BrooklynBus

Where do I find this citywide bus plan that addresses SBS problems? I don't see it on their website. The buses would work just as fine in the service roads as in the main roads. Reconstruction of the bus stops is a waste of $20 million.

I only heard them say they didn't want bus lanes on the narrow portion of Kings Highway. There shouldn't be bus lanes in the wide portion of Kings Highway because there is no way to justify them. They won't improve service. Some of the other recommendations would improve B82 service, but they do not require SBS. I not only want this project to be put on an indefinite hold. The entire SBS program for new routes needs to be put on hold until the many problems associated with it are adequately addressed.

And there are many who believe the project as proposed should not go forward at all. And you seem to be saying it is alright to tell representatives one thing and tell or not tel, the public something else. That what they tell, representative to appease them does not matter. I repeat you don't tell representatives that you are delaying the project to obtain additional community input and then close down the input on the web. But this is typical of how DOT has handled every SBS project thus far with lies, distortions and omissions to deliberately mislead the public and reduce opposition. Why is it that you won't find a single SBS report that states a general traffic lane will be converted to an exclusive bus lane? Why is something like 90 percent of the people caught by surprise when SBS starts if publicity was so great? Why is there no mention of any proposed SBS routes on the MTA website? That is where someone would look to go to learn about it, not to the DOT website where if you want to learn about the B82 SBS, you have to look under Southern Brooklyn SBS.

Clearing equipment and not leaving dangerous conditions is one thing. Proceeding with construction to finish it shows there is no intention of making changes, delaying or scrubbing the project.

You don't tell people a project is on hold while you are continuing construction. That is just flat out lying.

But what's the point in saying you are postponing it to get more comments, then cutting off the comments. It just shows how dishonest the entire process has been.

Don't you find it ironic that when DOT postpones the B82 SBS to receive additional community input after receiving complaints that many never knew of the plan, they decide to close the comments on their website. That should tell you they are not interested in what the public thinks.

Have you seen Avenue P during the evening rush hour? It moves at about five miles per hour between Coney Island Avenue and Ocean Ave. it really isn't better than Kings Highway. It takes 15 minutes for a car between Ocean Parkway and Ocean Avenue. Part of the reason is the timing of the lights in favor of Ocean Parkway, Coney Island Ave and Ocean Ave. Ninety seconds for those streets and 30 seconds for Avenue P. All the other east west streets that go through the Brighton line are almost just as bad. And the conversion of Quentin Road adds only three or four spaces. Closing East 12th would worsen traffic by forcing East 12 Street traffic into Coney Island and Kings Highway. Then they have to use Kings Highway to get back to East 12 St.

I know when they re did the B44 schedules after three months and added locals, they also greatly scaled back on the SBS especially on weekends. They originally proposed a combined SBS and local from Knapp Street every three minutes during the morning peak because they expected most B4 and B36 riders to switch to the SBS. I remember telling them at CB15, that would never happen. You can check the morning schedules now from Knapp Street and see what it is. I know it's no longer every three minutes.

Not according to the NYC Comptroller.

To Brilliant93. Your statements are in italics: So let me get this straight unless if facts coming from you or anyone who’s against sbs or any other improvement the mta tries to make its lies and such? Never said that. The MTA is quite capable of telling the truth. They just have been only telling the partial story, the positives and omitting the negatives and lying and misleading. Here's an example: Any change anyone makes will help some and hurt some. But if you look at the MTA's SBS FAQ's SBS makes it better for every single bus rider, everyone in cars, and means increased business for commercial establishment. Absolutely, no one is hurt. It is absolutely perfect. That just isn't possible. I read your piece and I can admit they’re might be issues with less local service and people being ticketed unfairly but in what way doesn’t sbs mean better service? Lesser stops on an express route means people can get to where they have to go faster. I use sbs on the B46 when I need to get into the city and I get there much more faster than I did when it used to be a limited service even though the B46 was a reliable bus before then. As I stated, I am not disputing that some riders are better off because of SBS. I said that right up front. Any chance must help more people than it hurts for it to be considered a success. And that also includes those who don't ride the bus. The proper data has not been collected or has not been made public to conclude it is an improvement. SBS helps long distance riders as I stated, but most use buses for short distances making SBS savings minimal for most or no savings at all. Former B44 Limited riders boarding at Avenue R are worse off, because now they must take the local and can't use SBS. Also anyone going to Kings County Hospital/Downstate is worse off because they now have an extra walk. I could understand wanting more local service but if local buses on most routes aren’t up to capacity that’s just wasting money. If more people ride sbs then why put more buses on the local if it’s only going to be half empty? But who says more are using the SBS than the local? Do you know that for a fact. Separate SBS/local data is not easy to find. It was available for the B44 SBS/local and it showed riders were about equally split between the two. Does that make sense to you when the longer buses are on the SBS and regular buses on the local? That means the SBS is emptier than the locals which are more crowded. Bus lanes aren’t going to hurt business nor will it make them go out of business. If most customers arrive by foot or transit who’s the better beneficiary? Especially if it’s a bus lane that is operational at certain times of the day it’s a compromise especially in a city this dense. Cross Bay Blvd merchants complained of 30% fewer customers. Not sure if that was overall or during the times the lanes are in effect. But that doesn't make me against those curbside lanes. I just think on Cross Bay, they are not needed in the off-peak direction. In fact, I think they also need to be in effect on Saturdays and Sundays from May to Labor Day for the beach traffic. Straphangers shouldn’t be stuck in traffic if they’re not the ones making the traffic. On top of that there’s people who still park in bus lanes and stops while forcing elderly or disabled people to walk into streets. The NYPD aren’t enforcing the law nor are they are too abiding by it themselves via doing the same thing. I can’t remember to name a European city but they did something called a compromise where parking space wasn’t added unless parking was taken away from somewhere else. It was there to help their congestion problem. As a result their businesses have grown as it was feared they would lose it. As I said before if most of these businesses have customers that don’t own cars or come by car who would benefit from bus lanes? Not disagreeing with you here. I am not really opposed to the curbside lanes on Kings Highway. It's the loss of parking spaces that are not being replaced which is the problem. Had the city not removed the municipal parking lot, there would be much less of a protest. The available parking there right now is just absolutely critical. As someone who uses these buses for work and to get around I find it quite arrogant when people who just fan ride or Just witness bus routes happen to decide or come up with things that aren’t in the passengers point of view. I don’t see how sbs is a failure when it’s compenents have nothing to do with it’s faults. There’s bus lanes on local routes in certain places in the city, there people who park in them, there’s people who still miss the bus, there’s still shitty bus service on majority of the routes in nyc and that doesn’t have to do with sbs. But in what way are the better solutions since some of you like to criticize? I can’t see how the kings hwy corridor would be better off without any sort of treatment because people will double park and block traffic. I read your piece and even if they did the same thing with the limited service as much as they did with sbs it still would generate opposition. Something definitely needs to be done on Kings Highway between Coney Island and Ocean Ave. I just don't see SBS as the answer. You also have to look at the big picture. If bus lanes are not going to be enforced, why put them in? If articulated buses are going to have more difficulty making some of the tight turns and negotiate the double parkers, why change buses? If articulated buses mean you will have to wait longer for a bus, why use them? If local service will be reduced, and it will be, why make people wait 20 or 30 minutes for a local so SBS riders can save five or ten minutes? You are hurting one group to help another but not making it fetter for everyone. Also, why put in exclusive lanes where buses are already going fast and won't be going any faster with SBS? The proposal as it is currently does not make sense. Since SBS helps those riding long distances, it's routes need to be fast and travel longer distances connecting new neighborhoods and increasing employment opportunities. That would happen if it went from Bay Ridge to Gateway or JFK as I proposed. In fact, I proposed gat be the first Brooklyn SBS route back in 2004 instead of the B44 which was also done wrong. Why did the Southern Brooklyn SBS become a B82 SBS without explanation? We have a transit issue in our city and it’s not going to get better if we keep letting things go the way they are. If third world countries have a better bus system than we do its embarrassing. I agree.

The MTA is known for changing their mind, reneging on promises, and telling different stories to different parties. Why do you think they meet with each business association separately? So they can tell each one how many parking spaces they are eliminating in their area without ever having to disclose the total number of parking spaces that will get eliminated. They agreed to add a much needed Avenue R bus stop on the B44 SBS, then later said they weren't going to do it. You can't believe anything DOT or the MTA tells you. Look how they hid the causes of subway delays.

Part 2 is out. http://www.gothamgazette.com/opinion/7609-the-great-select-bus-service-conspiracy-part-2

The least they could have done would be to make the presentation in front of the entire community boards instead of only a few on the transportation committee. DeBlasio used billboards to promote Vision Zero but not to publicize SBS. There could be a single presentation describing the entire proposal in addition to separate ones for each board. It's as if no one rides a bus outside their community board. It shouldn't take a convoluted menu on the DOT website to find info on SBS. The B82 SBS is listed under the Southern Brooklyn SBS as if someone supposed to know to look there. Also, most people would look for info on the MTA site where there is none, not on the DOT site where if you click on the graphic that asks for your opinion on the B82, you are taken to info that is three years old. Do you need more examples?

Let me weigh in also. First of all, no one is talking about just putting a bus on Avenue P without any discussion. You are just making that up. It is merely being presented as an alternative for discussion. And just because part of a street is residential, doesn't automatically mean a bus can't run on it or that communities will oppose it. There was no opposition when one direction of the 13th Avenue bus was moved from the commercial 13th Avenue to the residential 14th Avenue. And it's very easy to blame everything bad on community groups calling them all NIMBY's and not wanting any change. That is just untrue. I go to my Community Board meetings fairly frequently and often see them approve new developments. They oppose them when they have good reason to oppose them. I also realize that sonetines they don't always behave in a rational manner. No matter how you try to spin this, the B82 SBS has been poorly publicized, just like all the others. Most find out about it when it is implemented. Many bus riders today still have no idea what SBS is unless there is a route in their neighborhood. You are also assuming SBS means better service and that no one is hurt, just because the MTA tells you that. Read my piece in the Gotham Gazette. Part 2 will be out in a few hours. Maybe that will open up your eyes if you are willing to accept facts that contradict with what you have been hearing. But I have my doubts. You will probably continue to believe what you believe now no matter what anyone else says.

Yes, correct. Their rationale for not including Avenue R is that there were few bus transfers there. They also needed to include those boarding at Avenue R, Avenue S and Quentin Road as well as B100 transfers because most of those people would walk to Avenue R if it were an SBS stop. Why should those who previously used the Limited, now be forced onto the local? It makes no sense and isn't fair. Then there was their other clip with yours truly. http://brooklyn.news12.com/clip/14260172/gravesend-residents-to-rally-against-citys-plan-for-b82-bus-line

That is the crux of the problem. The data is not there or has not been released to show what works and what doesn't work. There needs to be a real analysis of all SBS routes before any more are created. Even the B44 works very well for a few people, line 30 health care workers along Emmons Avenue who live in Crown Heights. But the MTA and DOT have been using data selectively and distorting the results to wrongly show it has all been a success. Also, Avenue D SBS stop was added prior to implementation and the MTA agreed to add Avenue R, then reneged. No one said anything about throwing out a route without outreach. And yes there has been a long history of people opposing new bus routes on their streets so it is a legitimate issue. And your other issue is also legitimate. But the outreach has been pathetic. Besides meeting with business owners and the transportation committees of community boards, there has been no outreach to the general public. The first SBS meetings were held with the entire community boards and for the B44, they had publicized workshops for everyone, but those resulted in too much criticism so now all they do besides those meetings is stand at bus stops and listen to people complain how horrible the existing service is and use that as rationale to institute SBS. Anyone who suggests improvements or changes is just ignored because of the MTA and DOT's arrogance. This plan was postponed because Byford was convinced the outreach was lacking.

They should have known because I warned them about it last June. But as usual they didn't care. http://www.qchron.com/editions/queenswide/sbs-will-not-solve-beach-commuter-s-headaches/article_c9144508-c9ec-52a9-b05d-f374ba5c093a.html

It's no time only the B46 that has big problems. And just wait till the beach traffic hits Woodhaven Blvd this summer. The weekends will mean mega traffic congestion with the loss of two lanes for general traffic. Last summer without the lanes southbound traffic barely moving south of Atlantic Avenue. With the lanes in effect, the entire street will be at a standstill. The buses will be the only thing moving on Woodhaven, but they will all be stuck on Cross Bay as they were last year which means the SBS will also be greatly delayed.

Not so. It's just that parking is more of a premium in Brooklyn than it is in other areas. In some neighborhoods, it's almost as bad as it in Manhattan. Once I wanted to have dinner in Bay Ridge. I searched for a meter for a full hour, before giving up and eating in Park Slope. Also, asking for better bus service does not equate with SBS. SBS has not been an improvement. At least the data is not there to show that it has. Many are for better bus service but have not been sold that SBS means that just because DOT and the MTA claim that without adequate proof.

And the B41 will face even more opposition than the B82. The Flatbush Avenue merchants are dead set against it after seein the results on Nostrand and on Utica. Assemblyman Cymbrowitz announced it on Facebook before that article came out. He wouldn't have done that f it weren't true. And sometimes when it's in the paper, you can't believe it's true. Courier Life announced about three months ago that a B44 SBS stop would be added at Avenue R. Then the MTA changed their mind after DOT and the MTA both agreed, and the stop was not installed.

And since when does the media report the news timely. There are crimes that are reported three weeks after they occur, only when the police need the public's help. The mainstream media also considers buses as a local issue and no worthy of citywide coverage. When the southwest Brooklyn bus changes were made in 1978, there was zero TV coverage and a citywide newspaper strike. Only Courier Life covered it and that was because of a demonstration in Coney Island because if the B74 elimination on Mermaid Avenue that lasted for three months. Changng 12 bus routes on one day was not considered newsworthy. Not that much has changed regarding the media in 40 years. News12 and neighborhood papers will probably only briefly mention it.

Amazing how people see what they want to see. The headline clearly states it has been postponed and the article says it was supposed to start in July.

Serious wonders like making local service very infrequent like every 20 or 30 minutes. Where do you think they will be getting all that new SBS service during hours that the Limited doesn't run? It will come from the local service, and antics will increase headways even more. The traffic changes they are proposing around the terminal do not require SBS to be implemented.

The problems at Rockaway Parkway Station can be solved without SBS.