BridgeGate 2

[BrooklynBus]

This is  proof that government is intentionally causing traffic congestion to slow down traffic and make it more difficult to drive using improved safety as an excuse. It goes beyond de Blasio. 

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2018/02/27/drivers-surprised-that-lane-restriction-for-pip-helix-permanently-alters-gwb-traffic/

 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Seems like it doesn't matter anyway.  Those who drive are hellbent on doing so, even if they sit in traffic for hours wasting gas and time.  

[BrooklynBus]

2 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Seems like it doesn't matter anyway.  Those who drive are hellbent on doing so, even if they sit in traffic for hours wasting gas and time.  

People use the most efficient or cheapest method. If the are driving now, it is their best alternative. If you are not going to improve mass transit and give them better options, it is certainly not fair to make their commute more difficult. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

6 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

People use the most efficient or cheapest method. If the are driving now, it is their best alternative. If you are not going to improve mass transit and give them better options, it is certainly not fair to make their commute more difficult. 

Oh please with that.  There's a growing amount of people moving here that are car centric, and improving mass transit won't make a difference.  You love to throw that out there and I'm not saying that there isn't truth to that but there are plenty of anti-transit types around the city.  In my neighborhood, I'm within walking distance to several express buses, local buses and shuttle buses to Metro-North and yet in my building I think I may be the only one besides one lady that uses the express bus.  Other people either drive or are picked up and they drive expensive cars because they want to be seen.  I have a neighbor who drives a Mercedes Benz.  We live in the most walkable part of Riverdale with great access to the shops and so on, but I live in what is an expensive part of Riverdale and if people are going to use public transit, they won't be caught dead on the local bus.  They'll use the express bus or Metro-North.

It's like your neighborhood. Are you going to sit here with a straight face and tell me that all of those expensive European luxury cars that I see coming from Manhattan Beach onto Emmons Avenue... They all have to drive? BS. You know those people are trying to keep up with the Joneses and wouldn't be caught dead using public transit.  They live in tony Manhattan Beach likely in an expensive beach house... No chance in hell that they're going to ride the B1 or B49. lol

[BrooklynBus]

10 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Oh please with that.  There's a growing amount of people moving here that are car centric, and improving mass transit won't make a difference.  You love to throw that out there and I'm not saying that there isn't truth to that but there are plenty of anti-transit types around the city.  In my neighborhood, I'm within walking distance to several express buses, local buses and shuttle buses to Metro-North and yet in my building I think I may be the only one besides one lady that uses the express bus.  Other people either drive or are picked up and they drive expensive cars because they want to be seen.  I have a neighbor who drives a Mercedes Benz.  We live in the most walkable part of Riverdale with great access to the shops and so on, but I live in what is an expensive part of Riverdale and if people are going to use public transit, they won't be caught dead on the local bus.  They'll use the express bus or Metro-North.

It's like your neighborhood. Are you going to sit here with a straight face and tell me that all of those expensive European luxury cars that I see coming from Manhattan Beach onto Emmons Avenue... They all have to drive? BS. You know those people are trying to keep up with the Joneses and wouldn't be caught dead using public transit.  They live in tony Manhattan Beach likely in an expensive beach house... No chance in hell that they're going to ride the B1 or B49. lol

I believe you are greatly exaggerating this snob thing about people who do not use local buses or other mass transit. Did you ever ask one of them why they choose to drive? Their answers may surprise you. You just jump to unfounded conclusions. 

I could jump to the same conclusions as you do but I don't. Here's an example. I also live in an expensive area as you do. My neighbor has her husband drop her off at work on his way to Jersey or else she takes a cab. Yes, she wouldn't be caught dead in a bus. She works at the other end of the B1 bus route with practically door to door service. So why doesn't she use it? Is she a snob as you automatically conclude or is there another reason. It's actually quite simple. She values her time. The bus would take an hour even without any problems and a cab takes her 20 minutes. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

I believe you are greatly exaggerating this snob thing about people who do not use local buses or other mass transit. Did you ever ask one of them why they choose to drive? Their answers may surprise you. You just jump to unfounded conclusions. 

I could jump to the same conclusions as you do but I don't. Here's an example. I also live in an expensive area as you do. My neighbor has her husband drop her off at work on his way to Jersey or else she takes a cab. Yes, she wouldn't be caught dead in a bus. She works at the other end of the B1 bus route with practically door to door service. So why doesn't she use it? Is she a snob as you automatically conclude or is there another reason. It's actually quite simple. She values her time. The bus would take an hour even without any problems and a cab takes her 20 minutes. 

But let's be honest here.  You really think someone driving a Porsche or other luxury car is going to be taking the local bus? I mean really... Quite frankly I don't even know why you use the local bus. lol  You technically could drive everywhere and being in Manhattan Beach there really isn't much around in terms of supermarkets or anything so I'm surprised that you even take the bus.  I'm guessing those are the instances when you have lots of time on your hands. lol

[BrooklynBus]

18 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

But let's be honest here.  You really think someone driving a Porsche or other luxury car is going to be taking the local bus? I mean really... Quite frankly I don't even know why you use the local bus. lol  You technically could drive everywhere and being in Manhattan Beach there really isn't much around in terms of supermarkets or anything so I'm surprised that you even take the bus.  I'm guessing those are the instances when you have lots of time on your hands. lol

So you are saying that anyone who drives a luxury car is a snob and won't even consider a local bus? You may be correct. But what percentage of the population is that? A very small one. Most people in Riverdale and Manhattan Beach do not drive luxury cars. I would say it's no more than like 30 percent. We were talking about the GWB. Are you implying that everyone using the GW Bridge is driving a luxury car? 

I take the bus whenever I have to go somewhere with no street parking and lately the list is becoming longer. When you consider the 30 minutes you need to park, the bus actually can be quicker. One time I took two buses with perfect connections to get to Avenue Z and Coney Island Avenue and was there in 15 minutes, just as quick as driving even if I could park there. 

 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

23 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

So you are saying that anyone who drives a luxury car is a snob and won't even consider a local bus? You may be correct. But what percentage of the population is that? A very small one. Most people in Riverdale and Manhattan Beach do not drive luxury cars. I would say it's no more than like 30 percent. We were talking about the GWB. Are you implying that everyone using the GW Bridge is driving a luxury car? 

I take the bus whenever I have to go somewhere with no street parking and lately the list is becoming longer. When you consider the 30 minutes you need to park, the bus actually can be quicker. One time I took two buses with perfect connections to get to Avenue Z and Coney Island Avenue and was there in 15 minutes, just as quick as driving even if I could park there. 

 

No, I'm just being realistic in stating that a lot of people want to keep up with the Joneses and won't be caught dead using public transit, and we have more people moving here like that. I'd even go further and say that it's partially a generational thing.  I will say though that lately I've been so frustrated with public transit, that I've been considering getting a car and driving.  

[BrooklynBus]

9 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

No, I'm just being realistic in stating that a lot of people want to keep up with the Joneses and won't be caught dead using public transit, and we have more people moving here like that. I'd even go further and say that it's partially a generational thing.  I will say though that lately I've been so frustrated with public transit, that I've been considering getting a car and driving.  

I still say you are talking about a very small percentage of people and are exaggerating the snob thing. And there is nothing wrong about getting a car and driving. It's just too bad that the renting options or ride shares are not cheaper. I remember when I was in Israel a long time ago where you had a choice of private transit, i.e cabs, mass transit (usually buses) or ride share pretty much wherever you went. Ride share was a cross between cabs and buses. Better quality of service for only a slightly higher cost. I don't believe it was more than double the cost like express bus here with Manhattan as your only destination. I have long advocated for express buses or vans between major centers and reasonable fares. There is a demand as evidenced by all the illegal Chinese vans. It's just that the politicians and the MTA don't have any real desire to improve transit. 

[Deucey]

On 3/1/2018 at 4:30 PM, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Other people either drive or are picked up and they drive expensive cars because they want to be seen

Maybe.

But the reason I'll be going back to (having the option of) driving isn't because of poor transit options or service, it's 1) despite all the crap that goes with having a car in New York, having one is freedom - meaning that if I decide I want to go somewhere, I can just do so, and I don't have to rely on someone else doing their job competently to get me where I'm going, and 2) I don't have to spend 1.5 hours on six transit modes (including walking and Lyft) to go to a license test in Ramsey NJ because I can drive there in 45 minutes. 

Or, if I felt like going to that mall on Flatbush, I can get right there in 35-40 minutes instead of a ferry to a train to a bus over 1 hour 15 minutes.

I suspect there's a good number of people who feel the same way.

That doesn't discount your point, but that freedom factor matters to a good number of drivers.

[P3F]

On 3/1/2018 at 4:30 PM, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

There's a growing amount of people moving here that are car centric, and improving mass transit won't make a difference. 

It depends on the area. Areas where everyone has a luxury car (assuming such an area even exists)? Sure, I'll take it. The not-so-wealthy parts of Eastern Queens? I'm sure extending the subway would have a meaningful impact.

Quote

You love to throw that out there and I'm not saying that there isn't truth to that but there are plenty of anti-transit types around the city.  In my neighborhood, I'm within walking distance to several express buses, local buses and shuttle buses to Metro-North and yet in my building I think I may be the only one besides one lady that uses the express bus.  Other people either drive or are picked up and they drive expensive cars because they want to be seen.  I have a neighbor who drives a Mercedes Benz.  We live in the most walkable part of Riverdale with great access to the shops and so on, but I live in what is an expensive part of Riverdale and if people are going to use public transit, they won't be caught dead on the local bus.  They'll use the express bus or Metro-North.

Ok, so you've made the point that people with more money tend to float towards being willing to pay (each day) for tolls, parking, and gas. That's not exactly news. Taking public transit is going to be cheaper than personal transport in the vast majority of use cases, so that's just how the general statistics are laid out. Of course, there will be notable exceptions such as where somebody's employer pays for their employees' parking.

Quote

It's like your neighborhood. Are you going to sit here with a straight face and tell me that all of those expensive European luxury cars that I see coming from Manhattan Beach onto Emmons Avenue... They all have to drive? BS. You know those people are trying to keep up with the Joneses and wouldn't be caught dead using public transit.  They live in tony Manhattan Beach likely in an expensive beach house... No chance in hell that they're going to ride the B1 or B49. lol

Past a certain level of luxury, you are correct. There are indeed people who wouldn't be caught dead on a local bus.

Average folks, however... It depends more on the situation. I take the subway every day because it is quick (faster than driving, in my case), and inexpensive. However, after the trip drops below a certain level of convenience, public transit becomes just a hassle. For example, if someone does their weekly grocery shopping at the Grand Army Plaza market on Saturdays, taking many grocery bags and standing on a crowded Q train doesn't really seem too pleasant.

I don't visit Manhattan Beach often so I don't know what portion of the residents takes the B1 to Brighton Beach or the B49 to Sheepshead Bay. But if I had to guess, at least some people do that commute. Generalizations can only get one so far.

[P3F]

16 minutes ago, Deucey said:

Maybe.

But the reason I'll be going back to (having the option of) driving isn't because of poor transit options or service, it's 1) despite all the crap that goes with having a car in New York, having one is freedom - meaning that if I decide I want to go somewhere, I can just do so, and I don't have to rely on someone else doing their job competently to get me where I'm going, and 2) I don't have to spend 1.5 hours on six transit modes (including walking and Lyft) to go to a license test in Ramsey NJ because I can drive there in 45 minutes. 

Or, if I felt like going to that mall on Flatbush, I can get right there in 35-40 minutes instead of a ferry to a train to a bus over 1 hour 15 minutes.

I suspect there's a good number of people who feel the same way.

That doesn't discount your point, but that freedom factor matters to a good number of drivers.

Also, this.

Public transit is the best option in many cases, but there are plenty of other cases where travel time or convenience is just terrible.

[BrooklynBus]

47 minutes ago, Deucey said:

Maybe.

But the reason I'll be going back to (having the option of) driving isn't because of poor transit options or service, it's 1) despite all the crap that goes with having a car in New York, having one is freedom - meaning that if I decide I want to go somewhere, I can just do so, and I don't have to rely on someone else doing their job competently to get me where I'm going, and 2) I don't have to spend 1.5 hours on six transit modes (including walking and Lyft) to go to a license test in Ramsey NJ because I can drive there in 45 minutes. 

Or, if I felt like going to that mall on Flatbush, I can get right there in 35-40 minutes instead of a ferry to a train to a bus over 1 hour 15 minutes.

I suspect there's a good number of people who feel the same way.

That doesn't discount your point, but that freedom factor matters to a good number of drivers.

That's exactly what I was trying to tell him. That he is exaggerating about people staying away from transit because they are snobs and they drive because they value their time. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

11 hours ago, BrooklynBus said:

That's exactly what I was trying to tell him. That he is exaggerating about people staying away from transit because they are snobs and they drive because they value their time. 

Value their time sitting in traffic...

[BrooklynBus]

5 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Value their time sitting in traffic...

Don't play dumb. You know as well as anyone that virtually all trips are quicker by car than by mass transit, The only times mass transit is quicker is if you are say taking an express train Manhattan between uptown and downtown. What percentage trips is that when comparing all trips in the city or metro area? A  small percentage,

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

Don't play dumb. You know as well as anyone that virtually all trips are quicker by car than by mass transit, The only times mass transit is quicker is if you are say taking an express train Manhattan between uptown and downtown. What percentage trips is that when comparing all trips in the city or metro area? A  small percentage,

Wasn't it you that said that congestion was worsening, and then you went on a tirade about Woodhaven Blvd and how difficult it was to drive down there?  Well which is it? One minute you're complaining that people who drive can't get around, and then the next trips by car are so much faster.  All I know is I see cars crawling in traffic regularly, so I'm not buying this whole deal that driving is so much quicker when you spent half of that time sitting in traffic.  

[BrooklynBus]

4 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Wasn't it you that said that congestion was worsening, and then you went on a tirade about Woodhaven Blvd and how difficult it was to drive down there?  Well which is it? One minute you're complaining that people who drive can't get around, and then the next trips by car are so much faster.  All I know is I see cars crawling in traffic regularly, so I'm not buying this whole deal that driving is so much quicker when you spent half of that time sitting in traffic.  

There is nothing conflicting with with what I have stated. Yes, congestion is worsening and yes, I have complained about traffic getting much worse on Woodhaven Boulevard  during rùsh hours since the bus lanes were installed. But we were talking about trips all over the city, not on Woodhaven  Boulevard only. So you are not comparing apples and oranges, but elephants and ants. 

Yes, cars are crawling in traffic regularly, but there are plenty of times when traffic also moves quite fine. And most of the time buses are subject to the same traffic delays as cars, have to make stops, and take a more indirect route than you do in a car. They also do not take an alternate route to avoid traffic as you can do in a car to make your trip quicker. So the fact is nine out if ten times you can get where you want to go quicker by car than by mass transit. 

You say I am being inconsistent, but wasn't it you who said you were actually thinking of getting a car because you were so fed up with mass transit? So which one is it? You think driving is better for your trips, or there is so much congestion that mass transit is faster even when bus headways are every 60 minutes? And please don't tell me that because of Bus Time you don't have to wait 60 minutes for a bus. Bus Time may work for a one bus trip, but how do you coordinate with your second bus if two are required late at night?  Or are the routes so good that you can make all your trips with one bus only? 

[Deucey]

7 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

All I know is I see cars crawling in traffic regularly, so I'm not buying this whole deal that driving is so much quicker when you spent half of that time sitting in traffic. 

That’s one thing, but if it were the only thing, every driver would be clamoring for more trains everywhere so s/he doesn’t have to drive.

(When they do clamor for it, it’s so others don’t drive and the roads clear so s/he can drive.)

The problem with transit - that Uber & Co, and even some transit systems are piloting to solve - is that last mile. Buses and trains run on fixed routes - so unless one lives near a train or is committed to walking, door-to-door service and on-demand travel is nigh impossible. Cars, bikes and other personal transport enables that.

I or you get off public transit, we have to still journey to our destination’s proximity. Cars - assuming there’s parking, pits people at the front door. If either of us wanted to Walmart, we’re schlepping on two or three trains or several buses for hours to get to and back from the one in White Plains, the several off the Turnpike, or Green Acres or Roosevelt Field. If we had cars, we just pick one and get there and back in two hours (including waiting in line to checkout).

Thats the freedom I mentioning earlier - no waiting for  to arrive; not schlepping on a boat or a railroad to Midtown or dealing with that W20 bus.

Personal transport gives options, public transport requires conformity. We could put trains on every other block and 2/3 of NYC will still own a car because even with the congestion, tolls and street parking crap, cars get people exactly where they want to go while transit doesn’t, necessarily.

(This microtransit project - on-demand buses, is being piloted in my old Sacramento neighborhood. If it works, could be a new paradigm for transit everywhere.)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

12 hours ago, BrooklynBus said:

There is nothing conflicting with with what I have stated. Yes, congestion is worsening and yes, I have complained about traffic getting much worse on Woodhaven Boulevard  during rùsh hours since the bus lanes were installed. But we were talking about trips all over the city, not on Woodhaven  Boulevard only. So you are not comparing apples and oranges, but elephants and ants. 

Yes, cars are crawling in traffic regularly, but there are plenty of times when traffic also moves quite fine. And most of the time buses are subject to the same traffic delays as cars, have to make stops, and take a more indirect route than you do in a car. They also do not take an alternate route to avoid traffic as you can do in a car to make your trip quicker. So the fact is nine out if ten times you can get where you want to go quicker by car than by mass transit. 

You say I am being inconsistent, but wasn't it you who said you were actually thinking of getting a car because you were so fed up with mass transit? So which one is it? You think driving is better for your trips, or there is so much congestion that mass transit is faster even when bus headways are every 60 minutes? And please don't tell me that because of Bus Time you don't have to wait 60 minutes for a bus. Bus Time may work for a one bus trip, but how do you coordinate with your second bus if two are required late at night?  Or are the routes so good that you can make all your trips with one bus only? 

Yes it was me and I still feel the same way.  However, that doesn't mean that driving is so much faster.  It's just more "comfortable".  In other words, instead of walking say 10 minutes to the express bus or Metro-North shuttle bus and then waiting, I get to walk to the garage, get the car out and be on my way, but I'm still sitting in traffic and crawling.  In my mind the little comfort gained from having the car isn't worth it, though you can go more places.  However, there's so many added costs (parking in the garage, tolls, gas, insurance, maintenance, etc.)... All to sit in the same traffic I sit in on the express bus.  Yes, you're right driving can be faster, but marginally at best in a lot of cases.  That's why I haven't ran out and gotten a car. I also left out getting the car stolen... As you know, Sheepshead Bay has some of the worst car jacking rates around and my current neighborhood while very low crime, has the same problem, hence why I would NEVER park on the street.  I have a few neighbors that park their expensive Benz on the street, but they can see their car from their balcony most of the time assuming they get a good spot.  I still wouldn't risk it.

I remember years ago when I was walking down Sheepshead Bay Road with a relative.  We watched in amazement as this guy went into a deli to get something just for a second and left his baby in the back seat. Before you could blink your eye, someone had gotten in the car and taken off with the kid in there.  No idea how it ended (the guy came out running after the car but he was long gone), but we always had a car in the garage for that reason.  It was a pain to walk to the garage, get the car out and so on, especially in inclement weather, and I do have flashbacks of those things when I consider getting one.  That ate up at least 15 - 20 minutes before even getting anywhere.  I would have to have parking on-site.

I have friends that are also adamant about driving and they have the same problem. Get to your destination a bit faster than using transit, but then spend 20+ minutes finding parking.  Driving in NYC is no picnic.  Far from.

 

 

10 hours ago, Deucey said:

That’s one thing, but if it were the only thing, every driver would be clamoring for more trains everywhere so s/he doesn’t have to drive.

(When they do clamor for it, it’s so others don’t drive and the roads clear so s/he can drive.)

The problem with transit - that Uber & Co, and even some transit systems are piloting to solve - is that last mile. Buses and trains run on fixed routes - so unless one lives near a train or is committed to walking, door-to-door service and on-demand travel is nigh impossible. Cars, bikes and other personal transport enables that.

I or you get off public transit, we have to still journey to our destination’s proximity. Cars - assuming there’s parking, pits people at the front door. If either of us wanted to Walmart, we’re schlepping on two or three trains or several buses for hours to get to and back from the one in White Plains, the several off the Turnpike, or Green Acres or Roosevelt Field. If we had cars, we just pick one and get there and back in two hours (including waiting in line to checkout).

Thats the freedom I mentioning earlier - no waiting for  to arrive; not schlepping on a boat or a railroad to Midtown or dealing with that W20 bus.

Personal transport gives options, public transport requires conformity. We could put trains on every other block and 2/3 of NYC will still own a car because even with the congestion, tolls and street parking crap, cars get people exactly where they want to go while transit doesn’t, necessarily.

(This microtransit project - on-demand buses, is being piloted in my old Sacramento neighborhood. If it works, could be a new paradigm for transit everywhere.)

For those trips outside of the city it can be good (notice I didn't say great).  Right now I think if I were driving on these roads, I would be grimacing at the idea of hitting a huge pothole and damaging my rims or messing up the shocks.

[BrooklynBus]

11 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Yes it was me and I still feel the same way.  However, that doesn't mean that driving is so much faster.  It's just more "comfortable".  In other words, instead of walking say 10 minutes to the express bus or Metro-North shuttle bus and then waiting, I get to walk to the garage, get the car out and be on my way, but I'm still sitting in traffic and crawling.  In my mind the little comfort gained from having the car isn't worth it, though you can go more places.  However, there's so many added costs (parking in the garage, tolls, gas, insurance, maintenance, etc.)... All to sit in the same traffic I sit in on the express bus.  Yes, you're right driving can be faster, but marginally at best in a lot of cases.  That's why I haven't ran out and gotten a car. I also left out getting the car stolen... As you know, Sheepshead Bay has some of the worst car jacking rates around and my current neighborhood while very low crime, has the same problem, hence why I would NEVER park on the street.  I have a few neighbors that park their expensive Benz on the street, but they can see their car from their balcony most of the time assuming they get a good spot.  I still wouldn't risk it.

I remember years ago when I was walking down Sheepshead Bay Road with a relative.  We watched in amazement as this guy went into a deli to get something just for a second and left his baby in the back seat. Before you could blink your eye, someone had gotten in the car and taken off with the kid in there.  No idea how it ended (the guy came out running after the car but he was long gone), but we always had a car in the garage for that reason.  It was a pain to walk to the garage, get the car out and so on, especially in inclement weather, and I do have flashbacks of those things when I consider getting one.  That ate up at least 15 - 20 minutes before even getting anywhere.  I would have to have parking on-site.

I have friends that are also adamant about driving and they have the same problem. Get to your destination a bit faster than using transit, but then spend 20+ minutes finding parking.  Driving in NYC is no picnic.  Far from.

For those trips outside of the city it can be good (notice I didn't say great).  Right now I think if I were driving on these roads, I would be grimacing at the idea of hitting a huge pothole and damaging my rims or messing up the shocks.

I hear what you are saying. A lot of if it's that much more quicker to drive than it is to take mass transit depends on the times you need to make your trips as well as where you are going. For your purposes a car may not be worth the extra hassle so you don't feel the need to have a car. My father didn't drive so until I got my license at age 20, I rode exclusively mass transit.

Now many if my trips are in the evening and many are between Astoria and Manhattan Beach. During the day it takes from 90 minutes to two hours by mass transit and less than an hour by car. (It used to take 45 minutes). At night when I usually return home, it would take way over two hours by mass transit with numerous changes and walking whereas by car it takes between 36 and 43 minutes. Yes, I could take a cab at night but that would run about $75 with a tip. Renting a car is about $130 a day and other options require a subscription. Also shopping is much more inconvenient without a car. I wouldn't dream about having to rely exclusively on mass transit. With the weather today, the buses were horrible. I walked most of the way to and from Brighton Beach today in the wet weather. 

[Deucey]

23 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Yes it was me and I still feel the same way.  However, that doesn't mean that driving is so much faster.  It's just more "comfortable".  In other words, instead of walking say 10 minutes to the express bus or Metro-North shuttle bus and then waiting, I get to walk to the garage, get the car out and be on my way, but I'm still sitting in traffic and crawling.  In my mind the little comfort gained from having the car isn't worth it, though you can go more places.  However, there's so many added costs (parking in the garage, tolls, gas, insurance, maintenance, etc.)... All to sit in the same traffic I sit in on the express bus.  Yes, you're right driving can be faster, but marginally at best in a lot of cases.  That's why I haven't ran out and gotten a car. I also left out getting the car stolen... As you know, Sheepshead Bay has some of the worst car jacking rates around and my current neighborhood while very low crime, has the same problem, hence why I would NEVER park on the street.  I have a few neighbors that park their expensive Benz on the street, but they can see their car from their balcony most of the time assuming they get a good spot.  I still wouldn't risk it.

I remember years ago when I was walking down Sheepshead Bay Road with a relative.  We watched in amazement as this guy went into a deli to get something just for a second and left his baby in the back seat. Before you could blink your eye, someone had gotten in the car and taken off with the kid in there.  No idea how it ended (the guy came out running after the car but he was long gone), but we always had a car in the garage for that reason.  It was a pain to walk to the garage, get the car out and so on, especially in inclement weather, and I do have flashbacks of those things when I consider getting one.  That ate up at least 15 - 20 minutes before even getting anywhere.  I would have to have parking on-site.

I have friends that are also adamant about driving and they have the same problem. Get to your destination a bit faster than using transit, but then spend 20+ minutes finding parking.  Driving in NYC is no picnic.  Far from.

 

 

For those trips outside of the city it can be good (notice I didn't say great).  Right now I think if I were driving on these roads, I would be grimacing at the idea of hitting a huge pothole and damaging my rims or messing up the shocks.

I could tell you stories of my 130 mile a day commutes and the popped tires 3x/year because of potholes and mirrors falling off.
California 99 is my nemesis.

But, comparatively speaking, I had less stuff happen to me on NY roads than California - and  I was putting in 150 miles a day and $60 in tolls over bridges (avg) my first 1.5 years here - and the only thing I had to repair was rock salt in my alternator. The busted windows because of Bailey Ave crackheads are another thing...

Even still, you might sit in the same traffic as the Express bus, but while it's stopped allowing boards and alights, that car is moving through lights and probably three blocks ahead by the time the bus starts moving. Doing that multiple times by the time it gets to 5th Av, that car is probably already starting to look for it's parking space. And on the way back, if you want to stop at the store and pick stuff up mid trip, you're either paying another fare (if you don't have unlimited) or limiting your options (bodega vs Aldi) on the bus, while the person in the car can just detour.

That's the problem with mass transit - the last mile, and the "waiting on other people" factor in extending trip lengths. That's why 2/3rd of NYers outside SI still have cars, IMO. Not saying cars > transit, but that freedom vs conformity argument is pretty compelling to many.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

14 minutes ago, Deucey said:

I could tell you stories of my 130 mile a day commutes and the popped tires 3x/year because of potholes and mirrors falling off.
California 99 is my nemesis.

But, comparatively speaking, I had less stuff happen to me on NY roads than California - and  I was putting in 150 miles a day and $60 in tolls over bridges (avg) my first 1.5 years here - and the only thing I had to repair was rock salt in my alternator. The busted windows because of Bailey Ave crackheads are another thing...

Even still, you might sit in the same traffic as the Express bus, but while it's stopped allowing boards and alights, that car is moving through lights and probably three blocks ahead by the time the bus starts moving. Doing that multiple times by the time it gets to 5th Av, that car is probably already starting to look for it's parking space. And on the way back, if you want to stop at the store and pick stuff up mid trip, you're either paying another fare (if you don't have unlimited) or limiting your options (bodega vs Aldi) on the bus, while the person in the car can just detour.

That's the problem with mass transit - the last mile, and the "waiting on other people" factor in extending trip lengths. That's why 2/3rd of NYers outside SI still have cars, IMO. Not saying cars > transit, but that freedom vs conformity argument is pretty compelling to many.

LMAO... See that's your dilemma... lol@Bailey Avenue crackheads... That area still has regular car break-ins. I tutor in a co-op near there on Sedgwick and the family has two cars.  Apparently someone in their building decided to do street parking and the car windows were smashed.  That area on Bailey is pretty desolate so it's not shocking. As far as taking the express bus versus parking, I live in the most walkable part of Riverdale and I have access to all of the shops and markets within a 5 - 10 minute walk, so driving would be pointless for me.  By the time I parked in the garage I could've picked up whatever and been home in my place.  Often times I clock how long it takes... With no traffic it can be 35 minutes... Same deal with Metro-North to the shuttle bus at night.  Walking home I stop off and pick-up whatever without any worries about finding parking etc. I really lucked out in that end. 

On Staten Island had I moved, I would've definitely needed a car.

[Deucey]

2 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

That area on Bailey is pretty desolate so it's not shocking.

Gawd, when I worked in Garden City I would make sure not to have appointments after 3:30 so I could get back and park on Sedgwick - either on the side of Fordham Hill Oval (where the security cameras are) or on the block with the VA hospital - even if up by Kingsbridge Rd, since there was always someone awake or walking or watching.

Even those times I had to park on Bailey after the light, I stayed as close to the corner with Sedgwick just so my car would be seen. There was a big rig that was always parked on the block that if you were in front of, those folks that hung out at the garage/stores next to the gas station where the Bx12 turned around at would mess with your car.

I still hate that block to this day.

2 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

On Staten Island had I moved, I would've definitely needed a car.

That's why I'm like "Let me get one." The only grocery in my hood is KeyFood on Bay and Victory - and that's an overpriced and shit store; the nearest decent one is 30 minutes on the S44 (ShopRite on Forest/Richmond. 

I used to have ZipCar, and for the money I spent at ShopRite or Stop & Shop, I could get more and cover the bridge toll going to Walmart in Bayonne. That alone, and factoring in the food quality on the other side of the kill has me thinking about finding a $5k special car to buy just to grocery shop and tear up the Turnpike going to Maryland to see my mom instead of BoltBus'ing it. Saves two hours; saves $100 on groceries and gives me options to not have to deal with  unnecessarily.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

19 minutes ago, Deucey said:

Gawd, when I worked in Garden City I would make sure not to have appointments after 3:30 so I could get back and park on Sedgwick - either on the side of Fordham Hill Oval (where the security cameras are) or on the block with the VA hospital - even if up by Kingsbridge Rd, since there was always someone awake or walking or watching.

Even those times I had to park on Bailey after the light, I stayed as close to the corner with Sedgwick just so my car would be seen. There was a big rig that was always parked on the block that if you were in front of, those folks that hung out at the garage/stores next to the gas station where the Bx12 turned around at would mess with your car.

I still hate that block to this day.

That's why I'm like "Let me get one." The only grocery in my hood is KeyFood on Bay and Victory - and that's an overpriced and shit store; the nearest decent one is 30 minutes on the S44 (ShopRite on Forest/Richmond. 

I used to have ZipCar, and for the money I spent at ShopRite or Stop & Shop, I could get more and cover the bridge toll going to Walmart in Bayonne. That alone, and factoring in the food quality on the other side of the kill has me thinking about finding a $5k special car to buy just to grocery shop and tear up the Turnpike going to Maryland to see my mom instead of BoltBus'ing it. Saves two hours; saves $100 on groceries and gives me options to not have to deal with  unnecessarily.

Yeah Key Food is basically a monopoly in Riverdale. There's two of them, one within walking distance for me. I use that as a my "corner store" because they charge more for most things than in Manhattan, so I just shop in the city at Whole Foods or Fairway for select items.  It's much easier since I have the express buses that stop sometimes across the street or down the block from Whole Foods.  I relax in Whole Foods, track the bus and then walk to the stop a few minutes before the bus is due.  No worrying about parking or any of that.

As for Sedgwick, yes that was wise of you to park where you did.  I think the problem is now since the Bronx is becoming so expensive given that most of the neighborhoods are what they are (I mean really paying $1500-1600 for a one bedroom in Kingsbridge is absurd), people are looking for deals anywhere.  Fordham Oval over there... It's so hilly. The family told me everyone is getting a car there (they moved there from Manhattan) and since the co-ops are "dirt cheap over" there compared to Manhattan, why not get a car or two? lol

The one thing I have saved on since moving to Riverdale is car service. On Staten Island I became very spoiled. On weekends, I'd call car service to pick me and take me to the express bus which was a 10 - 15 minute depending on which bus I wanted.  For that alone I'd spend roughly $320 a month (say about $80.00 or so each weekend), then the express bus fare, so easily around $500.00 a month.  Now I spend around $350 a month if I do singles on Metro-North or $446 - 505.50 a month with the monthly Metro-North pass and the express bus pass (if there are five weeks in the month).  Still likely cheaper though than driving.

12 hours ago, BrooklynBus said:

I hear what you are saying. A lot of if it's that much more quicker to drive than it is to take mass transit depends on the times you need to make your trips as well as where you are going. For your purposes a car may not be worth the extra hassle so you don't feel the need to have a car. My father didn't drive so until I got my license at age 20, I rode exclusively mass transit.

Now many if my trips are in the evening and many are between Astoria and Manhattan Beach. During the day it takes from 90 minutes to two hours by mass transit and less than an hour by car. (It used to take 45 minutes). At night when I usually return home, it would take way over two hours by mass transit with numerous changes and walking whereas by car it takes between 36 and 43 minutes. Yes, I could take a cab at night but that would run about $75 with a tip. Renting a car is about $130 a day and other options require a subscription. Also shopping is much more inconvenient without a car. I wouldn't dream about having to rely exclusively on mass transit. With the weather today, the buses were horrible. I walked most of the way to and from Brighton Beach today in the wet weather. 

I think if I lived in Manhattan Beach, I would definitely have a car.  It makes shopping and the like much easier. It would be a hassle otherwise.  I mean sure, you could walk from Manhattan Beach across the bridge to Sheepshead Bay depending on your location, but on nasty days that isn't fun taking that footbridge.  I lived right on the Manhattan Beach/Sheepshead Bay border (old junior high school was right on Emmons and Shore Blvd), and have used that bridge many times to hang out with friends who lived deeper into Manhattan Beach and so on.

[Deucey]

1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Yeah Key Food is basically a monopoly in Riverdale. There's two of them, one within walking distance for me. I use that as a my "corner store" because they charge more for most things than in Manhattan, so I just shop in the city at Whole Foods or Fairway for select items.  It's much easier since I have the express buses that stop sometimes across the street or down the block from Whole Foods.  I relax in Whole Foods, track the bus and then walk to the stop a few minutes before the bus is due.  No worrying about parking or any of that.

As for Sedgwick, yes that was wise of you to park where you did.  I think the problem is now since the Bronx is becoming so expensive given that most of the neighborhoods are what they are (I mean really paying $1500-1600 for a one bedroom in Kingsbridge is absurd), people are looking for deals anywhere.  Fordham Oval over there... It's so hilly. The family told me everyone is getting a car there (they moved there from Manhattan) and since the co-ops are "dirt cheap over" there compared to Manhattan, why not get a car or two? lol

 

I think if I lived in Manhattan Beach, I would definitely have a car.  It makes shopping and the like much easier. It would be hassle otherwise.  I mean sure, you could walk from Manhattan Beach across the bridge to Sheepshead Bay depending on your location, but on nasty days that isn't fun taking that footbridge.  I lived right on the Manhattan Beach/Sheepshead Bay border (old junior high school was right on Emmons and Shore Blvd), and have used that bridge many times to hang out with friends who lived deeper into Manhattan Beach and so on.

The big problem on that section is that because it's a mound of dirt and trees supporting the houses on Sedgwick, and the Major Deegan on the opposite side, there's no way to make that area more crime-resistant without posting NYPD there 24/7.

But then I feel that way about not only Bailey, but the Southbound side of Sedgwick as well - the last time my car got broken into before I sold it was on that side in front of the 24/7 garage Fordham Hill Oval residents pay $200/month to park in.

I would've said it was the California plates on the car that made it a magnet, but every time my car was broken into, so were several others on Bailey and on Sedgwick southbound. Would've reported it, but it's a nuisance crime even Broken Windows under Bratton or Ray Kelly wouldn't solve because they're not calling CSU out to dust for prints.

 

=====

I think the minute you buy your place and both realize the savings over renting, and gets worse getting you to midtown, you'll have a car and register it in Dutchess County to save on insurance and to pay the parking garage costs.

Or if you move back to Brooklyn - since you'll be close to Gateway Center and you'll need trunk space for all the stuff you'll buy at Target.