MTA holds out hope for more buses

[Via Garibaldi 8]

From what I hear, the big problem in the S. Bronx and central Bronx is bus fare-beating. My brother regularly rides the buses there and tells me that it is endemic. At many stops, people just get on the rear door with impunity. I don't know why the MTA doesn't post some plain-clothes transit police on random buses and arrest a bunch of folks. Word would travel fast.

And those are the same people that are trashing the bus.  When you don't pay for something you're less likely to value/respect it, and that's what's going on.  To those who are offended, I'm just telling it how it is.  This is what I also see as well.  

[Deucey]

And those are the same people that are trashing the bus. When you don't pay for something you're less likely to value/respect it, and that's what's going on. To those who are offended, I'm just telling it how it is. This is what I also see as well.

I see the same thing on buses in Bay Ridge and South Shore SI.

 

Seems to me that, aside from not enough public restrooms, the outer boroughs need more trash bins and more frequent pickup of those bins.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I see the same thing on buses in Bay Ridge and South Shore SI.

 

Seems to me that, aside from not enough public restrooms, the outer boroughs need more trash bins and more frequent pickup of those bins.

The garbage problem is citywide. I noticed it here and wrote to my elected officials. We now have more frequent pick-ups here in Central Riverdale. Nevertheless, some areas are worse than others.

 

I have never heard of buses being taken out of service for being trashed. Back in the day, Staten Island local buses took that title easily...

[paulrivera]

 As was mentioned the Bx7, Bx10 and Bx20 don't have this issue. Just lines like the Bx1 that come from the South Bronx.

Oh, you need to ride the Bx10 past 231st and into Bedford Park and Norwood in the afternoon.... It gets pretty bad.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Oh, you need to ride the Bx10 past 231st and into Bedford Park and Norwood in the afternoon.... It gets pretty bad.

I've only used the Bx10 once past 231st in Norwood. Couldn't stand it. Changed to the Bx1 at Mosholu Parkway. It was my attempt to get to Riverdale faster without meandering like the Bx10 does, not to mention the Bx1 uses artics. My first and last time. I will be sticking with the express bus for such trips in the future. Less aggravation, and the commute time is almost the same. Still takes a good hour or more going from Norwood or the Northeast Bronx to Riverdale.

[Rafa]

As mentioned before it's usually the people who don't pay that trash the buses including the school children.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Another interesting article...

 

http://riverdalepress.com/stories/Wait-still-on-for-better-service-on-Bx7-bus,61719

[paulrivera]

Another interesting article...

 

http://riverdalepress.com/stories/Wait-still-on-for-better-service-on-Bx7-bus,61719

It's not like all those people who waited an hour for the Bx7 at 231st were all only going to Riverdale Avenue while all those Bx10s went by (the only segment the 7 goes that the 10 doesn't)

 

But yea, the Riverdale folks need to press the TA even more than they do already, and that's saying something.

[Deucey]

It's not like all those people who waited an hour for the Bx7 at 231st were all only going to Riverdale Avenue while all those Bx10s went by (the only segment the 7 goes that the 10 doesn't)

 

But yea, the Riverdale folks need to press the TA even more than they do already, and that's saying something.

If only people on SI would do the same for AM ferry-bound S40/44 buses...when I do ride either, only on snow days am I not standing in front of the farebox while it rolls along Richmond Terrace.

 

Riverdale, I feel your frustration.

[checkmatechamp13]

If only people on SI would do the same for AM ferry-bound S40/44 buses...when I do ride either, only on snow days am I not standing in front of the farebox while it rolls along Richmond Terrace.

 

Riverdale, I feel your frustration.

 

Community Board 1 complained about overcrowding on the S74/78 on Van Duzer Street in the morning, and service was increased. (S78 service basically had about 3 extra buses per hour added in the AM rush).  

 

On Richmond Terrace, I proposed a combination of the S42/54 which would provide additional service along Richmond Terrace (buses would basically take Richmond Terrace to Franklin, cover the S42 route down Prospect & Lafayette, then take Castleton Avenue and take over the S54 route, and end at Seaview Hospital). 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

If only people on SI would do the same for AM ferry-bound S40/44 buses...when I do ride either, only on snow days am I not standing in front of the farebox while it rolls along Richmond Terrace.

 

Riverdale, I feel your frustration.

If you haven't figured it out yet, as a former Staten Islander who lived on the North Shore, you'll realize the politics sooner or later.  The North Shore is under represented (even the affluent parts - parts of the West Brighton, Westerleigh and Randall Manor come to mind) and even though many of the residents are vocal and active, the politicians are weak and worthless, and I'll put Debbie Rose at the forefront of that, along with former representatives like Mike McMahon.  Matthew Titone is another one that does nothing to improve transit on the North Shore.  We lost the X13 and X16 express buses along Forest Avenue under the watch of these worthless politicians.  Even after a petition drive to save the X16, Debbie Rose did nothing but plead with the to re-consider and has since done nothing.  I got fed up with it and it was one reason I left.  Move to the South Shore and you'll see a difference.  The only time I got action was when Vito Fossella was in office.  He worked to improve express bus service for ALL of Staten Island.  

 

It's not like all those people who waited an hour for the Bx7 at 231st were all only going to Riverdale Avenue while all those Bx10s went by (the only segment the 7 goes that the 10 doesn't)

 

But yea, the Riverdale folks need to press the TA even more than they do already, and that's saying something.

I think those people were waiting at 259th and Riverdale Avenue heading south, so I assume they must've needed to go past 231st and Broadway and were heading into Manhattan.  Either way a wait that long is unacceptable.  What's also amazing is that with all of the dispatching they have at 231st and Broadway, they can't seem to address this back up of buses that is definitely a chronic habit on the Bx7 in the 5 years that I've been living in Riverdale.  I sometimes get the Hudson Rail link along Riverdale Avenue and I see back-to back Bx7 buses followed by a gap of 15+ minutes.  This even happens on weekends when I'm running errands on Riverdale Avenue.  

[Deucey]

Community Board 1 complained about overcrowding on the S74/78 on Van Duzer Street in the morning, and service was increased. (S78 service basically had about 3 extra buses per hour added in the AM rush).

 

On Richmond Terrace, I proposed a combination of the S42/54 which would provide additional service along Richmond Terrace (buses would basically take Richmond Terrace to Franklin, cover the S42 route down Prospect & Lafayette, then take Castleton Avenue and take over the S54 route, and end at Seaview Hospital).

The flaw with that is it would make S52 even more crowded between there and Curtis High School during AM rush.

 

What I'd really like is for, at least on Richmond Terrace is to operate Limited buses like LA MTA does - stop at all local stops for the last mile of the route during winter month at least. We New Brighton folks are fortunate we can walk to the ferry, but enough people slip on the hills between Richmond and St Mark's Pl that the bus is the only way to avoid injury risk. The stairs at St Peter's church, as bad as they are, are safer than the hills.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The flaw with that is it would make S52 even more crowded between there and Curtis High School during AM rush.

 

What I'd really like is for, at least on Richmond Terrace is to operate Limited buses like LA MTA does - stop at all local stops for the last mile of the route during winter month at least. We New Brighton folks are fortunate we can walk to the ferry, but enough people slip on the hills between Richmond and St Mark's Pl that the bus is the only way to avoid injury risk. The stairs at St Peter's church, as bad as they are, are safer than the hills.

I don't expect the to break from its "ferry-centric" stance on Staten Island.  Getting around via the local bus on the island is always a mess because of this.  They've added some service here and there, but it could be better.  Maybe they're waiting for that fifth depot to come around before they add more service... 

[paulrivera]

What's also amazing is that with all of the dispatching they have at 231st and Broadway, they can't seem to address this back up of buses that is definitely a chronic habit on the Bx7 in the 5 years that I've been living in Riverdale.

The only dispatching that's really done nowadays is either short turning or deadheading from the terminal to the midway point of the route, which makes wait times even worse if you're not near the midway point of a route. The days of the adding extra sections on local buses to meet with the scheduled headways (let alone ridership) are mostly dead, and all the no-shows that happen on top of it just add to the problem.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The only dispatching that's really done nowadays is either short turning or deadheading from the terminal to the midway point of the route, which makes wait times even worse if you're not near the midway point of a route. The days of the adding extra sections on local buses to meet with the scheduled headways (let alone ridership) are mostly dead, and all the no-shows that happen on top of it just add to the problem.

Well you make a good point.  Speaking of no-shows, I didn't understand why they were automatically reducing service by 20% before they even knew if the storm would take hold?  It seems as if they are now looking for ways to cut service as much as possible.  The no-shows are another problem in and of itself.  I strongly believe that they are still not replacing drivers when they call out sick as a way to mitigate costs.  It's one of the disadvantages of BusTime.  It allows passengers to see if buses are coming but it also makes buses "an option" as opposed to "the option". For those who use it as "an option", great, but for those who need it as "the option", they're increasingly becoming screwed over.

[checkmatechamp13]

The flaw with that is it would make S52 even more crowded between there and Curtis High School during AM rush.

 

What I'd really like is for, at least on Richmond Terrace is to operate Limited buses like LA MTA does - stop at all local stops for the last mile of the route during winter month at least. We New Brighton folks are fortunate we can walk to the ferry, but enough people slip on the hills between Richmond and St Mark's Pl that the bus is the only way to avoid injury risk. The stairs at St Peter's church, as bad as they are, are safer than the hills.

 

Then the MTA can simply add more service to the S52 (extra trips starting from Stapleton to replace those S42 runs)

 

And as somebody who takes the S94 to the ferry, I can say that would screw over riders of the route in general. Once you're on Richmond Terrace, at least you can walk down if a bus isn't coming soon (or maybe walk back to Jersey Street if you're close enough). Riders further out have to sit through those extra stops you'd be forcing those limited-stop buses to make.

 

During really inclement weather, limited-stop buses make all local stops anyway (in which case those S94 buses basically become S44 buses), so that's already been done on the MTA's part.

 

I don't expect the to break from its "ferry-centric" stance on Staten Island.  Getting around via the local bus on the island is always a mess because of this.  They've added some service here and there, but it could be better.  Maybe they're waiting for that fifth depot to come around before they add more service... 

 

He's referring to making the limited-stop buses stop at the stops closer to the ferry. That's not "adding" service.

 

And he's traveling towards the ferry anyway, so either way, those buses are "ferry-centric"

 

Well you make a good point.  Speaking of no-shows, I didn't understand why they were automatically reducing service by 20% before they even knew if the storm would take hold?  It seems as if they are now looking for ways to cut service as much as possible.  The no-shows are another problem in and of itself.  I strongly believe that they are still not replacing drivers when they call out sick as a way to mitigate costs.  It's one of the disadvantages of BusTime.  It allows passengers to see if buses are coming but it also makes buses "an option" as opposed to "the option". For those who use it as "an option", great, but for those who need it as "the option", they're increasingly becoming screwed over.

 

School wasn't in session (and aside from the trippers, students fill up a lot of the regular runs as well).

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1. He's referring to making the limited-stop buses stop at the stops closer to the ferry. That's not "adding" service.

 

And he's traveling towards the ferry anyway, so either way, those buses are "ferry-centric"

 

 

2. School wasn't in session (and aside from the trippers, students fill up a lot of the regular runs as well).

1. I don't know what your point is, but either way, it's clear that you don't know what I'm referring to.

 

2. What does that have to do with anything? Either way automatically canceling 20% of the service with no concrete schedule is a poor policy. This isn't the first time they've pulled a stunt like that where buses were supposedly running and yet we were out there waiting for hours with no bus in sight during the morning rush when buses were scheduled at least every 15 minutes.  In other words, since passengers won't have a clue as to where the reductions take place, their wait may very well be an hour + for one bus.  It's happened numerous times now.

[Deucey]

I don't expect the to break from its "ferry-centric" stance on Staten Island. Getting around via the local bus on the island is always a mess because of this. They've added some service here and there, but it could be better. Maybe they're waiting for that fifth depot to come around before they add more service...

Never that... although I wish they'd adjust schedules from the "just in time" philosophy to getting buses to St George well before a ferry departure.

 

I get the idea of 'get off the bus and right on the ferry's goal, but all it takes is a bus being at crush load and a 30 second unload causing the bus to hit a red light and then you're waiting 29 minutes for the next yacht ride. Getting there 10 minutes before departure might extend commutes, but it's a much better inconvenience than getting there with 1 minute before departure - especially if your bus stop is at the middle or far end of the ramp.

[checkmatechamp13]

1. I don't know what your point is, but either way, it's clear that you don't know what I'm referring to.

 

2. What does that have to do with anything? Either way automatically canceling 20% of the service with no concrete schedule is a poor policy. This isn't the first time they've pulled a stunt like that where buses were supposedly running and yet we were out there waiting for hours with no bus in sight during the morning rush when buses were scheduled at least every 15 minutes.  In other words, since passengers won't have a clue as to where the reductions take place, their wait may very well be an hour + for one bus.  It's happened numerous times now.

 

1. The post you responded to referred to making the limited-stop buses "stop at all local stops for the last mile of the route during winter month at least." Logically, for the last mile before the ferry, those are mostly ferry-bound riders that would be picked up.

 

If this proposal were something that would shift away from the ferry-centric stance of the MTA, you would have to make the argument that the primary people benefiting are those coming from points that need to access the local stops closer to the ferry. The only real ridership base that would benefit from that are kids going to Curtis High School......except he specifically mentioned people living near St. George ("We New Brighton folks") as the ones he intends this proposal to benefit.

 

2. Now that you've clarified yourself, I agree with you. The reason for the reduction in service is that they expect ridership to be lower because at the very least, there will be no schoolkids on board. But I do agree that the reduced-service schedule should be published so people know when to expect a bus to come.

 

Never that... although I wish they'd adjust schedules from the "just in time" philosophy to getting buses to St George well before a ferry departure.

 

I get the idea of 'get off the bus and right on the ferry's goal, but all it takes is a bus being at crush load and a 30 second unload causing the bus to hit a red light and then you're waiting 29 minutes for the next yacht ride. Getting there 10 minutes before departure might extend commutes, but it's a much better inconvenience than getting there with 1 minute before departure - especially if your bus stop is at the middle or far end of the ramp.

 

Part of it also has to do with them being cheap. For example, in the evening, routes like the S46 & S48 have 3 buses running down the route. If you were to give riders a 10 minute cushion instead of a 3-5 minute cushion, that would require an additional bus dedicated to the route.

 

Personally, I think traffic signal priority and removing stops in general would do wonders for helping people reach the ferry more reliably. For example, right off the top of my head, why are there stops at both Van Duzer Street & Bay Street heading eastbound? When you have 5 minutes left and you think you're going to make it, but you stop at both stops and miss both lights, that's especially frustrating. Stops further out....why do the S44 & S46 stop at both Elizabeth Street & Caroline Street heading eastbound? Have them both stop at Elizabeth Street (since Caroline doesn't have a light at Castleton, and dead-ends south of Cary) and call it a day. By Cassidy-Lafayette, there should be one stop, not two. I know it's a senior housing development, but it's not like all these seniors are incapable of walking one block (and if they are, they should be using Access-A-Ride anyway)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1. The post you responded to referred to making the limited-stop buses "stop at all local stops for the last mile of the route during winter month at least." Logically, for the last mile before the ferry, those are mostly ferry-bound riders that would be picked up.

 

If this proposal were something that would shift away from the ferry-centric stance of the MTA, you would have to make the argument that the primary people benefiting are those coming from points that need to access the local stops closer to the ferry. The only real ridership base that would benefit from that are kids going to Curtis High School......except he specifically mentioned people living near St. George ("We New Brighton folks") as the ones he intends this proposal to benefit.

 

2. Now that you've clarified yourself, I agree with you. The reason for the reduction in service is that they expect ridership to be lower because at the very least, there will be no schoolkids on board. But I do agree that the reduced-service schedule should be published so people know when to expect a bus to come.

 

 

 

Part of it also has to do with them being cheap. For example, in the evening, routes like the S46 & S48 have 3 buses running down the route. If you were to give riders a 10 minute cushion instead of a 3-5 minute cushion, that would require an additional bus dedicated to the route.

 

Personally, I think traffic signal priority and removing stops in general would do wonders for helping people reach the ferry more reliably. For example, right off the top of my head, why are there stops at both Van Duzer Street & Bay Street heading eastbound? When you have 5 minutes left and you think you're going to make it, but you stop at both stops and miss both lights, that's especially frustrating. Stops further out....why do the S44 & S46 stop at both Elizabeth Street & Caroline Street heading eastbound? Have them both stop at Elizabeth Street (since Caroline doesn't have a light at Castleton, and dead-ends south of Cary) and call it a day. By Cassidy-Lafayette, there should be one stop, not two. I know it's a senior housing development, but it's not like all these seniors are incapable of walking one block (and if they are, they should be using Access-A-Ride anyway)

My point went further than that. The point is that people who perhaps want to travel on Staten Island using the local buses have a hard time doing so due to the ferry-centric mindset of the .

 

I think the should go further with their review of lines in general to better understand ridership patterns across the city. As I mentioned before, we've had an increase in people using the local buses within Riverdale, yet the buses are set up primarily for travel to and from the subways.

[paulrivera]

2. Now that you've clarified yourself, I agree with you. The reason for the reduction in service is that they expect ridership to be lower because at the very least, there will be no schoolkids on board. But I do agree that the reduced-service schedule should be published so people know when to expect a bus to come.

Actually, the MTA made the decision to cut service before the Mayor decided to close the schools. If anything, the city decided to call a snow day because the bus system wasn't going to be able to handle the ridership.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Actually, the MTA made the decision to cut service before the Mayor decided to close the schools. If anything, the city decided to call a snow day because the bus system wasn't going to be able to handle the ridership.

Interesting. I wasn't aware of that. That makes it even worse. Cutting 20% likely isn't what was on the road. Probably more like 30% cut because you know they'll have drivers that call out and the won't replace them.

 

One of the biggest excuses they use is that the buses can't get up the hills here but I haven't experienced such a situation. They sure as hell ran on Staten Island when we had snowstorms. The main issue was the number of B/O's that would call out and not be replaced.

[Deucey]

1. The post you responded to referred to making the limited-stop buses "stop at all local stops for the last mile of the route during winter month at least." Logically, for the last mile before the ferry, those are mostly ferry-bound riders that would be picked up.

 

If this proposal were something that would shift away from the ferry-centric stance of the MTA, you would have to make the argument that the primary people benefiting are those coming from points that need to access the local stops closer to the ferry. The only real ridership base that would benefit from that are kids going to Curtis High School......except he specifically mentioned people living near St. George ("We New Brighton folks") as the ones he intends this proposal to benefit.

 

2. Now that you've clarified yourself, I agree with you. The reason for the reduction in service is that they expect ridership to be lower because at the very least, there will be no schoolkids on board. But I do agree that the reduced-service schedule should be published so people know when to expect a bus to come.

 

 

Part of it also has to do with them being cheap. For example, in the evening, routes like the S46 & S48 have 3 buses running down the route. If you were to give riders a 10 minute cushion instead of a 3-5 minute cushion, that would require an additional bus dedicated to the route.

 

Personally, I think traffic signal priority and removing stops in general would do wonders for helping people reach the ferry more reliably. For example, right off the top of my head, why are there stops at both Van Duzer Street & Bay Street heading eastbound? When you have 5 minutes left and you think you're going to make it, but you stop at both stops and miss both lights, that's especially frustrating. Stops further out....why do the S44 & S46 stop at both Elizabeth Street & Caroline Street heading eastbound? Have them both stop at Elizabeth Street (since Caroline doesn't have a light at Castleton, and dead-ends south of Cary) and call it a day. By Cassidy-Lafayette, there should be one stop, not two. I know it's a senior housing development, but it's not like all these seniors are incapable of walking one block (and if they are, they should be using Access-A-Ride anyway)

I think there's too many stops for NYC buses to begin with - especially North Shore SI.

 

That one on Bay St across from the courthouse that every bus except the S44/94 and S40/90 stops at? Why??

 

Or the stops at Jersey, Westervelt, St Peters, Nicholas and Stuyvesant. Two of those could be eliminated and save run time. I get being accessible to almost everyone, but it isn't like Nicholas or Westervelt patrons couldn't walk to St James.

[checkmatechamp13]

I think there's too many stops for NYC buses to begin with - especially North Shore SI.

 

That one on Bay St across from the courthouse that every bus except the S44/94 and S40/90 stops at? Why??

 

Or the stops at Jersey, Westervelt, St Peters, Nicholas and Stuyvesant. Two of those could be eliminated and save run time. I get being accessible to almost everyone, but it isn't like Nicholas or Westervelt patrons couldn't walk to St James.

 

That stop at Borough Hall I could understand....all the Curtis & McKee kids get off over there, as well as people going to the courthouses and so on.

 

Out of those 4, I would really only say Westervelt stop should be eliminated (especially since the S42/52 stop is up the hill at Westervelt & Hamilton. Maybe push the St. Peters stop back to the nearside of Richmond Terrace to compromise a bit. I would say he other stops in that area are reasonably spaced.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

It's not like all those people who waited an hour for the Bx7 at 231st were all only going to Riverdale Avenue while all those Bx10s went by (the only segment the 7 goes that the 10 doesn't)

 

But yea, the Riverdale folks need to press the TA even more than they do already, and that's saying something.

 

It's not enough to demand more service on your route. You should also identify which route should lose service to cover your increase. (As long as there is a bus shortage, it's a zero-sum system.)