DeCamp ending commuter service effective April 7th

[46Dover]

https://baristanet.com/2023/03/say-it-aint-so-decamp-calls-it-quits-will-cease-commuter-services-to-nyc-effective-april-7/?fbclid=IwAR1yppIuP1xQcD5OQdayeGcAZLkjG8T5F1mXNp2yoyjeft7pvCNrj5spgfU

[Lil 57]

I’m hoping NJ transit can take over in the near future to fill the gap in service, given that the commuter bus fleet will most likely go back to them. Sucks to see a bus company end service.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

2 hours ago, Lil 57 said:

I’m hoping NJ transit can take over in the near future to fill the gap in service, given that the commuter bus fleet will most likely go back to them.

 

...unless DeCamp tries to keep the state-owned buses.

[46Dover]

20 minutes ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

 

...unless DeCamp tries to keep the state-owned buses.

NJT would probably want them back 

[Lawrence St]

36 minutes ago, 46Dover said:

NJT would probably want them back 

NJT wants them back. They ain’t giving away buses for charters lol.

[checkmatechamp13]

The bright side is if NJT takes over, those buses will be fully integrated with the rest of the system in terms of the fares (you can use the app, you can use the monthly passes on other routes, get transfers, etc). Plus NJT would probably operate open-door rather than the current pickup/drop-off policy.

[Lawrence St]

28 minutes ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

The bright side is if NJT takes over, those buses will be fully integrated with the rest of the system in terms of the fares (you can use the app, you can use the monthly passes on other routes, get transfers, etc). Plus NJT would probably operate open-door rather than the current pickup/drop-off policy.

With what personelle is NJT going to take over those routes? They barely have enough to cover the stuff they have now!

[go25]

1 hour ago, Lawrence St said:

With what personelle is NJT going to take over those routes? They barely have enough to cover the stuff they have now!

Oh, they have personnel, just some of them just don't want to work

[Tranzitfan81]

4 hours ago, 46Dover said:

NJT would probably want them back 

They need them back, some of those buses(17Ks) can come down to Southern NJ ( Egg Harbor Twp and Washington Twp-Turnersville) where they're needed desperately. 

[FlxMtroD]

This even made the New York Times. 

I know the garages down south need some cruisers and heck even Wayne needs some to replace some of their 9000s. Wayne would be the garage to take over DeCamp's 33 and 66 route and just number it in the 330s. Shift the former Market Street Garages 164X to Oradell and 148 to either Oradell or Westwood.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/20/nyregion/nj-nyc-decamp-bus.html

 

[FlxMtroD]

8 hours ago, Lil 57 said:

I’m hoping NJ transit can take over in the near future to fill the gap in service, given that the commuter bus fleet will most likely go back to them. Sucks to see a bus company end service.

It sucks that not enough or no COVID aid wasn't given to family run, small, mid size and some large private/ charter carriers while transit gets all the dough. That's why you been reading and hearing companies and family run businesses folding up, besides the change in rider behavior and companies allowing hybrid work from home and such

[Gotham Bus Co.]

22 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

NJT wants them back. They ain’t giving away buses for charters lol.

 

Don't the various private companies use state-owned buses for charters anyway?

[553 Bridgeton]

21 hours ago, Tranzitfan81 said:

They need them back, some of those buses(17Ks) can come down to Southern NJ ( Egg Harbor Twp and Washington Twp-Turnersville) where they're needed desperately. 

Currently the 18000s at EHT are getting swapped with newton Av 19000s going to EHT. 

[Lil 57]

4 hours ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

 

Don't the various private companies use state-owned buses for charters anyway?

They are not supposed to since NJT still owns and maintains those buses, but that doesn't mean that they are gonna listen to them.

[go25]

22 minutes ago, Lil 57 said:

They are not supposed to since NJT still owns and maintains those buses, but that doesn't mean that they are gonna listen to them.

That would be Academy. But stranger things have happened before.

[JAzumah]

1 hour ago, Lil 57 said:

They are not supposed to since NJT still owns and maintains those buses, but that doesn't mean that they are gonna listen to them.

It isn't that simple. NJT understands that those charters help balance the books. Charters should not be happening at the expense of commuter services, but NJT also knows that they do not have the cost structure to run all of that service themselves. Making everything NJT would leave you with less service overall.

[Lawrence St]

7 hours ago, JAzumah said:

It isn't that simple. NJT understands that those charters help balance the books. Charters should not be happening at the expense of commuter services, but NJT also knows that they do not have the cost structure to run all of that service themselves. Making everything NJT would leave you with less service overall.

Perhaps if NJT had a program that would let family owned school bus companies operate some NJT routes it would help everyone.

[JAzumah]

5 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Perhaps if NJT had a program that would let family owned school bus companies operate some NJT routes it would help everyone.

Those school bus companies would need to show up to the RFP information sessions and then NJT would tell them exactly how to qualify. The packages are a bit large right now, but I am certain those would be broken up if smaller carriers offered real savings without compromising safety.

[JLiu15]

If NJT takes them back, that means there would be a continuous block of NJT-livery 17xxx cruisers 17063-17120. I could see some going to Wayne to replace the 7100s and 9000s and Oradell to finally replace the remaining D4000s. I doubt they'd go to South Jersey as South Jersey is supposed to get the bulk of the D45 CRTs.

[GojiMet86]

1 hour ago, JLiu15 said:

If NJT takes them back, that means there would be a continuous block of NJT-livery 17xxx cruisers 17063-17120. I could see some going to Wayne to replace the 7100s and 9000s and Oradell to finally replace the remaining D4000s. I doubt they'd go to South Jersey as South Jersey is supposed to get the bulk of the D45 CRTs.

50 buses are more than enough to replace the 28~30 D4000s that are left. Although I do wonder if NJT is thinking of taking over the DeCamp lines, maybe at reduced service. In that case, they would still need some buses.

Edited March 23, 2023 by GojiMet86

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Ironically enough regarding this whole situation, they're discontinuing commuter service and eliminating all these lines on Good Friday. Oops!

The only thing I can see NJT doing route-wise without actually extending or creating new routes for now, is to gut the boarding restrictions through Nutley and Lyndhurst on the 192/199 and adding stops along the way. Otherwise, you'd be left with a situation where some sections in those areas get only off-peak service not no peak direction service. That would also mean that the 199 would effectively be a 192, eliminating the need for that number. 

Edited March 23, 2023 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[46Dover]

10 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Ironically enough regarding this whole situation, they're discontinuing commuter service and eliminating all these lines on Good Friday. Oops!

The only thing I can see NJT doing route-wise without actually extending or creating new routes for now, is to gut the boarding restrictions through Nutley and Lyndhurst on the 192/199 and adding stops along the way. Otherwise, you'd be left with a situation where some sections in those areas get only off-peak service not no peak direction service. That would also mean that the 199 would effectively be a 192, eliminating the need for that number. 

Used to be when DeCamp was shut down, we cross honored their tickets on the 199 when I ran during rush hour.  I remember being caught off guard when one gave me a DeCamp ticket, but when a whole gang of them came on board, like the saying goes “one is an accident, two is a trend”, I ended up going with the trend.

[Cait Sith]

On 3/20/2023 at 5:38 PM, Lawrence St said:

NJT wants them back. They ain’t giving away buses for charters lol.

Funny enough, Decamp used those buses on charters heavily...used to see them in Queens often.

On 3/21/2023 at 4:36 PM, Gotham Bus Co. said:

 

Don't the various private companies use state-owned buses for charters anyway?

Yep.

On 3/21/2023 at 8:52 PM, Lil 57 said:

They are not supposed to since NJT still owns and maintains those buses, but that doesn't mean that they are gonna listen to them.

Own, but not maintain.

Academy uses their buses often for charters and railroad shuttles in Long Island. Saddle River(before they got shitcanned by NJT for their nonsense) used those 17000s and 18000s on charters regularly. Coach USA used theirs mostly on LIRR/MNRR shuttles.

What NJT actually has a problem with is the carriers using buses outside of the territories they operate in or around. Saddle River got a lot of flack for running the state-owned buses on Greyhound routes when Greyhound was short on buses and personnel a few years back. One of them made it all the way to Washington DC, and folks at NJT were not happy.

Edited March 23, 2023 by Cait Sith

[Lex]

35 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

Funny enough, Decamp used those buses on charters heavily...used to see them in Queens often.

Yep.

Own, but not maintain.

Academy uses their buses often for charters and railroad shuttles in Long Island. Saddle River(before they got shitcanned by NJT for their nonsense) used those 17000s and 18000s on charters regularly. Coach USA used theirs mostly on LIRR/MNRR shuttles.

What NJT actually has a problem with is the carriers using buses outside of the territories they operate in or around. Saddle River got a lot of flack for running the state-owned buses on Greyhound routes when Greyhound was short on buses and personnel a few years back. One of them made it all the way to Washington DC, and folks at NJT were not happy.

This is exactly the sort of thing that leads me to believe arrangements like these aren't simply less than ideal, but actually terrible.

Edited March 23, 2023 by Lex

[Gotham Bus Co.]

On 3/21/2023 at 10:33 PM, JAzumah said:

Charters should not be happening at the expense of commuter services....

 

Doesn't it, though? Don't the private companies take state money for commuter runs but divert some drivers and buses to charters?