New York MTA Buy 200 Ex-TTC Orion VII Diesels

[MysteriousBtrain]

But in another thread, that may not even happen according to "The Real".

Keyword: may. Not everything is finalized. So for now, let's wait to see if the MTA even wants to let those Orion VIIs onto property.

[East New York]

But in another thread, that may not even happen according to "The Real".

Go read my post is the other thread. It's a scandal #OrionGate2017

[Union Tpke]

Go read my post is the other thread. It's a scandal #OrionGate2017

 

Thank you for your great post!

[IAlam]

With the exception of the Q58 & Q59, those would be some long deadheads, lol. Theoretically given that scenario, the Q54, Q55 could go to Jamaica or QV, the B32 & B24 could stay at GA (while the B57 & B62 goes to JG).

Obviously, some other JG and Brooklyn routes would have to get reshuffled as well.

Like I said it isn't the best idea but it just gives you an idea of what reshuffling can be done

 

Also even though the dead head would be way too long, the lot across from CS would easily be able to accommodate 200 buses if the MTA wanted to rent it out. 

[TechnicaPro]

I know it's kinda dumb to bring up an old thread, but has anything actually materialized for this order or is it no longer happening?

[GojiMet86]

Saw on NY1 today that some local Brooklyn politician is protesting the use of diesel buses on the  shuttle.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

2 hours ago, GojiMet86 said:

Saw on NY1 today that some local Brooklyn politician is protesting the use of diesel buses on the  shuttle.

Would that politician prefer no shuttles at all?

[MysteriousBtrain]

2 hours ago, GojiMet86 said:

Saw on NY1 today that some local Brooklyn politician is protesting the use of diesel buses on the  shuttle.

If I remember correctly I think people are upset about the 180 artic option being diesel.

 

Give me a break. If you want to be like that, take a visit to NICE and get back to us.

[GojiMet86]

Clearly oblivious to the fact that the newest buses in the fleet are almost all diesel.

[BreeddekalbL]

Name of said politician?

[GojiMet86]

http://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/transit/2017/11/14/mta-plans-add-diesel-buses-shuttle-l-train-commuters-affected-by-future-shutdown-nyc

 

Quote

MTA TO ADD MORE DIESEL BUSES TO STREETS ONCE L TRAIN SHUTS DOWN

By Zack Fink  |  November 13, 2017 @11:23 PM

As the shutdown of the L train between Brooklyn and Manhattan moves closer, some environmentalists are asking why the MTA's solution involves adding more polluting diesel buses to city streets. The subway tunnel will be temporarily shutdown for repairs in 2019, which is when the buses will be added. NY1 Political Reporter Zack Fink has the story.

Parts of Williamsburg, Brooklyn, sit in the shadow of the elevated Brooklyn-Queens Expressway, one of the most trafficked motorways in the city.

Residents in the area have long complained about pollution — even before the MTA announced plans to add diesel-burning public buses to the streets.

"This is going to have a very negative impact on the air quality of North Brooklyn, which is already notorious for having bad air quality," Brooklyn City Councilman Rafael Espinal said. "This is an environmental justice issue, this is a social justice issue."

The L train subway tunnel between Brooklyn and Manhattan was damaged during Hurricane Sandy more than five years ago. The MTA is planning on shutting it down for repairs, adding 180 new diesel-burning buses to shuttle affected straphangers.

"It was pretty surprising, especially to go with diesel when there are some other options, especially with electric being on the cutting edge," said Kat Fisher of environmental group Sierra Club. "We see not only other U.S. cities making this change; we see commitments coming out of cities in Europe."

According to the MTA, the agency is launching a pilot program next year to introduce zero-emissions electric buses, but it will take some time to get them out on the streets.

If all goes well, there will be 70 electric buses by 2020. One-third of the city's fleet currently run on alternative fuels like natural gas.

In a statement, MTA Communications Director Jon Weinstein said, "New York City Transit has been a leader in implementing environmentally-friendly bus technology and as we evaluate the results of our all-electric bus pilot, we will look to expand it."

Critics say diesel was the worst option. "There is an irony there. How are we going to buy diesel-powered buses to further have a negative impact on the environment, to mediate a problem that was caused by climate change?" Espinal said. "So, let's get serious."

The L train shutdown is scheduled to begin in April 2019 and last 15 months. It's expected to affect about 225,000 daily commuters between Brooklyn and Manhattan.

 

 

[Future ENY OP]

42 minutes ago, BreeddekalbL said:

Name of said politician?

Rafael Espinal. City Council- Williamsburg/Greenpoint. 

My guess is that they are going to keep the best RTS buses until 2020, but as far as the TTC buses is concerned. That plan is strapped.

We got so many new buses coming in within the next 2 years.  As with the everything is subject to change.

[QM1to6Ave]

Please, the diesel buses are cleaner than cars, and it's not like the electric buses, with their impossible to recycle batteries, have proven to be much better in the long-run. 

[Deucey]

There’s a CNG bendy bus model?

And don’t CNG buses fail faster?

[Fresh Pond]

7 hours ago, Deucey said:

There’s a CNG bendy bus model?

And don’t CNG buses fail faster?

The XN60, we'rin the process of getting them now.

 

CNG buses are more or less as good as their tanks are. Once the CNG tanks expire, you have several choices:

 

1. Recertify the tanks...essentially extend their lifespan just a little bit

2. Remove the tanks and convert them to run on another fuel type (like what TTC did to their Orion Vs)

3. Replace the tanks with brand new tanks

4. Cut your losses and retire the entire bus

 

The first 3 options are all pretty expensive as the tanks aren't cheap. Older CNG buses had tanks with 10-15 year lifespans, so at that point it was just easier (and cheaper) to replace the entire bus when the time came. Modern buses have tanks that can last 20+ years, so the tanks themselves can outlive the bus.

[IAlam]

16 hours ago, Fresh Pond said:

The XN60, we'rin the process of getting them now.

 

CNG buses are more or less as good as their tanks are. Once the CNG tanks expire, you have several choices:

 

1. Recertify the tanks...essentially extend their lifespan just a little bit

2. Remove the tanks and convert them to run on another fuel type (like what TTC did to their Orion Vs)

3. Replace the tanks with brand new tanks

4. Cut your losses and retire the entire bus

 

The first 3 options are all pretty expensive as the tanks aren't cheap. Older CNG buses had tanks with 10-15 year lifespans, so at that point it was just easier (and cheaper) to replace the entire bus when the time came. Modern buses have tanks that can last 20+ years, so the tanks themselves can outlive the bus.

why is re certifying an expensive option? 

[Q23 via 108]

On ‎20‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 10:21 PM, IAlam said:

why is re certifying an expensive option? 

Because your not just recertifying one Bus. You have hundreds of buses that would need new tanks. Not only that, but the bus is already about 15 years old, so it doesn't make much sense to spend money repairing older buses when they can buy newer buses.

[Q23 via 108]

Here is a Diesel Orion VII from Atlanta, GA. Photo taken by me.

[aemoreira81]

On 11/20/2017 at 5:44 AM, Fresh Pond said:

The XN60, we'rin the process of getting them now.

 

CNG buses are more or less as good as their tanks are. Once the CNG tanks expire, you have several choices:

 

1. Recertify the tanks...essentially extend their lifespan just a little bit

2. Remove the tanks and convert them to run on another fuel type (like what TTC did to their Orion Vs)

3. Replace the tanks with brand new tanks

4. Cut your losses and retire the entire bus

 

The first 3 options are all pretty expensive as the tanks aren't cheap. Older CNG buses had tanks with 10-15 year lifespans, so at that point it was just easier (and cheaper) to replace the entire bus when the time came. Modern buses have tanks that can last 20+ years, so the tanks themselves can outlive the bus.

All of the CNG buses starting with 185 have tanks that last 20 years. There is also a 25-year tank option as well, but I'm not sure any of the MTA (or NICE) buses have a 25-year tank bus, as the only fleets that the MTA has kept for 20 years or more that have arrived in NYC since 1981 are all from the Rapid Transit Series family.