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Union Tpke

Half of all NYC bus routes get a “D” for speed and reliability

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http://busturnaround.nyc/get_involved/half-of-all-nyc-bus-routes-get-a-d-for-speed-and-reliability/

New Yorkers are abandoning the bus in droves. Between 2009 and 2018, total bus ridership fell more than 17 percent, with a 4.7 percent decline in 2018 alone. Slow, unpredictable service is costing New Yorkers time with their families, making them late for work and appointments, and exacerbating the city’s gridlock as more people turn to road-clogging ride-hail services like Uber and Lyft.

According to the Bus Turnaround Coalition’s analysis of real-time MTA data, bus speeds for the average passenger were just 6.6 mph in 2018, down from 6.8 mph in 2017. On frequent routes, where buses are scheduled to arrive at least every 15 minutes, 1 in 9 buses arrived bunched, creating frustrating, unpredictable gaps in service. 

There’s nothing inevitable about falling bus ridership. Working together, New York City Transit and NYC DOT can deliver faster, more reliable service that will get New Yorkers back on the bus.

This year’s grades show some evidence of widespread improvement compared to 2017, though it may be imperceptible to most riders. In 2018, 30 fewer bus routes received a failing grade than the year before, due largely to reductions in bus bunching. On frequent bus routes, the rate of bunching declined from 14% to 11%. The MTA attributes these reliability gains to better dispatching practices that keep buses more evenly spaced.

And on a handful of high-ridership routes, bus priority improvements made tangible impacts:

@BrooklynBusThe only route in the city to receive an “A” was the Q52 Select Bus Service on Cross Bay Boulevard and Woodhaven Boulevard. The addition of bus lanes, all-door boarding, and consolidation of stops led to a 66% reduction in bus bunching compared to service on the Q52 in 2017. On the Q53 SBS, which uses the same bus lanes, bunching fell 45%.

On the B25, the extension of bus lane segments on Fulton Street led to a 25% reduction in bunching. 

@BrooklynBusOn the B82 SBS, speeds increased 15% and bunching fell 66% after the implementation of bus lanes and all-door boarding. The B82 Local also benefited from the new bus lanes, with a 36% reduction in bunching.

The impact of bus lanes, all-door boarding, stop consolidation, and signal priority on SBS routes is clear to see. Overall, SBS bus are faster than local routes (8.2 mph vs. 6.4

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4 minutes ago, Union Tpke said:

http://busturnaround.nyc/get_involved/half-of-all-nyc-bus-routes-get-a-d-for-speed-and-reliability/

New Yorkers are abandoning the bus in droves. Between 2009 and 2018, total bus ridership fell more than 17 percent, with a 4.7 percent decline in 2018 alone. Slow, unpredictable service is costing New Yorkers time with their families, making them late for work and appointments, and exacerbating the city’s gridlock as more people turn to road-clogging ride-hail services like Uber and Lyft.

According to the Bus Turnaround Coalition’s analysis of real-time MTA data, bus speeds for the average passenger were just 6.6 mph in 2018, down from 6.8 mph in 2017. On frequent routes, where buses are scheduled to arrive at least every 15 minutes, 1 in 9 buses arrived bunched, creating frustrating, unpredictable gaps in service. 

There’s nothing inevitable about falling bus ridership. Working together, New York City Transit and NYC DOT can deliver faster, more reliable service that will get New Yorkers back on the bus.

This year’s grades show some evidence of widespread improvement compared to 2017, though it may be imperceptible to most riders. In 2018, 30 fewer bus routes received a failing grade than the year before, due largely to reductions in bus bunching. On frequent bus routes, the rate of bunching declined from 14% to 11%. The MTA attributes these reliability gains to better dispatching practices that keep buses more evenly spaced.

And on a handful of high-ridership routes, bus priority improvements made tangible impacts:

@BrooklynBusThe only route in the city to receive an “A” was the Q52 Select Bus Service on Cross Bay Boulevard and Woodhaven Boulevard. The addition of bus lanes, all-door boarding, and consolidation of stops led to a 66% reduction in bus bunching compared to service on the Q52 in 2017. On the Q53 SBS, which uses the same bus lanes, bunching fell 45%.

On the B25, the extension of bus lane segments on Fulton Street led to a 25% reduction in bunching. 

@BrooklynBusOn the B82 SBS, speeds increased 15% and bunching fell 66% after the implementation of bus lanes and all-door boarding. The B82 Local also benefited from the new bus lanes, with a 36% reduction in bunching.

The impact of bus lanes, all-door boarding, stop consolidation, and signal priority on SBS routes is clear to see. Overall, SBS bus are faster than local routes (8.2 mph vs. 6.4

Their criteria are a bit flawed. Routes that have long non-stop segments such as the Bx29 and M35 benefit.

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1 hour ago, Union Tpke said:

http://busturnaround.nyc/get_involved/half-of-all-nyc-bus-routes-get-a-d-for-speed-and-reliability/

New Yorkers are abandoning the bus in droves. Between 2009 and 2018, total bus ridership fell more than 17 percent, with a 4.7 percent decline in 2018 alone. Slow, unpredictable service is costing New Yorkers time with their families, making them late for work and appointments, and exacerbating the city’s gridlock as more people turn to road-clogging ride-hail services like Uber and Lyft.

According to the Bus Turnaround Coalition’s analysis of real-time MTA data, bus speeds for the average passenger were just 6.6 mph in 2018, down from 6.8 mph in 2017. On frequent routes, where buses are scheduled to arrive at least every 15 minutes, 1 in 9 buses arrived bunched, creating frustrating, unpredictable gaps in service. 

There’s nothing inevitable about falling bus ridership. Working together, New York City Transit and NYC DOT can deliver faster, more reliable service that will get New Yorkers back on the bus.

This year’s grades show some evidence of widespread improvement compared to 2017, though it may be imperceptible to most riders. In 2018, 30 fewer bus routes received a failing grade than the year before, due largely to reductions in bus bunching. On frequent bus routes, the rate of bunching declined from 14% to 11%. The MTA attributes these reliability gains to better dispatching practices that keep buses more evenly spaced.

And on a handful of high-ridership routes, bus priority improvements made tangible impacts:

@BrooklynBusThe only route in the city to receive an “A” was the Q52 Select Bus Service on Cross Bay Boulevard and Woodhaven Boulevard. The addition of bus lanes, all-door boarding, and consolidation of stops led to a 66% reduction in bus bunching compared to service on the Q52 in 2017. On the Q53 SBS, which uses the same bus lanes, bunching fell 45%.

On the B25, the extension of bus lane segments on Fulton Street led to a 25% reduction in bunching. 

@BrooklynBusOn the B82 SBS, speeds increased 15% and bunching fell 66% after the implementation of bus lanes and all-door boarding. The B82 Local also benefited from the new bus lanes, with a 36% reduction in bunching.

The impact of bus lanes, all-door boarding, stop consolidation, and signal priority on SBS routes is clear to see. Overall, SBS bus are faster than local routes (8.2 mph vs. 6.4

You should be aware of anyone's motives when quoting statistics. The Bus Turnaround Coalition is in favor of SBS. Therefore, they will quote or manufacture statistics to make SBS look good. They claim there is a 66 percent reduction in Q52 bus bunching and a 45 percent reduction in Q53 bus bunching. Think about that for a while. How do you define bus bunching?  it is when buses are running in clumps rather than individually. A very high percentage of riders along those routes can take either route. I would estimate the as many as 80 percent of riders would not care if a Q52 or a Q53 came first because either bus would do. So wouldn't measuring bus bunching on both routes combined make more sense than measuring bunching individually?  Consider that for 20 out of 24 hours day, buses on each route operate only every 20 or 30 minutes.  By using bunching statistics for each route individually, it is grossly under estimated. Lets say between 12 and 2 PM, if buses are scheduled for every 15 minutes; buses arriving as follows: Noon - Q52; 12:02 - Q53; 12:15  - Q52; 12:16 - Q53; 12:31 - Q52; 12:31 - Q53; 1 PM - Q52; 1:03  - Q53; 1:14 - Q53; 1:15 Q52, etc. Under that scenario, while some buses may be considered late depending on how lateness would be defined, none of the buses would be considered as bunched because two buses with the same route number arrived together. But from a passenger's viewpoint who could use either route, all of them were bunched.

Similarly, many B82 riders going to the Brighton Line could also use the B7. What would you tell someone who just waited a half hour for a bus to the Brighton line and a B82 local, B82 SBS and B7 all arrived at the same time, that none of the buses bunched? Yet, that is what current methodology would say.

As for comparing local speeds to SBS speeds to show SBS success, that is also misleading. SBS has to be faster because they make fewer stops. The proper way to measure SBS success or failure would be to measure speeds with the Limiteds they replaced, not the locals.

As I said, you need to be aware of someone's motives when they use statistics.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, BrooklynBus said:

You should be aware of anyone's motives when quoting statistics. The Bus Turnaround Coalition is in favor of SBS. Therefore, they will quote or manufacture statistics to make SBS look good. They claim there is a 66 percent reduction in Q52 bus bunching and a 45 percent reduction in Q53 bus bunching. Think about that for a while. How do you define bus bunching?  it is when buses are running in clumps rather than individually. A very high percentage of riders along those routes can take either route. I would estimate the as many as 80 percent of riders would not care if a Q52 or a Q53 came first because either bus would do. So wouldn't measuring bus bunching on both routes combined make more sense than measuring bunching individually?  Consider that for 20 out of 24 hours day, buses on each route operate only every 20 or 30 minutes.  By using bunching statistics for each route individually, it is grossly under estimated. Lets say between 12 and 2 PM, if buses are scheduled for every 15 minutes; buses arriving as follows: Noon - Q52; 12:02 - Q53; 12:15  - Q52; 12:16 - Q53; 12:31 - Q52; 12:31 - Q53; 1 PM - Q52; 1:03  - Q53; 1:14 - Q53; 1:15 Q52, etc. Under that scenario, while some buses may be considered late depending on how lateness would be defined, none of the buses would be considered as bunched because two buses with the same route number arrived together. But from a passenger's viewpoint who could use either route, all of them were bunched.

The Q53 runs on at most 12 minute headways from morning to about 9/10 PM every day.

Edited by BM5 via Woodhaven
Changed to 'at most'

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1 hour ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

The Q53 runs on at most 12 minute headways from morning to about 9/10 PM every day.

I didn't check the schedule but the principles I stated are still valid. Only the waits would not be so long unless there is serious bus bunching. 

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, BrooklynBus said:

As I said, you need to be aware of someone's motives when they use statistics.

...which is exactly why you've gotten as much flack as you have on these parts over the years.

 

Quote

.....This year’s grades show some evidence of widespread improvement compared to 2017, though it may be imperceptible to most riders. In 2018, 30 fewer bus routes received a failing grade than the year before, due largely to reductions in bus bunching. On frequent bus routes, the rate of bunching declined from 14% to 11%. The MTA attributes these reliability gains to better dispatching practices that keep buses more evenly spaced.

There's no maybe about it.... This (supposed) widespread improvement said grades are supposed to illustrate, are imperceptible to most riders because it is unrelatable to most riders.....

Honestly now, would you need to blurt out a repudiative statement like that if these improvements were so conspicuous......

Edited by B35 via Church

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3 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

...which is exactly why you've gotten as much flack as you have on these parts over the years.

So exactly what are you saying? That I have been lying with statistics I have used? Give me one example. I am now beginning to regret all the nice things I have said about you all these years.  

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, BrooklynBus said:

So exactly what are you saying? That I have been lying with statistics I have used? Give me one example. I am now beginning to regret all the nice things I have said about you all these years.  

While I do question your motives, my claim isn't that I believe you were lying with stats..... The way you're flying off the handle here though is indicative of someone with a guilty conscience.

In so many words, I'm saying your little words of advice about being aware of someone's motives when they use statistics, is practiced by others whenever they see a BrooklynBus post just as much....

So, whenever you're done regretting over there, give my regards to Andrew :lol:

 

Edited by B35 via Church

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4 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

My claim isn't that I believe you were lying with stats..... The way you're flying off the handle here though is indicative of someone with a guilty conscience.

In so many words, I'm saying your little words of advice about being aware of someone's motives when they use statistics, is practiced by others whenever they see a BrooklynBus post just as much....

So, whenever you're done regretting over there, give my regards to Andrew :lol:

 

I have no idea what you are talking about. First you virtually accuse me of lying with statistics when I warn others to beware of those who do lie. So when I ask you for proof you take a step back saying you are not accusing me of lying but of having having a guilty conscience about lying. I have never lied with statistics so I certainly have no guilty conscience about it. 

Anyone who might believe I do lie with statistic, has no basis to come to that conclusion, other than that they disagree with me so I must be lying about statistics. That is exactly what happened on Streetsblog and why I was banned there. The truth seemed so far fetched to them that they couldn't possibly believe what I claimed was true. 

But I will tell you who does lie and I have caught them at it. It is DOT. After they put in the exclusive bus lane on Woodhaven they issued a report showing that travel times for cars increased by 38 percent along a portion of the street. They showed this in terms of minutes. I pointed out to them that if you do the arithmetic, it calculates to 38 percent. They had no idea it was so bad. I also criticized them at the meeting for stating they had modeling data but included none of it in the report.

Guess what they done? They removed the pages showing a 38 percent increase in auto travel time and replaced it with modeling data showing predicted data. Then they backdated the report to claim the revised report was what was shown to the community. Luckily I took a snapshot of the page they replaced before it was removed after I pointed out to them what the percentage was when calculated.

As far as Andrew, I haven't been in contact with him for several years. I don't even know why you would mention him. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, BrooklynBus said:

First you virtually accuse me of lying with statistics when I warn others to beware of those who do lie. So when I ask you for proof you take a step back saying you are not accusing me of lying but of having having a guilty conscience about lying. I have never lied with statistics so I certainly have no guilty conscience about it. 

The fact is that there was no accusation, actual OR implied.... Pointing out the fact that you've caught flack on here over the years due to questionable motives, isn't saying you're outright lying about stats.... Your assumption was wrong & you need to get over it..... You asking me for "proof" of stats you supposedly lied about, would be me addressing a strawman - In case you don't quite get it, it's not up to me to prove something I've never claimed.... No rational person would expect someone to do that....

I'm all for a good argument, but question me on a belief I DO hold, not a false one that was concocted out of emotion... Please & thank you.

1 hour ago, BrooklynBus said:

Anyone who might believe I do lie with statistic, has no basis to come to that conclusion, other than that they disagree with me so I must be lying about statistics. That is exactly what happened on Streetsblog and why I was banned there. The truth seemed so far fetched to them that they couldn't possibly believe what I claimed was true. 

I'm not saying which party was right or wrong (don't particularly care, to be frank), but this part of your post more or less conveys my original retort to you in this thread.... There are two sides to every story..... Just as easy as it is for you to tell people to be aware of someone's motives when they use stats, they can (and, have) adopted that same ideology when it comes to your agenda.....

....and please don't tell me you don't have an agenda, because all of us that are rather vocal on here do.

1 hour ago, BrooklynBus said:

But I will tell you who does lie and I have caught them at it. It is DOT. After they put in the exclusive bus lane on Woodhaven they issued a report showing that travel times for cars increased by 38 percent along a portion of the street. They showed this in terms of minutes. I pointed out to them that if you do the arithmetic, it calculates to 38 percent. They had no idea it was so bad. I also criticized them at the meeting for stating they had modeling data but included none of it in the report.

Guess what they done? They removed the pages showing a 38 percent increase in auto travel time and replaced it with modeling data showing predicted data. Then they backdated the report to claim the revised report was what was shown to the community. Luckily I took a snapshot of the page they replaced before it was removed after I pointed out to them what the percentage was when calculated.

Somewhat reminiscent of when the DOT outright lied about the completion date of the Church av renovation project (or whatever it was dubbed) some odd years ago..... Not the projected finish date, an actual finish date...... At the time, (according to a family friend) that was brought up in one of the CB meetings (when some were still pissed about EB B35's running via NY av > Linden > Flatbush > Church).....

More recently, how about the apparent lie the DOT fed to FEMA regarding damaged DOT vehicles during Sandy.... Now the city's gotta payback some 5 million dollars..... You get what you get with these crooks.....

You're preaching to the choir as far as that's concerned.....

1 hour ago, BrooklynBus said:

As far as Andrew, I haven't been in contact with him for several years. I don't even know why you would mention him. 

He was one of your main detractors online.

Edited by B35 via Church

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31 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

The fact is that there was no accusation, actual OR implied.... Pointing out the fact that you've caught flack on here over the years due to questionable motives, isn't saying you're outright lying about stats.... Your assumption was wrong & you need to get over it..... You asking me for "proof" of stats you supposedly lied about, would be me addressing a strawman - In case you don't quite get it, it's not up to me to prove something I've never claimed.... No rational person would expect someone to do that....

I'm all for a good argument, but question me on a belief I DO hold, not a false one that was concocted out of emotion... Please & thank you.

I'm not saying which party was right or wrong (don't particularly care, to be frank), but this part of your post more or less conveys my original retort to you in this thread.... There are two sides to every story..... Just as easy as it is for you to tell people to be aware of someone's motives when they use stats, they can (and, have) adopted that same ideology when it comes to your agenda.....

....and please don't tell me you don't have an agenda, because all of us that are rather vocal on here do.

Somewhat reminiscent of when the DOT outright lied about the completion date of the Church av renovation project (or whatever it was dubbed) some odd years ago..... Not the projected finish date, an actual finish date...... At the time, (according to a family friend) that was brought up in one of the CB meetings (when some were still pissed about EB B35's running via NY av > Linden > Flatbush > Church).....

More recently, how about the apparent lie the DOT fed to FEMA regarding damaged DOT vehicles during Sandy.... Now the city's gotta payback some 5 million dollars..... You get what you get with these crooks.....

You're preaching to the choir as far as that's concerned.....

He was one of your main detractors online.

Well it sure sounded like an accusation to me. 

I know I’ve caught flack here and I don’t need you or anyone else to point that out. There is no reason for anyone to question my motives since I have never lied with statistics, distorted them, or omitted relevant statistics that I knew about. I have always been clear what my motives or agenda is. 

Yes I know he was one of my detractors, but since I have nothing to regret regarding anything I have said here, there was no reason to bring up his name. 

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25 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

Well it sure sounded like an accusation to me. 

I know I’ve caught flack here and I don’t need you or anyone else to point that out. There is no reason for anyone to question my motives since I have never lied with statistics, distorted them, or omitted relevant statistics that I knew about. I have always been clear what my motives or agenda is. 

BOOM.... goes the dynamite.

Someone that doesn't have anything to hide doesn't say things like that.... You aren't & haven't impressed anyone with this special little snowflake persona you're good for on these forums.... Your image on the internet is NOT squeaky clean & all of your detractors are not wrong either....

It's ironic to have you, of all people, come on here making a statement about being aware of someone's motives though :lol:

49 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

Yes I know he was one of my detractors, but since I have nothing to regret regarding anything I have said here, there was no reason to bring up his name. 

....then you got the answer to your inquiry of "I don't even know why you would mention him."

Simple concept, really.

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
On 3/6/2019 at 4:54 PM, BrooklynBus said:

How do you define bus bunching?  it is when buses are running in clumps rather than individually.

the definition of bunching as I've had it explained to me (by General Superintendents and multiple SLD's) over the years is when multiple buses show up at the same time, all being behind schedule. now, on a line like the old B46-Limited and the current 46SBS,"bunching" by definition is not when 2 buses show up at the same time on time. by definition, on time is when a bus shows up exactly at the allotted departure time on their paddle, 3 minutes prior to the paddle departure time or 3 minutes after the paddle departure time. now the technical definition of on time has and still varies, but the general consensus is the 3 minute rule. when I began in 2009, the rule was 5 minutes in TA Brooklyn. when i worked in MaBSTOA depots, i was instructed that 3 minutes was their grace period. now 3 minutes apparently is the systemwide rule. 

Edited by EastFlatbushLarry
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2 hours ago, EastFlatbushLarry said:

the definition of bunching as I've had it explained to me (by General Superintendents and multiple SLD's) over the years is when multiple buses show up at the same time, all being behind schedule. now, on a line like the old B46-Limited and the current 46SBS,"bunching" by definition is not when 2 buses show up at the same time on time. by definition, on time is when a bus shows up exactly at the allotted departure time on their paddle, 3 minutes prior to the paddle departure time or 3 minutes after the paddle departure time. now the technical definition of on time has and still varies, but the general consensus is the 3 minute rule. when I began in 2009, the rule was 5 minutes in TA Brooklyn. when i worked in MaBSTOA depots, i was instructed that 3 minutes was their grace period. now 3 minutes apparently is the system wide rule. 

On some low headway route, I don't start thinking bunching until I see something like 4 or more..... When you grow up seeing 2-3 B35's shadowing each other, it's not exactly something out of the ordinary..... Now if (erm, when) I start seeing Q76's OTOH, one right behind the other, almost like clockwork every afternoon, making the turn off Francis Lewis at Hillside, I start getting miffed.... See, I detest bunching on high headway routes (even if I end up benefiting from it).... With the Q76 though, you should hear me in my car, the mini rants I go on.... Lol.

As for the definition of on time, well as a passenger, the concept of *something* being 3 mins, 5 mins, etc. behind schedule still being on time (logically speaking), is alien to me..... With as timely as buses nowadays aren't, I'm surprised the threshold wasn't raised higher (to 7 mins. or so) instead of lower....

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2 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

the concept of *something* being 3 mins, 5 mins, etc. behind schedule still being on time (logically speaking), is alien to me...

when you work for transit, one (should) learn rather quickly that (conventional) logic doesn't exist here, nor has it ever. "transit logic", as my family members call it, can be a daunting thing to comprehend... impossible even. as i said, "transit logic" regarding on time is 3 minutes hot, 3 minutes down or exactly at the scheduled departure time on one's paddle report. 

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2 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Now if (erm, when) I start seeing Q76's OTOH, one right behind the other, almost like clockwork every afternoon, making the turn off Francis Lewis at Hillside, I start getting miffed.... See, I detest bunching on high headway route

Now if (erm, when) you see these 76's nose to ass so to speak, those runs should by transit definition be marked late, seeing as there's no logical way to think one of those buses are on time... and even if one of them was, it'd be the last bus of the bunch (usually the slowest bus of the pack is the one killing lights, hanging back and letting the other operators do their jobs) with this being the case, bunching (which by definition is a negative action, no matter the bus line) cannot include 1 bus that's actually on time, be it 3 minutes to the good or 3 minutes down. I already understand that most people will not subscribe to this theory, nor will they take the time to consider one of the pack might actually be on time... nor should they. i would never look to silence people's frustration. it's just a slight difference of interpretation.

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This is a bit shocking. The Q35 is 78% reliable according to Busturnaround. Now, even with the construction on the Marine Parkway Bridge and Cross Bay Bridges. The Q35 still manages to be on time. Same goes with the Q52 with the A grading. (I guess some progress is made with some of the Queens Divisions and the rest of the City is failing) 

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32 minutes ago, Future ENY OP said:

This is a bit shocking. The Q35 is 78% reliable according to Busturnaround. Now, even with the construction on the Marine Parkway Bridge and Cross Bay Bridges. The Q35 still manages to be on time. Same goes with the Q52 with the A grading. (I guess some progress is made with some of the Queens Divisions and the rest of the City is failing) 

 

When you consider that the Q35 doesn't really have a long route and traffic is usually around the mall, it's not a shock that it's reliable. 

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1 hour ago, Jdog14 said:

 

When you consider that the Q35 doesn't really have a long route and traffic is usually around the mall, it's not a shock that it's reliable. 

That is true for the 35.

Meanwhile the Q22 I believe got a failing grade. All these service cuts on the Rockaways meant to save money are actually hurting. 

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18 hours ago, EastFlatbushLarry said:

Now if (erm, when) you see these 76's nose to ass so to speak, those runs should by transit definition be marked late, seeing as there's no logical way to think one of those buses are on time... and even if one of them was, it'd be the last bus of the bunch (usually the slowest bus of the pack is the one killing lights, hanging back and letting the other operators do their jobs) with this being the case, bunching (which by definition is a negative action, no matter the bus line) cannot include 1 bus that's actually on time, be it 3 minutes to the good or 3 minutes down. I already understand that most people will not subscribe to this theory, nor will they take the time to consider one of the pack might actually be on time... nor should they. i would never look to silence people's frustration. it's just a slight difference of interpretation.

Could be a school tripper scheduled closely in front of/behind a regular trip

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Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

Could be a school tripper scheduled closely in front of/behind a regular trip

In the morning Q76 buses run every 4-5 minutes for a period (NB) . However, in both directions, they run roughly every 10 minutes.

Edited by BM5 via Woodhaven

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On ‎3‎/‎8‎/‎2019 at 1:34 AM, EastFlatbushLarry said:

Now if (erm, when) you see these 76's nose to ass so to speak, those runs should by transit definition be marked late, seeing as there's no logical way to think one of those buses are on time... and even if one of them was, it'd be the last bus of the bunch (usually the slowest bus of the pack is the one killing lights, hanging back and letting the other operators do their jobs) with this being the case, bunching (which by definition is a negative action, no matter the bus line) cannot include 1 bus that's actually on time, be it 3 minutes to the good or 3 minutes down. I already understand that most people will not subscribe to this theory, nor will they take the time to consider one of the pack might actually be on time... nor should they. i would never look to silence people's frustration. it's just a slight difference of interpretation.

What I find is that riders tend to judge lateness by how long they've been waiting - completely separate from even looking at/or knowing, some route's schedule.....

An example of what I'm talking about is, If a bus got to some stop at 8:10 prior & the next one is set to arrive at 8:30, some passenger got to that stop at 8:14 (missing the 8:10), the next arriving bus actually gets to the stop at 8:30, you will have people that'll claim that 8:30 bus in this little scenario is late, for no other reason than having to wait that 16 minutes....

On low headway routes (like the B35), forget it....  If someone's waiting for more than 3-4 minutes, you'd think the sky was about to fall.....

21 hours ago, Future ENY OP said:

This is a bit shocking. The Q35 is 78% reliable according to Bus turnaround. Now, even with the construction on the Marine Parkway Bridge and Cross Bay Bridges. The Q35 still manages to be on time. Same goes with the Q52 with the A grading. (I guess some progress is made with some of the Queens Divisions and the rest of the City is failing) 

21 hours ago, Jdog14 said:

When you consider that the Q35 doesn't really have a long route and traffic is usually around the mall, it's not a shock that it's reliable. 

The Q35 is anything but timely or reliable.... Buses tend to leave B. 116th whenever they want & you may as well sit on your hands waiting for it on the Junction end..... F***ing irritating to see 2 buses powered off on the B. 116th end - with the next incoming bus alighting pax, then immediately picking up pax. for the return trip back to Brooklyn (as in, no layover)...

12 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

Could be a school tripper scheduled closely in front of/behind a regular trip

Can't be....

That 1 trip leaves Bayside H.S (towards Jamaica) around 3:45..... I get to Francis Lewis around 5:20 - 5:30.....

Even if I happen to catch that light, I'm almost always seeing the Q76 (Jamaica bound) in pairs around that time...

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Can't be....

That 1 trip leaves Bayside H.S (towards Jamaica) around 3:45..... I get to Francis Lewis around 5:20 - 5:30.....

Even if I happen to catch that light, I'm almost always seeing the Q76 (Jamaica bound) in pairs around that time...

At that time, Q76 buses to Jamaica are running every 12 minutes. I guess I'm not surprised by it, given that the Q38 around my area runs on those headways during the rush, and also bunches (sometimes in two, sometimes in three), so I'm used to that. Shouldn't happen either way. Chance are that buses on their previous trip are inundated by school kids (since they would be making those trips right around the time that schools let out).

Edited by BM5 via Woodhaven

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On 3/9/2019 at 11:14 AM, B35 via Church said:

Can't be....

That 1 trip leaves Bayside H.S (towards Jamaica) around 3:45..... I get to Francis Lewis around 5:20 - 5:30.....

Even if I happen to catch that light, I'm almost always seeing the Q76 (Jamaica bound) in pairs around that time...

The Q76 seems like a more student-oriented route. I find it odd that it has that few trippers.

22 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

At that time, Q76 buses to Jamaica are running every 12 minutes. I guess I'm not surprised by it, given that the Q38 around my area runs on those headways during the rush, and also bunches (sometimes in two, sometimes in three), so I'm used to that. Shouldn't happen either way. Chance are that buses on their previous trip are inundated by school kids (since they would be making those trips right around the time that schools let out).

Seems a little late for schoolkids. Could also be a rookie operator operating a little slower than a typical Q76 operator and so the same follower always catches the leader.

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Posted (edited)
On 3/9/2019 at 1:30 PM, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

At that time, Q76 buses to Jamaica are running every 12 minutes. I guess I'm not surprised by it, given that the Q38 around my area runs on those headways during the rush, and also bunches (sometimes in two, sometimes in three), so I'm used to that. Shouldn't happen either way. Chance are that buses on their previous trip are inundated by school kids (since they would be making those trips right around the time that schools let out).

Most of the Q76 route is wide open... No real chokepoint to speak of b/w 20th av & Hillside av (not inclusive)..... You can't say the same thing for the Q38, which operates on rather narrow streets & serves a couple major destinations.... Even if they have the same (posted) headways around that time of day, there's no comparison..... The way I see it, there's less of an excuse for the Q76 to consistently bunch over the Q38.... If what I'm describing was a one time thing, it would be whatever.... However, this is a pattern I'm noticing....

1 hour ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

The Q76 seems like a more student-oriented route. I find it odd that it has that few trippers.

It has another tripper out of St. Francis Prep, but that's a bus I'd never see, because that runs up towards Parsons/14th (instead of down towards Jamaica).....

If you're talking about more trippers out of Bayside H.S. specifically, well you have to consider the Q31 as well......

Edited by B35 via Church

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