subwaycommuter1983

That's what the MTA needs to do. The MTA cannot continue to make the same mistake they did with the r179's. Those r32's and r42's would have been retired much sooner if the MTA would have included an additional option order of r160's instead of creating a new order of r179's.

The problem is that the MTA has the tendency to wait until the subway cars are literally falling apart to replace them. This current capital program should have included car orders to replace the r62's and r68's considering how long it takes to build, deliver, test and put new trains in service.

It would make more sense for the MTA to add a 3rd option order for the r211's than to do a separate order to retire the r68's. Look at the mess the MTA made with the r179's. If the MTA would have added a 3rd option order for the r160's, they would have avoided all the delays and headaches caused by the r179's and the r32's would have been retired sooner. I honestly don't think it is a good idea for storm doors to be locked after last Tuesday's shooting and the MTA should not wait until 2030 to retire the r68's. The MTA is already behind schedule with the r62's. The order for r262's should have been included in this capital program. At least the r211's include cameras and the MTA needs to retrofit all other NTTs with cameras.

Thanks for the update. I guess the testing process for the pilot train has been really smooth.

If people in the Bronx are more proactive and put more political pressure on the MTA and all levels of the government, many subway extensions could be a reality. The #1, #4, #6, and D trains need to be extended past their current terminals in the Bronx by using elevated tracks. Also, the MTA needs to revise phase 3 and phase 4 of the SAS to include an extension of the Q to the Bronx, running on elevated tracks above 3rd Avenue to Fordham Plaza. I'm pretty sure that it would be much faster and cheaper to build elevated tracks in the Bronx and in the outer boroughs than to dig tunnels in Midtown and Lower Manhattan. Going back to the r211's, I am hoping for the best. The r46's are breaking down a lot. Fortunately, the r179's are holding strong.

I agree 100%. It could go along 3rd Avenue in the Bronx as an elevated line. There use to be an elevated subway line along 3rd Avenue in the Bronx which was knocked down in the 1970's (dumb mistake). 3rd Avenue in the Bronx is more underserved than the east side of Manhattan below 59th street. IMO any subway extensions in the outer boroughs should be using elevated tracks. It's cheaper and it's faster to build and many subway lines run on elevated tracks in the outer boroughs anyways. As for the r211's, all option orders need to be exercised. Ridership is rising and will continue to rise.

I like the fact that you are addressing the BD trains getting NTT's since both lines get rerouted through 8th Avenue, which will become CBTC and r68's won't be able to go through 8th Avenue once CBTC is installed. 6th Avenue needs to be the next segment to get CBTC. It just doesn't make sense to worsen service on 6th Avenue by improving service on 8th Avenue. BOTH 8th Avenue and 6th Avenue need CBTC because ABCDEF trains get rerouted pretty often.

Yes, but they are only using 5 car trains. The G will need 8 car trains and the C will need 10 car trains.

glad it didn't derail. I heard that the Kawasaki trains that operate on DC metro were pulled from service due to derailment. Fingers crossed that these issues don't affect the r211's or any of the other MTA Kawasaki trains.

Are they testing these announcements on all B division lines or just on the lines that are potentially getting the r211's (all option orders included)??

The r179's were sent to CI before being sent to Pitkin. Also, the r179's were tested on Brighton in addition to Broad Channel. The r211's will most likely be transferred to Pitkin to be tested at Broad Channel.

That s another confirmation. Most local media is also confirming the information I still think that the base order of open gangway trains will go to the E.

Most likely for the L. Keep in mind that the G is slated to get 8 car trains either directly from the C or from ENY.

The base order doesn't include 8 car trains. Only one of the option orders include 4 eight car trains (32 cars) and it's unclear if they will be open gangway.

I love the propulsion. When entering the station it's sounds a bit similar to the Siemens r160's and when it's departing it sounds a little bit like the r179's.

I just hope the first option order of r211's is delivered and in service before work on 8th Avenue CBTC is complete, so that the C can be not only 100% NTT, but also 100% full length.

That's a possibility that can't be ruled out. Wouldn't the base order of r211A 's plus the 10 car r179's be enough to displace the r46's from Pitkin?

The r211A's can accommodate more passengers than the r160's. In the event that the C gets the r160's from Jamaica, It will still be an upgrade because the C will go from 8 car trains to 10 cars. However, the odds for the C getting the r160's from Jamaica are not high. In fact, many local media are confirming that the base order of r211A's will go to the A and C trains. in terms of the open gangway trains, I agree with you 100% that the base order and part of the option orders for open gangway trains should go to the E. The F and maybe the A should get some of the option orders for the open gangway trains depending on how many r211T's are purchased in the option orders. In the case of the Q, It doesn't have a huge ridership compared to the E and F trains and by the time the 2nd phase of the 2nd Avenue subway is complete, the r68's will be retiring or retired. I'm not exaggerating. Construction hasn't even begun. I also agree with you in regards to 6th Avenue CBTC. It needs to be the next segment to get CBTC after 8th Avenue CBTC. Improving service on some lines, while worsening service on other lines is not how the subway will be fixed. If 6th Avenue CBTC does happen and Jamaica gets the first option order for the r211's, then the displaced r160's from Jamaica can go to Councourse and CI. CI will also have to retrofit their current batch of r160's with CBTC. Let's see what happens. I just hope the MTA uses less politics and more common sense and put CBTC on 6th Avenue next and then throughout the whole system.

This is pretty much confirmed by the MTA and the media although I would not rule out the E getting some of the base order of r211A's plus the base order of 2 ten car open gangway trains, while the C gets the r160's from Jamaica. Scenario 1 A: r179's, r211A's C : r211A's E: r160's, r211T's Scenario 2 A: r179's, r211A's C : r160's E: r160's, r211A's, r211T's

If Jamaica gets the first option order, It will displace the r160's to CI and Concourse as well. The D will need NTT's due to 8th Avenue CBTC. The B not so much, unless 6th Avenue CBTC is indeed the next segment to get CBTC, (I hope so) which makes sense. The B doesn't run during the weekends and the B is easily suspended, even if it is due to a minor issue on Brighton or CPW. If all goes well with the open gangway trains, then the first option order should consist of mostly open gangway trains r211T's, wheras the second option order should consist of mostly r211A's. Any additional open gangway should be included in the replacement order for the r68's. Why?? By the time the Q starts running to 125th street, the r68's will be retiring. Construction hasn't even begun.

I think that the E will get the base order of r211T's and if all goes well with the open gangway trains, then the E/F possibly the A and Q will most likely get the option orders for the r211T's.

No! NQW riders need to relax and stop whining. There are still r160's and r68's running on those lines and most likely these 3 lines will get a chunk of the option orders for the r211's. In the meantime, NQW riders will have to deal with the r46's for a couple of years the same way AC riders had to deal with the oldest fleet in the system for over 10 years: r40 slants (retired on the A), r 44's, r32's, 42's (retired on the A), r46's. Thanks to 8th Avenue CBTC, AC trains will finally be 100% NTT. It's about time!!!

I agree. I hate standing as well, especially if it is a long ride. The reduce seating stinks and that's the only thing I don't like about the r211's.

The NQW will have to wait until the option orders of r211's are in service to get any new trains. The base order of r211's are barely enough to make the A/C 100% NTT'S in addition to the r179's.

"The R211 trains will test-run on the Eighth Avenue Line, which carries the A and C trains, as well as the Queens Boulevard Line, which runs the E, F, M, and R trains. " (AMNY). https://www.amny.com/transit/mta-moves-forward-with-new-r211-train-cars-after-yearlong-delay/ Either the A/C gets the base order of r211A's or they get the r160's from QBL or a combination of both fleets plus the 10 car r179's. This article confirms that the base order (except the r211S') is for 8th Avenue CBTC.