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Via Garibaldi 8

Full Shutdown of L Train to Be Halted by Cuomo

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26 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

That’s my point. There is no rule that says that the work can’t be done on nights and weekends. We shouldn’t have a full shutdown if it isn’t needed. What’s important is that the work is done that is needed. 

Mechanics' adage comes to mind:good_-_cheap_-_fast7.jpg

I feel like we just got a back pocket "AHA" from the other guy from Queens with a hero complex, and that we're getting the third line instead of the first or second.

The shutdown's already been vetted and contracted out. Terminating those contracts will cost - and with a perennially broke agency about to steal more of our money in 60 days, this act by that CNN Anchor's brother is a gross act of financial malfeasance.

This should've been brought up 6 months ago in order to be vetted before contracts got signed and folks made job changes or turned down work to do it.

And I haven't seen anything saying that the ADA work and entrance rebuilds are still going forward. So yeah, that former Kennedy-by-marriage literally pissed away God-knows how much money just to scratch an itch.

Nice that folks don't have to take (M) or the M14s, but he really pulled some BS.

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19 minutes ago, RR503 said:

MTA was basically not clued in on all this. I'm generally skeptical of the conclusions of remote academics and 'big thinkers' who use the word 'innovative' when talking about safety-critical maintenance, and the lack of detail, dissonance in message (is it just the benchwall or the whole track/tunnel structure) and the startling lack of NYCT personnel on the team just reinforces my skepticism. Was this a kangaroo court? 

Seems like how the other numbskull from Queens just listened to one person on the phone and decided to upend policy by withdrawing from Syria before consulting his experts.

/politics

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2 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I think this should answer the questions if those bitching and complaining:

http://www.mta.info/press-release/nyc-transit/mta-announces-l-train-shutdown-averted

This answers zero questions for me. It’s literally a textual regurgitation of the earlier press conference. I imagine this was put out under duress — to say nothing of without any shred of board approval. 

Don’t let qualifications blind you. The folks who are supposed to be the best and the brightest in transit often don’t understand its nuances. 

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I wonder how much support he might lose from this... I hope people don't still blindly vote him for his party.

 

Guess I'm going to Chi-Town or the west coast for college...

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iGUzhWX.png

All of a sudden the work is a lot simpler than what was  Initially assessed. The Cable ducts I kinda understand but tunnel lining.. Pump system? What happened there? Wayback machine the MTA site.  

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2 minutes ago, R68OnBroadway said:

I wonder how much support he might lose from this... I hope people don't still blindly vote him for his party.

 

Guess I'm going to Chi-Town or the west coast for college...

I'm biased towards UC Davis or Berkeley for you. (I still have NorCal Pride.)

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Just now, RR503 said:

This answers zero questions for me. It’s literally a textual regurgitation of the earlier press conference. I imagine this was put out under duress — to say nothing of without any shred of board approval. 

 Don’t let qualifications blind you. The folks who are supposed to be the best and the brightest in transit often don’t understand its nuances. 

 

Now these folks are asking the real questions:

 

 

 

 

Couldn't help but laught at this one:

 

 

 

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Just now, Deucey said:

I'm biased towards UC Davis or Berkeley for you. (I still have NorCal Pride.)

Go Bears!!!!!

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It's basically putting a bandage over a deep cut and hope itll fix itself...

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Just now, RailRunRob said:

Go Bears!!!!!

Or Aggies...

Funny story, I went to Sacramento State between 1999 and 2002 and didn't know we had a b-ball team until I saw them playing while watching sports on my Oculus Go.

But I digress.

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4 minutes ago, RR503 said:

This answers zero questions for me. It’s literally a textual regurgitation of the earlier press conference. I imagine this was put out under duress — to say nothing of without any shred of board approval. 

Don’t let qualifications blind you. The folks who are supposed to be the best and the brightest in transit often don’t understand its nuances. 

I’m not basing it off of qualifications per se. If they have consulted with the contractors on this project and done their own due diligence, and the contractors and these experts feel this project can be done without having a full shutdown using innovative techniques used elsewhere, then I don’t see what the problem is. These people worked pro bono, putting in hundreds of hours of their own time, so they are putting their reputations on the line for this project. They get name recognition if this works or if it’s a bust, so I’d say there’s a lot at risk for them. You don’t just do this blindly. 

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Just now, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I’m not basing it off of qualifications per se. If they have consulted with the contractors on this project and done their own due diligence, and the contractors and these experts feel this project can be done without having a full shutdown using innovative techniques used elsewhere, then I don’t see what the problem is. These people worked pro bono, putting in hundreds of hours of their own time, so they are putting their reputations on the line for this project. They get name recognition if this works or if it’s a bust, so I’d say there’s a lot at risk for them. You don’t just do this blindly. 

But didnt they already choose a contractor and pay them extra money to get it done in 15 months instead of 18 months?

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Just now, Deucey said:

Or Aggies...

Funny story, I went to Sacramento State between 1999 and 2002 and didn't know we had a b-ball team until I saw them playing while watching sports on my Oculus Go.

But I digress.

Cal class of 02 here bears all day!!  Lol back on the topic.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Lawrence St said:

But didnt they already choose a contractor and pay them extra money to get it done in 15 months instead of 18 months?

That’s what change orders are for. The scope of construction projects changes all the time... If you saw how many change orders we had on some projects that started through me...

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I’m not basing it off of qualifications per se. If they have consulted with the contractors on this project and done their own due diligence, and the contractors and these experts feel this project can be done without having a full shutdown using innovative techniques used elsewhere, then I don’t see what the problem is. These people worked pro bono, putting in hundreds of hours of their own time, so they are putting their reputations on the line for this project. They get name recognition if this works or if it’s a bust, so I’d say there’s a lot at risk for them. You don’t just do this blindly. 

Understand when you work in NYC or for the MTA your on the world stage there's no way professionally your going go for 3-4 years in planning and not come across this type of process if it's out there. And if it's that new new.. and not tested there's a reason you're not going with it.. This feels a bit hostile taken over-ish.. This has Economical cost as well I feel that was a major factor. The Academics is for public validation.

Edited by RailRunRob

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Something else that I should add... If the work proves not to be up to par then the (MTA) can go back and sue the contractor. I’m certain they’ll include such a clause. No one forced the contractor to go along with the latest recommendations. They did so on their own...

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1 minute ago, RailRunRob said:

Understand when you work in NYC or for the MTA your on the world stage there's no way professionally your going go for 3-4 years in planning and not come across this type of process if it out there. And if it's that new new.. and not tested there's a reason you're not going with it.. This feels a bit hostile taken over-ish.. This has Economical cost as well I feel that was a major factor. 

Well you tell me... I know how I would answer this as a project manager who has worked on hundreds of projects... If you were asked to work pro bono on a project that could have severe consequences on your career, wouldn’t you do due diligence to cover your @ss? 

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1 minute ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Something else that I should add... If the work proves not to be up to par then the (MTA) can go back and sue the contractor. I’m certain they’ll include such a clause. No one forced the contractor to go along with the latest recommendations. They did so on their own...

The (MTA) or the boss Cuomo?  The (MTA) is leaderless at this point what options would they have? 

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, RailRunRob said:

The (MTA) or the boss Cuomo?  The (MTA) is leaderless at this point what options would they have? 

The (MTA) . They are not “leaderless”. Ferrer is the acting Chairman at the moment and has been in the past. This doesn’t change the (MTA) ‘s stance from a liability standpoint. There is one thing that the (MTA) does have and that’s an ARMY of lawyers to cover their @ss. I’m sure legal will take care of this as they have in the past.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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26 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I’m not basing it off of qualifications per se. If they have consulted with the contractors on this project and done their own due diligence, and the contractors and these experts feel this project can be done without having a full shutdown using innovative techniques used elsewhere, then I don’t see what the problem is. These people worked pro bono, putting in hundreds of hours of their own time, so they are putting their reputations on the line for this project. They get name recognition if this works or if it’s a bust, so I’d say there’s a lot at risk for them. You don’t just do this blindly. 

I have no doubt in my minds that these experts believe that this is the best option. But experts also told us that running the (C) from Euclid to Court Street was a good idea and that overcrowding was the root of subway delays, so....idk. I want to hear that this will work from someone who actually works with the system beyond the tunnel tour level. I think the discrepancies laid out in the replies above speak to that issue perfectly. 

I also don't trust these claims that they've consulted contractors here. Maybe they sent an email "we're changing the project," maybe they just did it. But given that people at the MTA basically just heard about this today, the notion that their claims of engagement hold any water is laughable. 

23 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

That’s what change orders are for. The scope of construction projects change all the time... If you saw how many change orders we had on some projects that started through me...

 

Yes. Change orders exist. But this isn't a change order. This is basically canceling the project and rescoping the whole damn thing. 

25 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Something else that I should add... If the work proves not to be up to par then the (MTA) can go back and sue the contractor. I’m certain they’ll include such a clause. No one forced the contractor to go along with the latest recommendations. They did so on their own...

We have no contractual confirmation that the contractor is on board with this, nor have we seen an official change order from the board. Seemingly no one cares about process anymore, but that is a dangerous disruption of the MTA's chain of command, to say nothing of it being a usurpation of the board's power. 

With the contractor and with the pro bono nonsense, you can't always trust the evidence of your own eyes. There are probably negotiations/deals being made in backrooms that are affecting outcomes. 

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1 minute ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

wouldn’t you do due diligence to cover your @ss? 

Minus the Pro bono. Bingo!! That's my point!! If your Chief engineer over that project it's a small Community your calling your pals in London and Hong Kong if something out there you'd have a idea. These guys know each other Conferences several times a years.

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, R68OnBroadway said:

I hope people don't still blindly vote him for his party.

That’s basically exactly what some people do and it’s normal across both American parties. They put no research into who they’re supporting and go off of what the party basically is. Cuomo can retain a ton of support by characterizing the Rublicans as devils, which is what he may have done in the latest elections. This works vice versa but it’s safe to say Cuomo has a good leach on those type of people he needs to stay in office.

Even after this event goes down, some people might not care about it or even see it as positive if Cuomo plays his chips right (long term). I honestly wish his support would dwindle since this really was handled disastrously, but he likely will remain alright, his support will fall but it won’t do “lethal” harm to him.

Edited by NoHacksJustKhaks

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3 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

acting Chairman

Acting.. Temporary A Ship without direction. Come on.

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1 hour ago, RR503 said:

I think this is also important. Canarsie would have been painful, but it would have showcased a different approach to transportation. On the surface level, we would have been actively and drastically restricting car access along key corridors. New Yorkers would have been able to experience efficient (albeit) crowded bus service pretty much for the first time in history, along with gains in pedestrian and bike access.

Underground, NYCT was being forced away from its highly linear approach to transportation. The Canarsie shutdown plan was a study in the way our system can distribute loads through its redundancy. Instead of the usual 'lines exist in isolation' mantra, we would have seen NYCT confront the fact it operates a network. Now, they could have done more in this regard, but such is life. NYCT would have also been forced to operate the system *well*. You basically had single point failure on the WillyB and on the (G); dispatchers would have had to get crafty with loads, frequency, variability, and service management. And they would have learned from all this -- to the benefit of the rest of the system and city. Today, we lost that opportunity. 

Most likely we lost this opportunity forever. That was very disappointing.😥😥😥

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