NJ Transit NewBus - Burlington/Camden/Gloucester

[checkmatechamp13]

Similar to Newark. Information available here: https://www.njtransit.com/newbus-bcg

[DaTransitMan4608]

Well idk what's gonna happen with this one, but I am very eager to see what's gonna happen with the 317. I would be very surprised if it doesn't get split in some fashion.

[B35 via Church]

On 10/11/2021 at 9:14 PM, DaTransitMan4608 said:

Well idk what's gonna happen with this one, but I am very eager to see what's gonna happen with the 317. I would be very surprised if it doesn't get split in some fashion.

I'd be worried that they'd try to phase it out.... Something like combine it with the #413, to have a Philly - Mt. Holly route (the only thing I see ending at Florence RiverLine station {and not even on a full time basis} is the #409)... At best, I think they'd retain the Lakewood - Asbury portion & renumber it the 8 whatever (ex. 839, 840, etc.).... While I think there is some value in connecting the more eastern part of Central Jersey to Philly, the reality is, there's not enough "there" there....

[Mtatransit]

10 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

I'd be worried that they'd try to phase it out.... Something like combine it with the #413, to have a Philly - Mt. Holly route (the only thing I see ending at Florence RiverLine station {and not even on a full time basis} is the #409)... At best, I think they'd retain the Lakewood - Asbury portion & renumber it the 8 whatever (ex. 839, 840, etc.).... While I think there is some value in connecting the more eastern part of Central Jersey to Philly, the reality is, there's not enough "there" there....

Not sure if NJT gets 5311 grants for those extra long South Jersey routes such as 317, 315 etc, so it may serve them better not to phase them out and run them as it

[Tranzitfan81]

On 10/16/2021 at 2:29 AM, B35 via Church said:

I'd be worried that they'd try to phase it out.... Something like combine it with the #413, to have a Philly - Mt. Holly route (the only thing I see ending at Florence RiverLine station {and not even on a full time basis} is the #409)... At best, I think they'd retain the Lakewood - Asbury portion & renumber it the 8 whatever (ex. 839, 840, etc.).... While I think there is some value in connecting the more eastern part of Central Jersey to Philly, the reality is, there's not enough "there" there....

I think this is the smart idea.  The 317 is way too long.  To be honest for local trips from Camden/Phila- Moorestown/Mt. Holly; I have always seen the 317 as the forgotten route.  For one, it runs every 2 hours and the 413 runs very frequent during the rush hours and basically hourly during off peak times.   The only difference is that the 317 stops at Moorestown Mall now which helps when a 413 is running behind.  Of course, that is also the great alternative since the 413 now serves both Moorestown and Cherry Hill Malls.  I would either scale the 317 back to Lakewood or maybe just combine it with the 413.   On the Ocean/Monmouth County End, an 830s bus can take that route,  I think the 317 connects with the 830 in that area anyway pretty much from Point Pleasant to Asbury Park.

[Tranzitfan81]

On 10/6/2021 at 6:27 PM, checkmatechamp13 said:

Similar to Newark. Information available here: https://www.njtransit.com/newbus-bcg

This is going to be very interesting:  I know two routes that definitely need to hit the chopping block: 419 and 451.  Both due to low ridership and I think the 451 is pointless as it runs parallel to PATCO most of the way and the 419 runs parallel to the RiverLine all the way to Riverside.

I am not too sure about the other routes, the 400 and 403 are very long and high performing the entire route.  I am not sure how they can make any improvements with this.

The Mall Routes out of Camden (404, 405, 407, 450, 457)- I think the 457 should be cut in half and only run between Haddonfield and Moorestown Mall.  The 404-405 and 407 are also quite busy but I was wondering if there was some way to combine the 405 and 407 and eliminate that Chapel Avenue service in Cherry Hill.   The 450 is a circular route that is busier on the Camden-Audubon end. But I am guessing enough people still ride it between Cherry Hill and Westmont/Audubon especially since it stops by the Garden State Marketplace on Route 70 and serves the Cherry Hill ACRL stop.  

The 406 is a very busy route as well along Rt 70, I think it should be shared between both Newton Avenue and Washington Twp which will help with the shortage of MCI buses at Washington Twp but also due to the fact that it doesn't really connect with Washington Twp routes outside of Camden. As far as service, maybe scale back some of the rush hour trips to Cherry Hill Industrial Park and Horizon Corporate Center in Mt Laurel.  During the weekday mornings, many buses are back to back. 

Those are my takes so far...it will be interesting how this pans out. 

 

[checkmatechamp13]

Just a heads-uo that March 30th there will be two public hearings, one in the afternoon and one in the evening.

https://www.njtransit.com/newbus-bcg

[Tranzitfan81]

https://www.nj.com/news/2022/03/better-south-jersey-bus-service-needed-for-philly-commute-and-in-rural-areas-riders-tell-nj-transit.html

Well NJ Transit is already doing a big dis-service to their riders in South Jersey.  There are now more routes being scaled back to end in Camden.  No more 317, 408 or 409 and if you're coming from the Shore, no more 313 and 315 to Philadelphia.  Riders have to either wait for another bus in Camden or take PATCO.  

Transfers take time and unfortunately when you get to the Transportation Center; there isn't always a bus coming going to Philadelphia. Coming back to Camden; that is also the same problem, and it could result in a missed bus connection.   PATCO is crowded during the rush hour sometimes standing room only.   They should have sent the 408 and 409 back to Market Street instead of eliminating Philly service altogether. For the 313/315 and 317 they should just go to 30th Street like the 414, 417 and 555.  So now from Route 38 in Cherry Hill or Mount Laurel, you can't go directly to Philadelphia.  The 317 was the last bus directly from Moorestown Mall to Philadelphia.  On the Southern end, the 412 goes to Philadelphia but you have a lot of stops. 

The 551 is now being re-routed to Market Street with the 401, 402, 404, 406, 410 and 412.  That is going to be a weird sight especially in the overnight hours.

This new redesign will be interesting. I really hope they listen to these riders.  A lot of changes need to be made.  I know the riders want 15-minute bus service- so far, the only route in the Camden area that is remotely close to that is the 400.  If they want service frequency, NJT will need more drivers and Turnersville garage will need some more buses which is a whole other story.  

 

[B35 via Church]

What I'd like to know, is what exactly did Greyhound have done at, or inside the bus terminal configuration-wise, to where NJT is now opting to scale back service to Camden on 5 of the 6 routes that terminated inside there (with the #551 now serving all the stops on Market that the rest of the Philly bound NJT routes do)....

[Tranzitfan81]

The article said something about safety concerns, but it shouldn't have constituted scaling the Philadelphia service.   They should have moved the 313, 315 and 317 to 30th street and sent the 408 and 409 back to Market Street. 

[553 Bridgeton]

Once again njt fails. The 551 has no need to be running market, broad. You screwed the 313/315 passengers with  that ride to sea isle and Avalon/Stone Harbor. They virtually killed the ridership on that line;  those people will not want to wait IN WRTC. 30th street was logical for the 313/15/17. 408/409 simply put back on market. This move was a money move and they found where to cut cost. The 316 will be really heavy this summer.
 

South Jersey riders cry and complain to the wrong people most take it out on the bus operator and when you tell them “well go to the meetings” they look dumb founded or “get petitions going” you get the same look. 

[FlxMtroD]

On 4/3/2022 at 3:38 PM, 553 Bridgeton said:

Once again njt fails. The 551 has no need to be running market, broad. You screwed the 313/315 passengers with  that ride to sea isle and Avalon/Stone Harbor. They virtually killed the ridership on that line;  those people will not want to wait IN WRTC. 30th street was logical for the 313/15/17. 408/409 simply put back on market. This move was a money move and they found where to cut cost. The 316 will be really heavy this summer.
 

South Jersey riders cry and complain to the wrong people most take it out on the bus operator and when you tell them “well go to the meetings” they look dumb founded or “get petitions going” you get the same look. 

Seems like NJT don't care about the south as much as they do up here on the north. Finding ways I guess to make riders unhappy and ruin ridership. Literally bringing those buses up north because let's be honest, it's easy money to them. It's no wonder that some political figures and groups want to break apart from NJ Transit and have the south it's own entity because of the poor structure and attention it's not getting

[biGC323232]

On 4/3/2022 at 10:45 AM, B35 via Church said:

What I'd like to know, is what exactly did Greyhound have done at, or inside the bus terminal configuration-wise, to where NJT is now opting to scale back service to Camden on 5 of the 6 routes that terminated inside there (with the #551 now serving all the stops on Market that the rest of the Philly bound NJT routes do)....

From what i heard..Greyhound suppose to had redone the inside of the term..Making it unsafe for buses to board ppl...

[njbus86]

This article explains what the problems supposedly were:

 

Greyhound defends terminal reconfiguration in Philly - WHYY

 

 

 

[553 Bridgeton]

This is sickening. As I said njt found an easy way to cut cost that’s all it boils down to. 
 

The X345s have a wider wheelbase then the D4500CTs, and the X345s make that turn without going up on the curb. The line of sight with the new config is actually better because your backing to the drivers side. 

[mfs NJT459]

One seat ride service to be restored in Philly this summer

313/315 will follow 414/417/555 trippers to 30th Street

317/408/409 will follow the Race, Market, Broad, Vine Street loop

https://www.nj.com/news/2022/04/commuters-will-get-direct-nj-transit-buses-to-philly-back-in-june-heres-how-theyre-doing-it.html

Edited April 29, 2022 by mfs NJT459