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CBTC - General Discussion

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A new GTFS timetable was released on May 9th. Here's a comparison of Main St to 34th St scheduled running times.

7 to Manhattan
5/18/16 "00:38:30.75";139.176673489183
5/17/17 "00:38:30.860656";137.501504103933
5/16/18 "00:38:33.84";135.902658289382
5/15/19 "00:38:34.5";138.059287247786

7X to Manhattan
5/18/16 "00:33:37.142857";74.907608597418
5/17/17 "00:33:37.142857";74.907608597418
5/16/18 "00:33:37.142857";74.907608597418
5/15/19 "00:33:40.465116";79.0705980022824

It's date, average running time in "hh:mm:ss" and standard deviation in seconds.

The GTFS schedules don't reflect any run time reduction as a result of CBTC's introduction (with or without ATO).

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Do you have the old supplement schedules for the (7) on your computer? The (7) was on a long term supplement schedule before CBTC, against which runtime gains have been made. 

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26 minutes ago, RR503 said:

Do you have the old supplement schedules for the (7) on your computer? The (7) was on a long term supplement schedule before CBTC, against which runtime gains have been made. 

Here's the Manhattan bound data for 5/15/19 from the supplemented schedule that I downloaded yesterday morning (5/10/19).

7
5/15/19 "00:39:04.235294";161.586936722929
7X
5/15/19 "00:33:40.465116";79.0705980022824

As you can see, there's usually a fairly close relation between the supplemented and GTFS schedules.

There is an archive for supplemented schedules that dates back to September 2017. My experience has been that substantive differences between the supplemented and GTFS have been few and far between. 

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10 minutes ago, Stephen Bauman said:

Here's the Manhattan bound data for 5/15/19 from the supplemented schedule that I downloaded yesterday morning (5/10/19).

 7
5/15/19 "00:39:04.235294";161.586936722929
7X
5/15/19 "00:33:40.465116";79.0705980022824

As you can see, there's usually a fairly close relation between the supplemented and GTFS schedules.

There is an archive for supplemented schedules that dates back to September 2017. My experience has been that substantive differences between the supplemented and GTFS have been few and far between. 

The post-4/26 supplements shouldn't show any runtime difference. If I'm not mistaken, before that date there was a supplement in effect that added a good bit of runtime to the (7). I'd be interested to know the extent to which that's changed, as with the (L) they pretty much left runtimes the same (which, IINM, causes some relatively significant operational issues with trains running ahead of schedule). 

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1 hour ago, RR503 said:

The post-4/26 supplements shouldn't show any runtime difference. If I'm not mistaken, before that date there was a supplement in effect that added a good bit of runtime to the (7). I'd be interested to know the extent to which that's changed, as with the (L) they pretty much left runtimes the same (which, IINM, causes some relatively significant operational issues with trains running ahead of schedule). 

Here are the run times from the supplemented from 4/10/19

7
4/10/19 "00:38:33.84";135.902658289382
7X
4/10/19 "00:33:37.142857";74.907608597418

 

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12 minutes ago, Stephen Bauman said:

Here are the run times from the supplemented from 4/10/19

7
4/10/19 "00:38:33.84";135.902658289382
7X
4/10/19 "00:33:37.142857";74.907608597418

 

Very interesting. I’m surprised (but also somewhat not) to see no schedule difference. What does northbound look like? 

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3 hours ago, RR503 said:

Very interesting. I’m surprised (but also somewhat not) to see no schedule difference. What does northbound look like? 

7 from 34th to Main St
4/10/19 "00:39:06.419214";139.139961017714
5/15/19 "00:39:09.141631";130.222427854399

7X from 34th to Main St
4/10/19 "00:32:38.225806";66.3454494850382
5/15/19 "00:32:50.769231";81.2847558799406

 

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Ugh. So they're padding the hell out of the schedules again. Lovely, just lovely. 

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9 hours ago, RR503 said:

Ugh. So they're padding the hell out of the schedules again. Lovely, just lovely. 

I had heard that runtimes would be reduced by 3 minutes, but I guess that was thrown out the window.

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Flushing CBTC Temporarily Offline Following Multiple Station Overshoots

- Dan Rivoli - NY1

The MTA's latest technology, computers driving trains at the push of a button, got derailed on the 7 line, days after its full launch last week.

The reason: trains were overshooting stations — by four cars in one instance. Six trains — including three Friday, a day after the launch — overshot a station last week.

Pete Tomlin, the MTA's subway signals executive, called it an "anomaly," where trains didn't stop when they were supposed to and instead headed straight to the next stop. He notes there were at least 12,000 successful runs of the system.

"We've actually decided as a precautionary matter we would turn it off, get to the bottom of it," Tomlin told NY1. "If the operator has to emergency brake the train, or take control of the train, that's not a good thing. It's not unsafe."

The 7 line is the second, after the L line, to get a new signal system this year.

In April, the MTA started testing the 7's automated feature, slowly rolling it out to more and more trains. The computerized system lets trains run faster and closer together — up to 29 trains in a single hour at peak times. MTA leaders want to expand the technology to other lines within 10 years, after spending nearly a decade bringing it to the 7 line.

Officials say the results are clear: a major improvement in the number of trains running on time, reaching 89 percent this April during its slow rollout.

Passengers spent less time waiting on platforms and their trips were quicker, according to the MTA.

"Automatic train operation is a great add-on to every line that we have. It makes train travel predictable, people know where exactly every train is," said Andrew Albert, the chair of the NYC Transit Riders Council and an MTA board member. "We have to make sure that the glitches are worked out and obviously some of the glitches were not worked out."

MTA officials are working with the contractor to figure out exactly what went wrong, how to fix it, and get the system running again within days.

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9 minutes ago, Union Tpke said:

@RR503 Are the dwell times on the 7 stringlines accurate? If so, there are very long dwell times.

33994391368_a1a17ed133_o.pngStringline_Southbound_7_Train_2Hours_5-17-2019_7-27-52-PM by Union Turnpike, on Flickr

The MTA’s real time data feeds don’t measure dwell time so much as they measure time in station. Whenever the countdown clocks show “0 minutes” or “arriving now” or whatever, the viewer begins to register dwell, and whenever the last ‘stopped at’ message is sent in the feed, dwell is over. So take those figures to be a rough approximation of the time from when the train enters a station to when it begins to leave. 

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