New express bus service: MTA continues to answer riders' concerns

[Via Garibaldi 8]

This passenger said that about 80 people were left this morning trying to get the SIM2 into the city after waiting 25 minutes.  Ridiculous...

[SIMplicity]

SIM7 trips added at 2:30pm and 3:00pm to close the gap between 2:07pm SIM1C and 3:30pm SIM7. Although, the X1 ran every 7-8 minutes during that time, and the X7 ran every 15 minutes (starting at 3pm). And they still haven’t increased SIM7 frequency.

There was a meeting with MTA yesterday, I think at SI Borough Hall. Oddo wants to expand ETC and SI Mall Park and Ride, even if it means throwing gravel down on an empty grassy area adjacent to the lot.

I happened to drive by the Huguenot/Drumgoole park and ride today (SIM2, SIM24, SIR) and it was beyond full.

[RailRunRob]

7 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

This passenger said that about 80 people were left this morning trying to get the SIM2 into the city after waiting 25 minutes.  Ridiculous...

Wow. Way to long of a ride to be standing gezz.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

On 8/22/2018 at 8:56 PM, RailRunRob said:

Wow. Way to long of a ride to be standing gezz.

Express bus riders don't have it easy.  We pay more than double the regular fare, often times wait longer for missing buses and then get the luxury to stand all the way home for a commute over 90 minutes in some cases. I haven't had to go through this often on the Riverdale express buses thank God, but I have on Staten Island. I don't miss these days at all. The only saving grace may be that these buses have air conditioning since many of the older ones didn't.  

 

On 8/22/2018 at 8:51 PM, SIMplicity said:

SIM7 trips added at 2:30pm and 3:00pm to close the gap between 2:07pm SIM1C and 3:30pm SIM7. Although, the X1 ran every 7-8 minutes during that time, and the X7 ran every 15 minutes (starting at 3pm). And they still haven’t increased SIM7 frequency.

There was a meeting with MTA yesterday, I think at SI Borough Hall. Oddo wants to expand ETC and SI Mall Park and Ride, even if it means throwing gravel down on an empty grassy area adjacent to the lot.

I happened to drive by the Huguenot/Drumgoole park and ride today (SIM2, SIM24, SIR) and it was beyond full.

The elected officials are getting an earful on social media and they should be.  They screwed up and they deserve everything they're receiving because this could've been avoided if they spoke up instead of going along with the  .  They essentially agreed to this plan and now they're going to have live with it.  I would vote every one them OUT if I was still living there.  Kinks were expected but this is absurd to have the sort of commutes, delays and gaps in service.  

[RailRunRob]

3 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Express bus riders don't have it easy.  We pay more than double the regular fare, often times wait longer for missing buses and then get the luxury to stand all the way home for a commute over 90 minutes in some cases. I haven't had to go through this often on the Riverdale express buses thank God, but I have on Staten Island. I don't miss these days at all. The only saving grace may be that these buses have air conditioning since many of the older ones didn't.  

Yeah, Id be mad as hell under those conditions not going to lie.  I was out that way yesterday came from Hoboken to meet my wife at the SI Mall via the S89 (Super fast route BTW) but I saw the SIM setup the SIM4 and the SIM4X SIM33 seems super confusing. Are they going to tweak/adjust schedules after some feedback from riders? Do they have people out in the field surveying routes? 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 minutes ago, RailRunRob said:

Yeah, Id be mad as hell under those conditions not going to lie.  I was out that way yesterday came from Hoboken to meet my wife at the SI Mall via the S89 (Super fast route BTW) but I saw the SIM setup the SIM4 and the SIM4X SIM33 seems super confusing. Are they going to tweak/adjust schedules after some feedback from riders? Do they have people out in the field surveying routes? 

They have dispatchers stationed and people at various stops monitoring, but still. Half of the people at the stops that are supposedly helping are useless because they aren't from Staten Island, and they spend more time looking at the maps than the actual passengers do!  I heard about a dispatcher trying to track down a missing express bus as he saw the line Downtown growing and growing.  Given how bad the crowding is, the fact that some drivers aren't trained enough on the routes and are skipping stops is just exacerbating things. Then you have some drivers that feel horrible because they're trying to stop at the old stops to pick up confused passengers.  It's really a nightmare. Too many changes.  The whole renumbering thing IMO has really made things far more confusing, especially for those who didn't partake in the workshops.  I hope that this is a lesson for them for the other redesigns because this has been a disaster on so many levels.

[RailRunRob]

6 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

It's really a nightmare. Too many changes.  The whole renumbering thing IMO has really made things far more confusing, especially for those who didn't partake in the workshops.  I hope that this is a lesson for them for the other redesigns because this has been a disaster on so many levels.

Yeah it's a huge change Staten Island is truly a borough of express Buses redesign of express routes in the other three should be a lot easier Queens being the second most complicated.Brooklyn and The Bronx should be a cake walk.. This is SI's second big route reshuffle and name changes I remember the days of S7 and R103/S103 and the switch in the late 80's. Are the local routes going to be tweaked as well?

[Around the Horn]

They simply aren't running buses frequently enough and there's too much congestion in Midtown.

How many buses are typically out during the rush? There's gotta be a way to get more buses out there...

[checkmatechamp13]

3 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I know that.  That doesn't change my overall point which you're confusing.  We're focusing on two different things. My overall focus has been on the  packing too many buses on one corridor which you don't seem to have a problem with BTW which makes no sense to me, as you bitched endlessly about bunching and long waits, which is exactly what we're seeing with this new plan. You've been focusing on the service gaps and lack of frequency which seems to  be what you're obsessed with.  That can be fixed to a degree with adding buses here and there. 

My issue was that people were arguing from the perspective of "I have to walk all the way to 5th Avenue". That's not the case, because there's bus and subway alternatives (both to 5th and to 23rd) that are available to them. If they choose to walk instead of using them, that's on them. 

In any case, I did believe there should still be at least Hylan buses along Lexington Avenue, because the frequency was high enough that if you split it between the two corridors, each one would still have a decent level of service. It was just the method by which they chose to argue it (though some people did bring up a good point: Once you get to 23rd Street, if the buses are delayed, you have more of a chance of being bypassed, even if you wouldn't have minded standing). 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

6 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

My issue was that people were arguing from the perspective of "I have to walk all the way to 5th Avenue". That's not the case, because there's bus and subway alternatives (both to 5th and to 23rd) that are available to them. If they choose to walk instead of using them, that's on them. 

In any case, I did believe there should still be at least Hylan buses along Lexington Avenue, because the frequency was high enough that if you split it between the two corridors, each one would still have a decent level of service. It was just the method by which they chose to argue it (though some people did bring up a good point: Once you get to 23rd Street, if the buses are delayed, you have more of a chance of being bypassed, even if you wouldn't have minded standing). 

The alternatives are generally slow... The M42 and M50 are non-existent during rush hour, and if you get one of them, they’re so slow that you’re better off walking over to 5th anyway and if it adds an extra 20 minutes then no it isn’t good. You keep looking at it from YOUR commute and no one else’s which is my problem.  There are people with mobility problems that now are being asked to transfer to the subway or walk further. I don’t understand why no one could see that trying to concentrate so many buses on one corridor was a bad idea given how many issues there are with the two bus lanes that exist. Ultimately people need to keep pushing until they move buses BACK to Lex and Madison which is what people wanted from the beginning because THEY know their own commute better than anyone else, not some person on the project that doesn’t live in NYC or NY looking at a map and making decisions. I get it. They thought well we have TWO bus lanes on Fifth. Let’s make sure they’re being used. They already are given how many buses were already running down 5th prior to this change. If they want to continue with this set up they will need MORE bus lanes. It’s that simple. Having people transfer for the hell of it is just stupid. There are no bus lanes at all on 6th, so all of the people in the morning that need Madison or areas East of that are saying screw this I’m transferring at 1st for a Madison Avenue express bus and I don’t blame them. If they are already walking further when they are on Staten Island, then having to make more changes in Manhattan is just making things worse. The idea was to provide direct service for people, so in mind that means more Midtown only routes for people in Midtown, not ok let’s run the majority of the buses up 6th just because when people need Madison and 6th, especially when Madison actually has bus lanes. God forbid they admit that they screwed up...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

7 hours ago, Around the Horn said:

They simply aren't running buses frequently enough and there's too much congestion in Midtown.

How many buses are typically out during the rush? There's gotta be a way to get more buses out there...

You can run more buses but they would just be sitting in traffic because there are too few bus lanes. That problem needs to be addressed and then you can see where you need more buses, but if they aren’t moving, then that’s worse IMO. 

[checkmatechamp13]

1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

The alternatives are generally slow... The M42 and M50 are non-existent during rush hour, and if you get one of them, they’re so slow that you’re better off walking over to 5th anyway and if it adds an extra 20 minutes then no it isn’t good. You keep looking at it from YOUR commute and no one else’s which is my problem.  There are people with mobility problems that now are being asked to transfer to the subway or walk further. I don’t understand why no one could see that trying to concentrate so many buses on one corridor was a bad idea given how many issues there are with the two bus lanes that exist. Ultimately people need to keep pushing until they move buses BACK to Lex and Madison which is what people wanted from the beginning because THEY know their own commute better than anyone else, not some person on the project that doesn’t live in NYC or NY looking at a map and making decisions. I get it. They thought well we have TWO bus lanes on Fifth. Let’s make sure they’re being used. They already are given how many buses were already running down 5th prior to this change. If they want to continue with this set up they will need MORE bus lanes. It’s that simple. Having people transfer for the hell of it is just stupid. There are no bus lanes at all on 6th, so all of the people in the morning that need Madison or areas East of that are saying screw this I’m transferring at 1st for a Madison Avenue express bus and I don’t blame them. If they are already walking further when they are on Staten Island, then having to make more changes in Manhattan is just making things worse. The idea was to provide direct service for people, so in mind that means more Midtown only routes for people in Midtown, not ok let’s run the majority of the buses up 6th just because when people need Madison and 6th, especially when Madison actually has bus lanes. God forbid they admit that they screwed up...

I didn't say they shouldn't have the service, but if they want to argue for it they need to use a different argument. The crosstown buses are slow but the 6 train or M101/102/103 or M15 are also alternatives.

And two FDR routes still run up Madison (plus the "via NJ" routes) so the majority still run up Madison (not to mention they can transfer to the BM1/2/3/4 or X37/38). 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

19 minutes ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

I didn't say they shouldn't have the service, but if they want to argue for it they need to use a different argument. The crosstown buses are slow but the 6 train or M101/102/103 or M15 are also alternatives.

And two FDR routes still run up Madison (plus the "via NJ" routes) so the majority still run up Madison (not to mention they can transfer to the BM1/2/3/4 or X37/38). 

Right the  train has its own problems as well as the other local bus alternatives you mentioned.  You already have to transfer so for you, you don’t see the big deal. Someone who didn’t have to transfer and now has to knows that they will more than likely have a longer commute 9 times out of 10. That’s the reality of it. The  likes the idea of transferring but then provides abysmal service on the “alternatives”. The gaps on the Lexington Avenue buses is just crazy, so yet again if it were me I would huff it or transfer to another express bus.

[Around the Horn]

Do we really want to squeeze more people on the ?

4 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

You can run more buses but they would just be sitting in traffic because there are too few bus lanes. That problem needs to be addressed and then you can see where you need more buses, but if they aren’t moving, then that’s worse IMO. 

True, thats a good point... They really dropped the ball on this.

[Future ENY OP]

7 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

Do we really want to squeeze more people on the ?

True, thats a good point... They really dropped the ball on this.

There wasn’t enough planning and methodology to release these new Staten Island Express routes. How do you go from 30+ express buses to 21 express buses and most don’t serve the whole entire part of the island. 

The purpose of a re-design is to cover all areas not serviced by subway and local bus. In this instance the dense parts of Staten Island. All this penny pitching is getting the  in trouble. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

30 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

Do we really want to squeeze more people on the ?

True, thats a good point... They really dropped the ball on this.

It isn't just in Midtown either... Downtown was a mess too...

More people left behind this morning...

[biGC323232]

13 minutes ago, Future ENY OP said:

There wasn’t enough planning and methodology to release these new Staten Island Express routes. How do you go from 30+ express buses to 21 express buses and most don’t serve the whole entire part of the island. 

The purpose of a re-design is to cover all areas not serviced by subway and local bus. In this instance the dense parts of Staten Island. All this penny pitching is getting the  in trouble. 

I agree....Worrying about saving a penny and gonna lose a 100 dollar bill.....

[biGC323232]

14 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

It isn't just in Midtown either... Downtown was a mess too...

More people left behind this morning...

This is basicly a mirror of how they do subway service....Cut lines (with the assumption that THERE'S NOT ENOUGH RIDERSHIP) and forces other lines to pick up the slack....With the end result of overcrowing,ppl forced to wait for the next bus ,train etc etc...I mean do they even have  ppl out seeing how successful this new idea is???

[Via Garibaldi 8]

3 minutes ago, biGC323232 said:

This is basicly a mirror of how they do subway service....Cut lines (with the assumption that THERE'S NOT ENOUGH RIDERSHIP) and forces other lines to pick up the slack....With the end result of overcrowing,ppl forced to wait for the next bus ,train etc etc...I mean do they even have  ppl out seeing how successful this new idea is???

There are people out. In that photo there's an orange vest, which is why that lady on the line is talking to them likely because she's been waiting and can't get on the buses that are coming as they overcrowded.  Conceptually this is a good idea overall. In other words, I totally agree that the buses should be making fewer stops. However, I DON'T agree with them all running down 5th in Midtown and primarily running up 6th when people need the East Side and Madison Avenue. That forces them to have to transfer when you've already removed their stop or changed it so that they either have to now WALK or DRIVE to reach the new bus stop, so maybe they save 10-15 minutes on the actual bus ride, but then lost it right back walking, driving or transferring, so the only one that saves is the  . It's a joke that unfortunately isn't really funny.  

[Around the Horn]

2 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

However, I DON'T agree with them all running down 5th in Midtown and primarily running up 6th when people need the East Side and Madison Avenue. That forces them to have to transfer when you've already removed their stop or changed it so that they either have to now WALK or DRIVE to reach the new bus stop, so maybe they save 10-15 minutes on the actual bus ride, but then lost it right back walking, driving or transferring, so the only one that saves is the  . It's a joke that unfortunately isn't really funny.  

THIS^ 

And even worse I highly doubt anyone in 2 Broadway is sweating this... If I were responsible for this plan, I'd be losing sleep over these pictures.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

THIS^ 

And even worse I highly doubt anyone in 2 Broadway is sweating this... If I were responsible for this plan, I'd be losing sleep over these pictures.

Something else that was brought up during a SI Live comment segment video is a lot of people move to Staten Island and elsewhere in the City and purchase or rent based on what transportation is nearby, so they may have bought their house or rented where they did specifically because they had an express bus right by them or some good transportation options.  Now they may not have anything or they have a much longer commute to reach the nearest bus. I sure as heck moved to an area of Riverdale with good transportation.  That was the primary reason I live where I do now because I spent so much time and MONEY traveling late nights, etc. to get home with the express bus and then having to get car service because there was no bus by me and I got tired of it.  Quite frankly there were times when I was angry. lol

Looking at how much money I spent in transportation versus now, it's a total 360.  It makes a difference too in terms of how you plan your days, how much sleep you can get, etc. and just your overall quality of life.  I know some here are transit hobby types and that's fine, but transportation has an extremely important role in our daily lives, especially as New Yorkers when so many of us depend on it. As you get older and start working or going to college you really get an understanding of this. When you're in high school, junior high, etc. you generally aren't traveling outside of your neighborhood as much unless you're going to a school outside of the neighborhood, so it doesn't impact you as much, but if you do, then you already get a feel for it.

[biGC323232]

17 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

There are people out. In that photo there's an orange vest, which is why that lady on the line is talking to them likely because she's been waiting and can't get on the buses that are coming as they overcrowded.  Conceptually this is a good idea overall. In other words, I totally agree that the buses should be making fewer stops. However, I DON'T agree with them all running down 5th in Midtown and primarily running up 6th when people need the East Side and Madison Avenue. That forces them to have to transfer when you've already removed their stop or changed it so that they either have to now WALK or DRIVE to reach the new bus stop, so maybe they save 10-15 minutes on the actual bus ride, but then lost it right back walking, driving or transferring, so the only one that saves is the  . It's a joke that unfortunately isn't really funny.  

Cant agree with you more....Express bus has been serving the eastside for decades now...Getting from east to west and vice versa is a very difficult task in the winter with snow and ice to deal with....If it aint broke dont try and fix it thats been the  problem for years with subways and buses trying to fixed things thats not broken...But wont fix the things thats are....Looking at those pics VG8 I had to see for myself and yesterday walking on 5 av was a complete disaster almost every block....You had ppl all over the place making sure they at there right stop...Total mess  

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1 minute ago, biGC323232 said:

Cant agree with you more....Express bus has been serving the eastside for decades now...Getting from east to west and vice versa is a very difficult task in the winter with snow and ice to deal with....If it aint broke dont try and fix it thats been the  problem for years with subways and buses trying to fixed things thats not broken...But wont fix the things thats are....Looking at those pics VG8 I had to see for myself and yesterday walking on 5 av was a complete disaster almost every block....You had ppl all over the place making sure they at there right stop...Total mess  

I haven't walked around there at night to see what it's been like given the pics that I've been seeing, and if I come through there it's after rush hour.  5th Avenue was pure hell during the rush before all of this... Now I can't even imagine. With all of the tourists everywhere, people trying to get home, etc. and then all of these additional people dumped onto 5th for the SI express buses, it is just pure hell.  They also won't be enforcing those bus lanes, something that  keeps throwing out there as a solution that in reality is just not happening.  This plan is bad enough with just two bus lanes, but with no enforcement, you can forget it.  I was in the area this morning and saw a yellow taxi in one of the bus lanes. He continued right down 5th in the bus lane without a care in the world because he didn't want to sit in the car traffic.  Then you have back-ups on the side streets blocking one or both bus lanes every other block and constant trucks in the bus lanes making deliveries so the buses are not coming down the bus lanes unimpeded. They are still fighting to get through other traffic in addition to the buses.

[BrooklynBus]

22 hours ago, trife86 said:

You created the B1? Lol

Yes, one Saturday morning in bed around 1976, the idea suddenly came to me when I was working for the Department of City Planning.  Originally, I just would have combined the B34 with the old B1 routing through Sheepshead Bay. It took until 2010 for the MTA to do the second installment to 4th Avenue. I am still waiting for it to cover the entire 86 Street. 

[Around the Horn]

3 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I know some here are transit hobby types and that's fine, but transportation has an extremely important role in our daily lives, especially as New Yorkers when so many of us depend on it. As you get older and start working or going to college you really get an understanding of this. 

I totally agree with you on that, lol...

Once I started commuting regularly to school, the X27/37 has become a godsend. I used to (foolishly, I'll admit) think they were a waste.

2 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I haven't walked around there at night to see what it's been like given the pics that I've been seeing, and if I come through there it's after rush hour.  5th Avenue was pure hell during the rush before all of this... Now I can't even imagine. With all of the tourists everywhere, people trying to get home, etc. and then all of these additional people dumped onto 5th for the SI express buses, it is just pure hell. 

I was there trying to fight through the VMAs mess to get to the 48th Street bus stop for my X37 (usually I go to Bryant Park, and I probably should have in retrospect). It was a complete mess. A long conga line of buses for what felt like miles.

What was kinda funny and annoying was that  I saw the X37 cross 49th while I was still walking east so I ran over to 48th and 5th to find out that they put up the SIMs there and took down the X27/28/37/38 sign without replacing it . I wasn't gonna risk the bus passing me so I ended up running down to I think 44th where there was a X27/37 sign, and it took 15 minutes after I arrived for that bus to get to the stop. Meanwhile, theres a SIM6, SIM10 and SIM30 stuck in the bus lane cause some moron parked their car there... and there was no way for the buses to go round it until it moved so my X37 was just sitting behind the SIM30 for what felt like forever. Thank god there wasn't a pop up shower cause I had no umbrella with me lol