Brooklyn

^^^^^ Ok..... and both via Whitehall. suspended. in two sections: 205th st to Grand st and Coney Island-Atlantic Terminal The and trains really have no where to go if there is a bridge problem....There is no way for them to bypass the bridge and resume their route. This is one of the issues with the 6th av line.

That's a real good one... Basically the only way to get to QB from Manhattan is through 60th st.... the will have to see extended action. The will be suspended. The and with both terminate at 57th st. continues its normal route terminates at 57th st (all times) to make room for the . Astoria riders will be upset, but that's what it is. Goes to Jamaica Center, as an EXPRESS, replacing the . The goes to 179th st making all local stops. service will have to increase...some of those trains can turn around at Bedford-Nostrand Av.... service will have to increase as well because people will transfer at 74th st and Court Square.

Sometimes you just wonder what the MTA is thinking. I really don't know how that line is going to shift that much ridership from the Lex line if it does not stop at a MAJOR transfer point like Fulton st. The way they are planning it, it is just an underground quicker M15 route--nothing wrong with that, but a huge portion of Lex line riders are coming from Brooklyn and the Bronx. A lot are coming from Grand Central from Metro North. With the LIRR possibly coming into GC too, the Lex line will never really see relief. This is why I argued for the train to make those two transfer points in the South Bronx and the one in Lower Manhattan. Some clever engineering would have possibly called for the train to make a stop closer to Grand Central. In any case, I am still glad the line is being built. M15 riders will scream in rejoice as they see commutes being slashed to a fraction of what it is now. The M15 can be a pain in the behind. But this is just like the 7 train extension. How can you extend it and not put a stop on 10th Av to serve Hell's Kitchen and take pressure off the M42 bus? Just doesn't make sense to me...but that's the MTA. Good idea CenSin linking the to a possible future Triboro to go to Queens Blvd.

Good points, CenSin. Yes, if the T went into Brooklyn, I would have it use the Montague St tunnel with the R train. However, I just wanted it to terminate it at Broad st. Getting it into Fulton St was most important to me. So I don't plan for it to use the tunnel into Brooklyn. I was just answering his hypothetical. I know about the past Metropolitan. It would be tough, but I think feasible. It would give Queens Blvd more options in case the line got rained out and shut down. At least people wouldn't be totally stuck and would have some way to get home. Also Brooklynites would have another way to get to Queens. You are right about trains being crowded before leaving Utica--that's because of people leaving the from Brownsville and East NY. Also you have people living along that area (obviously, lol). Another reason is people from Canarsie transferring from the B17 bus, not to mention people from the eastern portion of East Flatbush along the B46 routes. The B12 and B14 also contributes more people from the Ville and East NY. Some of them could take the , by why wait for a unreliable local when they can get a very reliable and express at Utica. In this light, extending the to the Junction actually makes a lot of sense, making a couple stops along the way at Ralph and Rockaway avs. Good call on that. I agree on the NIMBYs....you're preaching to the choir here.

But I ultimately think for the to relieve the most pressure from the Lex line, it MUST stop at Fulton St in Manhattan and it must stop at The Hub in the Bronx and at 3rd Av-138 st for the . The should go into the Bronx. Brooklyn isn't necessarily a priority for this line, IMO, BUT, if it did, it must stop at Jay St Metrotech for the and at Atlantic Center FOR SURE. That would maximize this line's effectiveness IMO.

I didn't see the need. Red Hook is an interesting neighborhood. With its proximity to the Battery Tunnel, I always thought a bus route terminating in Lower Manhattan would have been excellent....a modified B61 route going along Van Brunt st (terminating at the Ikea). It would be a nice short and sweet route--easily managed and simple. It would be 25 minutes TOPS from IKEA into Lower Manhattan where I used to work. People who live in the Hook face a transportation NIGHTMARE getting into manhattan--and the funny thing is that Manhattan is so terribly close. This is a little off topic, but I thought the B71 should have been kept and extended into Lower Manhattan as well. Park Slope and Carroll Garden residents would have screamed for joy. So would some Crown Heights residents. That would have been a super route. I believe the MTA was considerding doing this at one point. For me, I like keeping things simple and using existing infrastructure. Both routes would have been heavily used, no doubt. However, if the were hypothetically extended into Brooklyn, I would have it go along 4th av as a local to 59th St and have it terminate at 8th avenue on the line. This would help connect the Chinatowns in Manhattan and Brooklyn, take tremendous pressure off the train in Brooklyn and provide riders another way to get to the East Side of Manhattan (at Metrotech --that transfer was LONG OVERDUE and at 4th Avenue for the and . This would also provide another connection point to the Lexington Av line at the Atlantic Av station. The and trains would also indirectly benefit as well. This will also help tremendously with any service changes with the Lex line or 6th Av lines. It gives the MTA more flexibility and riders way more options.

I appreciate that. Thank you very much. CeeSin, I also love the idea of the going to Broadway Junction. I always thought Utica Av was an odd terminal....but then again, that also might put tremendous strain on the 4 train. I would imagine that by the time a Woodlawn Av train left Utica Avenue, it would probably already be packed!! I will put up my Manhattan rough sketch soon....there is nothing different from the system now except I extended the L train to Columbus Circle and drew the SAS....My SAS is almost identical to yours except a few stations are different and I have the going along the to Broad St in Lower Manhattan. I thought it imperative that this train stop at the Fulton St station to take pressure off the 4 and 5 trains since this is a major transfer point. I think it also imperative that it goes to the Bronx and make connections at The Hub (3rd av 149th st) and 3av 138th st. St Barnabas could use better transportation. So could some riders...The T goes to the Bronx and terminates at Gun Hill Rd on the . I do not have an East Bronx Branch. This is a radical idea, but for the Lexington Av line, I always thought the train should serve the entire length of Manhattan (24/7) going down to Bowling Green, making stops at Wall St, Fulton St and Bowling Green, but ON ITS OWN TRACKS. It would loop around Bowling Green. I always thought this would help the and trains BIG TIME. I don't know if this can be done, but it's just a thought. I also extended the E train past WTC to stop at City Hall (for transfers to the 4, 5,6 J and soon to be T train), Chatham Square (Chinatown) and end at East Broadway on the . You would not believe how difficult it is for people in that part of Manhattan to get to City Hall and the West side other than relying on the M22 and M9 buses, which can be unreliable. This would also take pressure off the and lines and give people more transfer points to the 8th av line in case of emergencies and/or reroutes.

The rings add an interesting perspective. I agree that there needs to be more crosstown lines and lines that parallel the rings. That is one of the great failings of our transportation network. There is no reason why if I live in Bed Stuy that it should take me over an hour and a half to get to say Woodside when it is only less than six miles away. That to me is ridiculous. I firmly believe that at the very least, the "Triboro RX" needs to go up, or at the very minimum from Flatbush to Broadway Junction to help workers get to their jobs easier and take a tremendous amount of pressure off the B6 and B103 routes and also indirect pressure off the B8 and B82. That line could serve as an shuttle train. The ridership would be tremendous. But if it even went to just Queens blvd/Roosevelt Av, that would be outstanding. Another idea I had was to try to extend the to Queens Blvd/Roosevelt AV from Metropolitan Av...it would be like a loop. To lessen confusion, maybe this could be a seperate line terminating at Myrtle Av (like the current M shuttle) with a different line designation or just a simple . The old Rockaway LIRR branch needs to be reactivated despite NIMBY resistance. I love bikes and want more paths, but to convert that into a park/path seems ridiculous and a waste of infrastructure. People don't account for future growth...in 30 or so years, the population might double. Great stuff CeeSin.

I was only answering a question posed to me...I didn't think to make a thread of it.

So basically, this is what it would look like....it is unfinished, but I would extend the A train to Jamaica, full time. The Y train (in Olive) would serve the Rockaways. There would be a transfer to both the Jamaica line and the A train. There is a Utica Av subway terminating at Kings Highway. This would join a rebuilt Broadway line. The purple train is the "8" train mirroring the 7 train but a couple miles south going to the LI border. It would go to Manhattan along 42nd street. I personally think 42st should have 4 tracks and extend to 11th av. There the 7 and 8 trains would run. The 7 train would also extend to Bayside, making only 4 or 5 more stops, though. That would relieve pressure from the bus routes serving Flushing-Main st. Other than that, the map is pretty much the same as it is currently. Other changes: I agree the L train should be extended...that is a no brainer to me. Why? West side access (but along 10th av) and to build a NEW TERMINAL to increase capacity along the L line. People don't realize that the terminal design is a culprit to why the L train can't quickly and easily increase its capacity. The 8th av terminal is not good enough and limits the capacity of the line. I would terminate the L train either at 72st ( 1, 2,3 trains) or probably Columbus Circle (more transfer options). The SAS would only have one line, the "T". It would go into the Bronx along 3rd Av, making only about 10 or 11 stops in the Bx, terminating at Gun Hill Road to help the 2 line. The Bronx would really benefit by it. I would actually not have a 125th street stop, as there is really not much around there. The people who live there live mostly in the housing developments closer to 120th street. Other than that, the 4 train is good enough. It would stop at 116th or 120th st then head straight into the Bronx connecting at 138th street and the 6 line. In lower manhattan, after Grand st (B and D connection), it would head along the J line and terminate at Broad st. The J would probably have to terminate at Chambers st.

How does one upload an image?

It's not about changes--I respect your work and creativity. I just had something of my own to share, that's all . I am going to put up a rough sketch shortly...I just have a few things to do first.

Newcomer to the site here.... have been viewing for years and finally decided to join. Excellent map..I will post my own one day as well. It is similar to yours but a bit simpler.I love the idea of a train that connects JFK and LGA. I drew up a similar line but instead it would be the Triboro RX (the "X" train) curving NORTH after Roosevelt Av-Jackson Heights to LGA. It would terminate at Nostrand Av to connect with the 2 and 5 trains or Avenue J to connect with the Q. The line going to JFK would be a separate one (I call it the "Y" train that would take over the A train in the Rockaways). The "X" would be a Brooklyn-Queens line, and the "Y" train would strictly be a Queens line. I will try to upload a png image so that this is clearer. It wouldn't just be about connecting the airports but easing travel WITHIN Brooklyn and Queens. In Brooklyn, this would take tremendous pressure off the B6 and B103 routes. You can't imagine how many people are waiting for buses at that Flatbush Av terminal. A line like this would make it make it easier for people who live in East NY, Bed Stuy, and Brownsville to get to Queens if they work there... the commute can be a NIGHTMARE if they need to get to Queens Blvd or LGA. You also have people who need to get from Queens to Brooklyn...If they work at SUNY downstate, they are probably looking at a nearly two hour commute. You have a number of people who are health care workers and airport workers who would love this line.