metsfan Posted February 12, 2009 Share #1 Posted February 12, 2009 NJ transit is officially asking for bids to replace its aging budd arrow 3 EMU fleet. We all knew this day would come, i wonder what each builder/consortium will offer? http://www.app.com/article/20090210/NEWS03/902100314 - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 12, 2009 Share #2 Posted February 12, 2009 I just hope they stay away from the ROTEM oversized subway car known as a Silverliner V. Maybe something similar to the M8 being developed for CDOT/MNRR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share #3 Posted February 12, 2009 I just hope they stay away from the ROTEM oversized subway car known as a Silverliner V. Maybe something similar to the M8 being developed for CDOT/MNRR. I agree. They need serious equipment, not some overstuffed subway car. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 13, 2009 Share #4 Posted February 13, 2009 I might have to make my own mock up of an M7(since there are only photos of the real mockup M8) in NJT paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 13, 2009 Author Share #5 Posted February 13, 2009 I might have to make my own mock up of an M7(since there are only photos of the real mockup M8) in NJT paint. Nice. Post it here if you end up doing it. I wonder if brookville would make them? The BL20GH is doing well, and they appear to be able to construct EMU. What about GE? I think GE could make some really sexy top of the line EMU for (NJT). I would like to see an american company make them. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 13, 2009 Share #6 Posted February 13, 2009 I would like an American company but at the same time I want them to be good for the long haul like the arrow IIIs have been. I'm sure if GE was interested they could do something but my bets are Bombardier,Kawasaki and Rotem will be the bidders, maybe Siemens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 13, 2009 Author Share #7 Posted February 13, 2009 GE needs the business right now. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 13, 2009 Share #8 Posted February 13, 2009 No they don't they have freight engine contracts. What they need is to shed some companies that can't help them. GE as an entire company is having some trouble but GE transportation is fine, they have more than enough business from the freight railroads and other foreign railroads. Also I don't think GE will be interested because this would be a one time contract with no other roads looking to buy, so there is some risk involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 13, 2009 Author Share #9 Posted February 13, 2009 No they don't they have freight engine contracts. What they need is to shed some companies that can't help them. GE as an entire company is having some trouble but GE transportation is fine, they have more than enough business from the freight railroads and other foreign railroads. Also I don't think GE will be interested because this would be a one time contract with no other roads looking to buy, so there is some risk involved. Correct, however if they did build the new EMU fleet & ht a home run i can see future business between GE and (NJT), and possibly . Those new locomotives are amazing and would compliment the PL42AC perfectly. Would be interesting to see EMU and hybrid diesel from GE at a place like hoboken next to each other with the PL42AC. Those cats & geeps aren't going to last forever..... :cool: - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 13, 2009 Share #10 Posted February 13, 2009 The PL42 from an operational standpoint have been a nightmare. It has not been an uncommon sight for a Geep to come and take one away to replace it. I hope this changes but until then the Geeps are safe. A hybrid EMU/DMU would be great especially since then would have no reason for not expanding service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forest Glen Posted February 13, 2009 Share #11 Posted February 13, 2009 Why not just order more Bilevel coaches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 13, 2009 Share #12 Posted February 13, 2009 Why not just order more Bilevel coaches? You mean Multilevels B). They are not a problem solver for every case, such as the Gladstone branch along with the Princeton Dinky. Also I think to replace all the Arrows with Multilevels would mean for longer dwell times which many trains can't handle if they are to keep on schedule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 13, 2009 Author Share #13 Posted February 13, 2009 You mean Multilevels B). They are not a problem solver for every case, such as the Gladstone branch along with the Princeton Dinky. Also I think to replace all the Arrows with Multilevels would mean for longer dwell times which many trains can't handle if they are to keep on schedule. Correct. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiple_unit#Advantages The reason why EMU are good to have with push/pull, is because they are good at running local, where push/pull are better for express. Of course they can be used interchangeably on the schedule, however you will notice a difference in braking acceleration and dwell time when they do change it up. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamaica Express Posted February 14, 2009 Share #14 Posted February 14, 2009 While I do LOVE push pull consist...I do agree that thet aren't the best for everything....especially on the electric hoboken lines...I was looking at an M&E schedule the other day from 1979 and comparing it to the schedule now..and travel times today take double if not triple the times they took back then In my Opinion the only Push-Pull trains that should be on the M&E are the Dover Express trains and of course diesel trains to points west of electrification The Montclair line is SCREAMING for EMU's with how close those stations are...using push-pull trains on that line almost seems preposterous...the same goes for Summit/Gladstone locals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 14, 2009 Share #15 Posted February 14, 2009 How about just the fact that the Multilevels have problems because of their weight and the grades up there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 14, 2009 Author Share #16 Posted February 14, 2009 Those lines usually get toasters. I'd bet alp-46a will allow longer multilevel trains, and service where it isnt common now. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 14, 2009 Share #17 Posted February 14, 2009 The ALP46a's are going to be rated for 125 supposedly so I think if anything they might be seen more often than not on the Corridor not in slow service on the M&E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 14, 2009 Author Share #18 Posted February 14, 2009 Yea, true, perhaps simply free up alp-46 currently in service for more trains. They still have ~100 more multilevels to take delivery of. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 14, 2009 Share #19 Posted February 14, 2009 That I could see, there is also a rumor floating around that the 46's will get their speed upped as well, but like I sadi its only a rumor. Frankly I want to see the 44's rebuilt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 14, 2009 Author Share #20 Posted February 14, 2009 That I could see, there is also a rumor floating around that the 46's will get their speed upped as well, but like I sadi its only a rumor. Frankly I want to see the 44's rebuilt. They will likely get clearance to 125. If they get a full pass to 125 i can see many more trains per hour on the :nec:. Toaster will get rebuilt starting 2012 i think, they may get electronics upgrades that make them more robust and less prone to slippy slip. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaback9 Posted February 14, 2009 Share #21 Posted February 14, 2009 I hear as soon as the 46a's are in service the 44s go out for the needed rebuilds. So 2012 would be a good guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Kreszl Posted February 14, 2009 Share #22 Posted February 14, 2009 The PL42 from an operational standpoint have been a nightmare. It has not been an uncommon sight for a Geep to come and take one away to replace it. I hope this changes but until then the Geeps are safe. A hybrid EMU/DMU would be great especially since then would have no reason for not expanding service. Here are a couple of examples of a PL42AC being pulled away by a GP40PH-2B http://erickreszl.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1318114 http://erickreszl.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1465096 http://erickreszl.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1490951 http://erickreszl.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1490952 Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 15, 2009 Author Share #23 Posted February 15, 2009 Yea, aside from age related issues those are very reliable. Once in a while a HEP issue will come up, but otherwise i've seen more of the PL42AC at hoboken yard/MMC than the geeps, and in fact i've only seen the PL42AC outnumber the geeps on the :rvl: at newark, and i'm sure this is a timing thing, because i'm usually on the trenton bound side of nwk in the evening peak times. Lately though it was P40DC, a TON of cat's interspersed with the PL42AC. As far as new EMU, i can say that the arrow 3's are more reliable than their silver (3 not 2) relatives in livery, however they are beginning to show their age here and there and do need replacement ASAP to avoid any not-good stuff like a derailment etc. The train that was stuck in the tunnel the other day was an EMU, the train stuck just outside the tunnel few weeks ago EMU, the train stuck near sec was EMU, my train back from macys parade experienced a 15 second total blackout (we were coasting in silence with emergency lights on) and was not related to a phase gap (which is farther north than we were going trenton bound). Just a few hours ago i was on a train home from NYP after oogling the ACES consist, lights had a rapid "on then off then on" spasm then went dark and emergency lights came on after 7-8 seconds of the "light switch" style flickering..... I didn't pay it any mind at all, because i know EMU do the "still going but HEP off" from time to time, but it's getting worse. I am sure it was a transformer farting or some other quasi-EOL issue. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted February 15, 2009 Share #24 Posted February 15, 2009 Can Comet VIs run on the Gladstone branch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metsfan Posted February 15, 2009 Author Share #25 Posted February 15, 2009 Can Comet VIs run on the Gladstone branch? Not sure. Those are multilevels not part of or related to the comet/shoreliner series just FYI. I'm pretty sure they can operate anywhere especially if they can fit through the east river and sunnyside yard access tunnels. They are purpose built low profile high speed multilevel vehicles with 3 distinct seating areas. The only thing that may limit them is the weight as they are about 2.3x heavier than comet 5. But that brings back another point, that locomotives are far heavier than even these pax cars and are obviously used on the line many times a day. In any case it may be due to track condition on that line vs loading gauge issues if they aren't able to. - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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