Eric B Posted August 31, 2020 Share #126 Posted August 31, 2020 6 hours ago, B35 via Church said: M1: IDK what that area around Foley Sq. is considered, but Centre/Worth is not TriBeCa.... That would be pretty egregious if they did that. Probably Manhattan Civic Center. (That's basically what it is. For historical trivia, over 100 years ago, it was the infamous "Five Points", and before that, "the Collect", from the pond they built over, and is now represented by that murky pool next to the family court) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted August 31, 2020 Author Share #127 Posted August 31, 2020 Maybe M1 Civic Center via 5 Av then? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missabassie Posted August 31, 2020 Share #128 Posted August 31, 2020 10 hours ago, B35 via Church said: M1: IDK what that area around Foley Sq. is considered, but Centre/Worth is not TriBeCa.... That would be pretty egregious if they did that. M42: Why would the EB M42 signage say 2nd av, instead of 1 av? M116: Would never see the light of day..... MTA would duck that like the plague. As well they should, completely unnecessary. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted August 31, 2020 Author Share #129 Posted August 31, 2020 The M116 is too far north from Spanish Harlem anyway 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Around the Horn Posted August 31, 2020 Share #130 Posted August 31, 2020 10 hours ago, B35 via Church said: M42: Why would the EB M42 signage say 2nd av, instead of 1 av? That's the short turn code for when the UN is in session 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted August 31, 2020 Share #131 Posted August 31, 2020 19 minutes ago, Q43LTD said: The M116 is too far north from Spanish Harlem anyway How you figure? 116th is smack in the middle of East Harlem.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLX9304 Posted August 31, 2020 Share #132 Posted August 31, 2020 On 8/23/2020 at 12:41 PM, checkmatechamp13 said: Same way I've felt about the Todt Hill Houses (Castleton Corners). We could start a whole separate thread on the projects that are incorrectly named lol In any case, the one thing that irks me is the SIM23 (originally the SIM24 before they restructured the two) using Princes Bay to refer to Hylan & Luten. To me that is definitely Huguenot...Princes Bay is Seguine and beyond. The S89 uses "Eltingville / Hylan Blvd" whereas the S59 just says "Hylan Bl" (though I suppose if you consider Tottenville to be the full length terminal it makes sense why they would abbreviate the Eltingville one, even though it's the full-time terminal) Another one is the S98 saying "Mariners Hbr" while the S48 says "Arlington / Holland Av " which is more accurate (the limiteds out here in general tend to differ from the locals. In the morning a lot of them say "St. George" rather than "St. George Ferry". Then there's also the S91 saying "SI Mall" rather than "SI Mall - Yukon Av" (the S94 splits it up among two screens rather than one like the S44 & S61) Then there's the SIM4X/8X which say "via Park & Ride" in the morning. Either you got on at the park & ride itself (in which case you already know where you are), or you got on at Lamberts/Christopher Lane and it would make no sense backtracking to the park & ride. The whole concept of the SIM4X/8X (as planned by the MTA) I found stupid from the beginning. Way way back in the days, local buses in Staten Island terminating at St. George Ferry used to read just “Ferry” before it got changed to “St. George”. Today’s buses follow the forefront of the GMs & Flxibles that listed older signs like these. TA Express bus signage: Speaking of RTS buses, before the hood names were posted in the mid 1990s, they used go by the borough and the Ave they terminated: here is this list: Brooklyn X buses: X27- SHORE RD // 4TH AVE-BKLYN // EXPRESS X28- BROOKLYN // CROPSEY AVE // EXPRESS X29- BROOKLYN // SURF AV-W 37 ST // EXPRESS Queens X18 (68) HILLSIDE // 268TH ST // EXPRESS X20 (63) 149TH AVE // 253RD ST // EXPRESS X24 (64) CAMBRIA HTS // LINDEN BLVD // EXPRESS X51 SANFORD AVE // 165TH ST // EXPRESS Staten Island: X9- STATEN ISLAND // NEW DORP LANE X10- STATEN ISLAND // CASTLETON AVE (Same was said for X14 & X16) or TRAVIS AVE X11- STATEN ISLAND // ARTHUR KILL RD X12- STATEN ISLAND // SOUTH AVE X13- STATEN ISLAND // ARTHUR KILL RD or TYSENS LANE // FIRST STOP (for those coming out of Park Place) X17 & X19 - STATEN ISLAND // HUGUENOT AVE (for X17 only Annandale Rd from Broadway-Worth St) X18- STATEN ISLAND // NARROWS RD X20- STATEN ISLAND // F CAP BLVD Manhattan & Bronx X23 - YORK AVE // 92ND ST // EXPRESS X25 - GRAND CENTRAL // 42ND ST X61- BRONX // 262ND ST & BWAY // EXPRESS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted August 31, 2020 Author Share #133 Posted August 31, 2020 1 hour ago, B35 via Church said: How you figure? 116th is smack in the middle of East Harlem.... To me, 106 is Spanish Harlem 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted August 31, 2020 Share #134 Posted August 31, 2020 3 minutes ago, Q43LTD said: To me, 106 is Spanish Harlem Right, but so is 116th. You do realize that Spanish Harlem is nothing more than a moniker for East Harlem.... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted August 31, 2020 Author Share #135 Posted August 31, 2020 1 hour ago, B35 via Church said: Right, but so is 116th. You do realize that Spanish Harlem is nothing more than a moniker for East Harlem.... I hadn't looked at it like that 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted September 1, 2020 Share #136 Posted September 1, 2020 I know it's not actually a destination, but I just remembered that I haven't seen New York Avenue on the northbound B44's matrix. I really think it should've been noted prior to the SBS conversion (leaves Nostrand Avenue at Farragut Road to go up New York Avenue to Fulton Street, then uses that to reach Bedford Avenue), but the northbound split only reinforces the importance of saying it, especially since the SBS variant actually mentions Rogers Avenue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastFlatbushLarry Posted September 1, 2020 Share #137 Posted September 1, 2020 6 minutes ago, Lex said: I know it's not actually a destination, but I just remembered that I haven't seen New York Avenue on the northbound B44's matrix. I really think it should've been noted prior to the SBS conversion (leaves Nostrand Avenue at Farragut Road to go up New York Avenue to Fulton Street, then uses that to reach Bedford Avenue), but the northbound split only reinforces the importance of saying it, especially since the SBS variant actually mentions Rogers Avenue. imo yet another oversight. as you stated, New York Av should absolutely be a mentioned via street.. well before the sbs situation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Around the Horn Posted September 1, 2020 Share #138 Posted September 1, 2020 9 hours ago, FLX9304 said: Way way back in the days, local buses in Staten Island terminating at St. George Ferry used to read just “Ferry” before it got changed to “St. George”. Today’s buses follow the forefront of the GMs & Flxibles that listed older signs like these. TA Express bus signage: Speaking of RTS buses, before the hood names were posted in the mid 1990s, they used go by the borough and the Ave they terminated: I definitely remember seeing the lollipop signs for the express buses in Manhattan saying the borough and then the neighborhood (for example X28 Brooklyn Sea Gate), particularly the old Staten Island X routes in Lower Manhattan. A few X27 and X28 signs like that might still exist in spots. I didn't know about the actual bus signs saying that as well so those signs (and their phasing out) make more sense to me now. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted September 1, 2020 Share #139 Posted September 1, 2020 7 hours ago, Q43LTD said: I hadn't looked at it like that Yeah fam, Spanish Harlem is synonymous with East Harlem, not a subsection of it. 1 hour ago, Lex said: I know it's not actually a destination, but I just remembered that I haven't seen New York Avenue on the northbound B44's matrix. I really think it should've been noted prior to the SBS conversion (leaves Nostrand Avenue at Farragut Road to go up New York Avenue to Fulton Street, then uses that to reach Bedford Avenue), but the northbound split only reinforces the importance of saying it, especially since the SBS variant actually mentions Rogers Avenue. I don't disagree with the sentiment, but the thing I worry about is the B44 not even serving NY av. in the future... Something's going to happen with the B44 & B49 as it pertains with Nostrand and/or Rogers.... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastFlatbushLarry Posted September 1, 2020 Share #140 Posted September 1, 2020 46 minutes ago, B35 via Church said: Yeah fam, Spanish Harlem is synonymous with East Harlem, not a subsection of it. I don't disagree with the sentiment, but the thing I worry about is the B44 not even serving NY av. in the future... Something's going to happen with the B44 & B49 as it pertains with Nostrand and/or Rogers.... I've had the idea for a while now that somehow the 49 will become a branch of the 44 local. meaning that 49's will replace 44 locals north to flushing via rogers & southbound will travel on Nostrand, hit that right on foster, heading to ocean avenue, while 44 locals will eventually no longer serve anything north of Avenue D/newkirk/vandeveer. I'm not advocating this per se (nor am i advocating renaming the 49 the B44B or some foolishness) but logically thinking, what could/would stop this from happening? if you seriously think about, eventually there will come a point where they'll attempt to show how abysmal ridership is on southbound 49's via Bedford & northbound 44's via NY Avenue to invalidate the necessity for 2 bus lines (3 if you count the sbs B44 separately) serving 2 combos of north/south avenues each, with said avenues being mere blocks from each other. i don't necessarily believe in conspiracy theories, but i do believe in what i call transit treachery. the B47 (B40/78 combo) & Q21 are my go-to examples. i would elaborate, however, i think I've deviated off topic enough (apologies) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted September 1, 2020 Share #141 Posted September 1, 2020 37 minutes ago, EastFlatbushLarry said: I've had the idea for a while now that somehow the 49 will become a branch of the 44 local. meaning that 49's will replace 44 locals north to flushing via rogers & southbound will travel on Nostrand, hit that right on foster, heading to ocean avenue, while 44 locals will eventually no longer serve anything north of Avenue D/newkirk/vandeveer. I'm not advocating this per se (nor am i advocating renaming the 49 the B44B or some foolishness) but logically thinking, what could/would stop this from happening? if you seriously think about, eventually there will come a point where they'll attempt to show how abysmal ridership is on southbound 49's via Bedford & northbound 44's via NY Avenue to invalidate the necessity for 2 bus lines (3 if you count the sbs B44 separately) serving 2 combos of north/south avenues each, with said avenues being mere blocks from each other. i don't necessarily believe in conspiracy theories, but i do believe in what i call transit treachery. the B47 (B40/78 combo) & Q21 are my go-to examples. i would elaborate, however, i think I've deviated off topic enough (apologies) I would actually put the [Q11/Q21] vs. the [Q52/Q53] in the category of (so-called) transit treachery - the conscious & blatantly deliberate attempt to force everyone into taking SBS' over locals by frontloading the vast majority of Woodhaven/Cross Bay service to the SBS' & severely bastardizing local service (almost to the point of complete irrelevancy)... But that's neither here, nor there..... More to the point of the B44/B49, I don't think the B49 will be a branch of the B44, nor do I think they're going to have B49's running that far north.... However, I do think they're going to look into doing away with Bedford av & New York av. service... Basically, have the B44/SBS, north of Flatbush av, be the sole bus route along Nostrand & along Rogers..... The B49 I think is going to get cutback (mileage-wise) either way; either [to Foster/Flatbush (or scooted over to end at Newkirk IRT)] or [to Prospect Park subway, via Ocean]..... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted September 1, 2020 Author Share #142 Posted September 1, 2020 6 hours ago, B35 via Church said: Yeah fam, Spanish Harlem is synonymous with East Harlem, not a subsection of it. I don't disagree with the sentiment, but the thing I worry about is the B44 not even serving NY av. in the future... Something's going to happen with the B44 & B49 as it pertains with Nostrand and/or Rogers.... Learn something new everyday. Maps can be very deceiving. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastFlatbushLarry Posted September 2, 2020 Share #143 Posted September 2, 2020 17 hours ago, B35 via Church said: The B49 I think is going to get cutback (mileage-wise) either way; either [to Foster/Flatbush (or scooted over to end at Newkirk IRT)] or [to Prospect Park subway, via Ocean]..... i can't debate that thought. either way, one of those lines thru the heart of flatbush is getting some form of "modification" (reduction/elimination/alteration) and if I'm being honest, i feel as if the grooming toward this eminent outcome started years ago 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted September 2, 2020 Share #144 Posted September 2, 2020 7 minutes ago, EastFlatbushLarry said: i can't debate that thought. either way, one of those lines thru the heart of flatbush is getting some form of "modification" (reduction/elimination/alteration) and if I'm being honest, i feel as if the grooming toward this eminent outcome started years ago Yeah, it aint nothing debate worthy AFAIC, just different thoughts on what/how the MTA may handle service in the future with the two routes.... 14 hours ago, Q43LTD said: Learn something new everyday. Maps can be very deceiving. Lol... Whatever map that has East Harlem panning no further north than 106th, is just as bad as the vast majority of all these destination sign readings we've spoken about in this thread that could stand to be updated/corrected.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeLow Posted September 2, 2020 Share #145 Posted September 2, 2020 22 hours ago, EastFlatbushLarry said: I've had the idea for a while now that somehow the 49 will become a branch of the 44 local. meaning that 49's will replace 44 locals north to flushing via rogers & southbound will travel on Nostrand, hit that right on foster, heading to ocean avenue, while 44 locals will eventually no longer serve anything north of Avenue D/newkirk/vandeveer. I'm not advocating this per se (nor am i advocating renaming the 49 the B44B or some foolishness) but logically thinking, what could/would stop this from happening? if you seriously think about, eventually there will come a point where they'll attempt to show how abysmal ridership is on southbound 49's via Bedford & northbound 44's via NY Avenue to invalidate the necessity for 2 bus lines (3 if you count the sbs B44 separately) serving 2 combos of north/south avenues each, with said avenues being mere blocks from each other. i don't necessarily believe in conspiracy theories, but i do believe in what i call transit treachery. the B47 (B40/78 combo) & Q21 are my go-to examples. i would elaborate, however, i think I've deviated off topic enough (apologies) Apologies for continuing this but I just gotta weigh in. Why move the B49 over to Nostrand? Keep Nostrand it as is, keep the 49 N/B on Ocean and run it up to Prospect Pk or get even bolder and pull that bad boy over to Utica along Empire Blvd. S/B is in reverse. Take it off that heartburn/indigestion named Bedford Ave. Yeah that's some bold tihs but it might pick up a couple handfuls of passengers. Damn thing is a ghost ship on Ocean. 20 hours ago, B35 via Church said: ...More to the point of the B44/B49, I don't think the B49 will be a branch of the B44, nor do I think they're going to have B49's running that far north.... However, I do think they're going to look into doing away with Bedford av & New York av. service... Basically, have the B44/SBS, north of Flatbush av, be the sole bus route along Nostrand & along Rogers..... The B49 I think is going to get cutback (mileage-wise) either way; either [to Foster/Flatbush (or scooted over to end at Newkirk IRT)] or [to Prospect Park subway, via Ocean]..... I can see that happening. If Transit decided to make that move perhaps the DOT might consider making both New York and Bedford one way streets respectively, allowing a smoother traffic flow...2 N/B lanes on New York and 2 S/B on Bedford. Double parking KILLS traffic movement on Bedford especially around Church. Bedford would resume 2-way S/O Flatbush. Traffic would flow smoother after folks get over the initial strangeness, IMO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted September 2, 2020 Share #146 Posted September 2, 2020 31 minutes ago, TeeLow said: ...If Transit decided to make that move perhaps the DOT might consider making both New York and Bedford one way streets respectively, allowing a smoother traffic flow...2 N/B lanes on New York and 2 S/B on Bedford. Double parking KILLS traffic movement on Bedford especially around Church. Bedford would resume 2-way S/O Flatbush. Traffic would flow smoother after folks get over the initial strangeness, IMO. I agree when it comes to Bedford, but traffic on New York av. isn't remotely problematic to the point where it should end up being 1-way.... Doing that would just force more SB traffic onto Nostrand. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeLow Posted September 2, 2020 Share #147 Posted September 2, 2020 8 minutes ago, B35 via Church said: I agree when it comes to Bedford, but traffic on New York av. isn't remotely problematic to the point where it should end up being 1-way.... Doing that would just force more SB traffic onto Nostrand. But that's the beauty of it. By adding another S/B lane on Bedford it would take some of the burden from Nostrand. Savvy drivers would pick up on that in a couple heartbeats. With the N/B lane removed from Bedford it wouldn't take too long before that "freelow" on New York would be used, especially when the initial bump would naturally flow to already troubled Rogers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted September 2, 2020 Share #148 Posted September 2, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, TeeLow said: But that's the beauty of it. By adding another S/B lane on Bedford it would take some of the burden from Nostrand. Savvy drivers would pick up on that in a couple heartbeats. With the N/B lane removed from Bedford it wouldn't take too long before that "freelow" on New York would be used, especially when the initial bump would naturally flow to already troubled Rogers. Alright, but at the same time, New York av. north of the precinct (Empire) doesn't allow for 2 lanes of flowing traffic & on top of it, ends at Fulton.... That is a deterrent to a lot of drivers around here & FWIW, is a reason that NY av. doesn't see near as much NB traffic that Rogers or Bedford does..... You're not going to get too much of that traffic that currently plagues Rogers onto New York av... Much of nobody currently taking Bedford is going to swing over to NY av either; you would just be exacerbating Rogers av. traffic at that point.... The real issue is that people in Flatbush (the neighborhood) take Rogers to bypass Flatbush av... The whole thing is a nasty domino effect. Edited September 2, 2020 by B35 via Church 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NBTA Posted September 2, 2020 Share #149 Posted September 2, 2020 I got a few for the Bronx. Bx1: Kingsbridge-231st Street, Mott Haven-136th Street Bx3: Kingsbridge-238th Street || Via Sedgwick-University Avenues (Layout like the Bx12 local today) Bx9: West Farms Square Sta, Bronx Zoo-183rd Street Bx7/Bx10: Coll of Mount St. Vincent || Bx7: Via Broadway/Riverdale Avenue || Bx10: Via HHP Bx13: I guess you can say Bronx Terminal Market-149th Street || Via Ogden Ave Bx21: Via Boston Road/Morris Park Avenue Bx22: Via Kingsbridge Road (For Bedford Park Buses, to ease confusion). Bx29: City Island or Bay Plaza via Pelham Bay Bx30: Via Boston Road/Gun Hill Road Bx31: Via Eastchester Road Bx32: Via Jerome/Morris Avenues Bx36: (When the redesign happens) Via Tremont Avenue || Castle Hill-Seward Avenue Bx39: Via White Plains Road Bx42: Ferry Point Park-Emerson Avenue Bx46: Prospect Avenue Station A couple of them probably can change, just can't think of them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLX9304 Posted September 2, 2020 Share #150 Posted September 2, 2020 On 8/31/2020 at 11:20 PM, Around the Horn said: I definitely remember seeing the lollipop signs for the express buses in Manhattan saying the borough and then the neighborhood (for example X28 Brooklyn Sea Gate), particularly the old Staten Island X routes in Lower Manhattan. A few X27 and X28 signs like that might still exist in spots. I didn't know about the actual bus signs saying that as well so those signs (and their phasing out) make more sense to me now. You are right about the phasing out version. They eliminated the borough names themselves and just reads X28- Bensonhurst/ Cropsey Ave on the newer fleets, just like some of the SIM buses reads by neighborhood name then street name or Simply X1 Eltingville TC. (Just to procrastinate) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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