Q43 Floral Park

In that instance, it wouldn't work. There isn't room for another ~90 buses at KB.

If there was a full multi-route swap with YON sure.... I doubt you'll get one but, Can you explain what's gained from this? As a rider of routes from both depots, I guess I'm seeing more cons than pros. ex: When the Artics can't be used (bad winter weather), its going to come down to do we send an MCI out on a rush hour Bx9 run and cut a BxM run or send it out on the BxM run and have nothing for local service. I'm also under the impression YON has extra space (back in the day they had ~105 Classics) and KB has no space (parking on the street).

I'm slightly concerned about the long deadheads from ECH to the BxM1-3/18 terminals causing service issues. But it's roughly the same distance to the QM2/20 terminals so I guess if those runs are fine it shouldn't be an issue. I've been waiting for the full merger but instead of closing YON, I think they should split some of KB's routes (Bx7/10/20) if it's not a union issue.

3266,3314,3398,3400, 3403, 3438, 3452 at YON 3086, 3092 at ECH. I wonder if this is permanent or just because snow is on the horizon like the last time

The S/B BxM1 can easily stop at 96/5 Av but it would have to be diverted to stop near Sinai N/B. As is, You can only cross park at 96/97/102 Sts to get to the stop at 3 av/96 and each path is uphill at some point. The BxM1 is the Inwood route because its for East Side service and you only need half the runs for that service, the BxM2 via Riverside Dr has no guarantee of being faster than to the West side depending on starting point and pushes more people on to the BxM1. If Inwood really needed a change I'd add more BxM18s have them serve the area peak and send the remaining peak BxM1s all via the Deegan.

The stops at CPW/86 and CPW/96 didn't generate as much ridership as the stops S/o 79 St and It's not exactly easy to walk from Sinai to the Bxm1. Running it via HHP misses all the stops s/o 227, I'd probably just leave it alone. Add a BxM1 stop at 225 St

It may be a swap... 3182 and 3376 are on the BxM6; 3108 BxM8; 3073 and 3389 BxM9; 3074 and 3094 are on the BxM10 respectively.

3266, 3269, 3400, 3403, 3406, 3414, 3417,3428 and 3431 are at YON with ECH stickers. I believe 3423 was on the BxM18 this PM but I need to double check it. IMO, the 99 O5s are holding up a lot better approaching retirement than the 95 O5. The ex CAS 4xxs were basically imploding and collapsing on a regular basis in KB territory, havent seen as much of that with the newer O5s.

I think this really depends... ECH seems to be better at maintaining service levels (i.e not dropping runs) but YON pretty much has a straight DH to all their Bx Terminals. On paper the ECH DH to Woodlawn/ Wakefield isn't bad but the DHs to the BxM1-3/18 terminals will probably take longer than the current ECH QM20 DH. Speaking off that, I wonder if those BxM9 runs out of CP/ QM20s out of ECH experience any extra delays.

I haven't seen 8363 in service, my assumption is that some buses are being used for training. It's going to take most of the 83xxs to kill off those 6xxxs so it'll be a couple weeks.

They had too much service on Sedgwick, and moving it to Bailey closed up a gap in service in Kingsbridge Heights. West of Van Cortlandt Av it's fine... but from Bailey/VCW to Norwood it's unreliable because it has a habit of catching every light. It has no choice but to run down to BPB but having it run on Paul Avenue and 205 Street as well adds a good 3-5 minutes depending on the time of day.

Saw it on the Bx9 last friday night but couldn't find 4802 on the roster/scrap list to figure out what the deal was. thanks for the update

The issue is that the Bx2 could have continued running via Melrose if they used E150/52 (NB) and E151 (SB) to get to Third. It seemed like they really wanted the Bx1 as the sole LTD down GC and that couldn't be done with the Bx2 turning off at 165. I think this was brought up before but sending the 30 to Ropes with the 16 puts too much service in that small portion of Eastchester and robs the 30 of a great deal of ridership. You didnt give a routing but the Bx37 BPE to Co-op sounds like its a combo Bx30/39 (WPR/Boston/Co-op?)... the problem is that there isn't much around BPE to warrant terminating a route there with the Bx22/39 covering that area pretty well and it might be too much service on Boston Rd

It runs on the "service road" currently so I wondered if a set up like the B7 on Kings Highway would work. It doesn't run frequently enough to mar traffic, the islands are already there and less lights... I don't know about the arrangement LLE had with DOT but it was rare to see less than 3 buses at 26 St. It was also rare to see a run drop... The PM Bxm3 headways were ~10mins and the Bxm4A/Bs ~15 min and now they are 20 and 30 mins respectively.

I always wondered why they didn't find a way of running the BxM4 on the main road...

2. Theres a difference between running the Bx16 THROUGH Gun Hill Rd on Bainbridge and running the Bx16 ON Gun Hill. Way to just disregard the article, the safety of Norwood pedestrians and the fact that they want the at Woodlawn... again for some false sense of safety... 3. Please post a schedule that shows the weekday last run to Woodlawn at 10:45PM at any point in the past. 4. Sorry Misread the original post, Then that's only a cut of 2 runs.... is it worth it? 5. I'd trust Stevie Wonder's eyesight on Bxm11 ridership over yours when you're afraid to go into the neighborhoods it terminates in.... Tell me one instance of you riding it to 241 and describe what you saw... the poor service is all the more reason to make sure that Northern Dyre Av riders are covered by the Bxm10. 6. & 7. Not sure what you're saying/point is but people are starting to move back to these areas... 8. just like you aren't a Bronxite right? Spare me the BS. This "stop by stop analysis" is trash when I said the old routing didn't make sense not the current one (did you know the Bxm18s used to go that way also?). The only way the old routing would have been successful was if the S/B Bxm2 crossed to the west side at 96 St as well. All of this continues to tell me you don't read my posts thoroughly or have the ability to admit when you're wrong... For everyone: I'm not talking about realtors or businesses... When has MTA actively promoted the usage of the express buses to get to venues/events? I know you've been ignoring the nonsensical suggestions regarding the Bx16 and your insights are spot on... On an aside do you have any other suggestions for that area of the NE Bronx? Not that I'm entertaining it but where did they suggested sending the 41 after going up that way? I hope not to 241 still.... Like I said out of sight, out of mind. I'm not that familiar with VCP East but based on you originally stating it should skip straight to the I assume theres no need for bus stops on that road?

2. The intersection at GH/Bainbridge is one of the most dangerous in the borough (http://www.norwoodnews.org/id=2777&story=assessing-the-bronxs-most-dangerous-road/) and has nothing to do with Montefiore. Norwood isn't going to go for another route clogging the intersection turning. Cutting off the Bx16 from the 4, marring connectivity and putting it in traffic for the sake of "keeping Woodlawn safe"... Yikes. 3. Save your sass for a friend, which I'm not and just admit you misinterpreted what I said regarding the Bxm4. The times they lost service were in the Peak not late evenings. What is ridiculous about a community having input on when a run needs to be added if they are requesting the service? There should be article denoting this request similar to the ones you provide for Riverdale... 4. Still technically a bus to/from Manhattan every 15 mins so its more service than Co-op has... Also flexibility with regards to the 1/2 really depends on a riders age and ultimate destination (especially with them on the UES both way n/o 79) . I think 7am is too early for 20 min Bxm7 headways but 12 is too late to start considering it switches to 30 mins after 2pm.... 10am would be a solid middle ground... 5. Let me be clear I'm discussing the weekday Bxm11 but I knew you were going to say this...You have stop by stop ridership to back that up? You say that they would have asked for a Bxm10 extension.... how do you know they didn't and there isn't "any physical proof" as you claimed for Woodlawn? 6. Perhaps I wasn't clear... I was saying the B/O used Sedgwick the entire way (as in 138-Exterior-Sedgwick).. The biggest lifesaver in days of yore was via 7av-155-HRD... haven't seen that used in a while. General remarks: As for affording the express bus, I think that logic will doom routes (Bxm3/4/6, BM1-5, QM21 etc). I'll reiterate that I don't think it should be more than 200% base fare... The Bxm2 routing in Manhattan never really made much sense (you could leave the UWS from N/o of 79 but you couldn't get there without a crosstown) and the only thing worse than it following that routing was the fact that some Bxm18 runs used to go that way N/B (you had to x-fer at 99/Madison).... True but people still confuse it for the local somehow. I don't think I've ever seen an MTA poster that said take the Bxm1/2 to Wave Hill, the 3 to the Golf Course, 4 to Yankee Games, the 11 to the Zoo, QM5 to the Farm etc....

1. I don't recall "boasting" about my travels throughout the Bronx and I most certainly don't deny that statistically some areas of NYC generally have higher crimes rates than others. I just said there are neighborhoods people often deem safe that are actually more dangerous than the neighborhoods with deplorable reputations. Thus, I don't fear the concept of walking through any neighborhood in this city... You are correct in your assessment that I am and will always be a proud Bronxite regardless of where I reside. Correspondingly I will always find it highly disrespectful to hear non-natives speak badly about some neighborhoods while playing up others. Every neighborhood has its charms and there are also members of this forum who reside in these communities... 2. MTA was most certainly referring to Lex Service in Manhattan as it'd be highly implausible to connect Bx16 riders with the .... if you bothered to look at the link you would see it discussed terminal delays which would be a Bronx issue and that affects the Bx16 a great deal as every station it connects to is a terminal.... That being said Second worst is better than the worst so once again why shaft Bx16 riders and force them to have Dyre or a 2 seat ride at Nereid only? Also the last thing Norwood needs (doubt they'd even allow it) is another route on Gun Hill making that turn on/off of Bainbridge. 3. If that article you linked is your evidence of Woodlawn asking for more service then it took them a decade which means they are piss poor at advocating for themselves. I'm not sure if you noticed...hell you clearly didn't otherwise you wouldn't have said: "You keep talking about how service existed until 23:15, but it was cut back to 22:45, which by the way is the same time it stops running to Woodlawn on Saturdays."... My remark was: "The 11:15 was the last run to Woodlawn for decades and they didn't say a thing. They got the 11:45 run when the Bxm4 was made because MTA chose to run it on the old BxM4A headways after the 745 run. Then they cut the 745 run so the hourly service began after the 715 run. If they put the last bus back at 11:15, it would have been a service cut. " You can use a 12-hour or 24-hour format and it still won't change the fact that you misread my post. I never mentioned anything about a service cut back to a 10:45 run and my argument is still valid. Your "by the way" is completely unnecessary as I linked you the schedules going back 6 years meaning I'm aware of the service hours all week. If they asked for that run, I want physical proof not "inside knowledge". As for ridership picking up... doubt it. Its not really worth the 6 bucks for Concourse riders (Norwood maybe) and Woodlawn can't support a standalone service without them. 4. Bad comparison, technically Riverdale has 15 minute headways to Manhattan so that's 4 buses an hour... There's nothing wrong with 30 minute headways but you still can't tell me what times so... round and round we go 5. If residents in Baychester and points north couldn't afford the express bus, the Bxm11 wouldn't be carrying as well as it does so try again. that latter remark is simply disrespectful and a stereotype to boot.... 6. I apologize for this one... I should have denoted that I was asking everyone more or less about the flexibility of express segment detours. In general I don't feel like MTA does a decent job at promoting Express bus service/making it attractive. A roundtrip MN/LIRR CityTicket on the weekend is 4 bucks cheaper than the express bus round trip....

1. How reliable is this site? It doesn't look like its officially complied by anyone reputable and I ask because the boundaries include part of Norwood (which is 52nd) in the Woodlawn map and combine Wakefield with Williamsbridge but split Edenwald in half. The Eastchester portion of the precinct isn't included either... Whether or not Woodlawn is the saving grace, collectively 47th is better than a lot of places that people deem safe. I don't want to continue our safety discussions, I just wanted to see you support your viewpoints with facts. give it a rest with being certain it was outsiders... 2. You do know the 5 is the worst IRT line in terms of lateness and the thru service to Nereid is spotty. Like you'll be lucky if two runs make it all the way up the line in service. Check this out http://jalopnik.com/you-are-not-insane-the-new-york-city-subway-is-getting-1687817007 so bx16 to Woodlawn> Bx16 to Nereid for a potential 2 seat ride and def better than going to Dyre from Wakefield... 3. Dinowitz represents riders on every YON route and this information is a decade old so once again the last Woodlawn run at that point (05) was the longstanding 11:15.... Also this article is in regards to the fact that LLE gave the North Bronx better service than MTA Bus ever has or will (not Woodlawn needing another run) so thank you for supporting my argument. I know you weren't a resident of the Bronx at the time, but we (NW Bronx express riders) became the crash test dummies for MTA Bus. Ask one of the long time riders on your Bxm1/2/18 runs and I promise you they'll say the same thing. MTA rationalized using the 92-93xxs from UP/JAM/QV and 1xx from CAS/CS until the 3xxxs arrived because only 10 of the Classics were ADA compliant only to find they were less reliable than the latter. I sat in the rear stairwell of an RTS twice that first week alone on the way to school because the service became nonexistent. Went from having 10 min AM rush headways to 3 dropped runs in a row, 2 buses showing up at the same time when the route was on 30 min headways etc. during the dead of winter. This went on a daily basis for the first full year, essentially killing reliability which in turn ruined ridership. NYBS passengers got it rough as well but by the time they got around to absorbing QS things were a bit more stable ... 10 years later and they still drop runs/change service without adequately informing Bxm passengers. going back to the Bxm4 compare these: http://www.umassk12.net/science50/buses.pdf 2009 http://webserver.mta.info/busco/schedules/bxm4nxt.pdf 2010 http://web.mta.info/busco/schedules/bxm4cur.pdf Now I'm going to scan my old Bxm4A/B schedule when I find it but It would have been a service cut of 30 mins, they had no choice but to add a 12:15 4. I'm probably being anal but how are you determining what % increase/decrease is statistical significant enough to warrant more runs/cut runs respectively? if all routes are being held to the same standard and a general decrease in ridership of -8.2% is a significant enough loss to warrant cuts then we have to cut runs on the BM1-4, BxM4 and BxM6 as well. I'm going to check out those 7 runs this Saturday to see how ridership goes. I also think the express bus fare shouldn't be more than 200% the base fare.... 5. You skipped my remarks on the BxM10 6. Sigh thank you for telling me what I know as a lifelong YON rider.... For the third time this is why I'm asking for an official reroute on paper.... I agree, Bx16 riders won't approve of it being on Webster the whole way and the last time I used it, it hit every light on 233. I can't see what the problem would be running it VCE/McLean closed door when technically it does stop in Mt Vernon. I definitely think MTA was trying to replace the 34 with 16 because we all know Woodlawn has no need for 3 routes. I'm still not completely convinced it would be the worst thing in the world....

1. All 3 communities compose the 47 Precinct which is used to determine crime rates on the Crime Map and 47th is safer than areas that have been gentrifying for the past decade (73,77,81....) hell its safer than Park Slope (78). So can you supply neighborhood by neighborhood crime rates to support your argument? I don't really care who you choose to engage with, I just want you to be aware of the fact that your posts tend to convey a tone of elitism which can be offensive. 2. You could have clearly stated as such from jump... The 16 run time would be longer for no reason, time saved running it on Webster would be lost the minute it got to the traffic on Gun Hill. There's no need for 4 routes on GH and you make the assumption that people don't need to get to stops only which would require going to 149 and coming back up. We know Woodlawn STA isn't in Woodlawn its name is based off the fact that Bainbridge used to be Woodlawn Rd.... What would be the point of it remaining on 233 but not stopping? So residents can complain about being bypassed? Out of sight, out of mind..... 3. The following quotes imply that they asked for better service: "Woodlawn is a perfect example of areas that while small have been very vocal about their express bus service." and "The service span has been expanded to 00:15 back to Woodlawn, and that isn't "just because" ... Can I get an article for proof? As I stated, The 11:15 was the last run to Woodlawn for decades and they didn't say a thing to Liberty Lines or MTA about not being satisfied with it. Liberty Lines gave them way more service than what they have now and they could/should have asked for a later run because it made no sense the 4A was the last run. They got the 11:45 run when the Bxm4 was made because MTA chose to run it on the old BxM4A headways after the 745 run. Then they cut the 745 run so the hourly service began after the 715 run. If they put the last bus back at 11:15, it would have been a service cut. I can link you the schedules from 09/10/14 I used in making my assessment refuting your sentiments if that helps. I don't remember the PM Katonah Express being that heavily used (it def wasn't getting Bxm1 Super Express ridership) and the real drawback was that they had to run a regular 4B right behind it or else the 2 stops on Bainbridge N/o of GH had a serious service gap. That route can't survive without the Concourse riders 4. Again a 8.2% drop isn't that significant... Bxm4 lost the same amount and thats nothing compared to the BMs. the service could have been every 10 mins at some point and you wouldn't know... but Im alright with 30 min headways if you can give me some actual times. What you see might not be the norm or what the average Bxm7 rider sees and deals with.... The real question is why has ridership been tanking? 5. Ehh beloved is a poor choice of wording, I've used the Bxm6 and 7 the least in life... I'm more familiar with the Bxm10 which is why I'm saying If the buses aren't full you know MTA isn't going to attempt to add more runs. Weekdays it's losing more ridership than the 7 and weekends no so of course more riders (still less last year). A route extension is more likely to get more riders and in turn more runs than just adding more runs and expecting people to come. 6. Right I know some will deviate, my B/o on the Bxm3 used Sedgwick all the way the other night. ... I'm saying can MTA create an official reroute/ give all B/os the ability to deviate if need be... LLE had at least 4 backup reroutes.

The fact that you only feel comfortable enough to engage in conversation with someone in Woodlawn vs. Wakefield or Eastchester, is your own personal insecurity, don't force us to deal with that. Also stating that a bus route will ruin a community is Robert Moses logic at it finest and that line of thought has never helped urban inhabitants prosper. Overall, the classist and racist implications in your posts lead me to believe you're just mad that a predominately minority community has the best express service in the city. Do you read these posts throughly before commenting or look for keywords and go from there? It has to be the latter or else you wouldn't have agreed with B35 saying the Bx16 should skip Woodlawn (he mapped it via Van Cortlandt Park E & McLean) just to say you're now against it running on McLean in general. As for the Bxm4, I don't recall them specifically asking for this... The 11:15 was the last run to Woodlawn for decades and they didn't say a thing. They got the 11:45 run when the Bxm4 was made because MTA chose to run it on the old BxM4A headways after the 745 run. Then they cut the 745 run so the hourly service began after the 715 run. If they put the last bus back at 11:15, it would have been a service cut. I answer all of your questions with detailed explanations and you largely ignore them. You rarely answer mine (ex. has the Bxm7 service remained the same over the last 5 years?) and for that reason I'm not going to repeat why I don't agree with giving MTA the go ahead to cut service on the most used route. Just re-read my previous posts .... You want more Bxm10 runs, you need more riders....extend it north to 233. The fact that theres no express bus over there is insane. can MTA give YON B/os the ability to make detours when the Deegan/Harlem River are a mess? I know it's not as bad as the QM crawl down Queens Bl but always having to sit in traffic doesn't encourage people to take the bus. Granted the weather was horrible last night but a 3 hour commute exacerbated by a missing run is crazy.

When I suggested the Bx16 replacing the 34 that implied it running via Katonah however we moved past that. You highly doubt you could speak with someone there because you wouldn't dare attempt it. Providing 30 min headways that early in the AM would be comparable to the Bxm7 headways... the issue is that the BxM10 ridership was down last year so are those buses crowded or full? if crowded, fine if full Maybe 45 minute headways. Does the BxM7 have the exact same service levels as it did in 2008? The 16/34 revamp sounds good and the schedule says the Bx16 ends in Eastchester, but the map and sign say in Pelham. Most of the designation signs need to be updated but I have no idea who is responsible for maintaining that database.

We both know no one wants to deal with the hassle of a shuttle bus + 2 trains to get to the East Side. The demographic using the Bxm10 is irrelevant, what matters is that its well short of the Bxm7s ridership to warrant comparable service. As for the 34: you said "not to mention that the Bx34 is much safer since it goes directly from the subway to Woodlawn" which we've determined is false as the 16/34 share the same route. Just be blunt and say you feel Wakefield/Eastchester are more dangerous than Woodlawn so we can move on with the proposals...

Overcrowding has never been a part of my experience involving the Bx16 however I stated I don't use it often so I'm willing to back down from that one. Nonetheless if overcrowding is problem on the Bx16, they still might want to look into adding more runs given its a standalone route. I actually agree with you and B35 regarding the Bx16 skipping over Woodlawn and that it would be for the best (only if the 31 remains). That doesn't negate you trying to say the Bx34 is safer than the Bx16 and that they follow different routes from the train.... I'm unsure of how much Co-op service has really increased post-10 cuts....Maybe someone else can help. I mean the Bx25 runs just went back to being Bx26s, the Norwood 28 runs became 38s, the 29/30 haven't changed and they split the QBx1. Apart from them boosting Bx23 service but I can't think of any major headway changes that have occurred with those other routes. You keep saying Co-op City has too much service but its the only plausible terminal when Pelham Bay can't effectively turn any more routes/ involves using 95 from the North and the Bx16 has Eastchester covered... Honestly, Co-op and Riverdale are tied for loudest but Throggs Neck will absolutely speak up if need be, again the 2010 cuts showcased this. Country Club screwed them by letting the Bx14 get canned (honestly think they didn't like that it ended in Parkchester) and then complaining about a lack of service which in turn caused the Bx8 to be sent that way. CC complained about the frequency of service and CNGS but the real problem which TN voiced was that they ended up with a longer indirect ride to the @ PBP and couldn't get to shopping along Crosby. MTA would have left it alone if not for them chiming in. The 40/42 need some changes but not on the TN side. I have a close friend who takes the Bxm9 every day and she's never complained about the service levels. Although that might have something to do with the fact that I'm always complaining about the Bxm3 being inconsistent... Weekend Express bus ridership decreasing on all but 2 Bxm routes isn't some its most. However, I do agree with your statement that "ridership on some Bronx routes may have only decreased slightly". Which leads me to state that I don't find an 8.2% decrease in ridership alarming enough to cut Bxm7 service down to 30 mins all day. At some times sure but when is the question. I'm always leery about advocating to cut express bus service when the MTA has been doing it bit by for the last decade. The Bxm10 has more weekend ridership than the Bxm9 but I think that has a lot to do with the fact that the rarely runs south of E 180. Both routes are still about 1000 riders away from competing with the Bxm7....

I think Allerton passengers benefitted from the fact that they had a chance of a less crowded bus on the Bx25 but LTD service might have been tricky because of the headways. Prior to the creation of the Bx38, the Bx16 was probably the most straightforward Norwood route. It's odd... on paper the stint around Mundy La looks like it would be the most indirect part of the route but it's really the Woodlawn section. I understand where you're going with the ridership statement and was actually thinking the same thing regarding the 16 nonstop McLean/Webster to Katonah/242 if it replaced the Bx34. I think the only issue with a non-stop service would be Woodlawn throwing a fit about not having a bus to go east along 233 after having the Bx31 for a few years. Looping it down Vireo instead of Bronx Bl would probably sate them. The 30 going west of Norwood would take people off the Bx10 but the problem is that Sedgwick N/o of Ft Independence already has more than enough service and the Bx2 layover is technically the Bx3 stop so you couldn't fit all 3 routes.