CenSin

Today’s been one of those better days on the : lucked out and skipped ahead of 3 s on the way to Sheepshead Bay.

Last week, not so much: stuck in traffic for so long I could not even transfer to the same I was on before I got on the . 😂

On 8/25/2023 at 4:52 PM, Nitro said:

That's at the border of fantasyland.

Which side of the border did you have in mind?

21 hours ago, Nitro said:

Since the Utica Avenue Subway has proven to be infeasible. The only realistic approach is to extend the  to Broadway Junction if you don't believe me look up this article.

What article? It’s a Reddit thread, same as any other chain of posts here on NYC Transit Forums.

10 minutes ago, Vulturious said:

Funny, but instead I have the  replace the  outright.

You don’t mean the other way around? Or you mean to put an sticker on all the R188s?

Those R143s and R160s aren’t going under the East River to Queens without brand new tunnels.

12 minutes ago, nightmare402 said:

M will be fully suspended August 30-sep 5

12 minutes ago, nightmare402 said:

We're replacing tracks

Didn’t they do a shutdown to renovate the entire branch not too long ago?

On 8/7/2023 at 1:02 AM, ABCDEFGJLMNQRSSSWZ said:

I have 3 theories:

1. The IRT started constructing the 4th Avenue line before the contract was officially awarded to the BMT, and BMT construction basically destroyed whatever IRT infrastructure that had been constructed.

2. The IRT constructed provisions for the 4th Avenue line alongside when the BMT building it's 4th Av subway. These provisions extended as far as Butler St, but have been sealed off and lost to time.

3. IRT started constructing the 4th Avenue line before the contract was awarded to BMT, but BMT preserved what IRT had constructed

Subway history: https://nycsubway.org/wiki/The_Dual_System_of_Rapid_Transit_(1912)

Quote

The Tri-Borough Plan. Early in 1908, the Commission adopted routes in Brooklyn which, with the Fourth Avenue, Brooklyn, Subway, it linked up with the Broadway-Lexington Avenue Subway by means of bridges and tunnels over and under the East River. The whole plan became known as the Tri-Borough System. In Brooklyn it embraced the Broadway-Lafayette Avenue Subway running from the end of the Williamsburg Bridge out Broadway, Brooklyn, to Lafayette Avenue and back through Lafayette Avenue to a junction with the Fourth Avenue Subway at Fulton Street, as well as two extensions of the Fourth Avenue Subway running to Ft. Hamilton and Coney Island. The estimated cost of this system was about $147,000,000 and the plans provided for about 45 miles of new road including both underground and elevated portions.

There are a lot of provisions in the form of station shells and bellmouthes all along the Eastern Parkway line.

Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nevins_Street_station

Quote

Between this merge and Atlantic Avenue is another unused trackway, splitting from the local track towards a subway under Fourth Avenue (later built as the BMT Fourth Avenue Line). This trackway and another trackway (both built for the same proposed subway) end at the same level, under Fourth Avenue, just west of the Pacific Street station on the current BMT Fourth Avenue Line and a few feet higher.

Have a look at the area marked 46c (source):

1 hour ago, Lawrence St said:

The lawlessness on the subway overnight is ridiculous.

Fixed.

15 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

This morning on the  train there was an assault and robbery during the AM rush hour at Bedford Av.

I’m surprised that even happened. I frequent that area, and you can leave personal property unattended at the gyms, cafes, and restaurants and still expect to find it where you left it.

But then again, it’s in the train, and I’ll bet the assailant wasn’t someone who strolled into the train to commit robbery after hopping the turnstile at Bedford Avenue.

1 hour ago, N6 Limited said:

16 hours ago, Kamen Rider said:

Not only that, outside of the core rush hour period, management recently told us they want us to make more connections

Great! Customer service focused actions. 

It depends on which customers you are talking about.

The that gets held at both 36 Street and 59 Street for the same ? How many people from the 2 local stations are benefiting from the time saved and at the cost of how many who are already on the train? Often, I also see an pulling out of 59 Street as the approaches, and it waits for the right behind—as if those 2 minutes filled up the next with a lot of people heading to Sea Beach stations. lol

6 minutes ago, trainfan22 said:

Cause the terminates at Bedford Park using single pocket operation, so I thought the would as well. 

If that were the case, I’d weep for those who rely on it during rush hour.

27 minutes ago, ABOGbrooklyn said:

Why cant they also install CBTC the same time as track repair shut down?

I doubt we’ll get a good answer. Sometimes there are a lot of technical reasons something cannot be done but most of the time the reasons will never see the light of day.

As a software developer and computer hardware geek, I find that getting the client to understand that technical limitations or design choices impose limitations on what’s possible or how fast other features get implemented is a herculean task. Sometimes I get suggestions how to do my job by people who have no idea how to do my job.

I am not saying this is one of those cases, but people very privy to the implementation details might have gotten this and lament that their explanations just make laypeople go “but what if you ….” So they don’t bother engaging anymore.

But of course, this is the MTA we are talking about with a reputation for dragging feet and burning cash. There’s plenty of justification to question how they could be more efficient.

23 hours ago, Wallyhorse said:

This all stemmed from pols in Brooklyn wanting the  split in two, making the a much shorter route (on weekdays, nights and weekends I would extend this  to Metropolitan to absorb the night and weekend shuttles) that in Brooklyn would not be subject to delays from elsewhere on the line.  This also would have been about keeping pols happy.

The pols both matter and don't matter—depending on whether the idea is favored.

: for the pols!

An elevated line (e.g., Myrtle, Third, etc.): f*** the pols!

23 hours ago, Wallyhorse said:

This also would have been about keeping pols happy. 

Methinks it’s really about keeping Wally happy. 🙂

5 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

Waiting 30 plus mins for an train wouldn't help either. Every time the screws up, I have to wait more than 12 mins. Adding extra service isn't going to help because the line is pure trash.

A train () that can get you to the nearest transfer station is better than none () at all. 🙂

3 hours ago, texassubwayfan555 said:

Why is this thread labeled as Systemwide CBTC when CBTC is not even planned to cover the whole subway system?

As opposed to separate threads about CBTC for every segment of track

I imagine an alternate reality where the MTA follows through with building a connector between Queensboro Plaza and Queens Plaza. Then the trains just go to Queensboro Plaza, people could go downstairs to continue their trip, and none of the trains’ frequencies would be constrained by three different routes having to share a pair of tracks. Astoria would certainly be happy to have twice the frequency from the reroute of trains.

On 7/24/2023 at 3:21 PM, darkstar8983 said:

On 7/23/2023 at 5:01 PM, CenSin said:

Do they really have to though? The  could go to Hewes Street while the  terminated on the middle track. Now there is one less possible train movement that blocks another.

1. The  and  regardless will cross over each other. All you would do is change which direction the overlapping happens.

Hmm… You’re actually right. While the - terminal swap would reduce the number of track intersections, the functional result is still the blockage of trains both entering and leaving the middle track. There is a quick fix for it via the addition of one slip switch east of the station and another switch west of the station, but the result is suboptimal from a passenger’s perspective, and that same effort could be put towards making Marcy Avenue a viable terminal instead.

1 hour ago, mrsman said:

A 3rd Ave subway with a stop at 60th-63rd would be a huge improvement for transit connections basically connecting all of the Upper East Side and good parts of Queens all in one station.  The 3rd Ave platform would provide an in-system transfer between the 59th street station on the  (and its connections to the Broadway trains that head to Queens via 60th street) and the 63rd street station that currently provides connections to  (63rd street tunnel to Queens and the connection to SAS.

The question becomes how to route such a line so that it makes sense, what to connect it to, and how to possibly reroute some of the existing B division trains in the area to limit unnecessary congestion due to interlining.

I don’t know if the structure of the tunnels would allow shoehorning another diverging tunnel from the curve coming out of 72 Street, but it already exists and gets trains halfway to 3 Avenue.

But while the transfers would be very convenient from 60 Street down to 14 Street, the trains do need a way to get back to 2 Avenue for the transfers at Houston Street () and Grand Street (). The block between 36 and 37 Streets appears to be the least developed area with just a parking facility, a lot of road, and a low-rise building on the northwest corner.

But it could also very well continue down 3 Avenue and Bowery, connecting to 2 Avenue () via a slightly longer passageway and Bowery () before continuing along its original planned R.O.W. along St. James Place, Pearl Street, and Water Street. This would definitely rule out a track connection with the Manhattan Bridge, but doesn’t prevent an indirect transfer to the and via the Bowery platforms if such a connection were to be built.

EDIT: Actually, one could be built if the vestiges of the bridge tunnels were to be reused as follows:

• The Manhattan-bound Broadway track and Brooklyn-bound 6 Avenue track are connected to the Bowery R.O.W.
• Where the ridiculously large mezzanine would have been would instead host the bridge tracks and platform.
• The lower level would be reserved for a future extension down to Chatham Square and beyond.
• Obviously, the tracks would be on the “wrong side” for the direction of traffic they’d be serving. North of the Grand Street station, the trackways would have to cross à la 59 Street Columbus Circle.

1 hour ago, Lawrence St said:

terminating  trains have to block the  from entering & leaving until it clears the block.

Do they really have to though? The  could go to Hewes Street while the  terminated on the middle track. Now there is one less possible train movement that blocks another.

On 7/19/2023 at 7:46 PM, Freight Trainmaster said:

Does anyone really believe this ocean level nonsense?  Hard to imagine folks being so gullible.   

Oh, and what sort of gull are you?

6 hours ago, Calvin said:

The turnstiles in the Subway system are slowly being moderated to avoid people from jumping or sneaking their way in. There's also work being done in the gates as well. 

 https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/ny-turnstile-back-cocking-modification-mta-20230717-5fkk74kr3ffmdh55nmazl5hiou-story.html?fbclid=IwAR1tFNDVlHD-O6hVAqFH9Z3KQ9cmO_tusGrLfL-94GSZwMdxTXdcpj61oD4

Pretty soon, if you couldn’t dance on a moving subway car, you wouldn’t be fit enough to hop the turnstiles.

49 minutes ago, R68ACTrain said:

I fail to see how the Bronx would be affected as it is connected to the rest of the continent as opposed the other 4 boroughs, and Long Island.

A continent is just a very big island. 😉

The Bronx? It’s surrounded by water on  three sides.

Skimmed the discussions and I find it interesting that there is talk of making Utica Avenue built to B Division clearances for an eventual connection to one of the numerous B Division lines up north. There is a lot stacked against something like that from happening:

• All of the B Division stations in the potential path of a Utica Avenue extension are through stations. That isn’t true of the Eastern Parkway line which has one pair of tracks dead-ending just east of Utica Avenue. (And of course, because there were always plans to make such a branch.)
  • So, a tie-in to any of the B Division lines would immediately siphon service from all the stations west of Utica Avenue on that line.
• All of the B Division lines except for the are served by multiple routes sharing a double-tracked tunnel or bridge across the East River. Capacity would be an issue.
• Speaking of capacity: a connection to the Williamsburg Bridge via Myrtle Avenue–Broadway would probably be a no-go. It caps train lengths to 8 cars, and there is no capacity to send more trains to Manhattan’s prime destinations (in midtown).
• The fabled Second System to dodge all of the above limitations would be expensive enough to be inconceivable as a serious proposal. There’s an entire 5 miles of tunneling between 2 Avenue–East Houston Street and Myrtle Avenue–Broadway and a river. The Amtrak tunnel under the Hudson River is projected to cost $7 billion.
  • Doing this would also assume there is a trunk line with spare capacity to connect it to.

8 hours ago, ArchytectAnthony said:

the  will have to use those new switches that are built underground closer to Church Avenue.

Finally they will use them. I’m pretty sure those installed in the tunnel were there more than a year ago, but the kept using the ones outdoor. The tunnel ones seem to have much better track geometry for high speed switching than the subpar ones they replaced—ironically added by the same IND which had championed high-speed track geometry.

8 hours ago, ABCDEFGJLMNQRSSSWZ said:

The only bad thing about the  jumping all the way from 138th to 72nd St is anyone coming from the Bronx who needs to get off in Manhattan north of 72nd St would have to take the train to 72nd St and backtrack or just take the .

That is a much smaller market, isn’t it? And it’s what the locals are for.

On 7/7/2023 at 4:44 PM, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

No between Marcy Av and Broad St.

 

No between Myrtle Av and 2 Av.

Emergency teams are responding to someone who was struck by a train at Delancey St-Essex St.

The last stop on Broad St-bound trains will be Marcy Av where they will turn for Jamaica Center-Parsons/Archer-bound service.

Interesting… which tracks got knocked out that crippled both and service this way?