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Eric B

New combination 2/5 strip maps demo'ed!

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and you're the expert on this... how?

 

It would not be the first time a fleet's signage is refitted. R44s and R46s came with roll signs, and those were replaced.

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Of course, the only reason the 44s and 46s got those electronic signs is because they were already equipped with electronic sign curtains controlled from the cab. Otherwise, they would've received the same treatment the 40s and 42s did in the late '80s

 

As to the question of FINDs on the 142s, they aren't necessary. Unlike the 160s, which run on vastly different lines dependent on the needs of service at the time, the 142s mostly stay on the lines they're assigned to. Combine that with the limited amount of reroute possibilities on the IRT and the usefulness of FINDs diminishes greatly. The reason this "new" combined line map design exists is because it's the only major reroute that happens regularly and because the cars are shared often. That doesn't happen often enough on the other lines to justify the expense, especially when those potential funds could go to fixing/replacing the damaged side signs.

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Damaged signs are another issue that needs to be fixed.

The (6) yard (drawing a blank on the name) did a horrible job at maintaining the R142As. Almost every car had damaged signs that were never fixed. And those dirty strip maps, jeeze. Edited by CKhaleel

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The (6) yard (drawing a blank on the name) did a horrible job at maintaining the R142As. Almost every car had damaged signs that were never fixed. And those dirty strip maps, jeeze.

At least with those R142As on the (7) now, we almost never have to see those strip maps ever again. With these new maps hopefully coming to the (2) / (5), the (6) will be the one with the oldest strip maps in the system.

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Speaking of strip maps, I'm going to only speculate on not seeing updated strip maps on the (1) until both the new South Ferry Station reopens and Cortlandt St Station reopens as well.

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At least with those R142As on the (7) now, we almost never have to see those strip maps ever again. With these new maps hopefully coming to the (2) / (5), the (6) will be the one with the oldest strip maps in the system.

Forgot the (1) train,huh?

Speaking of which, one of the 2200's had a (1)(9) strip map still in it.I rode it around the time South Ferry reopened.

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Forgot the (1) train,huh?

Speaking of which, one of the 2200's had a (1)(9) strip map still in it.I rode it around the time South Ferry reopened.

That's true, but I'm talking about NTT wise.

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Yep I saw it to, what I wonder is if the R142's actually did have the (9) program in the first place.

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Yep I saw it to, what I wonder is if the R142's actually did have the (9) program in the first place.

 

I think they do, (9) train service ended in 2004, and the R142/As started coming in 2001... So I'm not sure why they wouldn't have had it.

Edited by LegoBrickBreaker101

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Oh, I know how this goes! Someone is gonna come in and say the (9) shows up as a Not in Service program...right?

 

On second thought, are there any current or former TA employees who could vouch for the past existence of a functional (9) program? 

Edited by CKhaleel

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It's possible some of the cars have (9) options, just as there are more (1) options on some cars than on the official lists. I'm not sure how the software is updated, but if they're done so piece by piece, the removal could've been missed during one of those updates, similar to how a few 142s had '03 transfers well into 2008.

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Eh, they don't really have to conform with much of what Vignelli called for anymore. Believe me, I wish they did, but they could print these however they wanted to. There are endless errors and design language mistakes in the modern system that break from the Unimark coding. The manual is updated every few years anyway--hence whey the letters in bullets increased size, Helvetica was normalized, etc. 

 

I mean, definitely. All of it pretty much goes to hell whenever the MTA decides it's time to have some sort of in-station line strip map again, but certain things have always stayed the same (mostly because there's never a reason for them to change, like the placement of words relative to the line in a strip map). Vignelli was always a little bit too strict with his Swiss-style prescriptiveness anyways.

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Since this is about the 2/5 trains, I was wondering:

 

1) During the AM hours, the R142s that leaves Livonia Yard, does it become a (2) train or the (5)?

 

2) Wouldn't it be easier for the (5) to go to New Lots Av since it goes out of service after 8 PM? (the trains terminating at Utica)

 

3) Does a train goes to its assigned yard after reaching to the last stop? (Example: Nereid Av, (5) train set)

 

http://web.mta.info/nyct/service/pdf/t5cur.pdf: notice the times at 5:45PM and 5:51PM to the Bronx on weekdays

Edited by Calvin

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I know i'm late on this topic, but if we had to deal with the strip map confusion for over a decade, what is another decade? People could listen to the announcements and look at the subway maps than to rely on the strip maps. When it comes time to retire the r62/as, then move the r142s on the 2/5 over to the 1/6 lines. That way by then the new trains will have the find already built in and don't need to modify anything. They would need to print up some 1 line strip maps and put back the 6 line strip maps or print up new ones to reinstall them on the r142s.

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I know i'm late on this topic, but if we had to deal with the strip map confusion for over a decade, what is another decade? People could listen to the announcements and look at the subway maps than to rely on the strip maps. When it comes time to retire the r62/as, then move the r142s on the 2/5 over to the 1/6 lines. That way by then the new trains will have the find already built in and don't need to modify anything. They would need to print up some 1 line strip maps and put back the 6 line strip maps or print up new ones to reinstall them on the r142s.

Sure, you could ignore a problem which is easy to solve, but why? There is no downside to fixing a communication issue which has been causing problems for almost 15 years now.

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Easy to solve? With today's riders they'll probably be even more confused seeing both lines listed on the same map. Plus if they have their phones, they could see for themselves what stop is coming up if they don't want to look at the maps in the cars or use a physical map.

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The new design is easy to figure out if you stop and think about what you are looking at. A 2 stripmap on a 5 train, or a 5 stripmap on a 2 train is not only confusing, but it is also misleading!

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I think you are giving the average rider too much credit to expect to understand a map with so much info all on the same map. I mean yes, it is better than the current situation of a map in use or not in use, but i still doubt it will stop people from asking the c/r or t/o what train it is or what stops the train will be stopping at etc.

It is a nice map, but i don't see the point in printing up a batch of new ones now when they can wait another decade plus for new trains with the find already installed and the current trains pushed over to lines that don't share trains at all or very rarely.

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The new maps are being printed anyway (fleetwide). The choice is between new maps which do not make an attempt to solve the 2/5 fleet sharing problem, or new maps which display both the 2 and the 5.
Why not get them right?

Edited by Art Vandelay

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I stand corrected. If they are printing new strip maps now for the whole fleet, then i guess they may as well go with the combo one then. I was mistaken thinking they wanted to print these new maps specifically for the 2/5 because people complained about signs being nis.

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It's about time they considered this, although gutting the strip maps and installing FIND would have been the more preferable option, this is definitely more cost-effective. I do remember out-of-towners/tourists/infrequent subway riders giving the  (2) map on the  (5) train a funny look and then getting off the train, thinking they had gotten the wrong one. The design's confusing and takes getting used to, but it's better than what they have now.

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Keep in mind the R142s are already running out of storage space, so not only would it cost money to install FINDs, but they'd also have to upgrade the storage space of all the R142s to accommodate the FIND programming.

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