Designing Bus Routes to Attract Passengers and Reverse the Decline in Ridership

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1 minute ago, BrooklynBus said:

I don't understand you. I thought I made myself clear. The  gets plenty out of the deal. All the money they are now spending to provide extra service to Kingsborough would be reimbursed by Kingsborough or the city. How would KCC be paying less? 

Well let's see... KCC would only have to pay the  for the service, not buy buses, pay drivers or any of that.  I would have to think they would save money that way. My question about what does the  get out of it is simple.  Are they now in the business of running shuttle bus service for such institutions? In other words, those buses would essentially only serve KCC students and no other commuters.

[BrooklynBus]

27 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Well let's see... KCC would only have to pay the  for the service, not buy buses, pay drivers or any of that.  I would have to think they would save money that way. My question about what does the  get out of it is simple.  Are they now in the business of running shuttle bus service for such institutions? In other words, those buses would essentially only serve KCC students and no other commuters.

When I said pay for the service, I was talking about direct costs, meaning labor and fuel. I don't see how the MTA could ask for more. The MTA could not ask them to pair for the cost of the buses or maintenance, etc. so  KCC still gets a good deal.

I have no problem if the shuttles only picked up KCC students if KCC paid for the service. Regarding the other buses, KCC should pay for a portion of the costs, the portion used by KCC students. But the city should also pay a portion because those same buses are also used to pick up large numbers of students from Lincoln HS after half the KCC students get off. 

Right now it is the MTA's responsibility to provide service to all schools which is significant and why many routes have a school open and school closed schedule. I think the city should pay the cost differential between the school open and school closed schedule. Right now the only student subsidy provided is for reduced fares and the MTA has always complained the formula is unfair and doesn't cover all the costs. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1 minute ago, BrooklynBus said:

When I said pay for the service, I was talking about direct costs, meaning labor and fuel. I don't see how the MTA could ask for more. The MTA could not ask them to pair for the cost of the buses or maintenance, etc. so  KCC still gets a good deal.

I have no problem if the shuttles only picked up KCC students if KCC paid for the service. Regarding the other buses, KCC should pay for a portion of the costs, the portion used by KCC students. But the city should also pay a portion because those same buses are also used to pick up large numbers of students from Lincoln HS after half the KCC students get off. 

Right now it is the MTA's responsibility to provide service to all schools which is significant and why many routes have a school open and school closed schedule. I think the city should pay the cost differential between the school open and school closed schedule. Right now the only student subsidy provided is for reduced fares and the MTA has always complained the formula is unfair and doesn't cover all the costs. 

Well yeah, not including the rampant fare beating that goes on with all of the "students" passing their Metrocards around to what are really adults abusing the system.  Byford is supposed to produce that farebeating report soon. I'm itching to see what the number is...

[BrooklynBus]

1 minute ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Well yeah, not including the rampant fare beating that goes on with all of the "students" passing their Metrocards around to what are really adults abusing the system.  Byford is supposed to produce that farebeating report soon. I'm itching to see what the number is...

I also can't wait to see that report but who knows how accurate it is. And that's really irrelevant to this discussion anyway. Also don't really see much fare abuse from the KCC students. Never saw anyone passing MetroCards. How would that work anyway?  

Some of the fare abuse is sanctioned by the bus drivers. When there are at least 50 students waiting at Coney Island Avenue, I have seen drivers open the back door for students to board even when no one has to get off. It even makes sense. They are all coming from the subway and already paid, the bus gets to hold 90 instead of 70 since no one moves to the back, and the bus leaves the stop three minutes quicker. 

 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

6 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

I also can't wait to see that report but who knows how accurate it is. And that's really irrelevant to this discussion anyway. Also don't really see much fare abuse from the KCC students. Never saw anyone passing MetroCards. How would that work anyway?  

Some of the fare abuse is sanctioned by the bus drivers. When there are at least 50 students waiting at Coney Island Avenue, I have seen drivers open the back door for students to board even when no one has to get off. It even makes sense. They are all coming from the subway and already paid, the bus gets to hold 90 instead of 70 since no one moves to the back, and the bus leaves the stop three minutes quicker. 

 

Only irrelevant if the  was being fully reimbursed by KCC, which isn't the case currently. I agree about the report and everything else you stated.

[BrooklynBus]

17 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Only irrelevant if the  was being fully reimbursed by KCC, which isn't the case currently. I agree about the report and everything else you stated.

The city reimburses the MTA for the half fare not KCC. When someone beats the fare there is no reimbursement at all.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

5 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

The city reimburses the MTA for the half fare not KCC. When someone beats the fare there is no reimbursement at all.

Crazy... 

[BrooklynBus]

This is the Columbia University Planning School's Urban Magazine's version (on page 13) of my Gotham Gazette recent series of articles on how to fix the bus system. This version goes into more detail about the southwest Brooklyn bus route changes. The rest of the article is pretty similar. 

https://issuu.com/gsapp_hp/docs/urban_2018-2019_final_print_dec0218

[BrooklynBus]

On 12/8/2018 at 6:18 PM, BrooklynBus said:

This is the Columbia University Planning School's Urban Magazine's version (on page 13) of my Gotham Gazette recent series of articles on how to fix the bus system. This version goes into more detail about the southwest Brooklyn bus route changes. The rest of the article is pretty similar. 

https://issuu.com/gsapp_hp/docs/urban_2018-2019_final_print_dec0218

They changed the link. It I sent now: 

https://issuu.com/gsapp_hp/docs/issu_urban_2018-2019_final_print_de