BrooklynBus Posted October 20, 2017 Share #1 Posted October 20, 2017 http://rockawaytimes.com/index.php/news/22-we-get-email/3026-bad-bus-plans https://www.rockawave.com/articles/the-stupidity-of-mta-planner The letters are very similar, but there are some differences. The MTA actually stated at the meeting that if the remaining bus stops are too far for the elderly and handicapped to use, after they remove about 15 of them on the Q22, they should rely on access-a-ride instead of taking the bus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted October 22, 2017 Share #2 Posted October 22, 2017 Needs context... I did some further research, as I wanted to know what was even behind the MTA possibly going about removing stops on the Q22 all of a sudden.... I don't follow CB14 like that, so I would've never known about this.... For those that are interested, I'll do some copy & pasting here & save the rest of ya'll the trouble... The entire article that BrooklynBus responded to: "Fireworks at CB14 Meeting".... *snippets of said article, below* Quote ....with the NYPD’s approved commandeering of the former Fort Tilden Army Reserve Center as a counter terrorism bureau training unit and the Metropolitan Transportation Authority’s proposed plan for changing scheduling and stops for the Q22 and Q35 buses, folks from all sides (CB14 members) came out swinging..... Quote ....Fireworks really ignited in regards to transportation. The spark started with MTA representatives who came to present their master plan for eliminating Q22 bus stops on both the east and west ends, and relocating the Q35 Rockaway base from Newport Avenue and 116th Street to Rockaway Beach Boulevard. A CB 14 member exploded, “With all the new housing and senior centers going up in Rockaway on both the east and west ends, how do you expect this to benefit the community? When you eliminate these Q22 stops, what about the handicapped people who need to get to the closest stop to get on the bus?” One MTA representative responded, “Well, that’s why we have Access-A-Ride, to accommodate disabled people and seniors.” Another CB 14 member exclaimed, “Access-A-Ride?! You guys are a joke. You’re talking about a car service that takes hours to arrive? Furthermore, the Q22 is already unreliable and always packed, especially during rush hours when the school children are packed on the bus. And you are telling us that the MTA is implementing this because of low ridership? Then you want to further congest Beach 116th Street with the Q35 bus? Tell me how three buses, especially in the summer time are going to function without causing a ruckus on an active commercial strip. You need to redirect your minds from your fancy guidelines based on your inefficient research studies. Take the damn bus yourself, and you’ll see the reality!” To me, the details of this "master plan" is incomplete & the reason for doing so (as it relates to Ft. Tilden anyway), I'm not quite getting.... Take away stops from the Q22 to have it run between what 2 points..... The eastern-most point of Ft. Tilden is way over there on B. 169th, so why would there be a need to shift Q35's onto Rockaway Beach Blvd from Newport? I could understand getting rid of that B. 169th st stop (which isn't much more than an xfer point), but other stops on the Q22 due to low ridership? I don't know.... If I were to take a guess at this whole thing, is it that they want to have the [Q35 run along Rockaway Beach blvd to replace the Q22 b/w B. 147th & B. 116th] & have the [Q22 run from Mott to B. 116th]???? On 10/20/2017 at 11:37 AM, BrooklynBus said: http://rockawaytimes.com/index.php/news/22-we-get-email/3026-bad-bus-plans https://www.rockawave.com/articles/the-stupidity-of-mta-planner The letters are very similar, but there are some differences. The MTA actually stated at the meeting that if the remaining bus stops are too far for the elderly and handicapped to use, after they remove about 15 of them on the Q22, they should rely on access-a-ride instead of taking the bus. Now I'm addressing your post in-particular.... What 15 stops are they planning on removing from the Q22 (since it's mentioning the eastern and western ends of the route) ? Not only did this whole bit need context, it needs clarity as well... That could explain why nobody replied to this thread up until this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooklynBus Posted October 23, 2017 Author Share #3 Posted October 23, 2017 From the Rockaway Wave: "In total, 15 eastbound stops are set to be eliminated, including Beach 144th, Beach 141st and Beach 137th streets. The MTA said instead of these stops, people could use Beach 143rd Street, which is 360 feet away and Beach 139th Street, which is 385 feet away. It also plans to remove 10 westbound stops, including Beach 145th, Beach 141st and Beach 147th streets. One area that will be heavily impacted is Beach 73rd Street to Beach 86th Street, which calls for the removal of six stops along the route. It adds back four stops, but adds significant walking distance to the new route. CB14 Committee Member Karen Sloan-Payne expressed her anger regarding this plan. She noted how there are several high rises there, a lot of seniors and the ferry shuttle doesn’t stop there." https://www.rockawave.com/articles/cb14-opposes-mta-plan-to-remove-bus-stops/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted October 28, 2017 Share #4 Posted October 28, 2017 20% of Q22 riders (appx. 7k) ride west of B. 116th? That sounds quite high to me.... IDK, I guess the summer usage could bolster it to around that percentage, on top of those xferring b/w the Q22 & the Q35 either at B. 169th itself or at the old health care center stop (B. 149th) as well.... Outside of those 2 specific situations though, I'd have to say that there are more ppl. using buses along Newport b/w B. 116th (not inclusive) & B. 149th..... Neither of which (Q22/Q35) is remotely all that great b/w B. 116th & B.169th (both, not inclusive)...... But even worse than that, there is no way in hell that trips on the Q22 takes 20 mins. to get from B. 116th to B. 149th... That's just a flat out lie..... I have walked the Q35 route from B. 116th/Newport to the old Q35 stop that was at Rockaway Beach Blvd/B. 147th (before the right hand turn) in that amount of time.... Got fed up with waiting for the Q35, so I started hoofing it out... I eventually caught it at that old stop in question..... Anyway, if that distance (116th to 149th) is a 10 min. ride on a typical Q22 trip, it's high..... Basically, I say that to say, the only real problem I have w/ such a proposed change on the western end, is the shifting of the Q35 along Rockaway Beach. Blvd... FFS, I hope they won't have buses ending at the old/original Q21 terminal (B. 116th/Ocean Promenade) - as there's simply no way in hell they can have truncated Q22's, diverted Q35's, and current Q53's all terminating at the current Q53 terminal - That to me, would amount to "stupid"..... Personally, I don't have as much of an issue w/ what they want to do w/ the Q22 in its totality..... Hell, I've suggested quite a few times on here that it should be cut back to B.116th (to have it share a terminal w/ the current Q35).... Good portion of whatever few riders that take the Q35/Q22 on that end of the Rockaways aren't really riding east of B. 116th no how...... With that said, those consolidations/cuttings/whatever of stops on the more eastern end of the route though, I can't really concur with..... It looks like they're trying to turn the Q22 into a faux shuttle or something; that's not gonna work..... To sum it up, yeah there's stupidity on display; I just don't see what they want to do w/ the Q22 on the western end as being the worst of it...... The bringing up of Access-a-ride, I seriously think was a snide, pacification method.... They were better off not even bringing it up AFAIC.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted October 28, 2017 Share #5 Posted October 28, 2017 My whole problem with that proposal is shifting the Q35 onto Rockaway Beach Boulevard (with the Q22). Keeping it on Newport Avenue is somewhat easy for both sides of the Peninsula to get to it (at least in Belle Harbor). You might as well get rid of the Q22 there. Also, the Q22 does not need to terminate at B.116 Street. I think Q22 buses can terminate at B. 118 Street, and use Memorial Circle (two blocks up) and turn around, and originate at B. 119 Street (towards Mott Avenue). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted October 28, 2017 Share #6 Posted October 28, 2017 2 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said: My whole problem with that proposal is shifting the Q35 onto Rockaway Beach Boulevard (with the Q22). Keeping it on Newport Avenue is somewhat easy for both sides of the Peninsula to get to it (at least in Belle Harbor). You might as well get rid of the Q22 there. Also, the Q22 does not need to terminate at B.116 Street. I think Q22 buses can terminate at B. 118 Street, and use Memorial Circle (two blocks up) and turn around, and originate at B. 119 Street (towards Mott Avenue). From what it's looking like, there won't be a "with the Q22".... Especially with the NYPD taking over Ft. Tilden as a training facility for counter-terrorism; you can't have buses ending over there with that..... Perhaps they could have buses ending at B. 149th, but w/ what I'm picking up, they want to have the current short turns end up becoming the full time routing.... Taken from that link in BrooklynBus' latest post to date: Quote "Representatives from the MTA explained that the MTA wants more short turn buses coming to the area, therefore it plans to eliminate stops on the Q22 past Beach 116th Street. It noted that the buses take an extra 20 minutes to go to Beach149th Street, which is only 20 percent of the ridership. The MTA also plans to relocate the Q35 from Newport Avenue to Rockaway Beach Boulevard, allowing it to make the same stops as the Q22, but pick up the stops past Beach 116th Street that the Q22 will lose." IDK, I think you're getting a little funky with bringing up Memorial Circle & all that... I see those patrons/CB14 fighting that tooth & nail, more fervently than what they're doing with this proposal of the MTA's that we're even talking about..... The buses don't need to be running past B. 116th; especially if it's for the cause of providing a more efficient route for eastern Rockaway riders..... You're going to benefit much of no one ending buses 2-3 blocks after B. 116th.... Memorial Circle is their Plaza st east/west (Grand Army Plaza)..... Can't see that happening. Hell, the Q21 used to carry air in the western part of the Rockaways... I used to laugh back when both the Q35 & the Q21 ended at B. 116th/Newport & you would have the crowd slowly pacing towards the bus stop pole as it slowly approached the bus shelter after coming off layover (with the destination signage not displayed yet).... Then when the b/o put the Q21 signage up, literally Everybody would back off!! Anyway, So what did they end up doing with the Q21 instead? Bended that sucker like Beckham (running east of the wye instead) instead & concocted a LTD service out of the Rockaways portion of route (which eventually became today's Q52)..... What I do agree with you on, is having the Q35 remain on Newport.... It double feeds that part of the Rockaways (which is basically what you're saying); which is actually a reason why I believe the Q22 currently sees poorer usage on the western end.... Also, quite frankly, Newport/B. 116th is about as ideal a terminal as you're going to get down there..... The Q22 shorties turn up B. 116th to do the same thing the Q35 does, except that it turns back left on Newport instead of hanging that right...... The only thing I thought (and still do think) should've been running along Rockaway Beach blvd. west of B. 116th is the QM16 - I was saying that before they eventually extended it past B.116th (where it used to terminate).... Look at the ridership increase that came with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted November 9, 2017 Share #7 Posted November 9, 2017 I'm just reading that there's "too much" bus service west of Rockaway Park. So why wasn't this addressed shortly after the takeover? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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