R10 2952 Posted June 10, 2009 Share #1 Posted June 10, 2009 I've been thinking about this for some time. Let's try to predict/ and answer the questions as thoughtfully and thoroughly as possible. -WHAT IF the R-10, R-14, R-15, R-16, R-17, and R-21/22 had all been fully rebuilt, and repainted into Redbird/greenbird paint schemes? -WHAT IF the R-27/30s had been sucessfully rebuilt (in other words, rebuilt by Morrison-Knudsen, and with A/C) and kept past 1993? -WHAT IF Rush-hour express Service ran on all the currently dis-used bi-directional express tracks (Like the Uptown , or Brooklyn )? -WHAT IF the , , , and <R> trains still ran today? -WHAT IF the Christie Street Connection was still used? -WHAT IF the Nassau St. Line was fully used (Chambers Street Loop, currently abandoned platforms, etc.)? -WHAT IF most of the Elevated lines still existed, albeit with improvements? -WHAT IF each yard ran trains of every car class? (For example, R32-R160 on the line) -WHAT IF Redbirds had ran regularly on the lines? -WHAT IF R-62s and R-68s were still singles? -WHAT IF the R-40 Slants had all been built as Single cars? -WHAT IF the ran from 71st. Ave. to Church Ave.? -WHAT IF all train cars had been rebuilt in 1987-1991 to look the same as they had pre-GOH? I can't think of anything else, but if all the above HAD happened, I would have been very happy. What do you guys think things would be like if all of the above had happened?:cool::tup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcconnell Posted June 10, 2009 Share #2 Posted June 10, 2009 Some R10s actually were painted into the "greenbird" paint scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R10 2952 Posted June 10, 2009 Author Share #3 Posted June 10, 2009 Some R10s actually were painted into the "greenbird" paint scheme. Yeah, I know. I wasn't really focusing on ONLY the R-10s, though. And I also meant what it would be like if they had been REBUILT, not just repainted.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan Railer Posted June 10, 2009 Share #4 Posted June 10, 2009 Slants would have been better as 4 and 5 car sets, with one end slant, and the other a modified, so, here's a ten car set of what i'm talking about: AS-B-B-B-AM+AM-B-B-B-AS AS= Slant AM= Modified Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maserati7200 Posted June 10, 2009 Share #5 Posted June 10, 2009 -WHAT IF the R-27/30s had been sucessfully rebuilt (in other words, rebuilt by Morrison-Knudsen, and with A/C) and kept past 1993? -WHAT IF the Nassau St. Line was fully used (Chambers Street Loop, currently abandoned platforms, etc.)? -WHAT IF most of the Elevated lines still existed, albeit with improvements? If the R27/R30 was sccefully rebuilt and had A/C, I'd say it would have lasted until 2001-2002 aand get replaced by the R143. In addition, there would be less R68/A's. If the Nassau street line was fully used Grand street ( would have never existed. In addition 6th avenue trains would not be able to go over the Manhattan bridge. Part of the crystie street connection put 6th ave traisn on the Manhattan bridge, but this took away the connection to the Nassau street line. We might even see trains go over the Manhattan Bridge. If most elevated lines existed, well one thing the in Brooklyn wouldn't exist. See, the BRT (BMT) had an elevated line over Fulton street since the late 1800's. Then the IND came over, and tore most of it down for its subway (some is still left, you 80th street to Lefferts BLVD is the original el). In the 1920's, before the IND existed, the BMT wanted to strengthen the Fulton el (so subway trains can run instead of el cars) and extend it to the DeKalb Avenue (the same station where the ( stop) to then go over the Manhattan bridge or the Monatgue street tunnel to Manhattan. Of course Mayor Hylan and his corrupt fashion would not allow it to happen. Another thing, if the 5th Avenue el in Brooklyn still existed the West end line would use the lower level of 9th Avenue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EE Broadway Local Posted September 12, 2009 Share #6 Posted September 12, 2009 What If: The Second Avenue Subway had been built as started on October 27, 1972 and was operating today from Whitehall to The Bronx? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KNIGHTRIDER3:16 Posted September 12, 2009 Share #7 Posted September 12, 2009 What if the mets could win A world series lol Nah I like these what if's they make ya think but one stands out in my head What if the <R> were running well the <R>could replace the train could be skip stop service again O the (K)I would like to see this come back and it be nice to run it with the line (W)wll what if .. looks better then just the plain ol' <R> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Concourse Posted September 12, 2009 Share #8 Posted September 12, 2009 What If: The Second Avenue Subway had been built as started on October 27, 1972 and was operating today from Whitehall to The Bronx? I had something similar: What if the IND started building the SAS rather than the 6th Av express tracks? Thus making the B/D/F/V sharing the same tracks for some if not all of 6th Av till Broadway-Lafayette. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32 3348 Posted September 12, 2009 Share #9 Posted September 12, 2009 If all the Els weren't torn down by the IND then we would have a much more functional rapid transit system in New York. Almost all of the IND was built to compete with existing IRT and BMT lines in order to run them out of business. Once the IND system was completed, and plans for a second system had come around, the Great Depression hit and there was no more money to expand. If the IND constructed lines where there was no pre-existing transit service (like they did with the QB line), we would have lines such as a Utica Ave. subway and maybe even a line branching out to Staten Island. Instead, much of the IND construction (i.e. Grand Concourse, 8th Ave. Line, 6th Ave. line, Fulton St. line, proposed SAS) focused on competition with the IRT/BMT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Concourse Posted September 12, 2009 Share #10 Posted September 12, 2009 Agreed, the Fulton El was probably torn down much too soon and replaced by a subway. I'm sure Brooklyn riders there were happy the el was gone, but the IND should've focused on replacing the 2nd Av el with a subway than to tear down the Fulton El. I'd go one more step further in saying the IND should've taken the Jamaica el segment [either replacing it with a subway or leave it as is] and making it another branch from Fulton or 'swaping' with the J/Z so the J/Z would run to Lefferts and the Rockaways.* *something I might do for a fantasy map in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted September 12, 2009 Share #11 Posted September 12, 2009 What If: The Second Avenue Subway had been built as started on October 27, 1972 and was operating today from Whitehall to The Bronx? Then, the R44s would be zipping by at 77 mph! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted September 12, 2009 Share #12 Posted September 12, 2009 Then, the R44s would be zipping by at 77 mph! Yeah, they'd be zipping by at 77MPH and then the next thing you know, you're sitting on just seats with no carbody around you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #13 Posted September 13, 2009 Yeah, they'd be zipping by at 77MPH and then the next thing you know, you're sitting on just seats with no carbody around you Did you know that they were intended to hit 77 mph on the SAS if it was built in the 70s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #14 Posted September 13, 2009 Did you know that they were intended to hit 77 mph on the SAS if it was built in the 70s? Yeah, when they were new Now they're rusty as hell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #15 Posted September 13, 2009 Yeah, when they were new Now they're rusty as hell Rust doesn't bother me as long as I can sleep inside the train on a comfy bucket seat in the corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #16 Posted September 13, 2009 Rust doesn't bother me as long as I can sleep inside the train on a comfy bucket seat in the corner. Oh it will when you wake up with no carbody around you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #17 Posted September 13, 2009 Oh it will when you wake up with no carbody around you I don't get why you complain about the minor rusting when you favorited these trains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #18 Posted September 13, 2009 I don't get why you complain about the minor rusting when you favorited these trains. I aint complaining I like 'em It's a joke you know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #19 Posted September 13, 2009 I aint complaining I like 'em It's a joke you know Well, it doesn't quite sound like you're joking. If I must allude, then perhaps you should check out what the haters say about them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #20 Posted September 13, 2009 Well, it doesn't quite sound like you're joking. If I must allude, then perhaps you should check out what the haters say about them. that's because they're haters...I don't get how people don't like the 44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #21 Posted September 13, 2009 that's because they're haters...I don't get how people don't like the 44 Other than rust, the reasons are the same as those striking the R68. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRG Posted September 13, 2009 Share #22 Posted September 13, 2009 Not this again. We can go back and forth and debate on how much the R44s suck or not (the R44s DO have flaws, albeit minor, which I will not bring up), but this is NOT an R44 thread. I've come across several threads that somehow transformed into an R44 debate. Let's please get back on topic. How about this: what if the subway was extended into Staten Island??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfan22 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #23 Posted September 13, 2009 Hehe, this thread reminds of the song "What IF" lol.... Interesting What IF questions in the OP. Also What IF pataki wasn't NY's Govenor? Our bus fleet could have been much diffent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #24 Posted September 13, 2009 what if the Manhattan Bridge never closed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRG Posted September 13, 2009 Share #25 Posted September 13, 2009 what if the Manhattan Bridge never closed? Then it would have basically fell apart! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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