Update on Plan to move Q60 stops to the Median

[B35 via Church]

On ‎10‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 12:44 PM, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

Personally, I'd do a Q60 Local/Limited Split Service starting from Sutphin/Archer, down to QBP. Local Buses Terminal at/or near the QBP area while Limited's continue to 2nd Avenue. 

Q101 Service in My opinion, should bypass QBP and head straight for Hunters Point.  

Not remotely enough space around Sutphin/Archer to terminate every Q60 trip (locals + LTDs)..... That's the problem.

19 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

The Q32 has decent usage going towards Queens, but I always noticed Manhattan travel is weak especially on 5th Ave. 

I wonder if having it travel along 59th street would make it more useful to Columbus Circle. It could be a decent alternative to the . 

You think an issue is that the Q32 doesn't go far enough west?

I mean, IDK, I would try my hand at taking the thing specifically off 5th/Madison (and away from Penn) & have it serve 3rd/Lex instead... Keep it as an east side route (although I haven't really solidified where it'd terminate)....

18 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

....BTW are you suggesting combining the B32 with the Q69?

(And if so what are you suggesting for the Q100? I know in the past you mentioned restructuring it into a regular Q69 limited or something to that effect)

Nah, I wouldn't run the 21st st. LTD towards Astoria Heights, I'd end it over there by the Terrace Gardens/Marine Terrace apts.... It would basically be a straight shot up/down 21st in Queens; no diversions of any sort....

...and the Q100 would simply be a local (via current routing).

13 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

Just improve Q6 service. Out of all the JFK routes, I think the Q6 is still one of the most unreliable. I always see large gaps in service, buses bunch up and buses that are missing. The reason why the Q60 gets the usage it does on Sutphin is because the Q6 can be terrible. Other times Q60 buses are near empty along that stretch. 

Q7 & Q41 are significantly worse in that category; I don't think the Q6 is that unreliable, tbh.... What I will say is that the Q6, with all the usage it gets, to me, is somehow one of the more underrated/underserved routes in the whole borough.... Doesn't make sense... Q40 & Q60 doesn't do nearly enough to help that route out (I'm quite sure is the thought process, let the MTA tell it)..... Too much territory south of 109th....

[NY1635]

15 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

Just improve Q6 service. Out of all the JFK routes, I think the Q6 is still one of the most unreliable. I always see large gaps in service, buses bunch up and buses that are missing. The reason why the Q60 gets the usage it does on Sutphin is because the Q6 can be terrible. Other times Q60 buses are near empty along that stretch. 

The useless route out of JFK is the Q3. The Q10 and B15s do all the work in the airport while the lone Q3 is taking it's time. Going thru Rockaway and Sutphin is the fastest way to get into Jamaica without dealing with traffic. 

As for the Q6, it's only doing the work that the Q40, Q60, and Q8 can't be bothered to do around Sutphinl. The Q6 and n6 are the only things I still see getting decent crowds at 165th Street at night.

Edited October 10, 2019 by NY1635

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

1 hour ago, NY1635 said:

The useless route out of JFK is the Q3. The Q10 and B15s do all the work in the airport while the lone Q3 is taking it's time. Going thru Rockaway and Sutphin is the fastest way to get into Jamaica without dealing with traffic. 

As for the Q6, it's only doing the work that the Q40, Q60, and Q8 can't be bothered to do around Sutphinl. The Q6 and n6 are the only things I still see getting decent crowds at 165th Street at night.

He's talking about JFK depot, not routes that go to JFK airport (which is why the Q60 and the other routes are in this discussion as well). The Q3 isn't "useless" either, as airport employees do use that route (overnight service frequencies were recently improved over the summer as well). 

Also, the Q8, Q40, and Q60 can't be serving all the areas around Sutphin when they all have other purposes. 

[B35 via Church]

1 hour ago, NY1635 said:

As for the Q6, it's only doing the work that the Q40, Q60, and Q8 can't be bothered to do around Sutphinl.

This premise is just plain false.

[aemoreira81]

On 10/8/2019 at 9:38 PM, NY1635 said:

The MTA should extend those B32 trips to Astoria along Vernon Blvd. It can avoid the dreaded Queens Plaza and get there in time. 

Not to fond of sending anything along Sunnyside unless it's a thru route. It's an industrial area, but not as insidious as Industrial Maspeth.

.You probably have to go to Queens Plaza at some point though. I would ask if it might be better to have it run via Vernon Boulevard to 44 Drive, and then cut across to then take over the Q101 Steinway...which would likely require turning the route over to MTA Bus, but could also mean that the Q103 is no longer needed in any way, shape, or form.

[checkmatechamp13]

1 hour ago, aemoreira81 said:

.You probably have to go to Queens Plaza at some point though. I would ask if it might be better to have it run via Vernon Boulevard to 44 Drive, and then cut across to then take over the Q101 Steinway...which would likely require turning the route over to MTA Bus, but could also mean that the Q103 is no longer needed in any way, shape, or form.

The busier part of the Q103 is north of the not south of the Queensboro Bridge

[NewFlyer 230]

9 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Not remotely enough space around Sutphin/Archer to terminate every Q60 trip (locals + LTDs)..... That's the problem.

You think an issue is that the Q32 doesn't go far enough west?

I mean, IDK, I would try my hand at taking the thing specifically off 5th/Madison (and away from Penn) & have it serve 3rd/Lex instead... Keep it as an east side route (although I haven't really solidified where it'd terminate)....

Nah, I wouldn't run the 21st st. LTD towards Astoria Heights, I'd end it over there by the Terrace Gardens/Marine Terrace apts.... It would basically be a straight shot up/down 21st in Queens; no diversions of any sort....

...and the Q100 would simply be a local (via current routing).

Q7 & Q41 are significantly worse in that category; I don't think the Q6 is that unreliable, tbh.... What I will say is that the Q6, with all the usage it gets, to me, is somehow one of the more underrated/underserved routes in the whole borough.... Doesn't make sense... Q40 & Q60 doesn't do nearly enough to help that route out (I'm quite sure is the thought process, let the MTA tell it)..... Too much territory south of 109th....

I don’t even know if the Q32 would garner more usage being on 3rd/Lex Ave. I honestly see ridership being more or less the same. I think the north and south avenues on the Eastside are over saturated with bus routes minus 1st and 2nd Aves and York Ave if we are including streets north of 57th street. Q32 in its current state simply seems like another route thrown into the mix that also happens to run into Queens. I think partially what hurts Manhattan usage is the route in Queens. I think it parallels the  too much and it’s has no unique routing of its own. Yeah I know it runs alone north bound on 81st but the Q33 is available on 83rd which isn’t too far. I’m fine with the Q32 running to 34th street and 5th Ave, I think it’s Queens routing needs to be modified to make it more useful, rather than being a route that people take if the subway is messed up or them being too lazy to walk to the subway.  
 

 

I honestly forgot all about the Q41, I barely take it nowadays, but yeah I can agree that the Q41 can be annoying. There were times where I took the Q8 instead and walked south from 101st street all the way down to 109th. I never really saw the Q7 being that bad these days but I know back under Green Lines, forget about it. All of Green Lines routes were bad minus maybe the Q10. The Q6 I will agree with you is underrated and definitely overlooked. The Q6 should have been the one to get artics, not the Q12. I’ve never seen the MTA force artics so hard on a route as they did with the Q12. The Q40 and Q60 does not do anything to help the Q6. I saw ads the MTA had on the buses talking about increased service on the Q6. To me it seems like service still runs the same. However I’m not 100% sure because I’m not usually around Sutphin south of Archer Ave. 

[checkmatechamp13]

11 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I honestly forgot all about the Q41, I barely take it nowadays, but yeah I can agree that the Q41 can be annoying. There were times where I took the Q8 instead and walked south from 101st street all the way down to 109th. I never really saw the Q7 being that bad these days but I know back under Green Lines, forget about it. All of Green Lines routes were bad minus maybe the Q10. The Q6 I will agree with you is underrated and definitely overlooked. The Q6 should have been the one to get artics, not the Q12. I’ve never seen the MTA force artics so hard on a route as they did with the Q12. The Q40 and Q60 does not do anything to help the Q6. I saw ads the MTA had on the buses talking about increased service on the Q6. To me it seems like service still runs the same. However I’m not 100% sure because I’m not usually around Sutphin south of Archer Ave. 

The frequency was increased (I believe in either January 2019 or September 2018)

[B35 via Church]

8 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I don’t even know if the Q32 would garner more usage being on 3rd/Lex Ave. I honestly see ridership being more or less the same. I think the north and south avenues on the Eastside are over saturated with bus routes minus 1st and 2nd Aves and York Ave if we are including streets north of 57th street. Q32 in its current state simply seems like another route thrown into the mix that also happens to run into Queens. I think partially what hurts Manhattan usage is the route in Queens. I think it parallels the  too much and it’s has no unique routing of its own. Yeah I know it runs alone north bound on 81st but the Q33 is available on 83rd which isn’t too far. I’m fine with the Q32 running to 34th street and 5th Ave, I think it’s Queens routing needs to be modified to make it more useful, rather than being a route that people take if the subway is messed up or them being too lazy to walk to the subway.  

The thing is, Roosevelt avenue, aside from any lack of uniqueness with the Q32 routing altogether in Queens, or the fact that the Q32 runs along too much of the  in Queens, still needs basic surface transit coverage....

9 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I honestly forgot all about the Q41, I barely take it nowadays, but yeah I can agree that the Q41 can be annoying. There were times where I took the Q8 instead and walked south from 101st street all the way down to 109th. I never really saw the Q7 being that bad these days but I know back under Green Lines, forget about it. All of Green Lines routes were bad minus maybe the Q10. The Q6 I will agree with you is underrated and definitely overlooked. The Q6 should have been the one to get artics, not the Q12. I’ve never seen the MTA force artics so hard on a route as they did with the Q12. The Q40 and Q60 does not do anything to help the Q6. I saw ads the MTA had on the buses talking about increased service on the Q6. To me it seems like service still runs the same. However I’m not 100% sure because I’m not usually around Sutphin south of Archer Ave. 

Well hell, compared to the Q12, of course the Q6 could use the extra capacity more... The Q12 has more help along Northern than the Q6 does along Sutphin.... On top of it, the patronage of the unique portion (speaking of which) of the Q12 (as in, east of Bell) is hardly comparable to that of the unique portion of the Q6 (as in, south of 108th/109th)....

As for the Q6 increase, I thought it was only supposed to happen during off peak hours.... It's also needed during peak hours.

12 hours ago, aemoreira81 said:

You probably have to go to Queens Plaza at some point though.....

And why is that?

Take a good look at bus usage at & around QBP on all the routes that serve it & you'll find that it doesn't remotely warrant the total amount of BPH divvied up into however many total routes that traverses it..... Extracting the Hunters Point portion of the Q103 & having that cut through QBP to run up Steinway, would serve much of no one justice - Not Steinway (av) riders, nor Hunters Point patrons..... Checkmate is right, the lion's share of Q103 riders taking buses to Vernon-Jackson  are emanating from areas well north of the bridge.... Hunters Point patrons are either getting shuttled (private shuttle bus), or biking, or simply walking to Vernon-Jackson; very few of them resort to taking Q103's now....

I have much less of a problem having Q101's running down 39th for 40th st , than having it put up with the bullshit it has to, to get to QBP..... The course the Q32 & the Q60 has to take to get to Queens Plaza north, is infinitely worse.... Total PITA all around... I would rather have the Q101 continue along Jackson to get to Hunters Point (if I even wanted the Q101 to run to Hunters Point) over having it cut through QBP.....

I'll be your huckleberry - Queens Plaza is ridiculously overrated.... I would take a few routes away from there.