Service Cuts May Start This Year

[Via Garibaldi 8]

32 minutes ago, bobtehpanda said:

What I've heard is that some of this is also indirect pressure. Retail is balking at paying rents premised upon office foot traffic that currently isn't materializing, so some landlords are pressuring tenants to bring somebody, anybody back.

It's really the City and some employers which don't to pay obscene amounts of rent while their employees sit at home. Eateries are still desperate for customers and so many places have closed lr haven't quite re-opened yet. Same thing we're grabbling with. We were supposed to move to a new office months ago and didn't because of COVID. Now we have a tons of space that we don't need and need to downsize, and the plan is to cut back considerably since we all will be doing a work from home rotating in the office schedule until who knows when. I hate bringing work home, but now, I am pretty much set up to do just about everything at home, save a few things that need to be done in person.

[bobtehpanda]

8 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

It's really the City and some employers which don't to pay obscene amounts of rent while their employees sit at home. Eateries are still desperate for customers and so many places have closed lr haven't quite re-opened yet. Same thing we're grabbling with. We were supposed to move to a new office months ago and didn't because of COVID. Now we have a tons of space that we don't need and need to downsize, and the plan is to cut back considerably since we all will be doing a work from home rotating in the office schedule until who knows when. I hate bringing work home, but now, I am pretty much set up to do just about everything at home, save a few things that need to be done in person.

In my experience, the current thing is not really representative of WFH since under normal conditions if you got tired of your place you could move on to a coffee shop or library or some other third place that's not your home or your office.

The issue is that getting cooped up only in your house for months on end sucks. A vaccine can't come (and be distributed) soon enough.

[Future ENY OP]

15 hours ago, Deucey said:

Imagine how bad it is at a WeWork or Greendesk building - small Manhattan studio apartment sized offices with 9-10 people sharing kitchens with 30 other companies.

Adam Neumann was smart AF to take the money last September.

However, you got WeWork buying billboard and bus ads throughout Manhattan and Brooklyn. Newmann was very smart to run with the $$$$ last year. I wonder who the new person in charge is. 

[Future ENY OP]

9 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

It's really the City and some employers which don't to pay obscene amounts of rent while their employees sit at home.
 

Eateries are still desperate for customers and so many places have closed lr haven't quite re-opened yet. Same thing we're grabbling with. We were supposed to move to a new office months ago and didn't because of COVID. Now we have a tons of space that we don't need and need to downsize, and the plan is to cut back considerably since we all will be doing a work from home rotating in the office schedule until who knows when. I hate bringing work home, but now, I am pretty much set up to do just about everything at home, save a few things that need to be done in person.

Very accurate. You have most of Downtown Manhattan city offices closed. The city themselves don’t have a real plan to bring back people into offices. You might be looking into early to mid 2021 at the earliest for an actual plan. 

[Deucey]

1 hour ago, Future ENY OP said:

However, you got WeWork buying billboard and bus ads throughout Manhattan and Brooklyn. Newmann was very smart to run with the $$$$ last year. I wonder who the new person in charge is. 

They had co-CEOs - because folks really think that actually works after Morgan Stanley tried it when it bought Dean Witter, but I think one of them left.

[FLX9304]

But as always stated since 1995 transit cuts or prior to it: Service cuts equals to fare hikes. 
 

oh um btw: The 1995 cuts wanna have a word with you.

But not can be said the same way about the 2010 service cuts that discontinued 100 bus routes. To this day:

In the Bronx, the Bx20’s midday and Saturday service has not been replaced. The Bx25 is to return with the BXRDP. the Bx14 was replaced by the Bx4A & Bx24. 
 

in Manhattan, M18, 27, & 30 have not been replaced. The M6 has been replaced by the M55 but shorten on the north end by 15 blocks. 
 

in Brooklyn: B23, B51 have not been replaced: the B37 & B39 but with no overnight service, the X37 & X38 have returned, so did B2, B24 & B69’s weekend service. 
 

in Queens: Q74, 89 have not been replaced. The Q26’s midday service has not returned. There is talk about bringing the Q75 back with some enhancements on the QRDP.   Q79 has been replaced by the Q36W. The Q31 & Q76 has their weekend service restored. The Q42’s midday service is back. They added Sunday service to the Q77 (but that was not part of the cuts)

In SI. The S67 has not been replaced, as well as the S60’s weekend service. S76’s weekend service is restored. 
 

express bus: X13, X16, X20, X25, X29, X51, & X90, QM22, QM23 has not been replaced. The X6 is replaced by SIM7, and a partial X18 has been replaced by SIM30B. 

[R10 2952]

2 hours ago, FLX9304 said:

But as always stated since 1995 transit cuts or prior to it: Service cuts equals to fare hikes. 
 

oh um btw: The 1995 cuts wanna have a word with you.

But not can be said the same way about the 2010 service cuts that discontinued 100 bus routes. To this day:

In the Bronx, the Bx20’s midday and Saturday service has not been replaced. The Bx25 is to return with the BXRDP. the Bx14 was replaced by the Bx4A & Bx24. 
 

in Manhattan, M18, 27, & 30 have not been replaced. The M6 has been replaced by the M55 but shorten on the north end by 15 blocks. 
 

in Brooklyn: B23, B51 have not been replaced: the B37 & B39 but with no overnight service, the X37 & X38 have returned, so did B2, B24 & B69’s weekend service. 
 

in Queens: Q74, 89 have not been replaced. The Q26’s midday service has not returned. There is talk about bringing the Q75 back with some enhancements on the QRDP.   Q79 has been replaced by the Q36W. The Q31 & Q76 has their weekend service restored. The Q42’s midday service is back. They added Sunday service to the Q77 (but that was not part of the cuts)

In SI. The S67 has not been replaced, as well as the S60’s weekend service. S76’s weekend service is restored. 
 

express bus: X13, X16, X20, X25, X29, X51, & X90, QM22, QM23 has not been replaced. The X6 is replaced by SIM7, and a partial X18 has been replaced by SIM30B. 

Yeah, they pretty much kneecapped the Bx20.  Used to be a fairly useful service pre-2010, but since then it's been reduced to the point that remaining potential riders are scared off by the combination of infrequency and no-show drivers.

@Via Garibaldi 8 any word on what the wizards from MTA management are planning to do with the Bx20 this time around?

[Lawrence St]

4 hours ago, FLX9304 said:

But as always stated since 1995 transit cuts or prior to it: Service cuts equals to fare hikes. 
 

oh um btw: The 1995 cuts wanna have a word with you.

But not can be said the same way about the 2010 service cuts that discontinued 100 bus routes. To this day:

In the Bronx, the Bx20’s midday and Saturday service has not been replaced. The Bx25 is to return with the BXRDP. the Bx14 was replaced by the Bx4A & Bx24. 
 

Wasn't the Bx5 also modified along with the Bx8 to replace the Bx14?

Seems like all this hassle could've been avoided if they just brought back the Bx14...

[GreatOne2k]

Bx20 had its Sunday service cut in 1995

[Lex]

2 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Wasn't the Bx5 also modified along with the Bx8 to replace the Bx14?

Seems like all this hassle could've been avoided if they just brought back the Bx14...

And what would that accomplish?

[NBTA]

3 hours ago, Lex said:

And what would that accomplish?

Cutting the Bx4A and the Bx24, as well as having 60% of the resources on those lines going to the Bx14, and the remaining 40% to the Bx4.

[FLX9304]

3 hours ago, NBTA said:

Cutting the Bx4A and the Bx24, as well as having 60% of the resources on those lines going to the Bx14, and the remaining 40% to the Bx4.

The Bx24 is doing better now than the Bx14. Plus, it serves the HMC. The Bx4A with the BXRDP is being shortened to the Simpson St Station of the  & the . 

[FLX9304]

9 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Wasn't the Bx5 also modified along with the Bx8 to replace the Bx14?

Seems like all this hassle could've been avoided if they just brought back the Bx14...

That’s was done and it had nothing but complaints from both sides. The Bx8 went str8 thru Country Club instead of serving each part, of what the Bx24 currently does. 

[R10 2952]

9 hours ago, GreatOne2k said:

Bx20 had its Sunday service cut in 1995

Just goes to show what's been said by many communities in the past- once a certain service is cut, it's rarely ever brought back.  Par for the course, unfortunately.

[checkmatechamp13]

1 hour ago, R10 2952 said:

Just goes to show what's been said by many communities in the past- once a certain service is cut, it's rarely ever brought back.  Par for the course, unfortunately.

That's why it's important for redesigns to be done well and accurately. I'll give you a couple of examples: On Staten Island, there used to be a route called the AE7, which was cut in 2010 due to low ridership. It was incorporated into the SIM25 in 2018 (and the SIM24 took over the last remaining area, the Outerbridge Park & Ride in January 2020). 

In the Queens redesign, we see elements of old routes being proposed (Q74, Q75, Q26 off-peak service, etc).

Again, I get your general point, but the redesigns present an opportunity to serve the same areas as the former routes, but in a more efficient manner.

Edited October 21, 2020 by checkmatechamp13

[FLX9304]

4 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

That's why it's important for redesigns to be done well and accurately. I'll give you a couple of examples: On Staten Island, there used to be a route called the AE7, which was cut in 2010 due to low ridership. It was incorporated into the SIM25 in 2018 (and the SIM24 took over the last remaining area, the Outerbridge Park & Ride in January 2020). 

In the Queens redesign, we see elements of old routes being proposed (Q74, Q75, Q26 off-peak service, etc).

Again, I get your general point, but the redesigns present an opportunity to serve the same areas as the former routes, but in a more efficient manner.

Riderships lost due to elimination of their routes of where service in the area is needed. I see where you’re coming from with this and I wholeheartedly agree with you on this. Areas where bus service operated on different times of the day was sorely needed. When the cuts in 2010 took place, community activists stood up against the MTA and won several routes back. It wasn’t like the 1974 cuts where, many routes in the Bronx was reduced or eliminated because of the cuts and several bus routes were running during weekdays only. Weekend service was too premium because the city itself was broke and areas were desperately needed of bus routes. People had to walk several blocks to reach the nearest bus route available. Especially on Sundays. 

Edited October 21, 2020 by FLX9304

[R10 2952]

2 hours ago, FLX9304 said:

Riderships lost due to elimination of their routes of where service in the area is needed. I see where you’re coming from with this and I wholeheartedly agree with you on this. Areas where bus service operated on different times of the day was sorely needed. When the cuts in 2010 took place, community activists stood up against the MTA and won several routes back. It wasn’t like the 1974 cuts where, many routes in the Bronx was reduced or eliminated because of the cuts and several bus routes were running during weekdays only. Weekend service was too premium because the city itself was broke and areas were desperately needed of bus routes. People had to walk several blocks to reach the nearest bus route available. Especially on Sundays. 

Either that or they ended up walking to the subway.  I know people who got so sick of the bus BS on weekends that they'd walk from Spuyten Duyvil to catch the  at 231st, and even walk across the Henry Hudson Bridge and through Inwood Park to get the  at 207th.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

23 hours ago, R10 2952 said:

Yeah, they pretty much kneecapped the Bx20.  Used to be a fairly useful service pre-2010, but since then it's been reduced to the point that remaining potential riders are scared off by the combination of infrequency and no-show drivers.

@Via Garibaldi 8 any word on what the wizards from MTA management are planning to do with the Bx20 this time around?

The final plan for the local routes was finalized last year. For the most part, the Bx7, Bx10 and Bx20 will run pretty much the way it does today, with a stop or two removed tops. I spoke to the chick that was responsible for the Bronx Redesign in my first meeting in late 2018 or early 2019. The plan is to keep about 70% of the routes roughly as is, with 30% of them changing. That pretty much applies to the local and express Bronx buses. I argued that on the express end, there weren't that many changes needed, plus there are geographical challenges, and that's what she responded with to try to shut me by saying, see we're not going crazy with changes, but the 30% was substantial, especially the proposed reduction of service, a detail she omitted. Of course with the pandemic, it's anyone's guess what will happen. We will have to wait and see. The  is still hoping funding will come around or that it can borrow until Congress finally agrees on a package.

I can tell you on the local bus end, I know some of the community organizers that raised hell. Country Club did not want that Bx24 running directly through the neighborhood, and one of the leaders of the Civic Association made sure it didn't happen. Very influential. Once they spoke with Council member Gjonaj and complained to the  , that was it. Went over to the Bronx Borough President, and as you notice, most of the local buses in the Eastern part of the Bronx are not seeing major changes. That is why. Very vocal communities from Country Club, Throggs Neck, Pelham Bay, and especially Co-Op City. Someone in my group posted these photos in Co-Op City. One of the few areas that Byford personally visited during the redesign discussions.

 

 

Edited October 22, 2020 by Via Garibaldi 8

[FLX9304]

12 hours ago, R10 2952 said:

Either that or they ended up walking to the subway.  I know people who got so sick of the bus BS on weekends that they'd walk from Spuyten Duyvil to catch the  at 231st, and even walk across the Henry Hudson Bridge and through Inwood Park to get the  at 207th.

Today’s residents don’t do such 😂😂😂 but back then, you just had the M100. And it was more frequent than both the Bx10 & Bx24 combined on weekdays, but the weekends, if you had to wait for the 100, you didn’t have to. Now if you was like in Bronxwood or Pelham Gardens, it’s another story, sir. The most frequently bus I was used to seeing was both the Bx26 (today’s 21) & Bx36. The old West Farms Depot is no different when it came to take care of buses, the only buses that they did pet was the 9000 series Flxibles but they didn’t last in the depot long enough to see the Yankees drop the playoffs to the KC Royals. In came the TA division fishbowls that replaced them and the always emptied Bx32 on St Ann’s Ave was the first one to see them. Since 1974, everybody was always talking about the old Bx32 about being eliminated ever since the 3rd Ave el was demolished

[Future ENY OP]

Source: NBC New York.  According to  service cuts and layoffs to begin in December. 

[B35 via Church]

On 10/21/2020 at 1:24 AM, Lawrence St said:

Wasn't the Bx5 also modified along with the Bx8 to replace the Bx14?

Seems like all this hassle could've been avoided if they just brought back the Bx14...

The good people of Country Club would agree with you....

The good people of Country Club also didn't utilize the Bx14 to the degree that one might've thought they did, for all the incessant whimpering & belly-aching they did back then (I still cant get over the, too many buses in our neighborhood bit, when they rerouted Bx8's through Country Club )

On 10/21/2020 at 4:00 AM, Lex said:

And what would that accomplish?

Some level of complaining from Country Club.... About what? God knows......

On 10/21/2020 at 2:48 PM, checkmatechamp13 said:

....but the redesigns present an opportunity to serve the same areas as the former routes, but in a more efficient manner.

There's a little thing called foolish pride (or stubbornness, whichever you prefer) that gets in the way of it all....

Nothing like masses of people defiantly conveying "You should've left the damn thing alone to begin with!!!".... What retort can you come back with after that, after having done the actual act of reverting a route (or portion of a route) that was eliminated sometime prior? I believe they call that eating crow

[FLX9304]

10 hours ago, Future ENY OP said:

Source: NBC New York.  According to  service cuts and layoffs to begin in December. 

These 8K people need their holiday money. It’s the wrong time to do it

[Via Garibaldi 8]

7 hours ago, FLX9304 said:

These 8K people need their holiday money. It’s the wrong time to do it

They don't have a choice. NY State Law MANDATES that they have a balanced budget, so they have to cut service and raise fares and tolls without any funding from the Feds. It's as simple as that. Can't make money appear that they don't have. If people were so concerned about it, they should've been out there advocating for funding as I was, amd given how few people did, obviously people didn't care that much.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

6 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

They don't have a choice. NY State Law MANDATES that they have a balanced budget, so they have to cut service and raise fares and tolls without any funding from the Feds. It's as simple as that. Can't make money appear that they don't have. If people were so concerned about it, they should've been out there advocating for funding as I was, amd given how few people did, obviously people didn't care that much.

 

Plus, a different NY State law (the 2010 "MTA bailout") mandates fare and toll increases every two years. 

[R10 2952]

6 hours ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

Plus, a different NY State law (the 2010 "MTA bailout") mandates fare and toll increases every two years. 

Of all the laws that affect the MTA, that one I hate the most.  Since they implemented it the fares have risen faster than the rate of inflation; it's a regressive, band-aid half-measure that is ultimately ineffective in the long-term because Cuomo has habitually redirected earmarked transit funds away from the MTA and into other areas of the state budget.