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checkmatechamp13

Bus Route Profiles Released By NYC Comptroller Scott Stringer

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5 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

How in the world do you walk from the Junction all the way to Bergen Beach? That's a long walk...

The will the get home and a good music playlist. But that just shows you how crappy service is. 

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Just now, Brillant93 said:

The will the get home and a good music playlist. But that just shows you how crappy service is. 

How long is the walk? 30 - 40 minutes?

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1 minute ago, Brillant93 said:

About 30 minutes. 

That's not too bad, but I could see there being no buses during that time period.  I personally would opt for the BM1 if you're coming from Manhattan.

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9 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

That's not too bad, but I could see there being no buses during that time period.  I personally would opt for the BM1 if you're coming from Manhattan.

I just took the bm1 for the first time not too long ago. It was nice but if I would have know where it stopped back then I sure would have. 

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1 minute ago, Brillant93 said:

I’ll try and take the bm1 more often when I’m in Manhattan during the weekdays. I work mostly in Brooklyn in midwood and bensenhourts which are other areas of congested mess lol. 

lol... You mean Bensonhurst. 

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16 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

lol... You mean Bensonhurst. 

Lol Auto correct is great with Brooklyn neighborhoods. 

  • LMAO! 1

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On 1/8/2018 at 4:07 PM, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

How long is the walk? 30 - 40 minutes?

 

On 1/8/2018 at 5:25 PM, Brillant93 said:

About 30 minutes. 

We're talking about NYC buses, so the walk time is just about equal to the bus ride :D

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31 minutes ago, N6 Limited said:

 

We're talking about NYC buses, so the walk time is just about equal to the bus ride :D

Ouch!!!! Lol 

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For some reason, the site freezes up every time I try to post, so I'll just refer to the members:

@B35 via Church

Quote

- The Bx33 crawls in Manhattan (it's not due to traffic either).... The Bronx portion, E. 138th around Third av, that's where traffic is a bit of a problem (IDK how far east it extends to though) .... The Bx35 is slow in the Bronx, large in part, due to the sheer passenger activity of it... "Them thaaar hills" in High Bridge won't be of any help in speeding things up either.....

- Nah, it's not the Fordham section that exacerbates the Bx28's runtime, it's the Norwood portion actually.... Good luck getting b/w 205th (D) & Gun Hill (2)(5) in any timely fashion throughout a large chunk of the day.... It's largely due to traffix from on/off the Bronx River Pkwy.... Hospital traffic (pedestrian & vechicular) along/around Bainbridge/Gun Hill rd only makes matters worse....

- Bx41 SBS flies, Bx23 f**kin crawls; outside of fanning, I can't be bothered with it.... OTOH, the MTA disseminated the old Bx41 (Hub - Wakefield) by keeping the quickest portion of the route & eventually threw SBS onto it (they aint slick).... Webster, which is wide enough, really only gets a noticeable amt. of standstill traffic in Bedford park (up from Fordham rd) & it's spotty throughout the course of the day.... The difference is probably by a tiny margin & I can believe it.....

- M4 above the M3 in terms of avg. runtime.... Oh, a ride on the M4 from end to end is definitely longer than the M3..... I think you maybe overlooking the Ft. Washington av portion (it's not a breeze & it's most definitely prone to standstill traffic at times)..... I agree that Broadway up in the 'heights is more or less free-flowing.... I'd say the St. Nicholas portion of the M3 & the Broadway portion of the M4 in Washington hgts. both cancel each other out..... I'd say that b/w 110th/Madison & the Bx6 (155th), the edge goes to the  M3 (M4 b/w that stretch takes up more mileage & significantly has more passenger activity on top of it).... The time it takes the M3 to get to 32nd from Astor doesn't come close to offsetting the time it takes the M4 to serve the entire Ft. Washington av. portion.... If the difference of overall runtime is around 10-15 mins, I can understand it.... anything greater than like 15, then IDK....

 

25
25

When I took it to get from the (4) train, I was surprised at how short, time-wise it got me into High Bridge, but distance-wise, I guess it wasn't that far. Still, I would've thought it would've been a route like the Bx19 with artics and the elevated train lines to deal with. The Bx35 didn't seem that slow, even with all the passengers. The Bx33, I agree with you that the B/Os themselves crawl the route more than it "naturally" should move.

I got about 3.3 miles to get to the northern section of Co-Op City, so that's the round-trip travel time on the Bx23. Do the other Co-Op City routes crawl like that within Co-Op City?

Oh wow, I forgot Ft. Washington Avenue has the hospital (and that's also the street passengers walk down from the GWB Bus Station to reach the (A) train, so I guess it gets some vehicular traffic heading to/from the bridge as well). Just did a quick Google Streetview check and saw a little traffic jam around the hospital, so I guess it makes sense. Yeah, the calculations were 115 minutes for the M3 and 130 minutes for the M4.

Quote

You don't have it on the excel file, but all the passenger mile is, is a measurement of consumption in terms of miles (instead of, in terms of people)... It's the inverse of passengers/mile....

e/g] B74 in 2016: 4,225 avg. riders/weekday.....  2,817 avg. riders/mile a weekday.... 6,337.50 avg. (revenue) passenger miles a weekday.

I chose a route that has no short turns, on purpose.... But if I rode the full loop of the B74 twice in 2016, I'd have... stopped off at Nathan's afterwards.
Seriously though, I'd have accounted for 6 of those passenger miles...

4
 

And the problem is that they don't offer any data about the average trip length on these routes to calculate passenger-miles (I remember Amtrak7 made a post saying even the MTA has a hard time estimating it). 

@Via Garibaldi 8

Quote

Is that a serious question? The same reason ridership is dropping in various lines:

-Slow, overcrowded, late, missing buses

-I'm sure those $1 vans aren't helping either

 
 
 

But percentage-wise, it got hit a lot harder. According to those stats, the B41 saw a 20% decrease in ridership from 2011 to 2016, whereas the Brooklyn average was 4.4% and the NYC average was 3.9%. You can't just dismiss it as saying it's just like any other bus route. 

Quote

Oh please. While that's certainly one issue, but it's not THAT big of an issue. Prospect Heights has been genfrifying for years now. 

....which means ridership in that area will continue decreasing....

@Brillant93

Quote

The problems I have with the B41 is that it’s often underserved on the Bergen beach branch and it not being on time as well. When I was in high school I relied so much on it until around my last year in school I took the Q to kings hwy and the B100 home. I mentioned in another post I literally walked home a few times from Flatbush junction to Bergen beach and got home before a bus was able to get there. I see lots of buses going to kings plaza but never Bergen beach. The buses would be so packed with passengers that you just have to rush to get on. My family avoids the 41. Even though now I just take it to he junction on some days to transfer to the B6, but it really is a sad bus route now. 

 

The B100 saw a nice 15% increase in ridership over the past 5 years. I wonder how many of those riders were east of Flatbush Avenue, and looking for a more reliable alternative to the B41 Bergen Beach branch.

On a side note, how far are you from Utica or Ralph? If you walk along Avenue N to one of those cross-streets, you'd be able to take the B46 or B47 if it comes before the B41.

Edited by checkmatechamp13

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5 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

@Via Garibaldi 8

But percentage-wise, it got hit a lot harder. According to those stats, the B41 saw a 20% decrease in ridership from 2011 to 2016, whereas the Brooklyn average was 4.4% and the NYC average was 3.9%. You can't just dismiss it as saying it's just like any other bus route. 

....which means ridership in that area will continue decreasing....

My point is on the surface, ridership is decreasing for the same reasons that bus ridership is decreasing overall. You can point to gentrification in Prospect Heights, but it is not some new phenomenon that is causing the decreases. The area has been genfrifying for years so the (MTA) would have to be fools not to look at demographics. That's a given with any bus line, and nothing special. Demographics are what they are and you can't change them, but what they can focus on is improving the service for those that would use it if it were more reliable.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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5 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

 

 

@Brillant93

The B100 saw a nice 15% increase in ridership over the past 5 years. I wonder how many of those riders were east of Flatbush Avenue, and looking for a more reliable alternative to the B41 Bergen Beach branch.

On a side note, how far are you from Utica or Ralph? If you walk along Avenue N to one of those cross-streets, you'd be able to take the B46 or B47 if it comes before the B41.

I know my neighbor/childhood friend takes it, and other people who walk four long blocks just to get to work on time. 

I live like 5 blocks from Ralph and Utica, I’m smack dab in the middle. I always liked the B46 because it was always a frequent bus and very reliable but the 47 can go to hell imo. Slow and rarely comes around. That route as well suffered from ridership lose because they cut service on it. So for the mill basin and flatlands area I would stay the most reliable service is the B6(even though it’s crowded but it’s frequent), B3, B46, and the B100. B41, B47,and B82 needs some religious miracle. 

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On 1/8/2018 at 12:57 AM, SubBus said:

Whats the reason for the drop in :bus_bullet_b41: ridership over the years?

To sum it up, increased congestion along more of Flatbush av over the years.... Flatbush av, north of Grand Army was what it was (and still is), with bridge traffic & traffic from Livingston st being major contributors, but Flatbush south of Empire has gotten much slower/more congested than when the B41 carried almost 40k riders/day.....

On 1/8/2018 at 9:47 AM, NY1635 said:

The area north of Grand Army Plaza gentrified over the years and the new residents of Prospect Heights use the (B)(Q) or Uber as their mode of transportation over the B41.

On 1/8/2018 at 10:34 AM, NY1635 said:

Blame Mayor DeBlasio for his Vision Zero campaign and the DOT's lack of planning for all the congestion on Flatbush Ave in that area. Prospect Heights is more pedestrian friendly at the expense of the B41 crawling on Flatbush between Grand Army Plaza and Atlantic Avenue.

Prospect Heights patrons hardly took the B41 for it to be anywhere close to being of any significance to all the ridership the route has lost over the years..... Gentrification isn't much of a reason it has lost so much ridership either; but the part of the B41 that isn't as utilized now due to gentrification is in Lefferts Gardens... Empire Bl. NB used to see way more people seeking NB B41's than they do now..... Now, it's (also) all about the (B)(Q) for folks in that general area too....

Fact of the matter is, the B41 is no longer many people's primary choice for getting to/from downtown - especially for riders residing south of Lefferts Gardens.... It used to be a route that had a lot of "distance riders".... Now, it's at the bottom of the totem pole in that regard, losing out to (even more people south of the Junction getting off for the 2/5 [as opposed to more of those folks staying on the bus the whole way, back then], more people overall taking dollar vans in general, & more people taking the B103 to/from downtown [the portion b/w the Junction & Downtown Brooklyn used to be rather shunned].....

On 1/8/2018 at 12:21 PM, Future ENY OP said:

I will say this. The 41 usefulness these days is between Empire Blvd and Kings Plaza. I could go as far back as the 90's that the B41 was very reliable when it came to on-time performance and was always in the top 10. A couple of times during the years it did beat out the B46. 

However, now you have Über, Lyft, Via and the (B)(Q) on Empire and these damm jitney buses that are all over Flatbush. Unless things change you will see ridership drop on the 41. 

Of course....

Growing up, I remember B41's (per bus) easily being more crushloaded than B35's around here.... According to a dollar van driver I used to know (back when dollar vans used to stop in front of kings plaza [Flatbush side !!], the very reason for the dollar van service along Utica wasn't due to anything involving the B46, it was due to the over-saturation of the Flatbush av market (paraphrasing)..... I never looked at it like that, but it made sense...... Now that the B41's lost so much ridership, how many Utica av dollar vans do you see now?

Have the MTA have more of those short turns on the B103 to the Junction during the rush running the full distance to downtown instead, that's going to spell even more trouble for the B41.... 4th av (oddly enough) isn't as congested as it used to be during the 90's; I remember 4th av being as bad as Canal street from Flatbush av on up to the Prospect Expwy (at minimum).....

Has there been any currently existing route that's lost as much ridership than the B41 over the course of a decade.... I don't think so.

On 1/8/2018 at 3:31 PM, Brillant93 said:

The problems I have with the B41 is that it’s often underserved on the Bergen beach branch and it not being on time as well. When I was in high school I relied so much on it until around my last year in school I took the Q to kings hwy and the B100 home. I mentioned in another post I literally walked home a few times from Flatbush junction to Bergen beach and got home before a bus was able to get there. I see lots of buses going to kings plaza but never Bergen beach. The buses would be so packed with passengers that you just have to rush to get on. My family avoids the 41. Even though now I just take it to he junction on some days to transfer to the B6, but it really is a sad bus route now. 

Well Bergen Beach patrons have always held the B3 in high regard & have had a knack of shunning the B41.... Ironically, the B3 is going down the tubes as well; less people are taking it to get to the Brighton & more people have considered the B41 to the IRT..... Took Bergen Beach folks long enough to "discover" the B41.... The ratio of total Kings Plaza trips to Bergen Beach trips used to be higher than whatever it is now - so although service to/from Bergen Beach isn't the greatest, I find it funny whenever I hear about Bergen Beach being underserved w/ the B41..... Now all of a sudden they want more B41 service.

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We’ve been wanted more service to Bergen beach for the longest. Have the mta got up and listen to us? No. Even as a teen I called and complained about the service. People got feed up and took alternatives. Walk long blocks to the B100 to the Q or B, take the B46 to crown heights and take the 4 or 3 train, or just take Uber or the dollar vans to the junction and call it a day. The issue more so is the commute home. By the time a Bergen beach bus get to the junction it becomes so packed and people bum rush on it. Even to this day nothing was done about it and I doubt it ever will. Even if the B41 is going to be SBS they’ll service Kings Plaza and leave us with a part time service which is just wrong. The MTA doesn’t care. 

The B3 is just for if you need it to go to the other side of Brooklyn Not really for the Q train transfer because the B100 can get you there faster. 

But in all ridership goes down when you piss off the people who are giving you money. Now we have alternatives and really the mta needs to listen to its customers more. 

 

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1 hour ago, Brillant93 said:

We’ve been wanted more service to Bergen beach for the longest. Have the mta got up and listen to us? No. Even as a teen I called and complained about the service. People got feed up and took alternatives. Walk long blocks to the B100 to the Q or B, take the B46 to crown heights and take the 4 or 3 train, or just take Uber or the dollar vans to the junction and call it a day. The issue more so is the commute home. By the time a Bergen beach bus get to the junction it becomes so packed and people bum rush on it. Even to this day nothing was done about it and I doubt it ever will. Even if the B41 is going to be SBS they’ll service Kings Plaza and leave us with a part time service which is just wrong. The MTA doesn’t care. 

The B3 is just for if you need it to go to the other side of Brooklyn Not really for the Q train transfer because the B100 can get you there faster. 

But in all ridership goes down when you piss off the people who are giving you money. Now we have alternatives and really the mta needs to listen to its customers more. 

It would be a part-time service to the (2)(5) but there would still be full-time service along Avenue N in the form of the B9. The good news would be that hopefully, there would be more consistent service towards Bergen Beach, since it would be a dedicated route instead of a branch. 

Edited by checkmatechamp13

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51 minutes ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

It would be a part-time service to the (2)(5) but there would still be full-time service along Avenue N in the form of the B9. The good news would be that hopefully, there would be more consistent service towards Bergen Beach, since it would be a dedicated route instead of a branch. 

that’s what we need a dedicated route not a branch.

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2 hours ago, Brillant93 said:

We’ve been wanted more service to Bergen beach for the longest. Have the mta got up and listen to us? No. Even as a teen I called and complained about the service. People got feed up and took alternatives. Walk long blocks to the B100 to the Q or B, take the B46 to crown heights and take the 4 or 3 train, or just take Uber or the dollar vans to the junction and call it a day. The issue more so is the commute home. By the time a Bergen beach bus get to the junction it becomes so packed and people bum rush on it. Even to this day nothing was done about it and I doubt it ever will. Even if the B41 is going to be SBS they’ll service Kings Plaza and leave us with a part time service which is just wrong. The MTA doesn’t care. 

The B3 is just for if you need it to go to the other side of Brooklyn Not really for the Q train transfer because the B100 can get you there faster. 

But in all ridership goes down when you piss off the people who are giving you money. Now we have alternatives and really the mta needs to listen to its customers more. 

 

I call it BS. I can remember when I lived in South Brooklyn, the B3 was cut back and now terminates just outside of Bergen Beach. Bergen Beach is a very insular neighorhood and most residents like it that way. If they didn't, the B3 or the B41 would run INTO Bergen Beach. I think your case is the exception and not the rule. For the record, I used to hang out right there in Mill Basin with friends that lived in the area. Mill Basin has generally been more expensive, but Bergen Beach is just a less expensive version of Mill Basin, and people living in both areas try to keep up with the Joneses, so the idea that Bergen Beach residents are clamoring for either bus seems rather funny to me. If anything I would think most drive or take the BM1 express bus. Mill Basin has homes in the millions, and prices in Bergen Beach aren't that much cheaper. There's a reason for that... Exclusivity if you will. Neither neighborhood is paved with gold per se, but they're kind of like Manhattan Beach. You don't associate those areas with people clamoring for bus service in general (even the express bus) because they portray themselves as being upper middle class neighborhoods where people generally drive.

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1 minute ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I call it BS. I can remember when I lived in South Brooklyn, the B3 was cut back and now terminates just outside of Bergen Beach. Bergen Beach is a very insular neighorhood and most residents like it that way. If they didn't, the B3 or the B41 would run INTO Bergen Beach. I think your case is the exception and not the rule. For the record, I used to hang out right there in Mill Basin with friends that lived in the area. Mill Basin has generally been more expensive, but Bergen Beach is just a less expensive version of Mill Basin, and people living in both areas try to keep up with the Joneses, so the idea that Bergen Beach residents are clamoring for either bus seems rather funny to me. If anything I would think most drive or take the BM1 express bus. Mill Basin has homes in the millions, and prices in Bergen Beach aren't that much cheaper. There's a reason for that... Exclusivity if you will. Neither neighborhood is paved with gold per se, but they're kind of like Manhattan Beach. You don't associate those areas with people clamoring for bus service in general (even the express bus) because they portray themselves as being upper middle class neighborhoods where people generally drive.

for me, having gone to school in Bergen Beach many moons ago, and having family living in the immediate area, I have always been under the impression that they could care less for local bus service, ESPECIALLY the B41 (letalone the Roy H. Mann JHS "specials" such as the B46 or B47, formerly the B78). Having lived in Howard Beach, I draw the parallel between both neighborhoods, that both are drawn to express service on a significantly larger scale.

I worked out of Flatbush Depot, and Mill Basin/Bergen Beach residents filed repeated complaints with DOB/Flatbush Depot/Spring Creek Depot about operators flying thru their neighborhoods, disturbing their sleep later in the evening/early morning hours. There were memos in the Flatbush Depot stating not to speed, excessively rev engines or idle engines in/around Bergen Beach. Point being: those residents aren't fans of city bus service. Just my opinion.

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1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

My point is on the surface, ridership is decreasing for the same reasons that bus ridership is decreasing overall. You can point to gentrification in Prospect Heights, but it is not some new phenomenon that is causing the decreases. The area has been genfrifying for years so the (MTA) would have to be fools not to look at demographics. That's a given with any bus line, and nothing special. Demographics are what they are and you can't change them, but what they can focus on is improving the service for those that would use it if it were more reliable.

Developers (especially) tend to lump Crown Heights & Prospect Heights together; completely ignoring the fact that they're two totally different neighborhoods....

While there is an unofficial segmentation of Crown Heights (the "jewish part" & the "black part", dubbed by locals), the northern part of Crown Heights doesn't encompass Prospect Heights (it's like calling Marble Hill, South Riverdale)..... What's gotten gentrified is the northern part of Crown Heights, not Prospect Heights, so for him (NY1635) to claim that the B41 saw losses for that reason is based on a false premise.

6 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

...When I took it to get from the (4) train, I was surprised at how short, time-wise it got me into High Bridge, but distance-wise, I guess it wasn't that far. Still, I would've thought it would've been a route like the Bx19 with artics and the elevated train lines to deal with. The Bx35 didn't seem that slow, even with all the passengers. The Bx33, I agree with you that the B/Os themselves crawl the route more than it "naturally" should move.

I got about 3.3 miles to get to the northern section of Co-Op City, so that's the round-trip travel time on the Bx23. Do the other Co-Op City routes crawl like that within Co-Op City?

Oh wow, I forgot Ft. Washington Avenue has the hospital (and that's also the street passengers walk down from the GWB Bus Station to reach the (A) train, so I guess it gets some vehicular traffic heading to/from the bridge as well). Just did a quick Google Streetview check and saw a little traffic jam around the hospital, so I guess it makes sense. Yeah, the calculations were 115 minutes for the M3 and 130 minutes for the M4.

- Lol, hell, If you took the (4) to 167th, you could have walked to High Bridge (even with the hilliness of the area); it's right there.... I was referring to a typical Bx35 trip from end to end though....

- The Bx26 & Bx28 doesn't circumnavigate Co-op anymore, so those two are out.... The Q50 tends to crawl at times, but it's not as bad (or consistently) as the Bx23 though (I suppose you could argue that it's actually worse for a LTD route to crawl to a level of that of being somewhat comparable to the Bx23 up there).... The Bx30, to me, moves at a better pace than the Bx23 & the Q50.... The Bx38 moves at an average/tolerable pace to me, not too too slow, but not as quick as it probably should be either.....

- Quite sure you aren't the only one that forgets about the Ft. Washington av portion... LOL..... But yeah, although the hospital is one cause of the influx of traffic, another cause  believe it or not, is to evade the areas around [178th - 181st] & around [168th], along both St. Nich' & along Broadway....

6 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

The B100 saw a nice 15% increase in ridership over the past 5 years. I wonder how many of those riders were east of Flatbush Avenue, and looking for a more reliable alternative to the B41 Bergen Beach branch.....

...and I'd like to compare that number with the amount of riders that shirked the B3 for the B100 instead.... I don't ever remember that many people ever waiting at those stops along Fillmore, east of Utica, for instance....

Bergen Beach folks have clamored for IRT service over the years.....

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37 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Developers (especially) tend to lump Crown Heights & Prospect Heights together; completely ignoring the fact that they're two totally different neighborhoods....

While there is an unofficial segmentation of Crown Heights (the "jewish part" & the "black part", dubbed by locals), the northern part of Crown Heights doesn't encompass Prospect Heights (it's like calling Marble Hill, South Riverdale)..... What's gotten gentrified is the northern part of Crown Heights, not Prospect Heights, so for him (NY1635) to claim that the B41 saw losses for that reason is based on a false premise.

Yes, everything here down the hill is considered "Riverdale", and I'm like uh no, that's Kingsbridge or Marble Hill. What is happening though is similar in that the realtors are using Riverdale to jack up the prices in Marble Hill and Kingsbridge. You know it's crazy when apartments in Kingsbridge and Marble Hill are reaching 1600-1700 for one bedrooms... 

I've been up in Prospect Heights. It was gentrifying years ago... Not like Park Slope or anything but prices were going up for sure. You had more subway centric types moving there. Crown Heights is also genfrifying, but I agree with your comments about what parts of Crown Heights are gentrifying. Definitely spot on. 

38 minutes ago, EastFlatbushLarry said:

for me, having gone to school in Bergen Beach many moons ago, and having family living in the immediate area, I have always been under the impression that they could care less for local bus service, ESPECIALLY the B41 (letalone the Roy H. Mann JHS "specials" such as the B46 or B47, formerly the B78). Having lived in Howard Beach, I draw the parallel between both neighborhoods, that both are drawn to express service on a significantly larger scale.

I worked out of Flatbush Depot, and Mill Basin/Bergen Beach residents filed repeated complaints with DOB/Flatbush Depot/Spring Creek Depot about operators flying thru their neighborhoods, disturbing their sleep later in the evening/early morning hours. There were memos in the Flatbush Depot stating not to speed, excessively rev engines or idle engines in/around Bergen Beach. Point being: those residents aren't fans of city bus service. Just my opinion.

Yep... The other thing that doesn't make sense is, if they were that concerned about bus service, why not have the B3 or B41 run INTO Bergen Beach? We both know why that won't happen. LOL Anywho, you still have a walk just getting to either bus so it seems inconvenient without even factoring in the poor service.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8
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20 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Developers (especially) tend to lump Crown Heights & Prospect Heights together; completely ignoring the fact that they're two totally different neighborhoods....

While there is an unofficial segmentation of Crown Heights (the "jewish part" & the "black part", dubbed by locals), the northern part of Crown Heights doesn't encompass Prospect Heights (it's like calling Marble Hill, South Riverdale)..... What's gotten gentrified is the northern part of Crown Heights, not Prospect Heights, so for him (NY1635) to claim that the B41 saw losses for that reason is based on a false premise.

That explains it. I was thinking of Prospect Heights and Crown Heights as two separate neighborhoods when talking about the B41. I'm familiar with the area and always thought of Grand Army Plaza and Barclays as being located Prospect Heights, while Crown Heights was always everything east of Washington Avenue. I didn't know that developers lumping both neighborhoods together. I rarely visit the area since my relatives moved out years ago. The few times I go to Brooklyn, I see more foot traffic and subway usage on Flatbush than bus usage.

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2 hours ago, Brillant93 said:

We’ve been wanted more service to Bergen beach for the longest. Have the mta got up and listen to us? No. Even as a teen I called and complained about the service. People got feed up and took alternatives. Walk long blocks to the B100 to the Q or B, take the B46 to crown heights and take the 4 or 3 train, or just take Uber or the dollar vans to the junction and call it a day. The issue more so is the commute home. By the time a Bergen beach bus get to the junction it becomes so packed and people bum rush on it. Even to this day nothing was done about it and I doubt it ever will. Even if the B41 is going to be SBS they’ll service Kings Plaza and leave us with a part time service which is just wrong. The MTA doesn’t care. 

The B3 is just for if you need it to go to the other side of Brooklyn Not really for the Q train transfer because the B100 can get you there faster. 

But in all ridership goes down when you piss off the people who are giving you money. Now we have alternatives and really the mta needs to listen to its customers more.

I still think it's fishy after all this time that the B41's been servicing the area, now some of those folks out there all of a sudden want B41's..... Flatlands patrons I can understand wanting more B41 service (especially after the cut in service (and waned reliability) of the B46 local, thanks to SBS.... On top of one of the least reliable routes in this borough; the B47), but Bergen Beach/Georgetown, nah, AFAIC, something's up.....

Lol @ that summary of the B3.... There are plenty people taking buses along Av. U from the Brighton that are riding past Kings Plaza (and vice versa) & that has been one facet of the route's ridership pattern for the longest & still is to this day.... Yes, the B100 will get you to the Brighton faster, but the B100 still isn't the norm for the majority of folks on that end of the borough.... The B100 should be far more utilized than what it currently is - and the ridership spikes (as Checkmate pointed out) seems to be slowly moving the needle in that direction....

I'd argue that the MTA wants these external transit alternatives (cabs, bikes, dollar vans, etc) to flourish; means less service they have to provide & less resources that has to be expended.... Things are going to get ugly around here if they ever resort to doing their "analysis" which'd have them start "tinkering" with B41 service - and not for the better either.....

This agency doesn't care about the riding public.

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1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I call it BS. I can remember when I lived in South Brooklyn, the B3 was cut back and now terminates just outside of Bergen Beach. Bergen Beach is a very insular neighorhood and most residents like it that way. If they didn't, the B3 or the B41 would run INTO Bergen Beach. I think your case is the exception and not the rule. For the record, I used to hang out right there in Mill Basin with friends that lived in the area. Mill Basin has generally been more expensive, but Bergen Beach is just a less expensive version of Mill Basin, and people living in both areas try to keep up with the Joneses, so the idea that Bergen Beach residents are clamoring for either bus seems rather funny to me. If anything I would think most drive or take the BM1 express bus. Mill Basin has homes in the millions, and prices in Bergen Beach aren't that much cheaper. There's a reason for that... Exclusivity if you will. Neither neighborhood is paved with gold per se, but they're kind of like Manhattan Beach. You don't associate those areas with people clamoring for bus service in general (even the express bus) because they portray themselves as being upper middle class neighborhoods where people generally drive.

I don’t live right at the end of the route but close to it and people take the bus to the junction. If the bus is late or if it’s early enough it’s nearly packed by the time it hits east 55th street on avenue N. And it’s us who want more frequent service, maybe not so for those who take the BM1 or live further down but those who live closer up need the service. 

On top of that the B3 did run into Bergen Beach but it was cut back about a few years ago due to budget cuts. I assume those people who lived deep to where the B3 traveled to just ended up getting a car or driving just to not walk blocks to  catch the bus. 

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