/102/103, they're still plenty of riders on all three buses. I don't think the will affect the M15 that much. Some people (elderly and handicap) also prefer the bus instead of the subway. ^This. Ironically, despite the millions of dolalrs spent making subway stations ADA compliant, the vast majority of wheelchair or scooter bound people that I know much prefer the bus. Many of them say that they have had accidents while trying to get over the gap onto the train, so they only want to use buses (or paratransit) where the B/O ensures their safety directly. Still, I think the M15 SBS will have lower ridership once SAS opens, but the beauty of buses is that they can easily be switched to any of the other overburdened lines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted December 30, 2014 Share #9 Posted December 30, 2014 ^This. Ironically, despite the millions of dolalrs spent making subway stations ADA compliant, the vast majority of wheelchair or scooter bound people that I know much prefer the bus. Many of them say that they have had accidents while trying to get over the gap onto the train, so they only want to use buses (or paratransit) where the B/O ensures their safety directly. Still, I think the M15 SBS will have lower ridership once SAS opens, but the beauty of buses is that they can easily be switched to any of the other overburdened lines bingo this guy gets it. On a serious note the will spell the end of M15 SBS but local service may get extra service. And other bus lines will get extra service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Sith Posted December 30, 2014 Share #10 Posted December 30, 2014 bingo this guy gets it. On a serious note the will spell the end of M15 SBS but local service may get extra service. And other bus lines will get extra service. No it wouldn't....with that logic. The M101 would no longer be a LTD thanks to the , and Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted December 30, 2014 Share #11 Posted December 30, 2014 Didn't you know... The is required to assume that the exact same ridership patterns (and maybe even the exact same riders) that prevail today will still prevail at any randomly chosen time in the future, just as they have prevailed from any given time in the past. Nobody moves in or moves out or grows up or graduates or changes jobs or retires or dies. I mean, that's basically all of modern transportation planning. We don't have the capacity (or money) to make more accurate models in this day and age, particularly since predicting the human condition is sort of like throwing darts while you're blindfolded and spun on a merry go round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted December 31, 2014 Share #12 Posted December 31, 2014 No it wouldn't....with that logic. The M101 would no longer be a LTD thanks to the , and M101 is a very long route hence being LTD. Plus it has short turns that don't go south of 96th street. Well, even though the will get you to places much faster than the M101/102/103, they're still plenty of riders on all three buses. I don't think the will affect the M15 that much. Some people (elderly and handicap) also prefer the bus instead of the subway. Really then why do I see empty M103s at rush hour in midtown no I am not lying it happens more than you think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted December 31, 2014 Share #13 Posted December 31, 2014 M101 is a very long route hence being LTD. Plus it has short turns that don't go south of 96th street. Really then why do I see empty M103s at rush hour in midtown no I am not lying it happens more than you think. Because your experiences mean absolutely nothing when it comes to actual statistics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted December 31, 2014 Share #14 Posted December 31, 2014 Ok, I have put a lot of thought into this, but what do you guys think will happen when the 2nd Avenue Subway is fully operational and the M15 SBS will no longer be useful when people start using the subway to Lower Manhattan. The future is not part of this conversation. The Lexington av lines won't be severely overburdened as they are now..... But that's obvious. I'm not sure what specifically it is you're asking; What do you think would happen with what? In 2257 I doubt buses will exist the same way they do now. I see what you did there On a serious note the will spell the end of M15 SBS but local service may get extra service. And other bus lines will get extra service. It'll be a cold day in hell when the MTA revokes SBS from off the M15... Or any other route that currently has SBS on it, for the matter.... ....Really then why do I see empty M103s at rush hour in midtown no I am not lying it happens more than you think. Probably because there are more M101's & M102's that riders got on first? Ya think..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeesPwnMets Posted December 31, 2014 Share #15 Posted December 31, 2014 Really then why do I see empty M103s at rush hour in midtown no I am not lying it happens more than you think. You're nitpicking because the M101 has 3x the ridership than the M103. And at 3 million riders a year, the M103 is no slouch either. Go to the M103's first stop at City Hall during the PM rush and you'll see the amount of people that get on at the very first stop. The three routes combined have over 18 million riders. If you made condensed all three routes into one route, the ridership would be greater than the M15, and that is with the running underneath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
161 New York Posted December 31, 2014 Share #16 Posted December 31, 2014 Coming from South Ferry or Lower Manhattan I am still going to use the M15-SBS when I need to get to places and restaurants on the LES/East Side and parts of Chinatown and the reverse to get to express buses downtown. I've used this bus many times during off-peak hours and weekends and find it to be sufficient time-wise. I definitely prefer it over the and TBH I know very little about the subways east of the Lexington line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted December 31, 2014 Share #17 Posted December 31, 2014 Coming from South Ferry or Lower Manhattan I am still going to use the M15-SBS when I need to get to places and restaurants on the LES/East Side and parts of Chinatown and the reverse to get to express buses downtown. I've used this bus many times during off-peak hours and weekends and find it to be sufficient time-wise. I definitely prefer it over the and TBH I know very little about the subways east of the Lexington line. There aren't any subways east of the Lexington Av Line that go north-south for a significant distance, which is why SAS is being built. I think it's going to be very useful for LES riders because of the rather convenient locations they picked for Phases III and IV (Houston St, Grand St, Chatham Sq, Seaport, and Hanover Sq) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTA Dude Posted December 31, 2014 Share #18 Posted December 31, 2014 Oh god. Lance, please lock this thread. This belongs in the SAS discussion thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted January 1, 2015 Share #19 Posted January 1, 2015 Oh god. Lance, please lock this thread. This belongs in the SAS discussion thread. Why? I think this question deserves own thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from Maspeth Posted January 1, 2015 Share #20 Posted January 1, 2015 NYCT will analyze ridership on the M15/M15SBS and make appropriate adjustments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted January 1, 2015 Share #21 Posted January 1, 2015 NYCT will analyze ridership on the M15/M15SBS and make appropriate adjustments. They always say that, and when they do, I never look foward to the "appropriate adjustments" (which will probably end up being minor decrease in M15 bus service, however with less local bus service, and a slight decrease of SBS). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Sith Posted January 1, 2015 Share #22 Posted January 1, 2015 Oh god. Lance, please lock this thread. This belongs in the SAS discussion thread. It's perfectly fine here. Relax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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