cotb16

- I remember having a exchange/discussion w/ Cotb regarding the Bx16/31 in here.....

 

here it is: http://www.nyctransi...12/#entry526593 (just look for the colored text)....

It's basically saying I would split the 16 into 2 branches; one goin straight down 233rd & the other running through woodlawn (the neighborhood) via nereid.....

 

Headways I haven't figured out yet....

 

 

- as far as a Bx3 LTD, nah.... for the reason Cotb said, and I wouldn't want to create a situation where too many buses are bunching on that route during the day.... Even I was surprised at how spread out ridership is on that route from end-to-end.....

 

side note: the bx3's turnaround scenario over by 238th trips me out every time...

 

 

The Bx3 ends up bunching a lot because of the traffic along its route (not just in Washington Heights, but there's traffic on University Avenue as well). While a Bx3 short-turn that runs between 238th/Bway and University/Cross Bronx Expwy (not touching Washington Heights) might sound good on paper, it could be a disaster since Washington Heights is the Bx3's biggest ridership generator.

 

Thanks to routes such as the Bx3, the Dominican community in the Bronx has really grown since the late 1970s.

What should be considered instead are short-turns that do not run up Sedgwick and end at University and Kingsbridge (I don't see an earlier place south of there to turn buses around); buses would use the Bx32 relay.

 

@Via Garibaldi 8 - a for eliminating the Bx34 and combining it with the Bx16 (whose resulting route would be still only 1 hour long), I admit that money is the motive there---because there, if it were up to me, the deadhead would be changed to being from the Pelham end instead of the Norwood or Fordham end that is currently used for Bx16 and Bx34 run-ons and run-offs; deadheads would be via the New England Thruway. (This differs from my prior proposal to reassign it to Kingsbridge.)

 

 

I agree with both. As for the Bx16/34 combo, don't underestimate its usage in Fordham as riders use it to reach Montefiore Hospital and some of the clinics in Norwood and Bedford Park, while avoiding the unreliable in the process. While the core of the Bx34's usage is betweeen Woodlawn station and the Woodlawn neighborhood during rush hours, that changes during the midday hours to the Montefiore-Fordham segment.

While we're at it I'd like to put out the idea of weekday limited-stop service on the Bx3; as it stands right now that route has very low headways (6-9 min Monday through Saturday from 7-7:30AM until after 8PM), gets quite crowded middays, and the buses become sardine cans during rush. Furthermore, from what I've seen most of the heavy passenger turnover takes place at certain major stops south of Kingsbridge Rd, and then buses tend to run with 15-20 people on them along Sedgwick Av and 238 St.

 

I'd run the LTD service from 179 St/ Broadway (GWB Bus Terminal) to the 242 St station 6AM-9PM weekdays and 8AM-7PM on Saturdays, making all current Bx3 stops until Kingsbridge Rd, and then:

 

University Av/Kingsbridge Rd

University Av/Fordham Rd

University Av/Bronx Community College

University Av/Burnside Av

University Av/Tremont Av

University Av/174 St

Amsterdam Av/181 St

179 St/Broadway (SB Terminal)

178 St/Broadway (at the M5 NB terminal, NB first stop)

 

Local buses would short-turn at the Kingsbridge VA Hospital while the limited-stop buses are running, and headways would be boosted to 4-5 minutes (3-4 minutes during rush hour) so that two buses (one local, one limited) would be coming every 8-10 minutes (6-7 minutes during rush).

 

I drew both service patterns on Google maps below; the blue line is the limited-stop bus and the red is the local. I deliberately sent the limited-stop bus down Amsterdam /179/Ft Washington Av/178 St to keep it out of the heavy traffic on 181 St.

 

http://maps.google.c...bSmtWfDQ&num=10

 

 

As much as a Bx3 limited sounds good on paper, it won't work in practice since some of the local stops (like 183rd St/Univ Av and 176th St) get good ridership.

The Bx8 ridership seems decent enough. If a problem occurs, add more buses. Ridership is more higher north of Westchester Square then going to Locust Point.

 

I don't see a purpose of there needing a Bx37 route. What would it fix anyways, besides ridership?

 

 

The heart of the Bx8's ridership is from Westchester Square to Pelham Parkway.

The 88 would takeover Eliot Avenue's Q38 portion. So, as I was saying, 69 street Below Eliot doesn't need service at all, except rush hours. Maybe reroute some 88s unto 69 street, alternate, so a bus seces 69 every 7 minutes, so does one along fresh pond. The station is a better place than fresh pond because of its geography around it. The 88 would serve a train station, which is a critical link to Brooklyn and Manhattan. I have to deal with a thing called the Q38, and it's getting better, but the headways aren't enough. That's why, on weekends, the heavier used sections gets 15-20 minute headways, while the least used portion is used 30 minutes flat out throughout the weekend.

 

 

Even though Metro Av station might be a good place to terminate the Q88, having it terminate at Fresh Pond would allow for a quicker ride from Eliot Av to the train.

I got two new proposals for the Q38 and Q64

Q38:

Split

Q88 takes on Eliot Avenue Portion From Middle Village Train Station to QCM

Q67 takes over Q38 route to Forest Hills From Eliot Avenue to Forest Hills. This Creates a route from LIC to Forest Hills. Current Q67 will not be affected north of Eliot Avenue. However between Eliot Avenue and Juniper Valley Road, service will be discontinued

Q67 operates every other bus the full route weekends. Most buses will operate between Middle Village and Forest Hills, every 30 minutes. Service to LIC remains 60 minutes weekends. Current Q38 riders using the 38 from one side to another, transfer at Middle Village

 

Q64:

Extended to Oakland Gardens

 

For more of my proposals, please click the link below

 

https://maps.google....2&hl=en&ie=UTF8

 

 

The only thing I would do for your Q88 is to change its western portion. Instead of terminating at the Metro Av station, it would end at Fresh Pond Rd/Metro Av (current Q67 terminus).

 

Route: Eliot Av, 69th St, Metropolitan Av, Eliot Av, Fresh Pond Rd

I was going to renumber the (current) Bx18 the Bx43. I already have the animated sign...

 

Any comments directly on the route?

 

 

It's going to have a hard time turning from Fordham to Jerome. Why not use Kingsbridge Rd instead?

How would the Q18 go to 74th st via roosevelt then follow Q47 routing if Q47 (to Glendale) takes roosevelt to 69th st? There has to be another way the Q18 can get to 74th instead of roosevelt.

 

 

The Q18 would take 58th St, Roosevelt AV, 75th St, Woodside Av, then 69th St, then Q47 route to Glendale.

For the Q64 to get to 73 and Springfield via Jewel Ave due to the fact the street is one way and narrow after 164st.

The Q112 can't get combined with the Q110 because they both travel in two different directions. The Q112 actually has ridership and has lots of people that wants to go to Jamaica or the A train.

 

 

The Q64 could turn right on 164th St, then left on 73rd Av to continue east.

forgot to add this.... you should know the drill by now...

reply in red

 

 

With the Bx11, I wanted to kill two birds with one stone. While it goes to Morris Heights to retain their access to 170th Street, it would retain service in underserved Highbridge. Macombs Road doesn't have many generators for ridership (save for the middle school on 176th St, where the Bx3/36 are nearby).

 

For the Broadway to Bailey situation, it depends on where riders originate. If they're at the Marble Hill Houses, they would walk south to 225th St. If coming from 230th, they would walk up to 231st. With this plan, those coming from Riverdale won't have to get off at Corlear/Kingsbridge Avs to walk two blocks to the downtown since the Bx7 would stop in front of the station in both directions.

 

For the Bx13 to The Hub & Gateway, the only downside is that it would miss the courts and social services by Concourse Plaza. There will be a good number of riders transferring from the Bx13 to the Bx6, just to travel 1-2 stops to the courts (to avoid walking the underpass or crossing the dangerous Grand Concourse).

 

As for the Bx30, I'm thinking of going back to the original idea of sending it to VA Hospital. It would serve the educational mile along with the Bx28, and provide those in the Northeast Bronx access to that hospital, and to Bronx Community College (by way of the Bx3 transfer at University Av).

I shrugged when I saw that.... Guess it's his way of acknowledging the point.

 

 

 

Exactly.... the BL-3 is not an alternative for the 1x.... and the 1x definitely should not get eliminated, regardless.....

The 3 swings all the way over to Purchase, via White Plains......

 

 

 

 

 

Only commented on the ones that were different from your original plan....

 

Replies in red

 

The reason why I don't have the Bx11 run via Macombs and W Tremont is because it gets high usage on 168th St in High Bridge. Without the Bx11 in Highbridge, they would be stuck with the Bx13 (which is a longer ride to the ).

 

For the bx30, I only sent it to 231st St to not be redundant to the Bx26 or Bx28. That routing is the current path that the Bx1 takes to get to 231st from Sedgwick Avenue. It serves IS 143, which many Bedford Park students (from the other side of the reservoir) are zoned to.

 

I think the Bailey reroute would save about 3-5 minutes, since Broadway is backed up in each direction (northbound by 231st St and southbound by 225th).

 

My Bx37 is my spin on the Q94. I cut the Q44 from the Bronx in order to rid the big route from delays caused by Whitestone Bridge and Cross Bronx Expwy traffic. Plus, Bronx residents would have a reliable route traveling between Flushing and Fordham. The Bx37 would run every 6-7 mins during the rush, 10-12 mins off-peak, and about 40-60 mins late nights.

 

I understand that there are too many buses at Dyre Av (the Bx16/14, Q50, W52/55/60/61/62). So I'm gonna send the Bx14 to Ropes Avenue to alleviate that situation. Only the Q50 and W60/61/62 would actually terminate there. I would probably have the W55 extended to either Bay Plaza (via Sec 3-4) or the Boston/Secor Houses.

 

For the Bx13 to The Hub, I like it since it serves two big shopping areas, the Gateway Center and the Hub. I've heard about a few customers going to Gateway park near The Hub (specifically along Brook Avenue and 152nd St where no meters exist), then take the 149th St Bus to the Gateway Mall.

Bronx Bus Overhaul (Update 1)

 

Southwest Bronx

 

Bx2: runs via Bx1 south of 149th St. Use extended Bx13 for The Hub

because of this, no Sunday service (all Sunday Bx2’s become Bx1’s since Bx1 runs local on that day)

 

Bx6: in addition to the service boost that will start in July, it would run every 8 mins on weekends

runs the full route late nights to connect with at 157th/Bway

 

Bx13: if Hunts Point extension is not a great idea, I’m thinking about combining two previous ideas. It would run to The Hub, but via the Gateway Center Mall.

It would replace the Bx2 in The Hub

However, I’m a bit skeptical about how the Bx13 will make the turn from 161st St onto River Av (and viceversa) with the high pedestrian traffic from Yankees’ games, the courts, and residents.

 

Route: 161st St, River Av, 149th St, Bergen Av, Westchester Av, Melrose Av

 

Bx15 & Bx55: interlined, both run under West Farms Depot

Combined Headways

Rush hrs: 4 mins (8 mins each)

Middays and Weekends (during the day): 5 mins (10 mins each)

 

Bx15: runs between Fordham Plaza and 138th St/3rd Av station

5am-8pm weekdays, 8am-6pm weekends

use local Bx55 other times

no longer runs on Willis Avenue

 

Bx55: runs between Gun Hill Rd sta and 125th St/Lexington Av (4/5/6) sta

northbound via Madison Avenue Bridge

makes limited stops 5am-8pm weekdays, 8am-6pm weekends

runs local other times

 

Bx55 limited stops

Gun Hill/White Plains

Gun Hill/Webster

204 St

Bedford Park Blvd

Fordham Plaza/3 Av

183 St

180 St

Tremont Av

Claremont Pkwy

168 St

163 St

157 St

149 St

138 St/Morris-Lincoln Avs

125 St/Lexington Av

 

Bx11: runs between West Farms Rd/Southern Blvd and River Park Towers

replaces Bx18 in Morris Heights, use Bx13/35 for Washington Heights

Route: 168th St, 167th St, Sedgwick Av, Tremont Av, McCracken Av, Harlem River Park Bridge, Undercliff Av

 

Bx18: eliminated, use Bx11 for Morris Heights

 

North Bronx

 

Bx7/20: rerouted between 231st St and 225th St via Bailey Av to avoid congested stretch of Broadway

Route: 231st St, Bailey, 225th St, Broadway

 

Bx19: truncated to Westchester Av/Southern Blvd

use Bx9 for north of Westchester Av

 

 

 

 

Bx9: runs between Hunts Point Av sta and 231st St/Riverdale Av

replaces Bx19 north of Westchester Av

Use extended M100 for Broadway

Route: Southern Bl, Fordham, Kingsbridge, Bway, 230th, Riverdale, 231st, Kingsbridge Av, 230th

 

Bx22: new western terminus is 231st St/Riverdale Av

use Bx28/30 for Goulden Av

 

Bx26: extended west to 262nd/Bway via Paul Av, Mosholu, Van Cort, Bway

allows faster connection between Eastern Riverdale and

 

Bx28 & Bx38: merged into one route (Bx28)

runs between Earhart Lane and 231st/Riverdale Av via All sections

route: Mosholu Pkwy, Paul, Bedford Park, Goulden, Kingsbridge

It runs through Kingsbridge Rd to serve Educational Mile and 225th St Target

use , Bx1/2, Bx16, Bx41/55 for Fordham

 

New Bx28 LTD runs rush hours only

Earhart Lane

Einstein Loop/Hutch Pkwy

Coop City Bl/Bartow Av

Bellamy Loop/Coop City Bl

Rombouts Av (serves Carver and Dreiser)

Donizetti Pl/Baychester Av (serves Truman HS)

Edson/Bartow Avs

Eastchester/Gun Hill Rds

Knapp St ( train station)

Boston Rd

Bronxwood Av

White Plains Rd

Webster Av

Montefiore Hospital/Bainbridge Av (e/b at 210 St, w/b at Gun Hill Rd)

206th St

West Mosholu Pkwy South/Paul Av

local to 231st Street

 

Bx30: runs from Earhart Lane to 231st/Bway

rerouted via 222nd St to fill crosstown gap and serve Edenwald/Baychester Houses and Cardinal Spellman HS

use new Bx14 for Boston Rd

route: Boston Rd, Grace Av, 229th St, Laconia Av, 222nd St, White Plains Rd, Gun Hill Rd, Bainbridge Av, Mosholu Pkwy, Sedgwick Av, Giles Pl, Heath av, Albany Crescent, Bailey Av, 231st St

 

Bx34: eliminated

use Bx10 for Woodlawn and Bx16 for Fordham

 

Bx10: new eastern terminus is 242nd/Katonah

Route changes east of Dickinson Av

route: Sedgwick, Mosholu, Paul, Bedford Park, Bainbridge, Jerome, 233, Katonah

 

Bx16: runs between Fordham Center and Ropes/Hollers Avs

via 233 St

use Bx23 for Nereid/Baychester, replaces Bx34 on Bainbridge Av

 

Bx23: runs between Pelham Bay Park and 233rd/Webster

via Sections 3-4-5

Route: Bronx Blvd, Nereid, Mundy, Pitman, Baychester, Boston, Conner, Co-op City Blvd, Asch, Bartow, Hutchinson, Hunter, Earhart, Erskine, bruckner

 

Q50: new northern terminus is Dyre Av station

runs local in The Bronx, serves Sec 1-2-4-5

Route: Bruckner, Erskine, Bx30 route to Boston Rd, then Dyre Av

 

Southeast Bronx

 

Bx4A: absorbed onto Bx4, use Bx14 for Metropolitan Avenue

 

Bx5: truncated to Brush/Schley Avs

use Q50 for Bruckner Blvd

 

 

Bx14: new Boston Road route running between Dyre Av station and Turnbull/Pugsley Avs (Stevenson High School)

replaces Bee-Lines and Bx30 on Boston Rd, Bx4A on Metro Av, and Bx36 on White Plains Road

Route: Dyre Av, Boston Rd, Bronx Park East, Bronxdale Av, Castle Hill Av, Metropolitan Av, McGraw/Wood Avs, White Plains Rd, Turnbull Av, Pugsley Av, Lafayette Av

 

Bx24: rerouted via Waters Pl to serve Bronx Psychiatric and Hutch Metro Ctr

Route: Westchester, Waters, Bronx Psy Loop, Waters, Hutch Metro Loop, Waters, Eastchester, Williamsbridge, Tremont, Lane Av

 

Bx31: extended to Castle Hill/Zerega Avs to serve Unionport

Route: Lane Av, Commerce, Zerega

 

Bx27: eliminated

use Bx36 for Rosedale av and new Bx37 for 174th St, and bx4/4a for Westchester

 

Bx36: new eastern terminus is Clason’s Point

use Bx37 for 174th St

Route: 180th St, Rosedale/Taylor avs, 174th St, Rosedale, Randall, Soundview

 

Restructured Bx36 LTD service

(Bx36 Locals run between Cross Bronx/Univ Av and Clason’s Point)

local between Washington Heights and Tremont/Univ Avs

Tremont/University

Jerome Av

Grand Concourse (west side)

Grand Concourse (East side)/Monroe Avenue

Tremont/Webster

180th St

3rd Av/180th St

Crotona Av

Southern Blvd

Boston Rd

Morris Park Av (180th St (2/5) station)

174th/Rosedale

Westchester

Story

Rosedale/Randall

local to Clason’s Point

 

Bx37: runs between Fordham plaza and Flushing station

makes Limited stops between Flushing and Parkchester, then local to Fordham

Replaces Bx36 on 174th St and Q44 on Cross Bx/Flushing

 

Route: 3rd Av, 184th St, Arthur Av, 182nd St, Boston Rd, Hoe/Vyse Avs, 174th St, Cross Bronx Exp, Brush Av/Hutchinson Pky, Whitestone Exp, Linden Pl, Northern, Main

 

LTD Stops

Roosevelt Av/Main St

Northern Blvd

35th Av/Linden Pl

Whitestone Expwy

20th Av/Whitestone Expwy

Lafayette Av/Hutch Pkwy

Bruckner Blvd/Brush Av (Home Depot)

Castle Hill av/Cross Bronx Expwy

Hugh J. Grant Circle

then local to Fordham Plaza

 

Interborough Routes

 

Q44: terminates at College Point via Q20A path, Q20 local takes Q20B’s place

Use new Bx37 for Flushing-to-Bronx service

 

M100: extended to 262nd/Bway to replace Bx9 north of 225th St

 

Bee-Line 60/61/62: new southern terminus is Eastchester/Dyre Av station

use restructured Bx14 for Boston Road and Bx12/22 for Fordham Road

 

Depot Lineups *uses artics

Eastchester: Bx23, Q50, BxM6, 7, 8, 9, 10

Gun Hill: Bx4*, 5*, 12*, 14, 16, 24, 26, 28, 29, 30, 31, 39*, 41*

Kingsbridge: Bx1/2*, 3, 7, 9*, 10, 11, 13, 22*, 32, M100

West Farms: Bx6, 15/55*, 17, 19*, 21, 33, 35, 36, 37, 40/42*

Yonkers: BxM1, 2, 3, 4, 11, 18

I propose

Bx1: Extend via Riverdale Ave to 246 street

Bx2: Retain

Bx3: Rerouted via Macombs Road,then in Bx11 route to GWB weekdays

Bx4: Extended to Pelham Bay Park and Co-Op City via Bx23 routing

Bx4A: See Bx24

Bx5: Extended via Einstein Loop to City Island

Bx6; Retain

Bx7: Rerouted via H H P

Bx8: Retain

Bx9: Extra Rush and Saturday Service

Bx10:Some Sevice originates at 207 street in Manhattan (2AM and 2PM Trips to 207 street). Limited stop service all day weekdays from 6 Am-10 PM

Bx11: Rerouted via Macombs Road and Unversity Avenue to Replace Bx18 and Allieviate Bx3/Bx36

Bx12: Retain

Bx13: Some service extended to Hunts Point

Bx15: Retain

Bx16: Service extended to Fordham via bx34 route weekdays and Saturdays

Bx17: Retain

Bx18:Eliminated, see Bx11/Bx40/42

Bx19: Retain

Bx20: Eliminated, see Bx7/Bx10

Bx21: Retain

Bx22: Retain

Bx23: Eliminated, see Bx4

Bx24: Extended along Weatchester Avenue and Metropolitan Avenue to the Hub using Hybrids

Bx24: Short-turns Aling Westchester Avenue and Metropolitan from WF using CNG Buses

Bx26: Retain

Bx27: Retain

Bx28: Retain and revert to 6/2010 routings

Bx29: See Bx5

Bx30: Retain

Bx31: Retain

Bx32:Retain

Bx33: Extend to St Nicholas Avenue or To Broadway

Bx34: See Bx16

Bx35: Rerouted along Bx11 Route until they intersect again from the GWB in the Bronx in Unversity Heights

Bx36; Limiteds take Castle Hill and Cross Bronx Expressway. Just Kidding, Retain ALL Service

Bx38: Make it the limited stop version of the Bx28 skipping Northern Co-Op city 7 days a week while some are local short-turns only to 205 street

Bx39: Retain

Bx41: Retain

Bx40: Limited making stops at major intersections during the day, local past 10 PM, and extended to Current Bx18 terminal via Segdwick/Undercliff Avenue to below the GWB

Bx42: Extended via Segdwick/Undercliff to current Bx18 terminal

Q44: Retain

Q50: Retain

60: Retain

61: Retain

62: Limited Stop in the Bronx

40/41: Retain

43: Limited stop in the Bronx

45: Retain

1: Retain

1T: Proposed to Be combined with the 1

1C: Renamed 111

1W: Renamed 101

1X: Eliminated, use 3

3: Limited Stop in the Bronx

2: Retain

8: Retain

 

 

Bx3: I agree with B35, this route is nicknamed "The Quisqueya Express" for a reason -- the bulk of the riders on University are heading to Washington Heights and the area around Sedgwick Houses.

 

Bx5/29 merger: no good. I don't think artics could handle the small City Island streets.

 

Bx11: keep it on West 168th St since Highbridge riders have a quicker ride to the with the Bx11 as opposed to the Bx13. Besides, Macombs Road does not pick up too many riders (save for the rush hours with the middle school on 176th/Macombs).

 

Bx35: agree with B35, keep it on Edward L. Grant Hwy since it's a direct ride from Washington Heights to the .

 

Bx36: the only things I would do to the LTD are 1) have it stop on both sides of Grand Concourse in each direction, 2) expand it to middays, and 3) Bx36 locals would not run into Washington Heights while LTD's run.

 

Bx40/42: while it makes more sense to send them to Undercliff Av, I don't think artics would have a tough time meandering through narrow streets known for double-parking.

Since there's Bronx, Brooklyn, Manhattan, how about Queens.

 

To me:

Q72: Extend via Queens Blvd non-stop to Woodhaven Blvd-Queens Center Mall.

 

Q33 Bus Stop at 82nd St/Northern Blvd should be combined with Q32 bus stop, so folks can take which bus leaves first.

 

Is possible could possibly combine Q49 and Q29 next?

 

 

Besides, most Q72 riders heading to Queens Center would get off at 57th Av/Junction Blvd. As for a Q29/49 merger, I wouldn't be surprised if they went with it, connecting with the at 90th St to fill the gap between Junction and 82nd, even if it came at the loss of the Queens Blvd express transfer at 74th St.

 

Potential route for the merged route:

 

Southbound: Astoria Blvd, 92nd St, Roosevelt Av, Britton Av, Hampton St, then Q29 route to Glendale

 

Northbound: Hampton St, Elmhurst Av, 91st St, Astoria Blvd

...and extending the Bx13 would make for a (much) longer wait for a bus to washington heights....

 

 

In any event:

1) At the expense of Bronx patrons having a chance to catch the express, I'd say it's well worth it.....

 

2) The M2 takes an indirect path to Columbia Presbyterian as it is... It takes Edgecombe b/c the M3 runs on Amsterdam (that wasn't done by accident either)...

- Harlem riders can (and do) take the 100/101 there, for a number of reasons...

- Madison av riders (those south of 110th, that is) seeking that area can take the M3... Come to think of it, if the M2 continued west on 155th, then you could have M3's short turn on 168th....

 

...then you can instantiate M3 LTD's (which I think should happen anyway).... LTD service would run the full route from 191st to E. village (LTD's make all local stops b/w 191st & 168th)... M3 locals would start at 168th.... M3 LTD service would run the same way M2 LTD's do..... M2 LTD's would run the same way M1 LTD's do (which is rush hrs. only).....

 

 

Bx6 riders would end up on the by way of the 145th St transfer from the . Most riders on the Bx6 get off at three stops in Manhattan; Edgecombe (for the M2 to Harlem), Amsterdam (for the M100 to Washington Heights since the M100 serves a more popular part of the neighborhood than the M101), and Broadway (for the or the M4/5).

How about swapping the M2 & Bx6 north of 155th.....

 

The increase in pax that would come from Bx6's at 168th st could very well justify an increase in service....

Instead of having to bother with extending Bx13's to supplement the Bx6.....

 

 

It would be a longer ride for Bx6 riders to either the at Broadway or the M100/101 at Amsterdam Avenue. Besides, taking the M2 from Edgecombe would mean Harlem riders losing access to Columbia Presbyterian.

From which direction? West or Eastbound Bx6 Customers?

 

I do agree that the Bx13 could get extended, even if its up to 3rd Avenue. That AM Rush only service i don't get the point.

 

Westbound. As for the Bx13 to 3rd Av, it should run more often than just AM Rush hours. The Bx6 is crowded during most of the weekday as those getting out of court hearings or the social services (like Welfare or Social Security) use it during middays.

 

 

Bee-Line should consider a 60 Limited, has thats pretty long. Especially with heavy ridership along US Route 1.

 

 

 

 

-For the Bx15, I understand there is a traffic problem, but the Bx15 is not the only route that deals with traffic issues, you also got the M60, M100, M101 dealing with it too. The M101 is much longer then the Bx15 which deals with a lot more traffic when it hits Midtown. The solution to 125th Streets issue is installing bus lanes and enforcement.

 

-For the Bx13, then I would suggest artics or additional buses. This route gets pretty packed at River Avenue going Northbound. Who knows if it gets much more heat if it were extended.

 

-For the Bx19, there are people who ride to Manhattan with it north of Westchester Avenue. People will surely not be pleased with the loss of the Bx19. An alternative would be to send up the Bx27 which might help in passenger numbers for the Bx19 if traveling between Fordham and Westchester Ave.

 

 

A good chunk of the Bx13's crowd at Yankee Stadium (heading to Highbridge) come from the Bx6.

- Well now wait a second.... By you suggesting moving Bx36's off 174th west of rosedale av, you're doing the exact same thing (underestimating).... From what I'm reading here of yours, only difference between what you're suggesting & what I'm suggesting is that I would still have Bx36 (locals) serving 174th (along with your "Bx37")..... Whereas you'd just have your "Bx37" serving that area....

 

- About the Bx13 & the removal of the Bx11 off ogden/plimpton, that much I figured out when I first read your plans (to boost usage on the 13)....

It was (and still is) the extending of it to out to Hunts Point I find that isn't justified - Even if Bx6's are being bombarded.....

 

- What you gave an answer to, wasn't really what I was asking about those 5 routes..... I wasn't talking about just it's usages to/from/along W. 181st.....

Anyway, I would stop to say the Bx13 is the least used, then the 11, then the 35, then the 3, with the 36 being the most used of the 5 routes in their totalities...... Just from my vantage points anyway... Someone posted the ridership stats not too long ago, so I'm sure someone would double check to see how accurate my visual assessments are.....

 

- lol.... about the Bx10, I thought that (benefit) was obvious.....

 

I would have my Bx37 run slightly more frequent than the Bx36 locals during rush hours.

Headways for Bx37: 6 mins during rush hrs, 8 mins during middays, 10 mins during weekends/evenings, no late nights

 

Not to mention, taking the bx36 off 174th would eliminate a good chunk of the turns, and bypass traffic at West Farms Square and along the 174th St bridge.

My reply:

 

1) I'm not implicating that the MTA's way of handling crowd control on the Bx6 is the best way (by extending 13's to 3rd to pick up some of the slack).... What I'm saying is, your method of having the 13 supplement most of the Bx6 in the bronx isn't the way to go either.... You're basically minimizing the 13's importance b/w the stadium & washington hgts.....

 

What should happen is, more service should be added to the Bx6 where/ when/ in what direction the usage it at its highest.....

 

2) Give me your opinion on the five [bronx - W 181st st] routes from highest to least utilized....

 

3) about the M100, yeh I figured that much.... Since you want to cut the 9 back to the mall on 225th, you needed something to cover the current 9's portion along broadway..... that is how that part of your plan came off to me.....

 

As for the Bx26, Broadway b/w 242nd & county line doesn't need 2 bus routes though (your M100 & your extended Bx26).....

 

4) Yeh, I agree w/ the removal of the Bx10 along Jerome av to speed it up....

 

However, I don't get the sense that there's much travel between Woodlawn & Riverdale enough to extend the 10 up there.... The route won't benefit from an extension to Woodlawn... The 10 is more heavily used west of the reservoir than it is on the eastern side of it.... an extension to Woodlawn would only garner but so many riders anyway - at the detriment of the folks that use that route the most...

 

I still say it's good on 205th....

 

6) Ok, so you would do things differently.... I would simply branch the Bx16 out b/w serving 233rd & 238th (nereid), instead of having the 16 serve 233rd & extending the Bx23 to cover 238th (nereid)....

 

The 23 is a feeder route to PBP serving co-op, and is necessary since the 50 runs LTD w/i co-op (and is coming from Queens, to boot).... You are changing the purposes of both the Bx23 & Q50 with your plans (really to botch up the Bx30).... I would leave the 30 as being the only route entering/leaving co-op from the north.....

 

8) I would just shorten the current Bx36 to Lafayette/WPR & have the LTD's take the Q44 routing b/w WPR & E tremont av... then from there, make its way to boston rd & E 180th st....Then you could have that "Bx37" of yours act as a part time route b/w Castle Hill & Fordham plz....

 

What I'm saying here:

* Bx36 LTD's: Lafayette > WPR > cross bx serv. rd > 177th > devoe > E tremont > boston > E 180th... then regular route to Washington Hgts...

 

* Bx36 locals: current Bx36 route b/w Lafayette/WPR & university av/174th

 

With the Bx36 LTD, don't underestimate its 174th St ridership. There's a high school and students who live in the Bronx River Houses go to junior high school in West Farms (since there's no JHS in Bronx River).

 

As for the current Bx13, most riders use it between the Stadium and 168th St. North of it, the Bx11 dominates due to its frequency and reliability. I cut the Bx11 to eliminate redundancy on Ogden Av and to get more ridership onto the Bx13 between 168th St and the Heights.

 

As for 181st st, the Bx13 has the least ridership on 181st St, then the Bx11, Bx35, Bx36, and Bx3.

 

Speaking of the Bx10, there's another benefit to my plan -- a quicker ride to the since it would now transfer to the Bedford Park Blvd/Grand Concourse station.

Replies in Red.

 

For the Bx6/13, I had the Bx13 go to Lafayette to get to Tiffany St and serve Barretto Point Park, silencing Hunts Point residents who cry of the lack of access to the park.

 

With the Bx15, I always felt that the 125th St traffic has hurt the route's performance. For a first-hand look, try using the Bx15 on weekends. The Bx15 arrives in 2's or 3's after a 20-minute wait along 3rd Avenue. Besides, there's plenty of buses and the and to reach Harlem from the South Bronx.

 

I reduced the Bx19's route in order to improve its performance, same reason why Bx41 service was cut north of Gun Hill in 2010.

 

Remember, the Bx26 serves Broadway, a different part of Riverdale than the Bx10.

 

As for the Bx28 LTD, I was thinking about it strongly. It would make limited stops between Section 5 and Paul AV, then local to 225th St.

 

The Bx16 would go to Fordham and the Bx10 to Woodlawn to allow for the elimination of the Bx34. With the latter, politics can also play a pivotal role as Woodlawn and Riverdale are often in the same political districts and district offices there would usually be in Riverdale.

On another thing that came up from QJTransitMaster, I would do the following to provide more consistent service on Boston Road in the Northeast Bronx.

 

1. The Bee-Line 60/61/62 would be cut back to the Dyre Av station

 

2. A new route, the Bx25, would run between Ropes Av/Boston Rd and Fordham Plaza.

-8 minute headways during rush hours, 12 minutes during middays, 15 minutes weekends/evenings

JW72093 beat me to it; I don't think Bronx's bus system needs an overhaul, per se....

But I'll still comment on these anyway:

 

 

Bx6/13: If the space existed, I would send the Bx13 to the Hub (via Melrose).... A 1-seat ride from the Hub to Washington hgts. might work.

I don't really see the need for the 13 to run out to Hunts point, just so that it can be interlined w/ the 6....

 

Bx15/55: I would leave the Bx15 running b/w 12th/125th & Fordham plz....

 

But I do think maybe the 55 LTD should be sent up to Wakefield/241st w/ the 39 truncated to Gun Hill rd.... either that, or have the Bx39 & Bx41 reverted to it's pre 6/2010 routings.....

 

Bx11: Rerouting the Bx11 to morris hgts to kill off the Bx18.... so basically you're saying the 11 isn't needed in washington hgts since you can take the 13 or the 35.... I'm neutral with this one.

 

Bx9/Bx19/M100: How can I say this....

 

I don't like the restructuring of the Bx9/Bx19, just to have to M100 run all the way up to Riverdale - It's the M100 part of it I totally disagree with.... This notion of having 225th as a full time terminal in a couple of your ideas, I'm not too fond of either.... However, the splitting of the 9 & the 19 at Hunts Point or Westchester/Southern isn't too bad an idea....

 

Bx20: I wouldn't bother extending it.... may as well get rid of it & give that service to the Bx7 & Bx10....

 

Bx26: Don't agree with extending this... Folks up in Riverdale would rather take the BxM3 into manhattan over taking the current Bx9 (or some local bus, in general) to the ..... and I can't fathom there being too much of a need for those patrons to get to areas where the 4 train runs within the bronx.....

 

Bx28/38: Yeah, I think the Bx28 should be reverted.... be gone w/ this Bx38....

 

Bx30: Don't think it's worth it - I mean, all that just to serve those projects while eventually getting back to Gun Hill/WPR.... Just have it loop around the edenwald houses via grace, making its way back to/from boston rd and & be done with it, if that's what you want to accomplish.... Don't agree with the notion of leaving Boston rd bus service all up to Bee Line either.....

 

Bx10/16/34: hmm, well....

 

The only thing I think should happen to the 10 is the moving of it across Bedford park blvd & up Bainbridge to get to 205th ... the Jerome av routing is too slow.... Anyone using the 10 that needs the hospital will just have to transfer..... Your idea of sending this all the way to Woodlawn I don't understand, especially knowing how slow that route already is.....

 

I agree in general with what you want to do w/ the Bx16/34.... I would go about the whole thing by creating 2 separate branches of the 16:

* Bx16's [via 233rd] would run b/w 205th & Ropes/Boston Rd... These buses would just shoot across 233rd, and use the current routing b/w Dyre av subway & the shopping center over there...

* Bx16's [via Nereid] would run b/w 205th & Dyre av ... These buses would run up Katonah av, to McLean<->Nereid, turn down Baychester av, and use the current routing from baychester av to get to Dyre av subway...

 

With both branches, some rush hour service would be extended to/from Fordham ctr.

 

Bx23/Q50: I don't think an extension to MNRR Woodlawn is necessary.... Personally, I think the Bx29 should be cut off at its head & merged with the Bx24..... This would increase the importance of the 23 b/c it would then be the only "local" (or, non-LTD) route that serves any section of co-op, coming up from PBP......

 

Basically, I'm saying leave the 23 alone....

 

- Co-op patrons needing MNRR can xfer from the 30 to the 16 (via 233rd)...

- Co-op patrons needing Dyre av can continue taking the 30 & walking..... There's zero need to extend the Q50 (of all routes) up there - especially on top of running Q50's local.....

 

Bx5: When that mall gets propped up over there or w/e, maybe then we can bring that up as a possibility.... Right now, I gotta say nah to this....

 

Bx24: The 21 should be doing all that in that area....

 

Bx31: Don't think this will be worth it; the 22 will still be prevalent down there...

Not sure how much demand for service to Westchester Sq that exists from Castle Hill....

 

Bx27/36/"37": I dunno about this one...

While I like what you did w/ the "37", what you're doing w/ the 36 overall confuses me.... and I wouldn't get rid of the 27 for an altered 36.....

 

 

My reasons to your replies:

 

1. For the Bx13's extension to Hunts Point, most of the Bx6's crowds are from Yankee Stadium to Southern Blvd. If the Bx13 ended at 3rd Av, too many riders would pile up the Bx6 to head east. Most of them are either heading to catch the Bx5 for service to Soundview or to reach some of the housing projects and high schools located uphill from 3rd Avenue.

 

2. For the Bx11, I did it to prevent too many buses from being on 181st Street. In addition, it would provide Morris Heights with a more frequent bus route.

 

3. The only reason why the M100 is heading to 262nd is to appease folks who would complain about the lack of service along Broadway (save for the ). Broadway is also the same reason why the Bx26 would be extended there.

 

4. In regards to the Bx10, it would provide a faster ride to Montefiore Hospital since it would now bypass the congested Jerome Avenue and make less turns. In addition, it would provide a connection between heavily-elderly Woodlawn with the many senior centers in Riverdale.

 

5. The idea for the Bx30 was to be a crosstown route of its own in the Northeast Bronx instead of following the Bx28 or the Bee-Lines. Edenwald would now be able to reach the at a stop closer to Manhattan and have first-time access to the and , which are key to reaching the West Bronx.

 

6. I only did the Bx23 to Nereid to allow more consistent service on the Bx16. Co-op City riders would be able to reach northern areas like Wakefield and Mount Vernon thanks to the Bx23. As for the Q50 to Dyre, I sent it up there to provide Co-op City an alternative to the and the Bx28.

 

7. For the Bx31's extension, it would provide Soundview/Castle Hill riders access to the hospitals in Morris Park, something Soundview/Castle Hill lacks (which is why Pedro Espada's clinics are so popular over there).

 

8. To clear up confusion for the Bx36, here are the specifics for the route.

 

Eastbound: 180th St, Tremont Av, Taylor Av, 174th St, Rosedale Av, Randall Av, Soundview Av

 

Westbound: Soundview Av, Randall Av, Rosedale AV, 180th St

 

-It would change east of Boston Rd by continuing on East 180th St, connecting to the and at E 180th St, thus giving Clason's Point/Rosedale riders with a connection to the express train.

 

-Having the Bx36 running on Rosedale would create a north-south route west of White Plains Rd in Soundview.

Yeah well you said it would be interlined but didn't say from where... Still not a good idea... As I said before, it makes the commute longer for folks who need the train.

 

 

The Bx7 and Bx20 probably already interline with each other since they're both from Kingsbridge Depot and have similar terminals. Both buses would share the same northern terminal.

 

On the upside, however, the Bx7 and Bx20 would bypass the Broadway traffic between 225th and 231st.

Sorry but I don't know if I agree with that one simply because those who want the would have a longer commute. If anything it would favor the riders, as they would have more service during the rush hours. It would also screw over the folks below 239th street as they would be forced to walk to and from Henry Hudson Parkway to Riverdale Avenue. We have the hills to contend with here in Riverdale, plus the tons of stairs to get across the parkway below 239th street, so you have to consider that. Not all of the ridership is along Riverdale Avenue. The folks near and along the Henry Hudson Parkway need the local buses too.

 

 

I didn't say that the Bx20 would be moved to Riverdale Av south of 239th. The only changes to the Bx20 are its northern extension, its reroute on 231st St.