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Which Routes Deserve Some Artics?


BxM4Woodlawn

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Braddock Ave barely picks up as it is right now. However I feel like people south of Hillside Ave on Springfield either want the community college or Jamaica. If I lived over there I would not take the Q27 all the way to Flushing especially a local because that will take around an hour vs maybe a 25 minute ride on the Q1 to the subway station and 35 to the terminal.

Q36, right?

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It was a general question. Would reverting the Q27 to pre-south of Jamaica days and making a new route from Cambria Heights to either Bayside LIRR or Fort Totten work using QCC/Cardozo as an anchor, or would that fail like the Q79 did because it didn't connect to a subway stop?

Don't know if this answers your question or not, but I'll say this..... 

 

Usage wouldn't be a concern.... The route would still garner ridership from SE Queens - since those are the same riders that utilize the current Q27 b/w QCC & Hillside/Jamaica/points south of Jamaica (av)...

 

The concern would be how the MTA would handle a split of the Q27....

We may as well forget about any overlapping of services along Springfield (they're too busy wasting money running dinky shuttles & trimming service (trips) on routes that have well-established riderbases).....

 

So what would be left, is to either split the Q27 at HHE, or revert that Q27 of old (basically saying f*** you to those wanting south of Jamaica av in the process)....

 

The Q27 being as long as it is (mileage-wise), aids in the provision/justification of the route's overall current headways....

You would see some serious subtraction by division if the route were to be split..... I'm talking no more (no better) than service every 15 mins. (incl. rush hour) for the portion b/w Flushing - Main (7) & HHE, and the portion b/w Cambria Hgts - 120th & HHE/QCC.....

 

The MTA's hands were tied; they really had no other reasonable choice but to extend the Q27 south of Jamaica av....

 

Braddock Ave barely picks up as it is right now. However I feel like people south of Hillside Ave on Springfield either want the community college or Jamaica. If I lived over there I would not take the Q27 all the way to Flushing especially a local because that will take around an hour vs maybe a 25 minute ride on the Q1 to the subway station and 35 to the terminal.

25 + 35 is 60.....

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Don't know if this answers your question or not, but I'll say this..... 

 

Usage wouldn't be a concern.... The route would still garner ridership from SE Queens - since those are the same riders that utilize the current Q27 b/w QCC & Hillside/Jamaica/points south of Jamaica (av)...

 

The concern would be how the MTA would handle a split of the Q27....

We may as well forget about any overlapping of services along Springfield (they're too busy wasting money running dinky shuttles & trimming service (trips) on routes that have well-established riderbases).....

 

So what would be left, is to either split the Q27 at HHE, or revert that Q27 of old (basically saying f*** you to those wanting south of Jamaica av in the process)....

 

The Q27 being as long as it is (mileage-wise), aids in the provision/justification of the route's overall current headways....

You would see some serious subtraction by division if the route were to be split..... I'm talking no more (no better) than service every 15 mins. (incl. rush hour) for the portion b/w Flushing - Main (7) & HHE, and the portion b/w Cambria Hgts - 120th & HHE/QCC.....

 

The MTA's hands were tied; they really had no other reasonable choice but to extend the Q27 south of Jamaica av....

 

25 + 35 is 60.....

He meant 35 from QV to 165th terminal. Given that the Q36 has a 30 minute runtime, the Q1 should have less. Although, I'm not fond of late-night only variations, especially when the daytime routing is completely different from the nighttime variations and serves different destinations. 

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He meant 35 from QV to 165th terminal. Given that the Q36 has a 30 minute runtime, the Q1 should have less. Although, I'm not fond of late-night only variations, especially when the daytime routing is completely different from the nighttime variations and serves different destinations.

Yeah about 25 minutes to Jamaica 179th station and an additional 10 minutes to 165th st terminal. In my opinion the Q1 is useless. It is less frequent than the Q43 and the Q27 and Q88 combined show up much faster than a Q1 would on Springefield. I felt that if the Q1 and Q27 terminals were swapped it would give the Q1 more of a purpose than being some route that people would take if it showed up first. It would probably hurt the Q27 because its ridership base south of Jamaica Ave is already established. Wasn't there a plan to further extend the Q27 south of 120th Ave and Springfield?
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He meant 35 from QV to 165th terminal. Given that the Q36 has a 30 minute runtime, the Q1 should have less. Although, I'm not fond of late-night only variations, especially when the daytime routing is completely different from the nighttime variations and serves different destinations. 

In this post in question, a comparison is being made:

 

If I lived over there (south of Hillside Ave on Springfield) I would not take the Q27 all the way to Flushing especially a local because that will take around an hour vs maybe a 25 minute ride on the Q1 to the subway station and 35 to the terminal.

 

So basically what you're telling me is that the comparison is incomplete.....

 

25 mins. to get to 179th (F), or

35 mins to get to 165th st terminal....

 

.....and then what?

 

Something drastically less than 1/2 an hour to get from [179th (F) or from 165th st bus terminal] to Jamaica, to make those same people believe a Q1 extension in SE Queens would get those patrons to Flushing quicker on a 2 moded commute?

 

¿Qué.....

 

 

Yeah about 25 minutes to Jamaica 179th station and an additional 10 minutes to 165th st terminal. In my opinion the Q1 is useless. It is less frequent than the Q43 and the Q27 and Q88 combined show up much faster than a Q1 would on Springefield. I felt that if the Q1 and Q27 terminals were swapped it would give the Q1 more of a purpose than being some route that people would take if it showed up first. It would probably hurt the Q27 because its ridership base south of Jamaica Ave is already established. Wasn't there a plan to further extend the Q27 south of 120th Ave and Springfield?

- I agree the Q27 & the Q88 singularly (forget about combined) show up faster than the Q1....

- I agree that having Q1's being as supplementary as it is to the Q43 is useless.....

 

However....

Running Q1's to Cambria Heights along Springfield though would even be MORE useless.... It would be more indirect than an already indirect Q77 is to get to Jamaica - and that's why that route isn't doing all that great ridership-wise now...... I mean, why would anyone ride along Springfield to get to Hillside/Springfield, to get to the (F) or 165th for another mode to Flushing - When other options to get to Jamaica in SE Queens south of Jamaica av along Springfield exists??

 

That... Doesn't... Make... Sense.

 

Ending the Q27 at LIRR QV & extending the Q1 to 165th creates redundancy; SE Queens patrons don't need another bus route to Jamaica... 

 

Bottom line: You still aren't explaining what making the Q1 more useful (have you tell it) has to do with the Q27 being a slow/long option to get to Flushing..... To hell with making the Q1 more useful if it means going back to severing a part of the bus network in the borough to what it used to be back in the early 2000's when the Q27 ended at the RR station......

 

Braddock Ave barely picks up as it is right now. However I feel like people south of Hillside Ave on Springfield either want the community college or Jamaica.

 

If I lived over there I would not take the Q27 all the way to Flushing especially a local because that will take around an hour vs maybe a 25 minute ride on the Q1 to the subway station and 35 to the terminal.

So what would YOU do to get to Flushing if you lived over there, with a cut back Q27 to Jamaica/Springfield & an extended Q1 to Cambria heights via Springfield?????

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I have a question about SE Queens... Has express bus service and the LIRR been curtailed since the areas changed demographically?  I get the impression that it has, and if that's the case, then the residents only have themselves to blame for their crappy transit options.

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I have a question about SE Queens... Has express bus service and the LIRR been curtailed since the areas changed demographically? 

I get the impression that it has, and if that's the case, then the residents only have themselves to blame for their crappy transit options.

There isn't a curtailment; it's more stagnancy than anything...... In other words, current service on those 2 modes for SE Queens patrons hasn't gotten better (overall), but it's not getting any worse either.....

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There isn't a curtailment; it's more stagnancy than anything...... In other words, current service on those 2 modes for SE Queens patrons hasn't gotten better (overall), but it's not getting any worse either.....

It's hard to justify more service on those other two modes if they don't use them enough. Here we have a healthy mix of express bus riders, MNRR riders and local bus riders.  I know some of the express bus riders will use the subway in the morning but take the express bus at night.  MNRR riders will use the express bus and vice versa, but overall we tend to be regular riders on one of those modes, which gives you a nice mix of options.  I occasionally see some of the folks that I ride with on the Hudson Rail Line using the express bus.  In SE Queens I get the impression that everyone wants the subway. lol We got service increases on the MNRR because we use the service and ridership is growing.  The excuse that the stations aren't accessible enough seems rather convenient.  I use the MNRR on weekends too and my stations are quite isolated.  Can't be any less convenient than schlepping on the bus to the subway.  I sometimes walk 20 minutes to the Riverdale or Spuyten Duyvil station.

 

I learned after doing the annoying local bus to ferry to subway commute that if you live in a isolated area and value your time and value convenience, you have to invest in your transportation and spend more money.  I don't see any other solution for those SE Queens residents.  They either use the express bus more, use the LIRR more, or move.  For all of the b*tching that people have done about the Bx7 and Bx10, I'd say service really hasn't improved.  Buses still bunch like crazy.

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In this post in question, a comparison is being made:

 

 

So basically what you're telling me is that the comparison is incomplete.....

 

25 mins. to get to 179th (F), or

35 mins to get to 165th st terminal....

 

.....and then what?

 

Something drastically less than 1/2 an hour to get from [179th (F) or from 165th st bus terminal] to Jamaica, to make those same people believe a Q1 extension in SE Queens would get those patrons to Flushing quicker on a 2 moded commute?

 

¿Qué.....

His stance is that essentially, the Q1 gets to the subway faster than the Q27, and people south of Jamaica Avenue will use it because of that. Now, I doubt that riders needed Jamaica and more Flushing, so that's why I wasn't fond of the idea, especially given it's a late night variation only. There really isn't a great demand to Jamaica from Springfield Blvd as much as Flushing during the day, so that's why I wasn't too fond of that idea. It'd be much better to keep the Q27 rather than an extended Q1.

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It's hard to justify more service on those other two modes if they don't use them enough. Here we have a healthy mix of express bus riders, MNRR riders and local bus riders.  I know some of the express bus riders will use the subway in the morning but take the express bus at night.  MNRR riders will use the express bus and vice versa, but overall we tend to be regular riders on one of those modes, which gives you a nice mix of options.  I occasionally see some of the folks that I ride with on the Hudson Rail Line using the express bus.  In SE Queens I get the impression that everyone wants the subway. lol We got service increases on the MNRR because we use the service and ridership is growing.  The excuse that the stations aren't accessible enough seems rather convenient.  I use the MNRR on weekends too and my stations are quite isolated.  Can't be any less convenient than schlepping on the bus to the subway.  I sometimes walk 20 minutes to the Riverdale or Spuyten Duyvil station.

 

I learned after doing the annoying local bus to ferry to subway commute that if you live in a isolated area and value your time and value convenience, you have to invest in your transportation and spend more money.  I don't see any other solution for those SE Queens residents.  They either use the express bus more, use the LIRR more, or move.  For all of the b*tching that people have done about the Bx7 and Bx10, I'd say service really hasn't improved.  Buses still bunch like crazy.

Yeah, they really want a subway extension, but that's not going to happen..... I've never bought into the inaccessibility of LIRR stations argument, because they wouldn't be patronized to much of any greater extent if it were the case.... I don't see there being less utilization of the bus-to-subway commute in general, if there were a] more LIRR stations in SE Queens & b] better LIRR service provided to them during peak times or whatever....

 

Compare that to NE Queens, where the express bus is well patronized - and on top of it, the LIRR is their "subway"....

 

The argument can be had that many SE Queens patrons don't care about investing in their community, but my stance is more that they don't have the means to invest in their communities; they're simply trying to get by (I don't mean that in the sense of being unlawful, but unfortunately it is included).....

 

 

His stance is that essentially, the Q1 gets to the subway faster than the Q27, and people south of Jamaica Avenue will use it because of that. Now, I doubt that riders needed Jamaica and more Flushing, so that's why I wasn't fond of the idea, especially given it's a late night variation only. There really isn't a great demand to Jamaica from Springfield Blvd as much as Flushing during the day, so that's why I wasn't too fond of that idea. It'd be much better to keep the Q27 rather than an extended Q1.

You mean to tell me all of this is just about getting to the subway for the sake of doing so????

That wasn't remotely the purpose for the Q27 having gotten extended south of Jamaica av......

 

Late night variation or not, running Q1's to Cambria Hgts - 120th makes no sense.

 

On top of that, he (New Flyer) wants to cut the Bellerose branch of the Q1 and send the Q83 to 227 during the late night hours

I wouldn't exactly cut the branch (to where no service is provided).... I would run 43's down there & call it a day....

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Yeah, they really want a subway extension, but that's not going to happen..... I've never bought into the inaccessibility of LIRR stations argument, because they wouldn't be patronized to much of any greater extent if it were the case.... I don't see there being less utilization of the bus-to-subway commute in general, if there were a] more LIRR stations in SE Queens & b] better LIRR service provided to them during peak times or whatever....

 

Compare that to NE Queens, where the express bus is well patronized - and on top of it, the LIRR is their "subway"....

 

The argument can be had that many SE Queens patrons don't care about investing in their community, but my stance is more that they don't have the means to invest in their communities; they're simply trying to get by (I don't mean that in the sense of being unlawful, but unfortunately it is included).....

I see... Good points indeed...

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He means 35 minutes to the terminal.

 

But In all honesty, a Q27 trip at night isn't suppose to be as delay prone, and it's more reliable than in the day.

Ah, I see

 

Yeah about 25 minutes to Jamaica 179th station and an additional 10 minutes to 165th st terminal. In my opinion the Q1 is useless. It is less frequent than the Q43 and the Q27 and Q88 combined show up much faster than a Q1 would on Springefield. I felt that if the Q1 and Q27 terminals were swapped it would give the Q1 more of a purpose than being some route that people would take if it showed up first. It would probably hurt the Q27 because its ridership base south of Jamaica Ave is already established. Wasn't there a plan to further extend the Q27 south of 120th Ave and Springfield?

Yes there was back in 2008. It was supposed to go as far as Merrick. I actually feared another extension south (say like the Conduits or 147) would make the Q77 extinct.

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Well I was throwing out some ideas. Now that I've read comments in this thread I've realized that it would not make sense to swap the Q1 and Q27 terminals. I keeping forgetting that the Q2, Q110 and Q83 are better routes to take if you wanted to travel to Jamaica and or its subway lines. I wasn't thinking about those routes when I had originally came up with that idea. I believe what caused me to think of a swap was because the Q27 has every other bus going to 120th Ave so the Q1 since it is not as frequent could take its place south of Jamaica and all Q27 trips serve Queens Village LIRR. I also know that usage on that route is pretty split so most people taking the Q27 from Cambria is getting off at Jamaica or Hillside Avenues anyway.

As far as any other route we know that the Q77 is slow so many people avoid it for that reason and the Q83 at night only serves Queens Village just for deadheading which I do wonder if it stops on Springfield but I don't see signs indicating that it stops along the way.

 

I guess since we have gotten off topic a bit I might as well add this. Since the Q27 was proposed to serve as far south as Merrick how would such a routing work? It seemed like the MTA was trying to get rid of the Q77 at one point or at least cut it down to 120th Ave where the Q27 currently terminates. And I guess south of Merrick gets nothing.

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I think it was you who said that the low floor buses would not last more than a decade. Well, the first group of Orion 7 OGs from the 6365-6489 batch have reached over that.

 

On to the original topic, I think the routes that currently have attics are fine.

A lot of the buses in the 6427-6489 group are shot. Hillside Ave. destroyed those buses
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Yeah, they really want a subway extension, but that's not going to happen..... I've never bought into the inaccessibility of LIRR stations argument, because they wouldn't be patronized to much of any greater extent if it were the case.... I don't see there being less utilization of the bus-to-subway commute in general, if there were a] more LIRR stations in SE Queens & b] better LIRR service provided to them during peak times or whatever....

 

Compare that to NE Queens, where the express bus is well patronized - and on top of it, the LIRR is their "subway"....

 

The argument can be had that many SE Queens patrons don't care about investing in their community, but my stance is more that they don't have the means to invest in their communities; they're simply trying to get by (I don't mean that in the sense of being unlawful, but unfortunately it is included).....

 

I just don't see why people would flock to Locust Manor or St. Albans when there's no parking or UniTicket and the QM21/x64 are giving one seat rides to more of Midtown.  I will say, I always felt the Q77/85 don't make it exactly convenient for some people to get to the LIRR at Laurelton/Rosedale (or the subway) because they don't serve as much of the community as they could...

 

assuming a person isn't willing to drive 

 

 in the area s/e of laurelton sta there's no Express bus so one has to:

a) walk,  111 to 137 av and walk to Locust Manor

b) walk, take the 111 to Springfield/147, then walk up to 145 Rd, Q77 to 142 rd, then walk again to the LIRR 

c) walk ~.5-1.0 mile to the Q77 and walk again to the LIRR

d) walk up 225 St all the way to the station

 

 

On the other side of Brookville Park, Rosedale has UniTicket but the Q5 doesn't serve south of the conduits  and the 85 runs end at 243/147. That leaves the X63 serving most of the area....

 

Getting to the LIRR from those parts involves 

a) walk, 111 to 137 av and walk to Locust Manor 

b) walk, 111 to the 85 to to Rosedale

c) walk over 1/2 mile to the Q85 to get to Rosedale.

d) walk to Rosedale

 

Even if someone got the UniTicket, it doesn't account for needing to transfer again at Penn or Atlantic and having to pay again. Also that entire area is a massive flood zone... walking long distances after work in inclement weather sounds miserable (just as bad as trekking to the Hudson line in the winter).  From personal experience I hate taking local routes from City Line to/from a train during rush hours (Q12,30), so if I lived out there the Q111 to the center would be out of the question. the weekly express bus unlimited seems like the most flexible option: Take the X63 and x-fer in Manhattan if need be. If something goes wrong with the 63, I don't have a problem taking the local to a LTD to the center because it's paid for already.

 

 

I also don't see anything stopping the Q77 from ending at 147 av or directly serving Laurelton STA, the Q85 from being extended down Huxley St or the non GA Q5 following the x63 at least to the Q111 terminal. 

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I just don't see why people would flock to Locust Manor or St. Albans when there's no parking or UniTicket and the QM21/x64 are giving one seat rides to more of Midtown.  I will say, I always felt the Q77/85 don't make it exactly convenient for some people to get to the LIRR at Laurelton/Rosedale (or the subway) because they don't serve as much of the community as they could...

 

assuming a person isn't willing to drive 

 

 in the area s/e of laurelton sta there's no Express bus so one has to:

a) walk,  111 to 137 av and walk to Locust Manor

b) walk, take the 111 to Springfield/147, then walk up to 145 Rd, Q77 to 142 rd, then walk again to the LIRR 

c) walk ~.5-1.0 mile to the Q77 and walk again to the LIRR

d) walk up 225 St all the way to the station

 

 

On the other side of Brookville Park, Rosedale has UniTicket but the Q5 doesn't serve south of the conduits  and the 85 runs end at 243/147. That leaves the X63 serving most of the area....

 

Getting to the LIRR from those parts involves 

a) walk, 111 to 137 av and walk to Locust Manor 

b) walk, 111 to the 85 to to Rosedale

c) walk over 1/2 mile to the Q85 to get to Rosedale.

d) walk to Rosedale

 

Even if someone got the UniTicket, it doesn't account for needing to transfer again at Penn or Atlantic and having to pay again. Also that entire area is a massive flood zone... walking long distances after work in inclement weather sounds miserable (just as bad as trekking to the Hudson line in the winter).  From personal experience I hate taking local routes from City Line to/from a train during rush hours (Q12,30), so if I lived out there the Q111 to the center would be out of the question. the weekly express bus unlimited seems like the most flexible option: Take the X63 and x-fer in Manhattan if need be. If something goes wrong with the 63, I don't have a problem taking the local to a LTD to the center because it's paid for already.

 

 

I also don't see anything stopping the Q77 from ending at 147 av or directly serving Laurelton STA, the Q85 from being extended down Huxley St or the non GA Q5 following the x63 at least to the Q111 terminal. 

Southeast Queens is suburban in nature.  Anyone moving there who doesn't drive and expects there to be buses running everywhere is just crazy.  I think B35 summed it up best when he said that folks out there want a subway.  They want an urban environment but yet moved to a suburban one.  Makes no sense.  I get why they moved there... Cheaper... However, you can't have it all. If you move to a suburban area, expect less transportation.  That's just the way it is.

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I just don't see why people would flock to Locust Manor or St. Albans when there's no parking or UniTicket and the QM21/x64 are giving one seat rides to more of Midtown.  I will say, I always felt the Q77/85 don't make it exactly convenient for some people to get to the LIRR at Laurelton/Rosedale (or the subway) because they don't serve as much of the community as they could...

 

assuming a person isn't willing to drive 

 

 in the area s/e of laurelton sta there's no Express bus so one has to:

a) walk,  111 to 137 av and walk to Locust Manor

b) walk, take the 111 to Springfield/147, then walk up to 145 Rd, Q77 to 142 rd, then walk again to the LIRR 

c) walk ~.5-1.0 mile to the Q77 and walk again to the LIRR

d) walk up 225 St all the way to the station

 

 

On the other side of Brookville Park, Rosedale has UniTicket but the Q5 doesn't serve south of the conduits  and the 85 runs end at 243/147. That leaves the X63 serving most of the area....

 

Getting to the LIRR from those parts involves 

a) walk, 111 to 137 av and walk to Locust Manor 

b) walk, 111 to the 85 to to Rosedale

c) walk over 1/2 mile to the Q85 to get to Rosedale.

d) walk to Rosedale

 

Even if someone got the UniTicket, it doesn't account for needing to transfer again at Penn or Atlantic and having to pay again. Also that entire area is a massive flood zone... walking long distances after work in inclement weather sounds miserable (just as bad as trekking to the Hudson line in the winter).  From personal experience I hate taking local routes from City Line to/from a train during rush hours (Q12,30), so if I lived out there the Q111 to the center would be out of the question. the weekly express bus unlimited seems like the most flexible option: Take the X63 and x-fer in Manhattan if need be. If something goes wrong with the 63, I don't have a problem taking the local to a LTD to the center because it's paid for already.

 

 

I brought something about giving midday service on the X63 . I don't know if that could possibly help in some way about the lack of travel to Manhattan. As for weekend service itself, I'm not sure the ridership is there, but I may be incorrect.

 

If there was enough ridership, I would also have the X68 as a possible candidate for enhancements in off peak service. I doubt that is the case also, and in some cases, the subway and or the QM6 are close by too.

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I brought something about giving midday service on the X63 . I don't know if that could possibly help in some way about the lack of travel to Manhattan. As for weekend service itself, I'm not sure the ridership is there, but I may be incorrect.

 

If there was enough ridership, I would also have the X68 as a possible candidate for enhancements in off peak service. I doubt that is the case also, and in some cases, the subway and or the QM6 are close by too.

Makes more sense to have them use the QM6. If they really wanted service they would use that and then make the case for X63 service, but since the QM6 is run by (MTA) Bus, it makes more sense to have them go to that, which I don't see happening to a huge degree anyway.  Those people want subway service, period.  The ones using the express bus simply don't ride in a large enough quantity to justify running anymore service outside of the rush.  

 

I would be much more inclined to give Northeast Queens more express bus service before I gave it to Southeast Queens.  If anything give them more local bus service, since they want subway service.  

 

Speaking of the QM6, what's with that 17:00 and 17:30 trip?  LIJ workers?

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Southeast Queens is suburban in nature.  Anyone moving there who doesn't drive and expects there to be buses running everywhere is just crazy.  I think B35 summed it up best when he said that folks out there want a subway.  They want an urban environment but yet moved to a suburban one.  Makes no sense.  I get why they moved there... Cheaper... However, you can't have it all. If you move to a suburban area, expect less transportation.  That's just the way it is.

 

To be fair, it has been planned at least since the '60s to actually do so (and it was insisted that they could finish the full-length subway well into the '80s), but like the Second Avenue Subway, something usually comes up to quash the plan. They aren't at fault any more than the people who bought apartments on Second Avenue in the '70s thinking they were going to get a subway.

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To be fair, it has been planned at least since the '60s to actually do so (and it was insisted that they could finish the full-length subway well into the '80s), but like the Second Avenue Subway, something usually comes up to quash the plan. They aren't at fault any more than the people who bought apartments on Second Avenue in the '70s thinking they were going to get a subway.

Yeah well no one in the right mind goes to an area based on transportation that "might" exist in the future.  When I planned my move to Riverdale, you had better believe that I researched all of the transportation options thoroughly and took a few trips up there to see what it was like.  Also did a walking tour from North Riverdale all the way down to Central Riverdale.  I looked at all of the schedules to see how they would fit with my work schedule and so on.  I didn't check out the (1) train because I had no interest in the subway since I don't live near it, but I even experimented with that just to see it was like in case for some reason I was stuck using it.  It just doesn't make any sense to move to an area and not do your homework. The previous set up I was at on Staten Island was more of a pre-arranged set up where I was doing a favor, but even in that case, I originally had access to four express buses during rush hour before the service cuts.  It seems preposterous to me to move to an area and then complain about a lack of transportation options.

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And I'm sitting here wondering what does this all have to do with artics......

A lot actually.  I think the points raised previously are good ones.  The situation in Southeast Queens probably won't change IMO, and you'd also have to have enough space for those buses at the respective depots that serve those areas.

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