Threxx Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2126 Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) I read a thread to read something interesting, not this really old joke about 'fowm' repeated a million times. NEXT No trains can pass 57 St at 6 and 7 Avs. Reroute: Note that all lines must have the same tph to Manhattan as before. : No trains b/w Delancey Street and Lexington Avenue-63rd Street, any trains in-between this section either continue to Brooklyn or terminate at 34th Street. / : No trains b/w 42nd Street and Queensboro Plaza or 5th Avenue-59th Street. : No trains b/w 5th Avenue-59th Street and Rector Street. Trains in this section of track either continue to Brooklyn or terminate at 42nd Street. Edited August 27, 2012 by Threxx 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2127 Posted August 27, 2012 Why can't you run the in the tunnel? It works on 60 St. Depends on what you define as "works". The delays on that leg RIGHT NOW can be unbelievable at times, especially during evening rush hours. Trust me on this, as I ride Broadway lines very frequently. I have a few horror stories about this. My view is "why add more delays?" I just didn't want a ripple effect that would delay Astoria and QB riders, that's all. Just having the and would greatly simplify things. People can get the Q at Atlantic and/ or DeKalb across the platform. This would also help the Brighton riders get more consistent and reliable service since it would have no tracks to share or bridges to cross (lol). Sure, they would have to get off their train in Brooklyn, but they would have NO LACK of transfers. Also, you can have a person who wanted the in Manhattan just stay on the and and transfer in Brooklyn or take an IRT at Times Square or 14th st to Atlantic Center. I just thought this would be the easiest thing to do. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2128 Posted August 27, 2012 I just thought this would be the easiest thing to do. The easiest thing to do isn't always the best thing to do... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighton Express Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2129 Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) Quit being a micro-managing butthurt, it's annoying as well. I believe I said that before... We don't need any flame wars here, so stop trying to point out every goddamn flaw in the way a person acts... The "flaw" for you is annoying as shit so please stop. NEXT No trains can pass 57 St at 6 and 7 Avs. Reroute: Note that all lines must have the same tph to Manhattan as before. Bedford Park Blvd to Coney Island (Grand CC/CPW/Brighton Local/6 Av Express) Euclid Av to 168 St (Fulton/CPW/UWS Local/8 Av Express) Coney Island to 179 St (Culver/PS/Viaduct/6 Av/8 Av Local/Queens Blvd Express) Jamaica Ctr to 95 St (Nassau St/4 Av Local) 42 St to Coney Island (Broadway/4 Av Express/Sea Beach Local) No Service 42 St to 95 St (Broadway/4 Av Local) 5 Av to Astoria Ditmars (Astoria Local) NOTE One train runs Astoria Express Edited August 27, 2012 by Brighton Express 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2130 Posted August 27, 2012 42 St to Coney Island (Broadway/4 Av Express/Sea Beach Local) 42 St to Coney Island (Broadway Express/Brighton Local) 42 St to 95 St (Broadway/4 Av Local) Good luck terminating the whole 29 TPH of Broadway at 42nd Street... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighton Express Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2131 Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) Good luck terminating the whole 29 TPH of Broadway at 42nd Street... Always got something to say... Bedford Park Blvd to Coney Island (Grand CC/CPW/Brighton Local/6 Av Express) No Service Edited August 27, 2012 by Brighton Express 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NX Express Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2132 Posted August 27, 2012 Depends on what you define as "works". The delays on that leg RIGHT NOW can be unbelievable at times, especially during evening rush hours. Trust me on this, as I ride Broadway lines very frequently. I have a few horror stories about this. My view is "why add more delays?" I just didn't want a ripple effect that would delay Astoria and QB riders, that's all. Just having the and would greatly simplify things. People can get the Q at Atlantic and/ or DeKalb across the platform. This would also help the Brighton riders get more consistent and reliable service since it would have no tracks to share or bridges to cross (lol). Sure, they would have to get off their train in Brooklyn, but they would have NO LACK of transfers. Also, you can have a person who wanted the in Manhattan just stay on the and and transfer in Brooklyn or take an IRT at Times Square or 14th st to Atlantic Center. I just thought this would be the easiest thing to do. There's no way for a to terminate at Atlantic or Dekalb. As for the N/Q/R, once they merge, delays should be minimal. The stream of trains is assembled and then moves down the line smoothly, since there is no switching and merging. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2133 Posted August 27, 2012 Always got something to say... Bedford Park Blvd to Coney Island (Grand CC/CPW/Brighton Local/6 Av Express) No Service We ain't going to go Dekalb Avenue on this thread now... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2134 Posted August 27, 2012 The easiest thing to do isn't always the best thing to do... I am sorry sir, but can you be specific? There's no way for a to terminate at Atlantic or Dekalb. Huh? Q trains have terminated at Atlantic Av. I know, because I have taken some that have. This was done during track work and such. As for the N/Q/R, once they merge, delays should be minimal. The stream of trains is assembled and then moves down the line smoothly, since there is no switching and merging. I don't know about that...we'll agree to disagree on this one. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2135 Posted August 27, 2012 1. I am sorry sir, but can you be specific? 2. Huh? Q trains have terminated at Atlantic Av. I know, because I have taken some that have. This was done during track work and such. 1. Like the fail that was the Dekalb fire a couple weeks ago... 2. The crossover that allowed trains to do that has been removed, look at the track maps: http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/caption.pl?/img/trackmap/pm_southeast_1.png 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NX Express Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2136 Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) Huh? Q trains have terminated at Atlantic Av. I know, because I have taken some that have. This was done during track work and such. The only way for a Q coming from the Brighton Line to terminate at Atlantic Av is for it to single-track from Prospect Park (this is done during late nights, but Q trains must run every 30 minutes for this to work). Even if both tracks are used, this results in a 15-minute frequency, which is nowhere near sufficient. Thus, until the Brighton Line gets a switch at Atlantic Av, Q trains in non-late-night service will continue to end at Prospect Park or get priority to run through to Manhattan. Edited August 27, 2012 by NX Express 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighton Express Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2137 Posted August 27, 2012 We ain't going to go Dekalb Avenue on this thread now... I don't know if you quoted the wrong post, but where on Earth does it say in my post about a to DeKalb? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2138 Posted August 27, 2012 I don't know if you quoted the wrong post, but where on Earth does it say in my post about a to DeKalb? I'm talking about the Dekalb Fail two weeks ago... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2139 Posted August 27, 2012 1. Like the fail that was the Dekalb fire a couple weeks ago... 2. The crossover that allowed trains to do that has been removed, look at the track maps: http://www.nycsubway...southeast_1.png 1. I still don't understand what you are trying to say here. 2. Thanks for the clarification. Why did they remove them??? Wow! The only way for a Q coming from the Brighton Line to terminate at Atlantic Av is for it to single-track from Prospect Park (this is done during late nights, but Q trains must run every 30 minutes for this to work). Even if both tracks are used, this results in a 15-minute frequency, which is nowhere near sufficient. Thus, until the Brighton Line gets a switch at Atlantic Av, Q trains in non-late-night service will continue to end at Prospect Park or get priority to run through to Manhattan. See #2 above. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2140 Posted August 27, 2012 1. I still don't understand what you are trying to say here. 2. Thanks for the clarification. Why did they remove them??? Wow! 1. The fact that the couldn't do the simplest reroutes, they were trying to do the easy thing... 2. They weren't being used, and you have to maintain switches. You barely have to maintain regular rails... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2141 Posted August 27, 2012 1. The fact that the couldn't do the simplest reroutes, they were trying to do the easy thing... 2. They weren't being used, and you have to maintain switches. You barely have to maintain regular rails... Thank you. On #2, there has to be contingency plans when there are service interruptions, but I understand what you are saying. That switch could have been useful, but then again, there are several others as well--no need to rehash that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2142 Posted August 27, 2012 On #1, can you specifically tell me why the Q service change would "not be the best thing to do"? Just curious. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2143 Posted August 27, 2012 On #1, can you specifically tell me why the Q service change would "not be the best thing to do"? Just curious. Well one, the switch isn't there, we've established that. Two, it would royally piss off 3 of the largest neighborhoods in Brooklyn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2144 Posted August 27, 2012 Well one, the switch isn't there, we've established that. Two, it would royally piss off 3 of the largest neighborhoods in Brooklyn. Rebuild it. About two, I most certainly know that. LOL. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSubwayStation Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2145 Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) People can get the Q at Atlantic and/ or DeKalb across the platform. This would also help the Brighton riders get more consistent and reliable service since it would have no tracks to share or bridges to cross (lol). Sure, they would have to get off their train in Brooklyn, but they would have NO LACK of transfers. Also, you can have a person who wanted the in Manhattan just stay on the and and transfer in Brooklyn or take an IRT at Times Square or 14th st to Atlantic Center. I just thought this would be the easiest thing to do. This would cause crowding on the and , though, don't you think? Anyway, I'll try something new: Here's a G.O. alert poster for my Manhattan Bridge scenario: https://docs.google....wRbYAV_Ee0/edit Edited August 27, 2012 by TheSubwayStation 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrainFanInfinity Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2146 Posted August 27, 2012 New scneario: The express tracks at the Broadway-Lafayette B D F M station are out of service due to a sick passenger. Please reroute without 60 TPH on the local track. No service b/w West 4 Street & Brooklyn. [D] No service b/w West 4 Street & Whitehall Street. NEXT All four local tracks are impassable at West 4 St. No service b/w 34 Street-Penn Station & Chambers Street. Via 6 Ave Local. Via 8 Ave Express. Via Crosstown. No service b/w Chambers Street & 34 Street-Herald Square. NEXT 14 St/8 Av is impassable. Via 6 Ave Local. No service b/w 34 Street-Penn Station & World Trade Center. Via 6 Ave Express. 2 trains run via Crosstown. No service b/w Union Square & 8 Ave. NEXT FASTRACK on the Lexington Av and 6 Av lines. Have fun. [4] No service b/w 125 Street & Borough Hall. [5] Service to Manhattan ends early. [6] No service b/w 125 Street & Brooklyn Bridge. Service ends early. Runs in two sections: Between The Bronx & Lower East Side-2 Avenue, via 8 Ave Local. Between Whitehall Street & Brooklyn, via Montague Street Tun. Via 53 Street - 8 Ave Local. Service to Manhattan ends early. Extended to 21 Street-Queensbridge. Incident on a train causes 34th street herald square to be closed off on the 6th ave line reroute away (broadway not affected) Due to a 12-9 at grand central the northbound lexingtion ave tracks are impassible and power is shut off reroute away! No service b/w 42 Street-Bryant Park & Times Via 8 Ave Express. Via 53 Street - 8 Ave Local. Select trains via Crosstown. Via 8 Ave Local. Rerouted to 21 Street-Queensbridge. [4] No service b/w 86 Street & 14 Street-Union Square. (It is possible, there might be delays though. So...) Select trains terminate at Brooklyn Bridge or Wall Street. [5] Northbound trains via 7th Avenue Line. [6] No service b/w 86 Street & Brooklyn Bridge. NEXT Word is that there is a coaster on the D line at W4 St. The brakes have failed for now, and the Emergency Brakes will not work until the train is just about to enter Coney Island. The switches are set like this, making these tracks impassible on the Downtown side. 6 Av Express, DeKalb Av Bypass/4 Av Express, West End Local. This is a tough one. Who can solve it? All trains via local, Southbound [D] trains via West End Express. NEXT: The Manhattan Bridge needs to be rebuilt, and gets shut down to ALL train service. This is a planned, long-term service change, so riders can be warned in advance. Thus, you need only to worry about providing the best service possible, and NOT about confusing people. No service b/w West 4 Street & Brooklyn. No service b/w West 4 Street & Atlantic Avenue-Barclays Center. [N][Q] Via Tunnel. Also, the Grand Street Shuttle is restored. NEXT The 7 Av Line is impassable at 34 St. [1][3] No service b/w Times Square-42 Street & 14 Street, via 7 Ave Express. [2] Via Lexington Avenue Line. Trains already on 7 Ave turn at 42 St. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2147 Posted August 27, 2012 This would cause crowding on the and , though, don't you think? Anyway, I'll try something new: Here's a G.O. alert poster for my Manhattan Bridge scenario: https://docs.google....wRbYAV_Ee0/edit Yes it will, definitely. Which I would say to give the a few more trains per hour and urge passengers to make that transfer at Atlantic Av, which many of them will. The Lex line will definitely feel the effects especially at Union Square and Atlantic Center. The train is definitely going to feel it too, especially at Jay St and Herald Square. It's not going to be easy, that's for sure, especially when you have such an important link being taken away. But IMO (and I stress MY OPINION) three train lines on the Broadway local track from Downtown BK to almost Queens isn't going to work. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSubwayStation Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2148 Posted August 27, 2012 But IMO (and I stress MY OPINION) three train lines on the Broadway local track from Downtown BK to almost Queens isn't going to work. Are you aware of trains per hour and capacity and such? Theoretically, the , , and on one track is not over capacity. If you think there's a problem, then why don't you just run each of them a little less frequently? That's much better than overcrowding the and specifically, and the already overcrowded IRT. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2149 Posted August 27, 2012 Are you aware of trains per hour and capacity and such? Theoretically, the , , and on one track is not over capacity. If you think there's a problem, then why don't you just run each of them a little less frequently? That's much better than overcrowding the and specifically, and the already overcrowded IRT. Theoretically.... Again, the crux of my argument is that all three lines through the Montague st tunnels will cause huge delays throughout the line and effect Astoria and Queens Blvd riders. I NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT CAPACITY. That is a red herring. I stated that based on my extremely frequent experience riding the line over the years and the delays that it faces NOW with just two trains running on the local track, and one of them only running on it PART of the way. This is also with ALL THREE TRAINS on the same track north of 57th st. So you bringing up capacity in this sense misses my point. What happens before DeKalb when the needs to get onto the local tracks shared by both the and the ? I see these trains crawling through Manhattan, IMO worse than they do now. With just the and , the converges at 59th st in BK and diverges after 59th and Lex. Simple. If the line gets backed up in BK or lower Manhattan, there can be trains sitting on the express track ready to be put into service for Astoria and QB (as they are now). If riders want the Brighton line, just stay on the or to BK. Simple. Or they can use the IRT. Again, I think this will be the least confusing and simplest for commuters to handle. I think this will also minimize delays into Manhattan and Queens. As Threexx pointed out, Brighton riders will be pissed, though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrainFanInfinity Posted August 27, 2012 Share #2150 Posted August 27, 2012 This would cause crowding on the and , though, don't you think? Anyway, I'll try something new: Here's a G.O. alert poster for my Manhattan Bridge scenario: https://docs.google....wRbYAV_Ee0/edit Via Tunnel??? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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