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New: Complete Overnight Service Shutdown


MHV9218

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5 hours ago, I love NY said:

https://nypost.com/2020/05/14/homeless-seen-sleeping-inches-from-each-other-on-shelter-stairs/

Only 103 subway homeless have remained in shelters since overnight shutdown. Compliments De Blasio, comlpimets for your stupid lies.....

Now how would the mayor force them to go inside the shelter and not violate their First Amendment rights?

Edited by Deucey
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They need to announce immediately what phase of reopening overnight subway service returns in.  Otherwise, the longer it is suspended, the less likely it is that it will ever come back.  I hope as they learn better cleaning procedures and adopt new technology, the system can be just as clean, but can remain open 24/7 as it was always intended to.

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On 6/10/2020 at 9:12 PM, MysteriousBtrain said:

Yes because overnight service is slowly gonna be permanently discontinued if nothing is done or announced.

True, but the problem is, it may be those shutdowns are the only way the MTA can legally remove the homeless from the system.

Maybe a compromise is to cut the shutdown to 2-4:00 AM, specifically citing the need to get the homeless out before they can create a repeat of the situations that forced the overnight shutdowns in the first place. 

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1 hour ago, Collin said:

So the only way to solve one problem is to punish everyone.  Very defeatist.

Technically the measure applies to everyone, but it only affects a slice of the population. When the rules are made so that a festering problem becomes very difficult to resolve, then creative new rules have to be put forth to get around them. Either that, or the city ponies up the dollars to fund a better solution. But after the economy tanks, I don’t think we’ll be seeing anything involving public spending.

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8 hours ago, Wallyhorse said:

True, but the problem is, it may be those shutdowns are the only way the MTA can legally remove the homeless from the system.

Maybe a compromise is to cut the shutdown to 2-4:00 AM, specifically citing the need to get the homeless out before they can create a repeat of the situations that forced the overnight shutdowns in the first place. 

A 1:59am from Far Rockaway arrives at 207 10 minutes before the "first train" of the day if the closure is only "2 hours". The current schedule has "last departures" as early as 1205am so last revenue train arrive at terminals at 1:30am or upto 215am.

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9 hours ago, CenSin said:

Technically the measure applies to everyone, but it only affects a slice of the population. When the rules are made so that a festering problem becomes very difficult to resolve, then creative new rules have to be put forth to get around them. Either that, or the city ponies up the dollars to fund a better solution. But after the economy tanks, I don’t think we’ll be seeing anything involving public spending.

They had their chance... now they have no choice but to keep the problem

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9 hours ago, bulk88 said:

A 1:59am from Far Rockaway arrives at 207 10 minutes before the "first train" of the day if the closure is only "2 hours". The current schedule has "last departures" as early as 1205am so last revenue train arrive at terminals at 1:30am or upto 215am.

Okay, maybe then 1:45-4:15 AM.  Point is, make it so it's long enough to get the homeless out of the system if that continues to be necessary as it was the homeless problem that forced the closure in the first place. 

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1 hour ago, Wallyhorse said:

It's far from the best solution, but it may be the only LEGAL way they can get the homeless out.  THAT is the problem.

When OMNY becomes the only fare payment method, there ought to be a feature where the last swipe time is provided when scanned. The MTA could hire personnel to go around checking fare payment randomly. Anyone still in the system more than 6 hours (including a generous margin for train delays when SHTF) after their last swipe shouldn’t be in there. Like on the LIRR, they need to be ejected.

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2 hours ago, CenSin said:

When OMNY becomes the only fare payment method, there ought to be a feature where the last swipe time is provided when scanned. The MTA could hire personnel to go around checking fare payment randomly. Anyone still in the system more than 6 hours (including a generous margin for train delays when SHTF) after their last swipe shouldn’t be in there. Like on the LIRR, they need to be ejected.

I see where you’re going with your idea but only law enforcement can legally carry out your idea. Anyone else who physically tried to eject someone would be subject to arrest for assault. Transit Police warned a few of us about that back in the 80’s at Lenox Terminal. The Chief Transportation officer and a Motor Instructor who lived upstairs also told us to stop the practice. I can also see the ACLU and other organizations heading into court at the first instance of the idea being implemented. My opinion. Carry on.

Edited by Trainmaster5
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2 hours ago, Trainmaster5 said:

I see where you’re going with your idea but only law enforcement can legally carry out your idea. Anyone else who physically tried to eject someone would be subject to arrest for assault. Transit Police warned a few of us about that back in the 80’s at Lenox Terminal. The Chief Transportation officer and a Motor Instructor who lived upstairs also told us to stop the practice. I can also see the ACLU and other organizations heading into court at the first instance of the idea being implemented. My opinion. Carry on.

This system is exactly why a lot of us are disillusioned. One one hand, the police have free reign to dish out violence. On the other hand, common sense policies can’t be implemented because of possible assault by anyone else.

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6 hours ago, Wallyhorse said:

Okay, maybe then 1:45-4:15 AM.  Point is, make it so it's long enough to get the homeless out of the system if that continues to be necessary as it was the homeless problem that forced the closure in the first place. 

 

During Giuliani's years, the Coalition for the Homeless demanded that the subways be closed overnight so that underground trains and stations could be used as shelters.

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On 6/23/2020 at 10:41 AM, CenSin said:

This system is exactly why a lot of us are disillusioned. One one hand, the police have free reign to dish out violence. On the other hand, common sense policies can’t be implemented because of possible assault by anyone else.

America has a legal system with pretty clear rules that grey areas tend to be resolved in favor of the status quo.

Legislators could, you know, do their jobs and legislate, but have you seen Albany? How long did it take for us to get Uber actually legalized across the state?

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On 6/23/2020 at 5:55 AM, CenSin said:

When OMNY becomes the only fare payment method, there ought to be a feature where the last swipe time is provided when scanned. The MTA could hire personnel to go around checking fare payment randomly. Anyone still in the system more than 6 hours (including a generous margin for train delays when SHTF) after their last swipe shouldn’t be in there. Like on the LIRR, they need to be ejected.

It's also worth noting in that most developed countries, social ills do not literally spill out onto the street like they do in the US, so the police don't really resort to violently ejecting people anyways because they don't have to.

Homelessness in the subway is a symptom, not the problem.

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5 hours ago, I love NY said:

If the 24/7 subway service will be eliminated, NYC will become a city like many other cities and it will no longer be my favourite city in the world.

In all fairness NYC subway doesn't need to be 24/7. The (MTA) needs to take the practice of (SEPTA) and other transit agencies to not run trains at night and offer bus alternatives.

The B99 is a perfect start to this and if ridership picks up lets just say more routes could be created in the near future. The (MTA) needs to continue with the deep cleaning of the trains.

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7 hours ago, I love NY said:

If the 24/7 subway service will be eliminated, NYC will become a city like many other cities and it will no longer be my favourite city in the world.

I don't remember NYC asking for this title from you.

Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded.

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10 hours ago, Future ENY OP said:

In all fairness NYC subway doesn't need to be 24/7. The (MTA) needs to take the practice of (SEPTA) and other transit agencies to not run trains at night and offer bus alternatives.

The B99 is a perfect start to this and if ridership picks up lets just say more routes could be created in the near future. The (MTA) needs to continue with the deep cleaning of the trains.

Imagine if they did an entire night bus network mirroring subway services with timed transfers...

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23 minutes ago, Deucey said:

Imagine if they did an entire night bus network mirroring subway services with timed transfers...

I’m in full agreement on this. I’ve seen it done in Philadelphia and LA. Although for the most part bus connections correspond to the late night service. Last night Flatbush had 6 buses since the service is every 20 minutes. I’m gonna give it shot to fan the line. (Something I haven’t done in years primarily since becoming a car owner and grown too tired of the (MTA)  shenanigans but this would be something to check out) 

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