TDL

16 hours ago, NoHacksJustKhaks said:

yeah personally. I'd NEVER consider this as a route off the Rockaway peninsula. Not into the city, and not even into most parts of Brooklyn for that matter...

if it were our only way off the peninsula, I'd say it qualify as cruel and unusual punishment 

It should exist, even if only as microtransit. No reason a 45-minute drive is a two-hour commute

On 5/25/2024 at 3:01 AM, Kamen Rider said:

okay 1: Can you go FIVE MINTUES without suggesting another service up the SAS? seriously? I know that's your old neck of the woods, but come on...

second, we don't have room for that "short turn" platform, especially since, you know, the airport is two stops away. If you told me you wanted to build a third platform at Howard beach, I could understand that that actually could be justifiable... but the casino is never going to be the traffic generator that would justify short turns, even under these circumstances. 

they are not going to put a bus on BCD.

no it isn't and no it is definitely not. operationally that makes no sense. 

You know, I had to put up with 2 months of zero train service and 8 months of single-track shuttles every 10-20 minutes all day when they rebuilt the Myrtle el in 2017-2018... and nobody cared. nobody complained. no one raised a high holy stink about how "unfair" it was. Now, when someone else is inconvenienced, some people try to move heaven and earth to placate them... and in my sorry state, all I still get are people trying to take my service... and coming soon, my regular job, away for the sake of their pet projects.   

 

heck, you know what Rockaway has right now, that I don't? 

24/7 direct service to midtown Manhattan. I have to transfer twice to the same late nights. every other station in the subway can get to the 42nd Street super station with only one or two seats, even after midnight. I need three.  

A shuttle every 10-20 minutes is better than having to wait for an infrequent train every 10-20 minutes and THEN having to take a shuttle bus. That’s why the shuttle buses should run nonstop from Rockaway Blvd to Mott, NOT Howard Beach, so that Rockaway customers can use any  train

If Ozone Park temporarily loses an express it’s for the greater good and fair compensation. If  to Lefferts or a Q116/117/119 really isn’t possible, have the non stop shuttles from Mott serve either Lefferts Or Howard Beach (one bus non stop to Howard Beach, the other non stop to Lefferts). Why? Because Rockaway riders should not have to suffer the same unreliable 20 minute headways they do now at some points of the day just to board a train that only takes them to a shuttle bus.

But the QM16/17 should expand and the  should definitely be fair free to avoid a double fare zone or wasting paper to print tens of thousands of GO tickets.

14 hours ago, Kamen Rider said:

we need to work on your understanding of sarcasm...

 

You are going way too overboard with these extra buses on the peninsula. they're overlapping too much.

Just as an example, at Beach 90th at the height of the rush, you'll have the Q22, the Q52 SBS, the Q116, the Q117, the Q119 and the QM17 all jockeying for bus stop space. 

Your Q116 suggestion does not need to go to Far Rockaway and the Q117 does not need to exist at all. 

Q116 is on RBB, Q117 on Beach Channel Drive. Two different roadways. 

On 5/8/2024 at 1:35 PM, TheNextGen2009 said:

Extending the route to the middle of nowhere. I don't see this lasting long. 

 

Eh, I personally think the n32 should've gotten the express variant.

Definitely the n32 should have. Its wayy more direct. Or for a tru express it should run via. Peninsula Blvd.

21 minutes ago, FLX9304 said:

Q115 is part of the redesign plan 

Q116 & Q117 are available 

You're absolutely right. 

REVISED Proposal

1) LIRR Cross Honoring

2) Q116 Limited Bus

   Far Rockaway-Brooklyn College via. Beach Channel Dr.

3) Q117 LIMITED

   Far Rockaway-Sheepshead Bay vía. Rockaway Beach Blvd.

4) Q118-Howard Beach/Lefferts Blvd-Mott Ave FREE Shuttle Bus. This way passengers can use either  train

5) Q119-Rockaway Blvd-Beach 90 Street FREE Shuttle Bus, stopping at Broad Channel.

6)  train Far Rock-Rock Pk, FARE FREE

7) QM16/QM17 off peak and weekend service

8)NYC Ferry enhanced service. Extend Rockaway Ferry to DUMBO after Wall St for Downtown Brooklyn Connections. Extend St. George Ferry to Sunset Pk so the West Side is accessible with a transfer.

1 minute ago, TDL said:

Definitely an idea. Or some sort of express microbus to Lower Manhattan (in lieu of the Q115/116 idea). If it uses microbuses similar to Access-a-Ride it can use the Belt Parkway. After stopping in Rockaway it can run non stop via the Belt/BQE terminating at Fulton Center.

However a Q115/116 would probably cost less and can use standard buses, only using the Belt Pkwy between exits 11 and 9.

23 minutes ago, Robert Spire said:

I would like to see off peak QM16 and QM17 service to be part of the plan. 

Definitely an idea. Or some sort of express microbus to Lower Manhattan (in lieu of the Q115/116 idea). If it uses microbuses similar to Access-a-Ride it can use the Belt Parkway. After stopping in Rockaway it can run non stop via the Belt/BQE terminating at Fulton Center.

4 minutes ago, NoHacksJustKhaks said:

you know, I'd love a hovercraft right about now XD. 

But yeah, this is gonna be a massive pain, and i dont think i've ever heard of that idea of turning 105 into a terminal station. That's exceptionally bizzare sounding to me, maybe because Broad channel is also very low lying.

They want a terminus not flood prone so that if another Sandy happens, the  or can run from Mott/Inwood-105th, since Rockaway Park is flood prone.

7 hours ago, Kingsbridgeviewer382 said:

The article mentions that LIRR cross honoring is part of the plan for the Rockaways shutdowns. The Rockaway Shuttle is planned to run between Rockaway Park & Far Rockaway (not fare-free) during the planned shutdown period.

Also, putting more strain on Lefferts would not be a good idea as  trains are still going to terminate there during the time the Rockaways are inaccessible and Howard Beach would not be able to handle all the  trains that would be taken off Lefferts if the  were to go there instead. All I see from that is Ozone Park riders complaining about the service reduction with putting the  there during the planned shutdowns.

For buses, the only planned things are beefed up service on the existing routes on top of a non-stop shuttle between Howard Beach & Far Rock, plus a shuttle between Beach 67th & Broad Channel. Not sure how a 35 Limited would be beneficial for  train riders that don't go to Flatbush aside from adding travel time to get to the alternate  and  service.

How many tph can Howard Beach turn? If inadequate, then some shuttle buses should originate from Lefferts Blvd non stop to Mott. No need to have your trains infrequent AND not going where you're going. 

I do think there should be connections to the  for Downtown Brooklyn/Lower Manhattan access. 

Just like after Sandy, there should be three legged transfers. The Q115/116 mitigates the need for those however. 

The  should be fare free to reduce the need for GO tickets or a double fare being charged. 

7 hours ago, Kamen Rider said:

Sure, and while we’re at it, let’s give them a hovercraft….

 

Great idea!

https://qns.com/2023/06/mta-rockaway-resiliency-project/
 

It’s sad that this hasn’t been publicized more. Meanwhile the  shutdown and the  swap was advertised extensively. This will be a SEVERE disruption to a transit desert. 
 

It would be nice if we could single track across the bridge and flats! But since we can’t, I propose the following to mitigate the damage.

1) LIRR Cross Honoring

2) Q115 Limited Bus

   Far Rockaway-Brooklyn College via. Beach Channel Dr.

3) Q116 LIMITED

   Far Rockaway-Sheepshead Bay vía. Rockaway Beach Blvd.

4)  to Lefferts. Don’t split the  AND make shuttle buses required.

5) Howard Beach-Mott Ave Shuttle Bus

6) Rockaway Blvd-Beach 90 Street vía. Broad Channel Shuttle Bus.

7)  train Far Rock-Rock Pk, FARE FREE

10 hours ago, MTA Researcher said:

You know what? Forget 2 Av … 

 

2 Av is taking forever and it’s very flawed…

 

Why not focus on QueensLink? The infrastructure is already there, just needs reactivation. Thus I would do this:

  Far Rockaway - Brighton Beach: RBB line - QBL Local - 63rd - 6 Av/Brighton Express

 Rockaway Pk - 95 St: RBB line - QBL Local - 60th - Bway/4 Av Express stopping at 45 and 53 Sts.

 

Rockaway Blvd would be rebuilt to connect  at Lefferts Platform,    at lower level RBB platform. 

Aside from this I have other ideas I won’t disclose because let’s stay on topic regarding which lines should go to Lefferts and Rockaways and if 2 Av is really necessary…

 

I'd do it this way.

 as is to Far Rockaway for the Brooklyn Connection

-Metropolitan Ave-Rockaway Pk.

-QBL Local to 71st Ave

- Howard Beach/JFK- 161 Yankee Stadium, via. RBB, Junction Blvd-LGA, Rikers Island, 161st Street. This line would connect with the  at Junction Blvd, LGA Airport, any new Rikers Island development once the jail closes, Hunts Point Ave , Intervale Ave , and Yankee Stadium .

15 hours ago, Theli11 said:

Like an East River loop route? Not sure if anyone is incentivized to take the  when you can just take... almost any East River route for faster service.

This route only benefits you if you need to go from East Harlem to Clinton Hill/Bed-Stuy. There's better routes.

South Ferry doesn't need more trains considering the fact that 5 lines are already in the area, I think Brooklyn is the best route for the SAS

If there's money for a new tunnel, that is

11 hours ago, Wallyhorse said:

Accidentally hit send before I finished, resuming:

would run eventually from 125/Lenox or further west to Euclid Avenue, extended overnights to Lefferts Boulevard.  This would run via a new Remsen Street tunnel from likely Hanover Square, which would in Brooklyn have a stop around Court Street that would include transfers to the and current ( late nights) and as I would eventually have it my version of the  and "Yellow " at Court.  I would be looking to build this to at least Chatham Square even ahead of Phase 3 to it at least is running to lower Manhattan.  It would then come in on the unused local track at Hoyt-Schermerhorn and run as the Fulton Local.  In Manhattan, Seaport if possible also a transfer point between the and all trains in the Fulton complex,

and would both run express on Fulton at all times ( except late nights) to Lefferts (as noted replaced by the late nights) while the  is on a 4/3 split between Far Rockaway and Rockaway Park with either the only operating late nights from Broad Channel-Rockaway Park OR the running as a 6 TPH line late nights, equally split between Far Rockaway and Rockaway Park so one of the two branches runs every 20 minutes. 

In the suggestion I proposed, Montague would only have two services,  and . No need for anything else.  can end in Hanover Sq or be extended to South Ferry for transit connections.

Just now, TDL said:

Yes. Many many MANY times. If you REALLY want to do that, have your  run from Bay Ridge-Broadway Junction, and then have the real  (which we will call ) run from Astoria-Euclid Ave. Save the cost of building a whole new tunnel.

And leave 2nd Ave as is, with an extension from Hanover Sq to South Ferry

39 minutes ago, Wallyhorse said:

Not the way I would do it because of the other thing I would do, move the  to Nassau and make it brown (doing the necessary work to re-open the former northbound platforms at Cana Street and Bowery) that I have noted many times elsewhere.   

Yes. Many many MANY times. If you REALLY want to do that, have your  run from Bay Ridge-Broadway Junction, and then have the real  (which we will call ) run from Astoria-Euclid Ave. Save the cost of building a whole new tunnel.

On 3/10/2024 at 1:45 PM, Wallyhorse said:

This is a good way to do it.  Mine is similar except it would go under Schermerhorn Street on a level lower than the Transit Museum (with potentially a stop near Court Street below the Transit Museum) and then ram up to connect to the existing unused tracks near Hoyt-Schermerhorn and then operate as the Fulton Street Local to Euclid (extended late nights to Lefferts to replace the late-night  there.  This would allow the and to both operate as Fulton Express trains with the replacing the to Lefferts and the  likely on a 4-3 split between Far Rockaway and Rockaway Park, eliminating the need for the Rockaway Park / except perhaps late nights or late nights with the using the old round-robin route to cover both Far Rockaway and Rockaway Park.  

Going under Remsen Street likely makes more sense if it allows for transfers to the  and ( late nights) at Borough Hall from such as new line).  It would serve the same purpose as my plan as it would allow the and to both run as Fulton express lines at all times ( except late nights with the to Lefferts at those times). 

Or just connect Fulton Local to Montague. There's spare capacity anyway. 

On 3/3/2024 at 12:22 PM, hounddriver said:

No buses on Ocean Pkwy. Besides-lanes are too narrow.

I propose a "Shore Parkway Line", making the following stops:

1. Rosedale LIRR 

2. Springfield Blvd 

3. Farmers Blvd 

4. Brewer Blvd 

5. Rockaway Blvd 

6. 150 St 

7. 134 St 

8. Lefferts Blvd-Airtrain 

9. (Westbound Only) Cohancy Street  

10. Cross Bay Blvd 

11. Gateway Center 

12. Rockaway Pkwy-Canarsie Pier 

13. (Eastbound Only)-Riding Academy

14. Flatbush Ave/ ToysRUs parking lot 

15. Knapp Street

16. Sheepshead Bay 

17. Ocean Pkwy 

18. Bay Pkwy 

19. Bay Ridge-95th St 

10 hours ago, Kamen Rider said:

To paraphrase Jeff Goldbloom as Dr Ian Malcom…

 

“You spend so much time thinking if it CAN be done you NEVER consider if it SHOULD be done…”

 

your suggestions have a habit of working on the principle most people call “robbing Peter to pay Paul”… taking service away from people who use it in favor of giving more service to areas that do not and routes that people do not take.

SAS does not need two services. If the SAS passengers want 6th Ave service, they can change trains for the F across the platform once service restarts. 
 

But you don’t live there NOW… you haven’t lived there for years… decades even at this point IIRC… so why should you be taken as an authority on a subject when your information isn’t even from this century…

On weekends, there's no harm no foul with this plan, though more crews would be needed. The  doesn't go to Queens weekends anyway. It would actually provide expanded service.

Or here's another plan (that actually might operationally work better than the current plan):

-207th St-Far Rockaway, via 8th/Fulton EXP (no lefferts service)

-Brighton Beach-Jamaica Ctr, via. Brighton/6th/63rd/QBL EXP

-205th St-Lefferts Blvd, via Concourse LCL/8th EXP/Fulton LCL

-145th/BPB-Coney Is.

-168th St- Coney Is, via. 8th LCL/Culver LCL, switching at W4. 

-Jamaica 179th-WTC, via 6th Ave LCL, switches to 8th after West 4th

-Extended to Forest Hills via. QBL Local

-Broad St-Jamaica Center. Express in peak direction between Marcy Ave and Broadway Jct.

-Metropolitan Ave-Chambers St.

-unchanged

-unchanged

-Bay Pkwy-Forest Hills, via. West End/4th Ave/Bway/QBL LCL

-unchanged

- Bay Ridge- Broadway Junction via. 4th Lcl/Nassau LCL

4 hours ago, Vulturious said:

The MTA has been running the  via 63 St,  to Chambers St, and the  on it's own at Queens Plaza for the past few Christmas weeks already. Is it going to suck? Yes, but it's still 100% better than the other proposal dragging the  into this mess especially under your proposal having the  run QBL Express. 

It’s not any worse than the  switching at Queens Plaza 

48 minutes ago, LGA Link N Train said:

Under a complete Shutdown of 53rd, you might as well do the same GO they’ve been doing for years,

 Via 63rd Street/6th Avenue

 Serving Queens Plaza-60th. 

 to Chambers.

Its already simple enough

This means losing service and Qns Plaza express service however

On 2/23/2024 at 6:27 PM, Vulturious said:

I have a few questions:

• Huh?!
• How does this solve anything?
• Why?!

Running the  with the  is one thing, at least there's one less merge to deal with in this scenario. However, having the  run express along QBL while the  is running around too just creates the same exact problem where the  would need to split and cut off the  while merging with the  along with the  cutting off the  in the process. QBL is somehow just as bad if not worse than the current setup, there's no extra service being provided in this scenario. 

Remember, this assumes a complete shutdown of 53rd, meaning only the  and  would be serving Queens Plaza.

A more frequent  could even run skip-stop service on crosstown, youd have a  and a .

After Ct Squ-  serves Greenpoint Ave, Broadway, Classon, Fulton

 serves Nassau Ave, Myrtle Willoughby, Clinton Washington

Both serve Metropolitan Ave, Bedford Nostrand, Hoyt, and all stops to Church Ave.