Jump to content


Attention: In order to reply to messages, create topics, have access to other features of the community you must sign up for an account.
East New York

R211 Discussion Thread

East New York

Program Updates Effective 2/20/19

8B572BC2-6B77-4999-9283-417E996BD0EF.jpeg

5197FE8E-FC09-4EBF-B992-6B7FB2371D54.jpeg

8EEC2B6D-E8A2-4DB9-85B2-9F4AB240BB25.jpeg

Message added by East New York

Recommended Posts

On 1/19/2019 at 9:30 AM, T to Dyre Avenue said:

Looking at the picture of the R211 side panel has me thinking those are going to be some of the narrowest side windows on a post-WW2 subway car fleet we’ll see. They have to be due to the wide entry doors.

 

This really bugs me. The windows keep getting smaller. Why? There's enough above-ground trackage that customers certainly would appreciate a little light and a view. The MTA should care. Wy can't we have modern plug-style doors that allow double the windows, instead of huge, opaque door pockets?

  • Thumbs Up 3
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

35 minutes ago, VIP said:

I think the (A) should get R160’s instead, those who ride the (A) do not deserve luxury, yet. Leave the R211 in wealthy neighborhoods. (N)(Q)  and (W)  perhaps?

Did you not read the beginning of my post?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

Did you not read the beginning of my post?

I think he was being highly sarcastic. Only person who would say something like that and mean it is Flushing Express.

  • LMAO! 9
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

*DISCLAIMER* THIS IS ALL JUST SPECULATION!! 

 

If all R211’s (from Option 1 only) arrive plus the 2 additional Open Gangway Trains, they should be prioritized on the (A) and (C) first since the (A) has very high ridership and the (C) is the Short version of the (A). For a period of time, they might share R32’s, R46’s, R179’s, R211’s, (and maybe R42’s). Keep in mind that this is just speculation. 

So plenty of R160’s should be on the (R) in the near future. 

 

40 minutes ago, VIP said:

I think the (A) should get R160’s instead, those who ride the (A) do not deserve luxury, yet. Leave the R211 in wealthy neighborhoods. (N)(Q)  and (W)  perhaps?

I highly doubt the (A)/(C)  will get these first. If the swap to make the (F)/(R) fully NTT with R160s doesn't happen by 2020, then they will be getting R211s from the base contract. The excess sets from the base contract can then head to the (A)/(C) until the option orders come in to fully replace the R46s on the (A)/(C).

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Railfan 007 said:

If the swap to make the (F)/(R) fully NTT with R160s doesn't happen by 2020, then they will be getting R211s from the base contract.

My reasoning exactly. And something tells me those QBL workers might not be in time for proposed CBTC...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, rbrome said:

 Why can't we have modern plug-style doors that allow double the windows, instead of huge, opaque door pockets?

Yes! Something like the S stock doors please (a side effect of plug doors is more room in the doorway, which is also well needed)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, rbrome said:

This really bugs me. The windows keep getting smaller. Why? There's enough above-ground trackage that customers certainly would appreciate a little light and a view. The MTA should care. Wy can't we have modern plug-style doors that allow double the windows, instead of huge, opaque door pockets?

Plug-type doors would only work here if the platforms were modified. It’s not worth the cost.

On 2/9/2019 at 6:54 PM, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

*DISCLAIMER* THIS IS ALL JUST SPECULATION!! 

 

If all R211’s (from Option 1 only) arrive plus the 2 additional Open Gangway Trains, they should be prioritized on the (A) and (C) first since the (A) has very high ridership and the (C) is the Short version of the (A). For a period of time, they might share R32’s, R46’s, R179’s, R211’s, (and maybe R42’s). Keep in mind that this is just speculation. 

So plenty of R160’s should be on the (R) in the near future. 

R211 prelim assignments are (A) and (R) to start off. Everything else is pending.  (C) (E) (F) and (Q)  are said to be in the planning as well. Logistics and final assignments could change based on the amount of options that are T models. 

(A)(C) and (R) however are the originally planned lines, and this hasn’t changed yet. Only major changes are the accelerated delivery schedule that puts the first 10-car train here next summer, and now puts SIR last for delivery.

 

Edited by East New York
  • Like 1
  • Upvote 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, East New York said:

Plug-type doors would only work here if the platforms were modified.

Not if you design it correctly. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Did the London Underground have to make any modifications for the plug doors on the S stock? Does anyone know?

I don't know if they made the S stock slightly narrower to compensate but it doesn't look like the plug doors stick that far outward in this video.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, rbrome said:

Not if you design it correctly. 

True. I just don’t see them deviating away from what we have now unless they modified platforms. MTA is notorious for NOT liking plug-type doors of any kind on buses, subways or trains for a few reason. One is ease of maintenance, and self redundancy if the door fails. The particular side that fails will just remain closed. It’s parts are also commons with all NTT’s including the R211 and R262’s when it comes to the mechanics, thus saving on maintenance costs and parts stock drastically. 

The TA’s main concern is moving more passengers faster. The windows viewing range isn’t enough of a priority to invest in a whole new door design at this time, that would still have to be researched, developed, and tested. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At least they’re giving (some) serious consideration to open gangway cars, a feature used successfully around the world. I really hope it will be a substantial portion of the R211 fleet (not just the 20 experimental cars currently planned for).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

R211s going to the (A)(C)(R) is an idea begat from renderings and the idea that they will opt for replacement in place of R46s. That may be what pans out, but I wouldn't call it a 'plan.' 

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, T to Dyre Avenue said:

I really hope it will be a substantial portion of the R211 fleet (not just the 20 experimental cars currently planned for).

They seem to be assuming that the two test trains will be successful, and that the option order with a significant number of open gangway trains will be purchased. Additionally, the R262 slides mentioned incorporating features of the R211s into their design, with open gangways being a bullet point on that list. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Chris Alleyne said:

No dude, once the R211s arrive, the R32s and R42s will be retired almost immediately with the R46s going shortly soon afterwards.

A. I said it was speculation 

B. I said “for a period of time”. Meaning that for a short time, we might see 5-6 car classes on the (A) and (C). Trains aren’t delivered and enter service all at once you know. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/11/2019 at 2:46 PM, Around the Horn said:

Did the London Underground have to make any modifications for the plug doors on the S stock? Does anyone know?

I don't know if they made the S stock slightly narrower to compensate but it doesn't look like the plug doors stick that far outward in this video

WRT maintenance concerns specified in this thread, I don't know if the S stock is handled like this specifically, but generally rolling stock contracts in the UK and EU also contain maintenance, in addition to building the fleet.

 

On 2/9/2019 at 6:17 PM, rbrome said:

This really bugs me. The windows keep getting smaller. Why? There's enough above-ground trackage that customers certainly would appreciate a little light and a view. The MTA should care. Wy can't we have modern plug-style doors that allow double the windows, instead of huge, opaque door pockets?

IMO the biggest beneficiaries of plug doors would be buses. At least on trains the doors don't do anything daft like opening inwards and reducing standing room in the vehicle.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Plochoci (or however you spell his name) just said the R211 is getting an Alstom propulsion system...

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Plochochi is the name (paused the video where there is no CC) and he says around the 58:40 mark that the R211s will have Alstom propulsion, for people who want a source to quote: 

 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Railfan 007 said:

Plochochi is the name (paused the video where there is no CC) and he says around the 58:40 mark that the R211s will have Alstom propulsion, for people who want a source to quote: 

 

 NOOOOOOOOOOOOO ! Please not like the R160s 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, R179 8258 said:

 NOOOOOOOOOOOOO ! Please not like the R160s 

The R160s propulsion is nearly 20 years old lol. It could be the same propulsion for parts commonality, but with the R179s having a different propulsion than the R142A/143/188, even though both trains have Bombardier propulsion, I doubt the R211s will have the same propulsion package as the R160s.

  • Thanks 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Railfan 007 said:

The R160s propulsion is nearly 20 years old lol. It could be the same propulsion for parts commonality, but with the R179s having a different propulsion than the R142A/143/188, even though both trains have Bombardier propulsion, I doubt the R211s will have the same propulsion package as the R160s.

These editors ears will tell you that there are definitely similarities between the R143 and R179 inverters. 

Instead of rolling in the sound, the R179s inverters have harder transitions like ONIX. But the overall progression is the same while the pitch is higher.

So I expect something similar when the R211 rolls around. Something different, but also the same in many aspects. The question is, by how much.

Edited by LTA1992

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, LTA1992 said:

So I expect something similar when the R211 rolls around. Something different, but also the same in many aspects. The question is, by how much.

The thing is the Bombardier trains are all using MITRAC, which is one of their widespread products. ONIX, however, doesn't seem to be produced by Alstom anymore, so it'll be interesting to see how a decade and a half makes a difference in terms of propulsion style. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Enjineer said:

The thing is the Bombardier trains are all using MITRAC, which is one of their widespread products. ONIX, however, doesn't seem to be produced by Alstom anymore, so it'll be interesting to see how a decade and a half makes a difference in terms of propulsion style. 

It was for comparisons sake since you can't really hear what I'm describing.

When I talk bout hard/flat sounds, ONIX and the new MITRAC have that.

Siemens and the older Adtranz/MITRAC inverters have rolling sounds.

Edited by LTA1992

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, LTA1992 said:

Siemens and the older Adtranz/MITRAC inverters have rolling sounds.

I know what you mean. ONIX and the R179's MITRAC have a harsher tone, while the older MITRAC 1580c inverters have a more soft tone. All I was saying is Alstom isn't exclusively harder sounds, for example this is Alstom propulsion, and even other ONIX systems in this video aren't like the R142s and R160s

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.