RailRunRob Posted October 8, 2018 Share #51 Posted October 8, 2018 15 hours ago, WestFarms36 said: Yes, the fleet would be split and Bus Frequencies up in Riverdale would not be reduced. The Bx9 Local and +SBS+ would have their frequencies split, continuing the Bx9 +SBS+ via Broadway would slow it down due to congestion anyway. There would be no Bus Cuts on the Bx9 between 225 St and 262 St. Not sure I follow. So if buses run every 6 mins per say and you split is that 10-12 mins for Locals? With a Bailey Ave route, it's 500-700 feet from Broadway the B44 was offset more than 1,400 feet from New York to Rogers it's not unheard of.. An Alternative to Bailey might be VIA Kingsbridge Ave Alt Stops. 225th/Broadway 231/Kingsbridge 238/Kingsbridge Back on Broadway ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted October 8, 2018 Author Share #52 Posted October 8, 2018 2 hours ago, RailRunRob said: Not sure I follow. So if buses run every 6 mins per say and you split is that 10-12 mins for Locals? With a Bailey Ave route, it's 500-700 feet from Broadway the B44 was offset more than 1,400 feet from New York to Rogers it's not unheard of.. An Alternative to Bailey might be VIA Kingsbridge Ave Alt Stops. 225th/Broadway 231/Kingsbridge 238/Kingsbridge Back on Broadway ... It's not that much of a walk and I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestFarms36 Posted October 10, 2018 Share #53 Posted October 10, 2018 On 10/8/2018 at 4:12 PM, RailRunRob said: Not sure I follow. So if buses run every 6 mins per say and you split is that 10-12 mins for Locals? With a Bailey Ave route, it's 500-700 feet from Broadway the B44 was offset more than 1,400 feet from New York to Rogers it's not unheard of.. An Alternative to Bailey might be VIA Kingsbridge Ave Alt Stops. 225th/Broadway 231/Kingsbridge 238/Kingsbridge Back on Broadway ... That routing could work better than Bailey Avenue. Its kinda redundant on Bailey Avenue with the Bx10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted October 10, 2018 Author Share #54 Posted October 10, 2018 11 hours ago, WestFarms36 said: That routing could work better than Bailey Avenue. Its kinda redundant on Bailey Avenue with the Bx10. I still think the bus lanes under the el could work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted October 10, 2018 Share #55 Posted October 10, 2018 3 hours ago, Lawrence St said: I still think the bus lanes under the el could work. Then you need to explain how then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRunRob Posted October 11, 2018 Share #56 Posted October 11, 2018 On 10/9/2018 at 10:51 PM, WestFarms36 said: That routing could work better than Bailey Avenue. Its kinda redundant on Bailey Avenue with the Bx10. Redundant in which way? They serve completely different area's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted October 11, 2018 Author Share #57 Posted October 11, 2018 On 10/9/2018 at 10:51 PM, WestFarms36 said: That routing could work better than Bailey Avenue. Its kinda redundant on Bailey Avenue with the Bx10. That's like saying the B82 SBS is redudant on Kings Highway with the B6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43 Floral Park Posted October 12, 2018 Share #58 Posted October 12, 2018 On 10/8/2018 at 12:38 AM, WestFarms36 said: Yes, the fleet would be split and Bus Frequencies up in Riverdale would not be reduced. The Bx9 Local and +SBS+ would have their frequencies split, continuing the Bx9 +SBS+ via Broadway would slow it down due to congestion anyway. There would be no Bus Cuts on the Bx9 between 225 St and 262 St. am I missing something or... split frequencies on different streets = service cut to Broadway (225-240 aka the direct connections) and service boost to Bailey/addition to Kingsbridge av? I actually can't see how to SBS it without cutting service though... there's too much service between 262-242 as is, the ridership just isn't there (in comparison to the rest of the route) and I'm not sure that segment can get any faster. imo I think we're going to need some short turn (local and sbs) runs that don't go to Riverdale before returning east in order to stop the bunching. Side note saw an op get stuck for 2 mins trying to bang the U at MCP last week so that clearly isn't best place to be turning buses either. On 10/8/2018 at 4:12 PM, RailRunRob said: With a Bailey Ave route, it's 500-700 feet from Broadway the B44 was offset more than 1,400 feet from New York to Rogers it's not unheard of.. An Alternative to Bailey might be VIA Kingsbridge Ave Alt Stops. 225th/Broadway 231/Kingsbridge 238/Kingsbridge I was under the general impression that the area around the B44 has the same elevation (can someone confirm?) whereas one would have to walk up hill to get to Bailey or Kingsbridge (which may be challenging for some people). lol if the bolded part ever happens, I will gladly direct every angry Bx3 rider to you... in all seriousness, you can't have the Bx3 making u-turns (that can already take 2-3 light sequences) and the Bx9 trying to stop + make diagonal turns at the same narrow intersection (it's gotten better and worse since the redesign). 6 hours ago, Lawrence St said: That's like saying the B82 SBS is redudant on Kings Highway with the B6. B7* and that might be a slightly bad comparison only b/c getting from Midwood to Bed-Stuy would be tedious without it (the one time I took that route, it did just seem like an after thought to the B82 & i still don't get why it ends at Flatbush like that...) this is a tad redundant because riders usually want the subway and the Bx9/10 hit the same ones (lex, 6th and 7th). there might be some people along the Bx10 on bailey who want a direct x-fer to the Bx15/17/19/21/36/40/42/Q44/beeline, but I see that group being a lot smaller than riders along the Bx9 who want a faster ride to Broadway and those connections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRunRob Posted October 12, 2018 Share #59 Posted October 12, 2018 31 minutes ago, Q43 Floral Park said: was under the general impression that the area around the B44 has the same elevation (can someone confirm?) whereas one would have to walk up hill to get to Bailey or Kingsbridge (which may be challenging for some people). lol if the bolded part ever happens, I will gladly direct every angry Bx3 rider to you... in all seriousness, you can't have the Bx3 making u-turns (that can already take 2-3 light sequences) and the Bx9 trying to stop + make diagonal turns at the same narrow intersection (it's gotten better and worse since the redesign). Nope west of Nostrand, there's substantial a hill to Rogers Ave the B44SBS/B49 are on top of the hill. There's a small hill to Kingsbridge Ave/231th and I don't remember one from Broadway to Bailey at any point 225-240th. The Hills come in East of Bailey. Yep I took that intersection into consideration with a Kingsbridge route. It would need some DOT rework abit I think it could handle it. Used to go to 238th quite abit for S&S Cheesecakes might have to make another trip soon lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted October 12, 2018 Share #60 Posted October 12, 2018 1 hour ago, RailRunRob said: Nope west of Nostrand, there's substantial a hill to Rogers Ave the B44SBS/B49 are on top of the hill. There's a small hill to Kingsbridge Ave/231th and I don't remember one from Broadway to Bailey at any point 225-240th. The Hills come in East of Bailey. Yep I took that intersection into consideration with a Kingsbridge route. It would need some DOT rework abit I think it could handle it. Used to go to 238th quite abit for S&S Cheesecakes might have to make another trip soon lol. May wanna save yourself the trip. Supposedly not as good as it once was... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRunRob Posted October 12, 2018 Share #61 Posted October 12, 2018 18 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said: May wanna save yourself the trip. Supposedly not as good as it once was... 😢 I guess I'll have to rely on Venieros for my Cheesecake fix! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted October 12, 2018 Share #62 Posted October 12, 2018 1 hour ago, RailRunRob said: 😢 I guess I'll have to rely on Venieros for my Cheesecake fix! Yep... Unless S & S got their act together... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43 Floral Park Posted October 12, 2018 Share #63 Posted October 12, 2018 2 hours ago, RailRunRob said: Nope west of Nostrand, there's substantial a hill to Rogers Ave the B44SBS/B49 are on top of the hill. There's a small hill to Kingsbridge Ave/231th and I don't remember one from Broadway to Bailey at any point 225-240th. The Hills come in East of Bailey. Yep I took that intersection into consideration with a Kingsbridge route. It would need some DOT rework abit I think it could handle it. Used to go to 238th quite abit for S&S Cheesecakes might have to make another trip soon lol. did the B44 riders complain about that? it sounds inconvenient esp. for the elderly... I mean technically it's uphill going east from broadway between 230-238 to cross over the Deegan (not nearly as steep as east of bailey) but since it was done with 2x the distance and a larger hill, I can see the case for the Bx9 via Bailey. although if you've got a way to redesign the intersection further so the Bx3/9 don't impede each other, (nothing comes to mind other than the Bx3 not making the U-turn there), SBS via Kingsbridge Av would be a lot more ideal than Bailey. I've heard good things about s&s but always ended up having junior's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRunRob Posted October 12, 2018 Share #64 Posted October 12, 2018 12 hours ago, Q43 Floral Park said: did the B44 riders complain about that? it sounds inconvenient esp. for the elderly... I mean technically it's uphill going east from broadway between 230-238 to cross over the Deegan (not nearly as steep as east of bailey) but since it was done with 2x the distance and a larger hill, I can see the case for the Bx9 via Bailey. although if you've got a way to redesign the intersection further so the Bx3/9 don't impede each other, (nothing comes to mind other than the Bx3 not making the U-turn there), SBS via Kingsbridge Av would be a lot more ideal than Bailey. I've heard good things about s&s but always ended up having junior's. Ive used the B44 on a few occasions. The 44 covers 3 blocks east to west New York,Nostrand and Rogers. Nostrand is the center with NB local on NewYork and NB SBS on Rogers. I feel like it depends on we’re your coming from Elders could easily just use the locals that require no hill. But if you live west of Nostrand you had the hill already anyways at least one way. A few older folks use the 48/69 both are close to me. The 45 has a big older base as well being it parallel’s the 3/4 trains. As for the 9 Kingsbridge Ave could work. I guess my question is how far up the priorities list would we place the 9 for SBS. I feel like the 19 or 40/42 would be better candidates for the upgrade. Is the MTA still applying Limited service? Or is it just SBS? A LTD Bx9 might be a better fit!! PS: Juniors is great!! But Venerios !!! The best cannolis as well take the trip!’ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestFarms36 Posted October 12, 2018 Share #65 Posted October 12, 2018 2 hours ago, RailRunRob said: Ive used the B44 on a few occasions. The 44 covers 3 blocks east to west New York,Nostrand and Rogers. Nostrand is the center with NB local on NewYork and NB SBS on Rogers. I feel like it depends on we’re your coming from Elders could easily just use the locals that require no hill. But if you live west of Nostrand you had the hill already anyways at least one way. A few older folks use the 48/69 both are close to me. The 45 has a big older base as well being it parallel’s the 3/4 trains. As for the 9 Kingsbridge Ave could work. I guess my question is how far up the priorities list would we place the 9 for SBS. I feel like the 19 or 40/42 would be better candidates for the upgrade. Is the MTA still applying Limited service? Or is it just SBS? A LTD Bx9 might be a better fit!! PS: Juniors is great!! But Venerios !!! The best cannolis as well take the trip!’ Is no longer on the LIMITED department. New LIMITED service is dead as dog poop at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRunRob Posted October 12, 2018 Share #66 Posted October 12, 2018 34 minutes ago, WestFarms36 said: Is no longer on the LIMITED department. New LIMITED service is dead as dog poop at this point. I don't really understand the logic in that. There should be something in between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestFarms36 Posted October 12, 2018 Share #67 Posted October 12, 2018 2 minutes ago, RailRunRob said: I don't really understand the logic in that. There should be something in between. The is just focused on +SBS+ these days... and they aren't stopping any time soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRunRob Posted October 12, 2018 Share #68 Posted October 12, 2018 3 minutes ago, WestFarms36 said: The is just focused on +SBS+ these days... and they aren't stopping any time soon. That's silly! So what that means unless you live along a corridor that can support SBS you can't expect speeder service? Think of a route like the Bx36 how could you SBS a route like that without shifting ridership to Tremont? I can't see how that could be a done deal with all this redesign stuff. BRT should be BRT. Limited should be able to get into those harder to reach places. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43 Floral Park Posted October 12, 2018 Share #69 Posted October 12, 2018 4 hours ago, RailRunRob said: Ive used the B44 on a few occasions. The 44 covers 3 blocks east to west New York,Nostrand and Rogers. Nostrand is the center with NB local on NewYork and NB SBS on Rogers. I feel like it depends on we’re your coming from Elders could easily just use the locals that require no hill. But if you live west of Nostrand you had the hill already anyways at least one way. A few older folks use the 48/69 both are close to me. The 45 has a big older base as well being it parallel’s the 3/4 trains. As for the 9 Kingsbridge Ave could work. I guess my question is how far up the priorities list would we place the 9 for SBS. I feel like the 19 or 40/42 would be better candidates for the upgrade. Is the MTA still applying Limited service? Or is it just SBS? A LTD Bx9 might be a better fit!! PS: Juniors is great!! But Venerios !!! The best cannolis as well take the trip!’ Gotcha. I think it's a lower than the Bx19 but higher than the Bx40/42. I always thought some local routes should have LTD service installed before SBS is implemented because it's a quick way to speed up service and allows them to determine if SBS is really needed. I'll have to check it out! 2 hours ago, RailRunRob said: So what that means unless you live along a corridor that can support SBS you can't expect speeder service? I've been meaning to post in the redesign thread but this came up and the table agreed it wouldn't be the best approach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestFarms36 Posted October 13, 2018 Share #70 Posted October 13, 2018 5 hours ago, RailRunRob said: That's silly! So what that means unless you live along a corridor that can support SBS you can't expect speeder service? Think of a route like the Bx36 how could you SBS a route like that without shifting ridership to Tremont? I can't see how that could be a done deal with all this redesign stuff. BRT should be BRT. Limited should be able to get into those harder to reach places. It would be nice but when you notice the last NYCT Bus route to receive LTD Service was the Bx36 in 2009. Bus last had it in 2013 for the Q70. Its just a service dead underwater and it is alive as long as those routes don't get cut, or converted to +SBS+ and LIMITED service no longer seems to be an option under the . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRunRob Posted October 13, 2018 Share #71 Posted October 13, 2018 11 hours ago, WestFarms36 said: It would be nice but when you notice the last NYCT Bus route to receive LTD Service was the Bx36 in 2009. Bus last had it in 2013 for the Q70. Its just a service dead underwater and it is alive as long as those routes don't get cut, or converted to +SBS+ and LIMITED service no longer seems to be an option under the . Think that might have to change moving forward. There are few routes I feel that need enhancement that SBS might be too big of a jump for. With all-door boarding seeming heading to routes beyond SBS, the MTA is really going to have to clarify what SBS really is! Quicker boarding isn't going to cut it. If it's BRT as they claim then get it up to BRT standards. Being up in Co-Op the other day gave me some insight into some of the frustrations up that way. The Bx28 comes to mind as a route that may work as an LTD route but SBS might be overkill. Making limited stops on a certain section then make all stops in others. The S.I Limited network might be good examples. S94 is limited really on the North Shore all but local on Richmond. We need that extra flexibility without the full weight of the DOT and NIMBY's fights were possible. A 4 tier setup is best IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRunRob Posted October 13, 2018 Share #72 Posted October 13, 2018 14 hours ago, Q43 Floral Park said: I think it's a lower than the Bx19 but higher than the Bx40/42. I always thought some local routes should have LTD service installed before SBS is implemented because it's a quick way to speed up service and allows them to determine if SBS is really needed. I fully agree.. Limited service also offers options for more flexibility with stops spacing and local at or after a certain point. The BX19 definitely might be a good test for LTD before SBS.. I feel like the Bronx is missing quick crosstown options why the 40/42 came to mind.. What's the ridership on the Bx9? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted October 14, 2018 Author Share #73 Posted October 14, 2018 Ok so I'm about to make a full mock-up Bx9 SBS scheduel. I'm still working on the Bx9 road renderings. What's the plan that everyone agrees with now? Via Bailey, Via Kingsbridge, end at 225th or go via Broadway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestFarms36 Posted October 14, 2018 Share #74 Posted October 14, 2018 3 hours ago, Lawrence St said: Ok so I'm about to make a full mock-up Bx9 SBS schedule. I'm still working on the Bx9 road renderings. What's the plan that everyone agrees with now? Via Bailey, Via Kingsbridge, end at 225th or go via Broadway? I fixed it for you. I recommend the Bx9 +SBS+ ending at 225 St. There's not a big market for +SBS+ above 225 St, the local is fine making trips to 262 St. Plus +SBS+ would be more than fine running between W Farms Sq-225 St as it is basically doing the busiest stretch of the route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43 Floral Park Posted October 14, 2018 Share #75 Posted October 14, 2018 17 hours ago, Lawrence St said: Ok so I'm about to make a full mock-up Bx9 SBS scheduel. I'm still working on the Bx9 road renderings. What's the plan that everyone agrees with now? Via Bailey, Via Kingsbridge, end at 225th or go via Broadway? via Kingsbridge or end 225 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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