Department of Subways - Proposals/Ideas

[realizm]

Back to your regularly scheduled program:

 

 

@Realizm

 

http://www.mta.info/nyct/service/ServiceReduction/part1.htm

 

This also helps too. Many lines got their service cut to about 40%. The and got cut to about 17%. The and , however, are still the most frequent of all lines in the system during the weekend periods.

 

Yes I remember this announcement. I think personally it was really stupid that they but service on the . Really dumb move. Look at how ridiculous 59th looks now. I mean surreal and unacceptable. I seriously question at this point if a mere phase 1 on the SAS will even help at this point. but its better then nothing.

 

10 minutes on the - not a good move and as the document shows its no wonder that the service is so crowded now especially with the fact that nothing has changed off peak and weekends with the 2014 service enhancements to my knowledge. Thats why I cant believe they cant add at least some train service here. Its pretty obvious the Jerome Ave Line next door sort of speak isnt doing much to relieve congestion.

Edited February 10, 2014 by realizm

[GreatOne2k]

Midday and evening could run to 167 St, Tremont Av, or Fordham Rd as well

[Fresh Pond]

Tried to stay out of this but screw it...

 

No matter where you send the on weekends, it's still gonna be in the way of another train, be it 2 Av (has to merge with the at West 4 to get into 2 Av) or Brighton Beach (you airway know what the deal is with that already).

 

The hss no stop that it makes on its own. It's not like the walk from the to the takes forever or anything

[cl94]

Tried to stay out of this but screw it...

 

No matter where you send the on weekends, it's still gonna be in the way of another train, be it 2 Av (has to merge with the at West 4 to get into 2 Av) or Brighton Beach (you airway know what the deal is with that already).

 

The hss no stop that it makes on its own. It's not like the walk from the to the takes forever or anything

 

Exactly. It would probably be cheaper to expand service and it wouldn't get in the way of anything. More CPW local service would be nice, but the area that needs it (the Bronx) would be happier with 7-8 TPH instead of the current 6. Albany would probably be more willing to provide funding for this, also. As noted, the 's current function is to interline with other services and reduce transfers. Nice, yes, but not necessary, which is an important consideration if limited funding is available. Expanding the will do little to interfere with the and , the only other services it encounters. While the frequency of the isn't great, it isn't worth the extra millions of dollars required to put on another local.

[RailGator]

Hello everyone this is my first post here on the forum, and here's my fantasy subway route.

 

The (P) Train

 

BROOKLYN

Starts on currently unused express tracks

• 7 Av   
• 4 Av-9 St     
• Bergen St (Lower Level)   
• Rises up to local   tracks
• Hoyt-Schermerhorn Sts    
• Fulton St
• Clinton-Washington Aves 
• Classon Ave
• Bedford-Nostrand Aves
• Myrtle-Willoughby Aves
• Flushing Ave
• Broadway
• Metropolitan Ave  
• Nassau Ave
• Greenpoint Ave

~~~~~~NEWTOWN CREEK~~~~~~

 

QUEENS

 Diverges, Entering westbound tunnel under 54th Avenue

 

• Long Island City-2nd St  LIRR

 

Enters new East River Tube

~~~~~~EAST RIVER~~~~~~

 

MANHATTAN

Enters underneath 34th Street

 

• 2 Av 
• Park Av  ​

Converges with current PATH tracks, and turns southbound on 6th Ave

• 34 St-Herald Square             
• 23 St  
• 14 St          
• 9 St
• Christopher St

 ~~~~~~HUDSON RIVER~~~~~~

 

NEW JERSEY

 

• Pavonia-Newport 
• Grove St 
• Journal Square 

Terminus, Journal Square Yards

 

  

 

 

 

 

[Wallyhorse]

The is already utilizing 2nd Ave frequently and every once in a while the gets rerouted to 2nd Ave via the line so that creates even more congestion. I don't think 2nd Ave will be a good choice.

Although it might a bit unfeasible, a permanent terminal could be Bowery. The south/east platform is currently abandoned. It could be revived for the . Of course, that would require digging to connect the to the Bowery station so like I said: it might be unfeasible. But at least that's a station with a platform ready to be used after some cleaning (and connecting the tracks).

Since there has been clamoring anyway to get the up Queens Boulevard on weekends to help the there, one possible solution would be to have the and swap cars (at least on weekends) and on weekends (and late nights if warranted) have the , with eight-car 480' trains run to Essex Street (or if necessary, Myrtle Avenue with "peak direction" express service (from Manhattan to 4:00 PM, to Manhattan after 4:00 PM)) with the going to 71st-Continental.   That would take care of two such issues.

[Fresh Pond]

And then there's this guy...

[Lance]

Well, there's a train that's never late. You can always count on Wallyhorse to bring forth a proposal that literally no one else thought about or even asked for. It's like clockwork.

[realizm]

Since there has been clamoring anyway to get the up Queens Boulevard on weekends to help the there, one possible solution would be to have the and swap cars (at least on weekends) and on weekends (and late nights if warranted) have the , with eight-car 480' trains run to Essex Street (or if necessary, Myrtle Avenue with "peak direction" express service (from Manhattan to 4:00 PM, to Manhattan after 4:00 PM)) with the going to 71st-Continental.   That would take care of two such issues.

No offense Wallyhorse you are a good guy, but seriously you lost me completely on this post.

 

But nethertheless thanks for sharing your ideas.

[Vistausss]

No offense Wallyhorse you are a good guy, but seriously you lost me completely on this post.

 

Not sure about you but I can't remember any post of him where he lost me completely...

Edited February 10, 2014 by Vistausss

[realizm]

Not sure about you but I can't remember any post of him where he lost me completely...

Theres a few times which I gave him props for nailing it on certain points which does make sense in past discussions. On top of that in general he is a plesant person and welcome addition to whatever discussions we have albeit I will admit he does have a very vivid imagination where it pertains to proposal threads, which is perfectly fine with me personally speaking, as much as I cant agree to everything he may bring to the table.

 

Which is generally quite normal on any internet community.

 

But anyway the swap on rolling stock idea he presented to solve clearance issues @ Essex, my take on it is that may prove to be too costly as well as peak direction express service which will not help to meet passenger demand along the BMT Eastern Division.

 

This was why the MTA decided to extended the in the first place to give residents who board at the local stations along the Jamaica El Manhattan access off peak, weekends. Which is why on this one I will have to say I wasnt clear on his post.

 

But let him speak for himself then we can continue with our exchange of ideas from there. In other words its no big deal.

Edited February 10, 2014 by realizm

[YankeesPwnMets]

Since there has been clamoring anyway to get the up Queens Boulevard on weekends to help the there, one possible solution would be to have the and swap cars (at least on weekends) and on weekends (and late nights if warranted) have the , with eight-car 480' trains run to Essex Street (or if necessary, Myrtle Avenue with "peak direction" express service (from Manhattan to 4:00 PM, to Manhattan after 4:00 PM)) with the going to 71st-Continental.   That would take care of two such issues.

The to Essex? That definitely would not confuse any riders.

[Jsunflyguy]

The to Essex? That definitely would not confuse any riders.

 

Passengers manage GOs on a regular basis, that's not a solid basis to avoid a particular permanent service pattern.

 

But if confusion is the basis of that plan then you could always send the M uptown. *disappears into the darkness*

Edited February 11, 2014 by Jsunflyguy

[Lance]

G.O.-related reroutes are different, and even then, the lines don't stray too far from its original (normal) route unless it's necessary. The MTA doesn't want to repeat what it did in the '80s and '90s, where some subway lines had widely different terminals and sometimes different routes altogether depending on the time of day. The idea nowadays is to keep it (service patterns that is) as simplistic as possible so as to minimize confusion among the riding public.

[Vistausss]

G.O.-related reroutes are different, and even then, the lines don't stray too far from its original (normal) route unless it's necessary. The MTA doesn't want to repeat what it did in the '80s and '90s, where some subway lines had widely different terminals and sometimes different routes altogether depending on the time of day. The idea nowadays is to keep it (service patterns that is) as simplistic as possible so as to minimize confusion among the riding public.

 

Exactly. And even nowadays that's not perfected either. Look at the (5)'s different terminals... and I don't mean E180, I mean either Dyre Ave or New Lots. I know why it's necessary but from a simplistic POV it still has ways to go.

Edited February 11, 2014 by Vistausss

[Turbo19]

Passengers manage GOs on a regular basis, that's not a solid basis to avoid a particular permanent service pattern.

 

But if confusion is the basis of that plan then you could always send the M uptown. *disappears into the darkness*

Passengers are competent enough to manage and differentiate multiple services?

 

Get out of here.

[RTOMan]

Don't worry Folks come June the 8th you will see Mikey service to Essex on the weekends... Just four cars but it will be there...

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Lance]

Exactly. And even nowadays that's not perfected either. Look at the (5)'s different terminals... and I don't mean E180, I mean either Dyre Ave or New Lots. I know why it's necessary but from a simplistic POV it still has ways to go.

I think you mean Nereid Av since that's the other northern terminal, though your point still stands. That's why Wallyhorse's posts are quite groan-worthy at times.

 

I just realized I really didn't comment on the subject itself. While I'm not opposed to running the B to Bedford Park during the midday hours, I don't see how it would solve the merging issues. Instead of holding up trains because of the switches just south of 145 St, the merger would occur just north of 135 St where the B and D split up to run local or express respectively along Central Park West, which would likely create the same delays as it does when the B terminates on the middle track at 145 St on the lower level.

[Jsunflyguy]

I think you mean Nereid Av since that's the other northern terminal, though your point still stands. That's why Wallyhorse's posts are quite groan-worthy at times.

 

I just realized I really didn't comment on the subject itself. While I'm not opposed to running the B to Bedford Park during the midday hours, I don't see how it would solve the merging issues. Instead of holding up trains because of the switches just south of 145 St, the merger would occur just north of 135 St where the B and D split up to run local or express respectively along Central Park West, which would likely create the same delays as it does when the B terminates on the middle track at 145 St on the lower level.

 

I think you mean Nereid Av since that's the other northern terminal, though your point still stands. That's why Wallyhorse's posts are quite groan-worthy at times.

 

I just realized I really didn't comment on the subject itself. While I'm not opposed to running the B to Bedford Park during the midday hours, I don't see how it would solve the merging issues. Instead of holding up trains because of the switches just south of 145 St, the merger would occur just north of 135 St where the B and D split up to run local or express respectively along Central Park West, which would likely create the same delays as it does when the B terminates on the middle track at 145 St on the lower level.

The situation being looked at is a low capacity one track terminal where a train that cannot enter blocks the interlocking thus delaying a third service. By moving the terminal north you'd automatically eliminate that conflict (regardless of B/D merge issues). With the tower at 145 fleeted trains can run in on station time and clear 135th which reduces issues with the A/C.

[MTA Bus]

I don't think that the needs to run on the weekends. It would just easier to just increase service on the . Besides, even if the were to run on weekends. no matter where you would sent it, it would still delay another train, whether it be the or the .

[Vistausss]

I think you mean Nereid Av since that's the other northern terminal, though your point still stands. That's why Wallyhorse's posts are quite groan-worthy at times.

 

Oops, you re right. I meant Nereid Ave.

[FamousNYLover]

Does anyone remember last 2 years ago, when had G.O was terminating at 2nd Av southbound unused track while Holiday train on terminated at on northbound unused track, which caused delays on , , and special .

 

Every time when I was on 6th avenue stations, tourists doesn't seem to understand doesn't run on weekends, so they just kept passing on .

 

It was same situation during pre- days, pre-, and now , even tourists still wait for train that never comes.

 

I also remember during Sandy ®ecove®ly effect, some tourists still wait for that goes into Lower Manhattan or Brooklyn Heights on weekends.

Edited February 11, 2014 by FamousNYLover

[realizm]

I don't think that the needs to run on the weekends. It would just easier to just increase service on the . Besides, even if the were to run on weekends. no matter where you would sent it, it would still delay another train, whether it be the or the .

 

I'm starting to think the same thing taking all things into consideration concerning delays in switch lineups and probklems with that congestion point at Second Ave if say the was to terminate there.

 

Again as mentioned before in that 2009 study, the CCC speculated that it may be wise to send the to Brooklyn (for that very reason, congestion @ 2nd Ave) after the then Culver Viaduct project is complete. But they decided to just knock out the after the 2010 budget cuts to make a long story short, as you well know anyway (Just throwing it out there anyway for the sake of making the post as a general response for the visitors reading up on our astute discussion).

Edited February 11, 2014 by realizm

[cl94]

Does anyone remember last 2 years ago, when had G.O was terminating at 2nd Av southbound unused track while Holiday train on terminated at on northbound unused track, which caused delays on , , and special .

 

Every time when I was on 6th avenue stations, tourists doesn't seem to understand doesn't run on weekends, so they just kept passing on .

 

It was same situation during pre- days, pre- , and now , even tourists still wait for train that never comes.

 

I also remember during Sandy ®ecove®ly effect, some tourists still wait for that goes into Lower Manhattan or Brooklyn Heights on weekends.

 

This problem could be easily solved by more signage. They already block off access to stations south of Canal Street on weekends. Biggest problem is that most people don't read the signs. More signs indicating which routes are part-time (such as at the entrance of every station) would give more of a heads-up. If anything, provide an easily-accessible weekend map that looks just like the normal map showing the non-GO service patterns and get it to every hotel and tourist guidebook so they have a chance of learning the routes.

 

In fact, tourist traffic is the most-viable argument that the should run on weekends because the CPW local serves some highly-trafficked tourist areas of Central Park and the Museum of Natural History. Remember, few rapid transit systems have more than a tiny amount of interlining (if any) or fewer operating routes on weekends.

[Jsunflyguy]

If the is going to delay a train by sharing tracks with it during a period of 10 minute headways how in the world does the railroad run during rush hour? (serious question)