Select Bus Service Discussion Thread

[Via Garibaldi 8]

10 hours ago, danielhg121 said:

I thought most of the stops on Staten Island had a few passengers at most waiting unless it's a major terminal or transfer point. They can't possibly farebeat at St. George Term. and are we describing farebeating as people who board through the back and/or people who board thru the front and ask the bus op for a ride? 

They most certainly will farebeat at the Terminal. We once had someone on the S48 get on, and the refused to move. Some passengers got pissed, and wrestled with the guy until they threw him off of the bus. What never made sense to me was the sense of entitlement among the people that did it. It happened on various local lines, but some were worse than others. Staten Island's farebeating is right up there with some of the local bus lines in the Bronx.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1 minute ago, XcelsiorBoii4888 said:

Staten Island fare beating is atrocious. Its bad to the point where more than 50% of the people on one trip will not pay. And farebeating by going through the back door? Please thats “so 2005”. They will literally walk right pass the bus driver as if its a subway shuttle or SBS route. I’m sorry are there hidden SBS routes on the island? Because paying onboard isn’t really a thing anymore. Every route will have more than 50% of the riders on one trip NOT PAY, except the S79 (just about 30% won’t pay). But after 10pm, I would say only around 10% of the riders on the island will fully pay their fare. Any Staten Island B/O can agree and I’m not exaggerating. Clearly the MTA doesn’t care because this has been going on for a long time. 

For the express, you’ll get a few here and there on weekends, especially the X10, but weekdays the express is good. 

Yes your assessments are spot on about the local and the express buses. The X10 gets it the most when it does happen, particularly the stops by Target Street. I think part of the entitlement may be due to how difficult it is to get a Metrocard. If you don't reload in the city, the stores usually run out fast, so getting one can be a PITA.

[DetSMART45]

Glad we don't have these farebeating problems.  Even back when DDOT service in Detroit was cut to bare-bones levels, customers STILL paid fares, and I've NEVER seen anyone sneaking in the rear doors.  Guess this must be purely a NYC thing, and you can keep it.

DDOT bus operators just got basically an extra paycheck last year, purely from ensuring people were paying at the farebox, but also because they are actually adhering to the schedules.  Buses come on time, run on time = more people riding.

DDOT bus drivers share in more than $250K in bonuses

Maybe the MTA unions should take a page out of the Detroit book, and benefit not only their membership, but also the MTA since there's that on-going problem of a constant deficit.  Notice this was back in 2015, and service on the street has improved like you wouldn't believe:

Detroit Bus Driver Contract Offers Bonuses When Ridership Rises

[Orion6025]

10 hours ago, Brillant93 said:

I believe ENY said that the XD60s from Grand Avenue are probably going to ENY depot after the M train reconstruction is completed. That is about 12 buses but to me that won’t be enough for the route. So it’s possbile those XD60s at Quill are going to be sent to ENY almong with the ones from Grand Avenue. 

I'd throw in a few of the Gun Hill buses too. 19 may still not be enough? With the potential to get to 30 with the GH units, there's probably hope.

Edited January 27, 2018 by Orion6025

[Brillant93]

15 minutes ago, Orion6025 said:

I'd throw in a few of the Gun Hill buses too. 19 may still not be enough? With the potential to get to 30 with the GH units, there's probably hope.

We’re just going to have to wait to see what is going to  happen. As EastNewYork says everything is subject to change. 

[checkmatechamp13]

@GreatOne2k

Quote

SBS would restore weekend rapid service to 3 Av and would replace the weekend Bx55 LTD service. 

To the 3rd Avenue corridor specifically, but at the same time, the MTA probably considers the Central Bronx corridor to have rapid weekend service due to the presence of the Bx41 a few blocks over (where the former limited only ran rush hours)

@Cait Sith

Quote

Staten Island's farebeating rate is much higher than most people think, hence the need for undercover cops on local buses.

I think he's saying it in the sense that Staten Island has relatively little crime otherwise, so they can afford to put undercover cops on the buses.

@danielhg121

Quote

I thought most of the stops on Staten Island had a few passengers at most waiting unless it's a major terminal or transfer point. They can't possibly farebeat at St. George Term. and are we describing farebeating as people who board through the back and/or people who board thru the front and ask the bus op for a ride? 

Definitely those boarding through the front.

 @XcelsiorBoii4888

Quote

 

Staten Island fare beating is atrocious. Its bad to the point where more than 50% of the people on one trip will not pay. And farebeating by going through the back door? Please thats “so 2005”. They will literally walk right pass the bus driver as if its a subway shuttle or SBS route. I’m sorry are there hidden SBS routes on the island? Because paying onboard isn’t really a thing anymore. Every route will have more than 50% of the riders on one trip NOT PAY, except the S79 (just about 30% won’t pay). But after 10pm, I would say only around 10% of the riders on the island will fully pay their fare. Any Staten Island B/O can agree and I’m not exaggerating. Clearly the MTA doesn’t care because this has been going on for a long time. 

For the express, you’ll get a few here and there on weekends, especially the X10, but weekdays the express is good. 

 

7

No, you are. Unless you're talking school trippers, the percentages aren't that high, and I ride the buses just as much as you.

@Via Garibaldi 8

Quote

They most certainly will farebeat at the Terminal. We once had someone on the S48 get on, and the refused to move. Some passengers got pissed, and wrestled with the guy until they threw him off of the bus. What never made sense to me was the sense of entitlement among the people that did it. It happened on various local lines, but some were worse than others. Staten Island's farebeating is right up there with some of the local bus lines in the Bronx.

I think he was under the impression that most farebeating out here was through the back door. It's not physically possible to enter through the back door at a terminal unless the B/O decides to unlock the back door for whatever reason.

[IAlam]

SBS enforcement is like little to none and it's only going to get worse with more SBS lines being introduced. The chances of getting checked on a weekend, holiday, or after 9 pm is incredibly low. Personally, I haven't been checked in over a year and I rides SBS buses all over the city and in many times over the subway. To make things worse since the eagle teams aren't checking local routes, as soon as word gets out they are conducting an inspection, people will fare beat on the local instead of the SBS.

[East New York]

I'm pretty sure the buses for EN could come from anywhere at this point. Quill, GA, and GH all have buses that aren't theirs, along with JK, and LG. Those are all temporary assignments, so EN could get enough for the B82 SBS and possibly some B15 runs. There should be more than enough once all the Option buses, Bus Company buses, and XN60's come in. So the assignments will likely change since Quill is slated to get 77 LFSA's instead of 15. That leaves just enough to rid GH of the ones they have, however, GH could get some of the options as well as KB, possibly bumping the 4700's EN as that was on the table for sometime. 

Only thing we can do is wait and see at this time because things are changing daily and sometimes hourly. 

[Brillant93]

8 hours ago, East New York said:

I'm pretty sure the buses for EN could come from anywhere at this point. Quill, GA, and GH all have buses that aren't theirs, along with JK, and LG. Those are all temporary assignments, so EN could get enough for the B82 SBS and possibly some B15 runs. There should be more than enough once all the Option buses, Bus Company buses, and XN60's come in. So the assignments will likely change since Quill is slated to get 77 LFSA's instead of 15. That leaves just enough to rid GH of the ones they have, however, GH could get some of the options as well as KB, possibly bumping the 4700's EN as that was on the table for sometime. 

Only thing we can do is wait and see at this time because things are changing daily and sometimes hourly. 

I started saying everything is subjected to change lol. 

But on another note I rode the B44 sbs and the buses now have WiFi on it. So are all sbs units supposed to have WiFi now? 

[Future ENY OP]

6 hours ago, East New York said:

I'm pretty sure the buses for EN could come from anywhere at this point. Quill, GA, and GH all have buses that aren't theirs, along with JK, and LG. Those are all temporary assignments, so EN could get enough for the B82 SBS and possibly some B15 runs. There should be more than enough once all the Option buses, Bus Company buses, and XN60's come in. So the assignments will likely change since Quill is slated to get 77 LFSA's instead of 15. That leaves just enough to rid GH of the ones they have, however, GH could get some of the options as well as KB, possibly bumping the 4700's EN as that was on the table for sometime. 

Only thing we can do is wait and see at this time because things are changing daily and sometimes hourly. 

They just started doing the framework for Flatlands Avenue SBS82+. Just read the CB5 proposal for the additional stop on Louisiana Avenue which wasn't even on the first proposal. 

Will East New York maintain control of the local B82 once everything is set in stone for the summer. Also, if there's a possibility that the 4700's do come to Brooklyn, will those be SBS+ or stay as local fleet? 

Quill's buses are coming in rapidly. Before you know it the first set of the LFSA delivery could be done as soon as May or June if they keep at the rate of things. 

10 minutes ago, Brillant93 said:

I started saying everything is subjected to change lol. 

But on another note I rode the B44 sbs and the buses now have WiFi on it. So are all sbs units supposed to have WiFi now? 

I'm thinking at some point all the SBS buses should have Wi-Fi. 

[MysteriousBtrain]

6 minutes ago, Future ENY OP said:

Will East New York maintain control of the local B82 once everything is set in stone for the summer. Also, if there's a possibility that the 4700's do come to Brooklyn, will those be SBS+ or stay as local fleet? 

4700's will always be locals because of their slow Hanover signs and because they are not Cuomo wrapped. But that doesn't mean one can't appear on an SBS route occasionally (like the Bx12 does)

[Future ENY OP]

2 hours ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

4700's will always be locals because of their slow Hanover signs and because they are not Cuomo wrapped. But that doesn't mean one can't appear on an SBS route occasionally (like the Bx12 does)

Copy copy.  I'm just saying with all these new buses coming in would it be best for all the boroughs that are getting SBS receive new equipment. It's only right. But of course, this is the MTA we are talking about and all is subject to change. 

[Jdog14]

8 hours ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

4700's will always be locals because of their slow Hanover signs and because they are not Cuomo wrapped. But that doesn't mean one can't appear on an SBS route occasionally (like the Bx12 does)

Not so fast. There's nothing preventing them from pulling a 4810 and retrofitting them with Multicolored hanovers. 

[Cait Sith]

On 1/29/2018 at 10:49 AM, MysteriousBtrain said:

4700's will always be locals because of their slow Hanover signs and because they are not Cuomo wrapped. But that doesn't mean one can't appear on an SBS route occasionally (like the Bx12 does)

That means nothing. If they can change the signs on the majority of the LFSAs that's currently on the SBS fleet, they can do the same with those XD60s.

Also, the long-standing rumor is that buses from 2011 and up are supposed to get the new look, so lets just wait and see. Also, they can just put a wrap similar to the one that's on the B46 SBS.

[MysteriousBtrain]

5 hours ago, Cait Sith said:

That means nothing. If they can change the signs on the majority of the LFSAs that's currently on the SBS fleet, they can do the same with those XD60s.

Also, the long-standing rumor is that buses from 2011 and up are supposed to get the new look, so lets just wait and see. Also, they can just put a wrap similar to the one that's on the B46 SBS.

Starting with the Bx6, SBS Stations began to be redesigned to include the cuomo look, and with the Q52/53 sporting the redesign as well, unless they overhaul the signs now and they begin to obtain the cuomo wrapping as well as the USBs over the next few months, the 4700's will not see SBS service regularly.

 

But again this is a rumor, so let's see what happens.

Edited January 31, 2018 by MysteriousBtrain
Restatement

[Brillant93]

16 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

Starting with the Bx6, SBS Stations began to be redesigned to include the cuomo look, and with the Q52/53 sporting the redesign as well, unless they overhaul the signs now and they begin to obtain the cuomo wrapping as well as the USBs over the next few months, the 4700's will not see SBS service regularly.

 

But again this is a rumor, so let's see what happens.

The XD60s are quite popular I see lol. But I agree though. Buses that are in the cuomo wrap, have WiFi, and have upgraded signs are going to be used for sbs. Sbs is a premium like service and for premium service you want your best updated buses for the job. Overhauling older buses would most likely cost too much. 

[Cait Sith]

1 hour ago, Brillant93 said:

The XD60s are quite popular I see lol. But I agree though. Buses that are in the cuomo wrap, have WiFi, and have upgraded signs are going to be used for sbs. Sbs is a premium like service and for premium service you want your best updated buses for the job. Overhauling older buses would most likely cost too much. 

It actually doesn't. Because it's not an overhaul. The wrapping and the sign changes are relatively cheap.

1 hour ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

Starting with the Bx6, SBS Stations began to be redesigned to include the cuomo look, and with the Q52/53 sporting the redesign as well, unless they overhaul the signs now and they begin to obtain the cuomo wrapping as well as the USBs over the next few months, the 4700's will not see SBS service regularly.

 

But again this is a rumor, so let's see what happens.

It's not a sign overhaul, they just replace them....

Those buses can be wrapped with the new scheme and fitted with WiFi & USB at the vendor. 5365-5374 got the wrap job done there and it didn't take them long to get it done either, so it's not COMPLETELY out of the realm of possibility....

Edited January 31, 2018 by Cait Sith

[Via Garibaldi 8]

7 hours ago, Brillant93 said:

The XD60s are quite popular I see lol. But I agree though. Buses that are in the cuomo wrap, have WiFi, and have upgraded signs are going to be used for sbs. Sbs is a premium like service and for premium service you want your best updated buses for the job. Overhauling older buses would most likely cost too much. 

It is? That's news to me. lol More like an overhyped limited stop bus. There are a few lines that truly have benefitted from the SBS designation. I find the M79 to be one of the most pleasurable lines to ride (generally speaking). It isn't as packed usually as the M86, less congestion throughout the route and less bunching (again compared to the M86). In terms of speed or quickness, that of course depends on the drivers, but the M79 drivers tend to wait as well, where as M86 drivers will wait for certain passengers. If you're not a female and you're a young male, chances are the bus won't wait.

Edited January 31, 2018 by Via Garibaldi 8

[Rafa]

So I was doing the sbs 52 this morning and this lady came on who I could see before picking her up was at the bus stop with other passengers right next to the fare machines that says over and over get ticket for sbs 52/53.  She got on and attempted to use a metro card so I looked at her saying to myself are u kidding me. I guess she saw the no fares collected on board and just walked in. I didn’t say a word because she just walked on in and didn’t say nothing to me. So pulled into a stop and u guess it the eagle team. Their getting ready to give her a ticket and she’s blaming me.  

[B35 via Church]

- Certain terms in this community I don't put much of any stock into.... "Exclusive" is one of them, "official" is one of 'em, and "overhaul" is another....

- The MTA advertises & showcases SBS as if it's a revolutionary, state-of-the-art service..... Those of us that are privy enough can see through the smoke & mirrors; it's a half-assed attempt at BRT..... Everything that's being done to make SBS "work", could have been done with LTD service..... I have not heard or read one person alluding to or proclaiming that LTD service was a premium service around the time of its inception - it was taken in (by the riding public) as a skip-stop local service & that's what it was originally put out there as being ..... There is nothing "premium" about SBS, it's a branding & not much more than that.....

[Via Garibaldi 8]

25 minutes ago, Rafa said:

So I was doing the sbs 52 this morning and this lady came on who I could see before picking her up was at the bus stop with other passengers right next to the fare machines that says over and over get ticket for sbs 52/53.  She got on and attempted to use a metro card so I looked at her saying to myself are u kidding me. I guess she saw the no fares collected on board and just walked in. I didn’t say a word because she just walked on in and didn’t say nothing to me. So pulled into a stop and u guess it the eagle team. Their getting ready to give her a ticket and she’s blaming me.  

Getting ready to?  Ticket her! I hate stupid oblivious people.  The signs are everywhere, in English and even in Spanish at some stops and other languages.  There's really no excuse.  

 

24 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

- Certain terms in this community I don't put much of any stock into.... "Exclusive" is one of them, "official" is one of 'em, and "overhaul" is another....

- The MTA advertises & showcases SBS as if it's a revolutionary, state-of-the-art service..... Those of us that are privy enough can see through the smoke & mirrors; it's a half-assed attempt at BRT..... Everything that's being done to make SBS "work", could have been done with LTD service..... I have not heard or read one person alluding to or proclaiming that LTD service was a premium service around the time of its inception - it was taken in (by the riding public) as a skip-stop local service & that's what it was originally put out there as being ..... There is nothing "premium" about SBS, it's a branding & not much more than that.....

Agreed.  There's a part of me that believes that the main reason that the  has worked to market and brand SBS is to cut their own costs.  They still get federal funding for the new buses (something they don't mention). I mean really those buses get run into the ground and what do they do with them? They unwrap them and throw them onto the local lines. I doubt they even rehab them (as in cleaning them up and ensuring that they run smoothly), so that's what the rest of the riding public gets.  Talk about an insult.  And before anyone says anything, I've seen how those old SBS buses look when they're removed from SBS service... They look so beat up and old.  They should be required to rehab those buses inside and out before putting those hand-me-downs on the other lines. Everyone is paying $2.75 for that service, and they all should be getting nice "shiny" buses that they advertise for SBS. If I was someone that didn't ride SBS lines, I'd say to myself what's so special about SBS that they get the new shiny buses but other lines get the hand-me-down buses?  

Now they've started rehabbing some of those 1200 buses, but really, that should've been done immediately after they were pulled from SBS service because those buses were in horrible condition.

Edited January 31, 2018 by Via Garibaldi 8

[B35 via Church]

49 minutes ago, Rafa said:

So I was doing the sbs 52 this morning and this lady came on who I could see before picking her up was at the bus stop with other passengers right next to the fare machines that says over and over get ticket for sbs 52/53.  She got on and attempted to use a metro card so I looked at her saying to myself are u kidding me. I guess she saw the no fares collected on board and just walked in. I didn’t say a word because she just walked on in and didn’t say nothing to me. So pulled into a stop and u guess it the eagle team. Their getting ready to give her a ticket and she’s blaming me.  

30 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Getting ready to?  Ticket her! I hate stupid oblivious people.  The signs are everywhere, in English and even in Spanish at some stops and other languages.  There's really no excuse.  

...attitudes like this (in bold) is why I don't fault the city one bit for capitalizing off of the stupid (whatever the fine is for not having an SBS receipt, when Eagle Team approaches you on some SBS route).... It's one thing if you haven't quite grasped the concept of off-fare payment & at least attempting to show the initiative that you want to "get it right"... It's another to have an attitude of f*** it (which is why I bolded that part of Rafa's post) & blame-shift others for your ignorance (and if you ask me, ineptitude)....

I'd say that I've been on enough SBS buses to say that this sort of thing is rather commonplace.... In most cases, when someone attempts to use the metrocard, the b/o will either instruct them (verbally) to use the TVM, or just simply point to the TVM.....

As long as you aren't a d***, I find that most b/o's will wait for you to get the receipt.... There is the argument that some riders have; it defeats the purpose of off board payment if b/o's are there waiting for pax to use the TVM when the bus is already at the "station".... On board the bus though, you'll hear people sucking their teeth & what not... Me, I personally don't mind it much on the SBS, but when I used to take the LIRR, I used to abhor that shit..... East New York (EB), Merillon av (WB), and New Hyde Park (WB) were the culprits... Quite sure it goes on elsewhere also.....

 

 

[P3F]

Is the bus lane on the narrow part of Kings Highway going to be deactivated in the evening/at night? I was just randomly thinking about how you can reliably find a parking space there every night (just something I've noticed from walking there a lot; I don't actually own a car). 

Edited January 31, 2018 by P3F

[Future ENY OP]

40 minutes ago, P3F said:

Is the bus lane on the narrow part of Kings Highway going to be deactivated in the evening/at night? I was just randomly thinking about how you can reliably find a parking space there every night (just something I've noticed from walking there a lot; I don't actually own a car). 

Coney Island bound? Or Sping Creek bound? 

[Brillant93]

58 minutes ago, P3F said:

Is the bus lane on the narrow part of Kings Highway going to be deactivated in the evening/at night? I was just randomly thinking about how you can reliably find a parking space there every night (just something I've noticed from walking there a lot; I don't actually own a car). 

There isn’t going to be a bus lane on kings hwy between Ocean Avenue and Bay parkway. The things that are changing are a redesign of the parking space around E12th street and extending bus stops on ocean avenue, kings hwy station, Coney Island Avenue, mc Donald avenue, and west 7st. The bus lanes are going to be on kings hwy between avenue K and Ocean Avenue. 

Edited January 31, 2018 by Brillant93