Breakdancers pummel commuter refusing to make space for performance on Brooklyn train

[P3F]

Not only that, I've seen them deliberately pick the 59th-125th run because they know it gives them a captive audience.

It definitely sucks that the end doors are locked on 75-footers (open end doors would make for a quicker getaway), but I've seen how the end vestibules swing on those cars around turns; I don't blame the TA for not wanting to be held responsible for people being crushed.

 

Incidentally, I've never seen them on the R32 A consist...

The end doors are not locked on the R44s on the Staten Island Railway.

[R10 2952]

Yeah, but SIRT is practically the last place in the system you'll find breakdancing.... if at all.

[Lawrence St]

That's because Staten Island RR don't have sharp curves like in the subway system.

 

And also, let's not forget the guy who slapped the hell out of a girl on the a few years ago...I think we're all better off if the subway car is quiet and no one speaker to each other...

[Union Tpke]

Not only that, I've seen them deliberately pick the 59th-125th run because they know it gives them a captive audience.

It definitely sucks that the end doors are locked on 75-footers (open end doors would make for a quicker getaway), but I've seen how the end vestibules swing on those cars around turns; I don't blame the TA for not wanting to be held responsible for people being crushed.

 

Incidentally, I've never seen them on the R32 A consist...

 

They also do it on the between QP and Roosevelt, and between Roosevelt and FH. I see the same people doing it.

[Mtatransit]

They always do that between express stops or when Crossing the river. However they must be praying on tourist. I never see it on the . Or the

[trainfan22]

They always do that between express stops or when Crossing the river. However they must be praying on tourist. I never see it on the . Or the

I seen them on either the or (I forgot) doing their dances over the WillyB, also on a train over the bridge, all three routes hardly have tourists on them in the outerborughs so their not praying on tourist's

 

I think the average subway rider overall has a favorable opinion of the dancers, as I seen everyday NYers give them money. 

[biGC323232]

I think some people give because they feel sorry for them. Either way there is no way in hell I would be swinging around on some pole for a few dollars if that.  I actually used to give money here and there for extreme circumstances, but the begging has gotten so out of control that I stopped and I don't care what reason they give or how good their performance is.  It's like we now can no longer just commute in peace.  We have to be constantly hassled to give up our hard earned money.  It's one thing to ask and another to be almost forced into a corner and then hassled and I don't appreciate it.  These guys know exactly what they're doing.  They wait until the very last minute to dash into a car just as the doors are about to close and then you're stuck in there while they do their performance, especially on lines where you can't go in between the cars.

 

The subway is supposed to be about moving people from point A to point B.  If you want to solicit I can tolerate the people with their signs on the platform or whatever, but don't go asking me for money.  I think the tourists think it's cute and want to feel like they're experiencing the "New York life", so they'll give a few dollars, but for the average New Yorker who is constantly expected to tip, it isn't cute.  I mean where does it end?  You go into a café or just about any other place, and they expect you to tip now for counter service.  It's absurd.  Then you turn around and you have these guys... 

That's word up....I Totally agree....wasting all that energy for a few dollars...than after them here comes the homeless person..i can't remember honestly the last time i rode any line and didn't run into these idiots...funny how there never a cop around when its happening...

[m7zanr160s]

Yeah, the amount of money they get seems small, but if you get, say, $2 per individual, per car, at 10 cars per-day, five days a week...that's a tax free $100. And that's just a low end estimate. Increase that by a dollar or two and the total amount is much more.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Yeah, the amount of money they get seems small, but if you get, say, $2 per individual, per car, at 10 cars per-day, five days a week...that's a tax free $100. And that's just a low end estimate. Increase that by a dollar or two and the total amount is much more.

It is small when you consider how much time is spent doing that... It's barely pocket change at best.  They would be better off getting a real job.

[Porter]

They do this because we let them get away with it. Give a mouse a cookie...

 

"Sorry, charity isn't in my budget" goes a long way, too, and it's more respectful since it's the truth.

[agar io]

That type of activity is really stupid, but at least they don't outright panhandle without even a performance, some candy bars, or a magic trick. I've run into people who've tried to intimidate me for money. Once there was someone who told me, "I know you have money" and tried following me even after I got off my seat and went to another train car. Of course, I actually didn't have any money. They only went away after I turned my pockets to show them so.

 

That said, if a group is trying to perform in the train, it would be better to make space for them than risk getting beat up. Whenever that type of thing happens, I personally pretend like I don't speak English (since I can also speak Chinese), and read a book instead.

 

Also, the city should expand programs to employ the homeless, the unemployed, or these teenagers, and do a better job educating them. That should solve most, but not all, of these panhandling, although I doubt it'll ever stop completely.

[MysteriousBtrain]

That type of activity is really stupid, but at least they don't outright panhandle without even a performance, some candy bars, or a magic trick. I've run into people who've tried to intimidate me for money. Once there was someone who told me, "I know you have money" and tried following me even after I got off my seat and went to another train car. Of course, I actually didn't have any money. They only went away after I turned my pockets to show them so.

 

That said, if a group is trying to perform in the train, it would be better to make space for them than risk getting beat up. Whenever that type of thing happens, I personally pretend like I don't speak English (since I can also speak Chinese), and read a book instead.

 

Also, the city should expand programs to employ the homeless, the unemployed, or these teenagers, and do a better job educating them. That should solve most, but not all, of these panhandling, although I doubt it'll ever stop completely.

I'm sorry but if ANYONE harasses me like that they are either getting dropkicked in the face or I would be calling the authorities, MTA or NYPD.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

That type of activity is really stupid, but at least they don't outright panhandle without even a performance, some candy bars, or a magic trick. I've run into people who've tried to intimidate me for money. Once there was someone who told me, "I know you have money" and tried following me even after I got off my seat and went to another train car. Of course, I actually didn't have any money. They only went away after I turned my pockets to show them so.

 

That said, if a group is trying to perform in the train, it would be better to make space for them than risk getting beat up. Whenever that type of thing happens, I personally pretend like I don't speak English (since I can also speak Chinese), and read a book instead.

 

Also, the city should expand programs to employ the homeless, the unemployed, or these teenagers, and do a better job educating them. That should solve most, but not all, of these panhandling, although I doubt it'll ever stop completely.

LMAO... That is hilarious and crazy... And no panhandling won't stop because there are too many suckers out there giving their money away. 

[Deucey]

That type of activity is really stupid, but at least they don't outright panhandle without even a performance, some candy bars, or a magic trick. I've run into people who've tried to intimidate me for money. Once there was someone who told me, "I know you have money" and tried following me even after I got off my seat and went to another train car. Of course, I actually didn't have any money. They only went away after I turned my pockets to show them so.

 

That said, if a group is trying to perform in the train, it would be better to make space for them than risk getting beat up. Whenever that type of thing happens, I personally pretend like I don't speak English (since I can also speak Chinese), and read a book instead.

 

Also, the city should expand programs to employ the homeless, the unemployed, or these teenagers, and do a better job educating them. That should solve most, but not all, of these panhandling, although I doubt it'll ever stop completely.

Closest I had to that was a hobo was about to mug me when I was half asleep on a leaving 135th St. Just one comment to dude: "You can stay broke and healthy or try and at least be crippled."

 

Dude bolted like The Flash when we got to 145th.

[LongLiveRock]

I seen them on either the or (I forgot) doing their dances over the WillyB, also on a train over the bridge, all three routes hardly have tourists on them in the outerborughs so their not praying on tourist's

 

I think the average subway rider overall has a favorable opinion of the dancers, as I seen everyday NYers give them money. 

 

 

Oh yeah - I don't think I've been on a over the bridge without some form of performers in half a decade. Often it's nice singer/guitar duos or whatever (that's the kind of performance we have to encourage), but usually breakdancers. I assume they choose the longest times between stops

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Oh yeah - I don't think I've been on a over the bridge without some form of performers in half a decade. Often it's nice singer/guitar duos or whatever (that's the kind of performance we have to encourage), but usually breakdancers. I assume they choose the longest times between stops

That's really a shame. Growing up in South Brooklyn and taking the train to the city, the main highlight was enjoying the views as we crossed over the Manhattan Bridge.  

[P3F]

It doesn't happen much on crowded rush hour and trains, thankfully. The breakdancers do their "routines" mostly during the middays, evenings, and weekends.

[itmaybeokay]

These guys know exactly what they're doing.  They wait until the very last minute to dash into a car just as the doors are about to close and then you're stuck in there while they do their performance, especially on lines where you can't go in between the cars.

 

These guys love their captive audience - and that's why I have no respect for whatever talent they have. They could be the best dancer the world has ever seen - go do it in union square - or wherever. Do it somewhere people who want to watch can come by and people who don't can walk away. 

 

You go into a café or just about any other place, and they expect you to tip now for counter service.

 

Damn I thought we were agreeing for once. There's a HUGE difference between this and tipping people who work in the service industry. I tip a dollar at the coffee shop by work every day when I get my joe and I am treated like ***royalty*** there as a result. You get what you pay for. But, to each their own. 

 

What I would do is strengthen the law to where doing such is a $10,000 fine and 10 years in jail (unless you have an actual and legitimate permit to do such that you have to go through serious channels to get).  That I suspect would make a lot of people think twice about doing these acts.

 

Having a high fine for begging is not the answer - that is just disproportionately punitive to the underprivileged. - I mean, fine, maybe for dancing, charge reckless endangerment - but just for begging, I think the best result would be an ONEROUS community service sentence scrubbing the floors of subway cars. It's a win-win, and the punishment fits the crime. 

 

That type of activity is really stupid, but at least they don't outright panhandle without even a performance, some candy bars, or a magic trick. I've run into people who've tried to intimidate me for money. Once there was someone who told me, "I know you have money" and tried following me even after I got off my seat and went to another train car. Of course, I actually didn't have any money. They only went away after I turned my pockets to show them so.

I mean, I'm not suggesting anything here, but friendly reminder that if someone tries to rob you, you're well within your rights to deliver any amount of harm you'd like to prevent it. My favorite in such situations is looking your assailant up and down, putting an incredulous look on your face and saying "you're not worth the paperwork". Let them come to their assumption. It's never failed me  (Although, disclaimer, I'm 6-2 so your mileage may vary)

[B35 via Church]

That type of activity is really stupid, but at least they don't outright panhandle without even a performance, some candy bars, or a magic trick. I've run into people who've tried to intimidate me for money. Once there was someone who told me, "I know you have money" and tried following me even after I got off my seat and went to another train car. Of course, I actually didn't have any money. They only went away after I turned my pockets to show them so.

 

That said, if a group is trying to perform in the train, it would be better to make space for them than risk getting beat up. Whenever that type of thing happens, I personally pretend like I don't speak English (since I can also speak Chinese), and read a book instead.

 

Also, the city should expand programs to employ the homeless, the unemployed, or these teenagers, and do a better job educating them. That should solve most, but not all, of these panhandling, although I doubt it'll ever stop completely.

Aint that something, I've gotten that too "you have money" shit too.... Usually a dead/piercing stare or a quick quip (like in Deucey's post) will get most these jokers from pestering you.....

 

IDK how old you are, but I'm not unfolding my pockets for nothing... A mugger is going to have to do w/e he's planning on doing (or thinks he's going to get away with), because that's a sign of weakness - to be frank, it's something men don't do.....

 

As far as these male strippers... ex-cons... fakedancers... Whatever they're called these days, yeah, I just get out of the way, because I'm not trying to end up on the receiving end of a Liu Kang MK forward-forward-[C] flying kick..... I tend to scowl at every single person I see giving them money, because all they're continuing to do is feed the bears....

 

The MTA has all those corny signs inside the subway cars, including "poles are for safety, not your latest routine", and what not....

Well they need to come out with one of a rendering of a panhandler with a cup (or a hand, out) & a passenger sticking up a middle finger !

[agar io]

IDK how old you are, but I'm not unfolding my pockets for nothing... A mugger is going to have to do w/e he's planning on doing (or thinks he's going to get away with), because that's a sign of weakness - to be frank, it's something men don't do.....

 

I was 16 when that happened. I only did that because I actually didn't have anything in my pocket, and my school MetroCard was in my backpack. If I did have something in my pocket, I'd definitely have gone to the conductor or station manager at the next stop.

LMAO... That is hilarious and crazy... And no panhandling won't stop because there are too many suckers out there giving their money away. 

 

Closest I had to that was a hobo was about to mug me when I was half asleep on a leaving 135th St. Just one comment to dude: "You can stay broke and healthy or try and at least be crippled."

 

Dude bolted like The Flash when we got to 145th.

 

I know, right? There are lots of crazy people trying to almost-mug you without actually doing so on the subway. It's the reason why I don't give money to anyone on the subway anymore, not even that guy trying to do magic tricks with me, or once, a hobo on the claiming that he dropped his money on the tracks (I bolted at the next stop).

[Via Garibaldi 8]

 

1. These guys love their captive audience - and that's why I have no respect for whatever talent they have. They could be the best dancer the world has ever seen - go do it in union square - or wherever. Do it somewhere people who want to watch can come by and people who don't can walk away. 

 

 

2. Damn I thought we were agreeing for once. There's a HUGE difference between this and tipping people who work in the service industry. I tip a dollar at the coffee shop by work every day when I get my joe and I am treated like ***royalty*** there as a result. You get what you pay for. But, to each their own. 

 

 

3. Having a high fine for begging is not the answer - that is just disproportionately punitive to the underprivileged. - I mean, fine, maybe for dancing, charge reckless endangerment - but just for begging, I think the best result would be an ONEROUS community service sentence scrubbing the floors of subway cars. It's a win-win, and the punishment fits the crime. 

1. Captive... No... Gullible... Yes... 

 

2. I don't know about you, but I spend at a minimum $3.00+ for an espresso and about $4.00 for a macchiato, usually twice a day, roughly 5 days a week or more.  I drink a lot of coffee, and I frequent several coffee spots.  There's only a few of them where I actually tip the barista on occasion because he does a good job, as I'm fussy about my macchiatos. I however am NOT tipping for an espresso.  Sticking a cup under an espresso machine doesn't exactly require any real skill.  Making a macchiato does though.  Nevertheless, tipping shouldn't be automatic. It should be deserved, especially when it comes to counter service.  For all other service (table service, food delivery, etc.), I generally tip 20% (not including tax) depending on the work involved and how good customer service is, but my point was everyone has their hands out now. Last night I went to get the subway, and there was a old lady begging for a swipe at the turnstile.  Got on the train and no sooner than we pull out of the station, here comes another guy walking through the cars begging for change.  It's like "gratuity" never ends in this damn city.  

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Aint that something, I've gotten that too "you have money" shit too.... Usually a dead/piercing stare or a quick quip (like in Deucey's post) will get most these jokers from pestering you.....

 

IDK how old you are, but I'm not unfolding my pockets for nothing... A mugger is going to have to do w/e he's planning on doing (or thinks he's going to get away with), because that's a sign of weakness - to be frank, it's something men don't do.....

 

As far as these male strippers... ex-cons... fakedancers... Whatever they're called these days, yeah, I just get out of the way, because I'm not trying to end up on the receiving end of a Liu Kang MK forward-forward-[C] flying kick..... I tend to scowl at every single person I see giving them money, because all they're continuing to do is feed the bears....

 

The MTA has all those corny signs inside the subway cars, including "poles are for safety, not your latest routine", and what not....

Well they need to come out with one of a rendering of a panhandler with a cup (or a hand, out) & a passenger sticking up a middle finger !

In Grand Central the other morning, I noticed that they had those folks in the bright orange vests walking all throughout the lower level looking for the vagrants that hangout there to convince them to go to a shelter.  The stench down there of late was just overwhelming from some of those guys, esp. on an empty stomach, and I was really grateful to see them addressing the problem.  The vendors must've been too.  Can't be good for business. Now if they can address this problem with passengers being held hostage on the train and constantly heckled for money...

[Porter]

There's a HUGE difference between this and tipping people who work in the service industry. I tip a dollar at the coffee shop by work every day when I get my joe and I am treated like ***royalty*** there as a result. You get what you pay for. But, to each their own.

 

That's funny, because I believe that customers should be treated like royalty simply by virtue of the service staff being proud of their establishment and not wanting their boss to lose face. But I suppose not every service culture can be as evolved as Japan's, right? We have a special kind of entitlement culture here, don't we...

 

Aint that something, I've gotten that too "you have money" shit too.... Usually a dead/piercing stare or a quick quip (like in Deucey's post) will get most these jokers from pestering you.....

 

This is precisely where "charity isn't in my budget" comes in. There's no way for them to reasonably follow that one up. It directly conveys that you acknowledge that you have money, but that it's not going to a stranger.

[yardlet6]

Wow, classy. Imagine if a musician used violence against someone who has no interest in listening to their music.

Some have. Kinky Friedman,Nina Simone and so on.

[Around the Horn]

Easy way to stop panhandling and busking on at least NTT's (I have no problem with playing music or breakdancing in a mezzanine)

 

1. Install cameras in each car (make sure conductor can view them from his/her cab)

2. Get Charlie Pellet to record a version of this: 

3. Conductor plays announcement when they see a panhandler or busker on the train.