Lawrence St Posted November 21, 2021 Author Share #51 Posted November 21, 2021 18 minutes ago, Lex said: If you've ever used the B35, you'd notice that Church Avenue has far higher use than 39th Street. On top of that, the B70 runs along/near it west of 8th Avenue. Actually I've noticed the opposite. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted November 21, 2021 Share #52 Posted November 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Lawrence St said: Actually I've noticed the opposite. Based on what, exactly? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NBTA Posted November 21, 2021 Share #53 Posted November 21, 2021 2 hours ago, Lawrence St said: Actually I've noticed the opposite. Based on what?! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted November 21, 2021 Author Share #54 Posted November 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Lex said: Based on what, exactly? 53 minutes ago, NBTA said: Based on what?! I rode it a few times end to end, the highest amount of people was between Sunset Park & Sunset Park. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 21, 2021 Share #55 Posted November 21, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, NBTA said: Based on what?! 2 hours ago, Lex said: Based on what, exactly? At best, the trips he embarked on in each separate instance, were all trips that were at the ass end of a bunching scenario.... At worst, this is an attempt to speak an erroneous talking point into existence by way of anomalous trips (or "trips", if you prefer) .... Either way, what's not about to happen is me getting into any sort of discourse with anyone seriously trying to convey that the 39th st. portion of the B35 garners more patronage than the Church av portion of the thing on average, or in general... To have buses running back & forth between Sunset Park & Kensington would not only be wasteful (even though the 39th st portion is no slouch), but would negatively affect the logistics of the route overall... Having locals from Brownsville terminate at McDonald av & having the LTD's run the whole way to Sunset Park is simple enough.... Quite frankly, there are more people from Sunset Park (of which choose not to bolt for the before the fact) that bolt for the over that of bolting for the .... Any trip running from Sunset Park at minimum should run to E. 18th, if we are to start talking about short turning B35 service from that end of the thing... It's more feasible to have EB trips short turning at Kings Hwy. than at anywhere else b/w E. 18th & Kings Hwy..... Stubbing service from the west at McDonald av would be just that - a stub. Edited November 21, 2021 by B35 via Church 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted November 25, 2021 Author Share #56 Posted November 25, 2021 On 11/21/2021 at 1:43 PM, B35 via Church said: At best, the trips he embarked on in each separate instance, were all trips that were at the ass end of a bunching scenario.... At worst, this is an attempt to speak an erroneous talking point into existence by way of anomalous trips (or "trips", if you prefer) .... Either way, what's not about to happen is me getting into any sort of discourse with anyone seriously trying to convey that the 39th st. portion of the B35 garners more patronage than the Church av portion of the thing on average, or in general... To have buses running back & forth between Sunset Park & Kensington would not only be wasteful (even though the 39th st portion is no slouch), but would negatively affect the logistics of the route overall... Having locals from Brownsville terminate at McDonald av & having the LTD's run the whole way to Sunset Park is simple enough.... Quite frankly, there are more people from Sunset Park (of which choose not to bolt for the before the fact) that bolt for the over that of bolting for the .... Any trip running from Sunset Park at minimum should run to E. 18th, if we are to start talking about short turning B35 service from that end of the thing... It's more feasible to have EB trips short turning at Kings Hwy. than at anywhere else b/w E. 18th & Kings Hwy..... Stubbing service from the west at McDonald av would be just that - a stub. But, with the current setup bunching will always happen, so you get LTD's piled up on Locals and it becomes a huge mess. Side note, what's with the B4 doing a big tour around Knapp St? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 25, 2021 Share #57 Posted November 25, 2021 2 hours ago, Lawrence St said: But, with the current setup bunching will always happen, so you get LTD's piled up on Locals and it becomes a huge mess. As opposed to what, having trips run b/w Sunset Park & Kensington be some sort of remedy? Having LTD service & local service on the B35 not be complementary to one another? There's no setup that's going to have B35's not bunch, when the route garners the amount of riders that it does, when (and how) it serves the areas that it does, when the specific corridors it serves are prone to moderate-to-heavy amounts of traffic, and when the route is as frequent as it is (even considering the conversion to artics)... 2 hours ago, Lawrence St said: Side note, what's with the B4 doing a big tour around Knapp St? Hey, that 7-11 is pretty convenient for b/o's Aside from that, there's no space for B4's to terminate w/ the B44 (Shore Pkwy eastbound b/w Brigham & Knapp)... That, and it's a bit of a coverage issue; it's what happens when you have areas divided by highways like that.... Being someone that's walked from the B44 terminal to that 7-11 over there on Knapp/Voorhies, for as short as that distance is, you really gotta watch yourself with as much traffic turning onto & off of Knapp over there.... I suppose the alternative is to have buses run on Voorhies (east of Ocean) to the current terminal, but then that screws the folks that currently take the B4 south of the Belt.... Catch-22 situation, as the B44 doesn't serve the Brighton line... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 16, 2022 Author Share #58 Posted January 16, 2022 Route Extension: B67: Extended down 16th Av (over former B23 routing) to Bay Ridge Pkwy, then via B64 to Bay Ridge/Shore Rd. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 16, 2022 Author Share #59 Posted January 16, 2022 21 hours ago, Lawrence St said: Route Extension: B67: Extended down 16th Av (over former B23 routing) to Bay Ridge Pkwy, then via B64 to Bay Ridge/Shore Rd. Anyone? Yay? Nay? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted January 16, 2022 Share #60 Posted January 16, 2022 8 minutes ago, Lawrence St said: Anyone? Yay? Nay? Nay. A Bay Ridge Avenue route should ultimately head towards the Brighton Line (and likely beyond) to provide some type of crosstown service. If you think about it, a Bay Ridge to Downtown Brooklyn (or Navy Yard) route would be wildly indirect compared to existing bus and subway options. Even though it's not Q38-level indirect, it's still best to avoid those types of long-winded routes. Now, a simple extension down 16th Avenue might be more worth it (but I think that should be served by a route that goes on to supplement the B8 on the eastern portion). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 16, 2022 Author Share #61 Posted January 16, 2022 Map update: B12: DUMBO to Bay Pkwy & Bay Ridge Ave via 7th Av. B13: Bay Ride-4th Av to Bay Pkwy & Bay Ridge Ave. B14: Church Ave Subway Station to 86th St Station. Thoughts? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted January 16, 2022 Share #62 Posted January 16, 2022 21 hours ago, Lawrence St said: Route Extension: B67: Extended down 16th Av (over former B23 routing) to Bay Ridge Pkwy, then via B64 to Bay Ridge/Shore Rd. The B64 runs on Bay Ridge av, not Bay Ridge Pkwy... Unless you're actually suggesting such a circuitous route to where buses would run down to Bay Ridge Pkwy, to have to come back up to run along the B64 route to Xaverian? Regardless, at this point, there's no point in extending the B67... Some b/o's go OOS at Church (like the one driver I had last Sunday morning... I wanted to ride the full route, but I could tell by the way he pulled into the stop that he was going go OOS... Since this other guy that was on the bus got off at Church, I just said f*** it & continued on with my itinerary of hoofing it to the B8... The way the b/o looked towards the back (I was sitting in the back, left most seat) of the bus, basically with the evil eye, you'd have though Church av. was the actual/official last stop.... It was going to be a walk anyway from Cortelyou rd, but it was a nice brisk morning, so I didn't really mind... I did think to myself though, if a wheelchair passenger and/or an elderly person was still left on the bus, would he have still went OOS)... I'd say it's to the point where they may as well have B67's/B69's officially end at Church, b/c it's ridiculous.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 16, 2022 Author Share #63 Posted January 16, 2022 1 minute ago, B35 via Church said: The B64 runs on Bay Ridge av, not Bay Ridge Pkwy... Unless you're actually suggesting such a circuitous route to where buses would run down to Bay Ridge Pkwy, to have to come back up to run along the B64 route to Xaverian? Regardless, at this point, there's no point in extending the B67... Some b/o's go OOS at Church (like the one driver I had last Sunday morning... I wanted to ride the full route, but I could tell by the way he pulled into the stop that he was going go OOS... Since this other guy that was on the bus got off at Church, I just said f*** it & continued on with my itinerary of hoofing it to the B8... The way the b/o looked towards the back (I was sitting in the back, left most seat) of the bus, basically with the evil eye, you'd have though Church av. was the actual/official last stop.... It was going to be a walk anyway from Cortelyou rd, but it was a nice brisk morning, so I didn't really mind... I did think to myself though, if a wheelchair passenger and/or an elderly person was still left on the bus, would he have still went OOS)... I'd say it's to the point where they may as well have B67's/B69's officially end at Church, b/c it's ridiculous.... Nah, it get's confusing with all these Bay streets. I uploaded a map to make it easier. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 16, 2022 Author Share #64 Posted January 16, 2022 Now, I could extend the B13 to the Brighton Line, but would it use Avenue P or Quintin Road? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 17, 2022 Author Share #65 Posted January 17, 2022 1 hour ago, checkmatechamp13 said: Nay. A Bay Ridge Avenue route should ultimately head towards the Brighton Line (and likely beyond) to provide some type of crosstown service. If you think about it, a Bay Ridge to Downtown Brooklyn (or Navy Yard) route would be wildly indirect compared to existing bus and subway options. Even though it's not Q38-level indirect, it's still best to avoid those types of long-winded routes. Now, a simple extension down 16th Avenue might be more worth it (but I think that should be served by a route that goes on to supplement the B8 on the eastern portion). Well, I rerouted the B69 towards Bay Pkwy instead of Bay Ridge, and created a new route from Bay Pkwy to Bay Ridge/Shore Rd. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 17, 2022 Author Share #66 Posted January 17, 2022 Some other changes: The B11 and the Eastern portion of the B6 after Flatbush are combined to form the B16 to form a new crosstown route. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted January 17, 2022 Share #67 Posted January 17, 2022 1 hour ago, Lawrence St said: Some other changes: The B11 and the Eastern portion of the B6 after Flatbush are combined to form the B16 to form a new crosstown route. This is just repeating both a failed service pattern from decades ago (hence the B11 ending where it currently does) and the disparate ridership situation of the current B6. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 17, 2022 Author Share #68 Posted January 17, 2022 23 minutes ago, Lex said: This is just repeating both a failed service pattern from decades ago (hence the B11 ending where it currently does) and the disparate ridership situation of the current B6. Exactly, decades ago. Things have changed since then, and all the signs point to true crosstown connections. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted January 17, 2022 Share #69 Posted January 17, 2022 1 hour ago, Lawrence St said: Exactly, decades ago. Things have changed since then, and all the signs point to true crosstown connections. Way to be inquisitive. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Around the Horn Posted January 18, 2022 Share #70 Posted January 18, 2022 On 1/16/2022 at 5:25 PM, checkmatechamp13 said: Nay. A Bay Ridge Avenue route should ultimately head towards the Brighton Line (and likely beyond) to provide some type of crosstown service. If you think about it, a Bay Ridge to Downtown Brooklyn (or Navy Yard) route would be wildly indirect compared to existing bus and subway options. Even though it's not Q38-level indirect, it's still best to avoid those types of long-winded routes. Now, a simple extension down 16th Avenue might be more worth it (but I think that should be served by a route that goes on to supplement the B8 on the eastern portion). I'll second this. Also while "circuitous" the B64 between Bay Ridge and Bensonhurst is well patronized. On the other hand I do like the proposed B14, even though it should use 13th Avenue both ways until 60th Street and then the northbound bus can scoot over. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted January 18, 2022 Share #71 Posted January 18, 2022 On 1/16/2022 at 6:08 PM, Lawrence St said: Nah, it gets confusing with all these Bay streets. I uploaded a map to make it easier. Honest mistake. No worries. We posted simultaneously, because I didn't see your map when I made that last reply.... On 1/16/2022 at 6:05 PM, Lawrence St said: Map update: B12: DUMBO to Bay Pkwy & Bay Ridge Ave via 7th Av. B13: Bay Ride-4th Av to Bay Pkwy & Bay Ridge Ave. B14: Church Ave Subway Station to 86th St Station. Thoughts? 23 hours ago, Lawrence St said: Now, I could extend the B13 to the Brighton Line, but would it use Avenue P or Quintin Road? "B12" & "B13": If the idea is to end these routes at the station, you would be leaving people with quite the walk with ending buses at Bay Pkwy/Bay Ridge av... One entrance is way up at 66th/Bay Pkwy... The other entrance is down on Av O/West 8th st.... Btw, Bay Ridge av. stops being bi-directional at 13th av, so those routings as depicted can't happen... "B13": I mean, I get extracting Shore rd. from the B16, but instead of randomly stubbing/dumping ppl. off at Bay Pkwy, this would be much better off serving the commercial part of Kings Hwy. down by the Brighton line.... "B14": By itself, I'd be worried it would garner enough ridership to justify its existence throughout the course of the day... I would do more with it, by having it coupled with the B16 (which would straightened to serve Ft. Hamilton Pkwy).... Both routes (your "B14" and the B16) would run b/w Prospect Park & 86th ... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 18, 2022 Author Share #72 Posted January 18, 2022 6 hours ago, B35 via Church said: Honest mistake. No worries. We posted simultaneously, because I didn't see your map when I made that last reply.... "B12" & "B13": If the idea is to end these routes at the station, you would be leaving people with quite the walk with ending buses at Bay Pkwy/Bay Ridge av... One entrance is way up at 66th/Bay Pkwy... The other entrance is down on Av O/West 8th st.... Btw, Bay Ridge av. stops being bi-directional at 13th av, so those routings as depicted can't happen... "B13": I mean, I get extracting Shore rd. from the B16, but instead of randomly stubbing/dumping ppl. off at Bay Pkwy, this would be much better off serving the commercial part of Kings Hwy. down by the Brighton line.... "B14": By itself, I'd be worried it would garner enough ridership to justify its existence throughout the course of the day... I would do more with it, by having it coupled with the B16 (which would straightened to serve Ft. Hamilton Pkwy).... Both routes (your "B14" and the B16) would run b/w Prospect Park & 86th ... Yeah, regarding the direction issues, NYCDOT needs to make it bi-directional. Now, I could instead reroute up 65th St. I rerouted the B14 via VA Hospital to gain more ridership, and created the B16 which runs from VA Hospital to Parkside Av via Fort Hamilton Parkway. I also extended the B12/B13 to Kings Highway. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 19, 2022 Author Share #73 Posted January 19, 2022 Would routing the B35 down 8th av be a smart move or nah? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted January 19, 2022 Share #74 Posted January 19, 2022 @Lawrence St I don't think the B14/16 can go through Fort Hamilton anymore (I believe that was part of the reason the B8 stopped going through there around 20 years ago or so). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 19, 2022 Author Share #75 Posted January 19, 2022 55 minutes ago, checkmatechamp13 said: @Lawrence St I don't think the B14/16 can go through Fort Hamilton anymore (I believe that was part of the reason the B8 stopped going through there around 20 years ago or so). How come? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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