The IRT TOMC is incomplete

[R36 Preservation]

Of the cars of the IRT SMEE museum fleet, it still lacks a few color scheme and car classes. There are no cars currently with the late 1950s hunter green (used on R21/22 and R26/28 when delivered) or the 1982-1988 all white scheme. NYCT has done well in bringing these R33s back into these historic colors.

 

Perhaps one R33 pair could be given the 1982-88 all white paint. There isn't a R21/22 or R26/28 in the SMEE collection, but perhaps one of the Unionport R26/28 pairs could be repainted in Hunter Green. These could be worthy of being in the collection, as being both the first "married pairs" and the last passengers cars built by ACF in 1959. Finding a R21/22 would be more difficult, since most were converted to work service and modified and many later scrapped.

[DJ MC]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[DJ MC]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[R36 Preservation]

No Steinways (except for World's Fair #5655) were preserved either.

[DJ MC]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[SubwayGuy]

7371 is at Seashore Trolley Museum.

6688 is at Shore Line Trolley Museum.

 

The preservation effort did not start in earnest until the 1960s. Anything retired before the 1960s was not saved. The real shame is that no Composites were saved.

 

Two Hi-V's were saved - a Deck Roof #3662 at Shore Line Trolley Museum, and a Gibbs Hi-V #3352 at Seashore Trolley Museum. None of the Standard (Hedley) Hi-V cars were saved.

 

Here's the complete list of what was NOT saved (these are production cars, this list does not include test trains or prototypes) and no longer exists:

-Manhattan El MUDC

-IRT Composite

-Hedley Hi-V

-Flivver

-Steinway (non WF) Lo-V

-C Type Brooklyn El car

-BMT Multi Sections

-BMT Bluebird

-Pullman R6

-An R7A as delivered

 

Hi-Vs, if they had been preserved, would have presented a problem. Because of their high voltage propulsion control, Hi-Vs energize dead sections of third rail when the cars bridge the gap between the energized and dead sections. This can create a tremendous safety hazard because the power is off for a reason (ie work gangs in the area). In the old days, purple signals used to indicate a power off section so the Hi-V would stop before bridging the gap. That's also why there was such a rush to get rid of the Hi-Vs in the 50s with the arriving SMEE orders, so that this condition would not have to be considered.

 

As far as the museum fleet goes, it's more important that existing unrestored cars get restoration before worrying about what color to paint things. If it comes up cars can be painted to all be different later, but for now it's most important to finish restoring R1 103, the World's Fair car, and the old BMT equipment.

[INDman]

Why spend money to paint trains that hve not been used in a while? Any money there is for museum cars will be spent on things worth doing like maintaining the Arnines, restoring car 103, the WF Low-V, and older BMT cars. The TOMC deadbirds that were repainted were done as a temporary thing for MOD trips. The R12/15/17/WF car are a different story.

[R1103]

Car 1208 of the Pullman R-6 fleet was saved, but was scraped apparently, since their fleet was 'too big'.

 

As for R21-22's, the 3 we have are work cars. We've never re-converted a work car into its former looks, and I doubt NYCTM would care to do so until 103, and the other top-of-the-list things are done.

 

I would say one of those Gel Train cars (r28/29), because another 33' pair could substitude, and they won't last for long in the work train business, so restoration could work. They only have one of each pair left now (not counting the R-28 at IRM), and it would put something new in for a change.

[R36 Preservation]

I would say one of those Gel Train cars (r28/29), because another 33' pair could substitude, and they won't last for long in the work train business, so restoration could work. They only have one of each pair left now (not counting the R-28 at IRM), and it would put something new in for a change.

One of the two R26/28 pairs should be redone in hunter green as delivered. The R28 set still has the original sash windows on 7925.

 

One pair in 1982-1988 all white paint may actually not be very interesting to many.

[SubwayGuy]

Car 1208 of the Pullman R-6 fleet was saved, but was scraped apparently, since their fleet was 'too big'.

 

That wasn't the full reason, but it was a damn shame otherwise there would be ten arnines

[Roadcruiser1]

Actually a future car if it can be restored can run with the Train of Many Colors. It's number is 5782, and it's stored at the 207 Street Yard. Also 9542, and 9543 exists. If one of them could be decoupled or if they could all be attached together then you would have a full 10-11 car IRT train.

 

Here is proof:

 

Car 5782

 

Car 9542, and 9543

[DJ MC]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[DJ MC]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Roadcruiser1]

Not being sarcastic do you think there might be more survivors tucked away somewhere. Or are these four cars 5871, 5782, 9542, and 9543 just it. Also this would mean that two out of the four cars available would be the lucky 2 that runs in the TOMC. Though the best solution is to put 5781, and 5782 onto the TOMC, because 9542, and 9543 is in the museum for display.

[SubwayGuy]

And seven BMT Standards. Why it was scrapped has been a mystery to me for a while. I heard it was taking up space or it was a GE car. One of several reasons I've heard as to why it was scrapped. The GE car thing I dismissed because 401 and 484 are R4s, which were all GE cars. Weren't there more Arnines that were preserved that were also scrapped in the early 1980s?

 

I'm not going to say anything here, but I will say this. Everyone that has commented on it has been overthinking it. It had to do with people involved is what I will say, but that's it. Needless to say a lot of people then as now were pissed off (and rightly so) that the car was scrapped, especially considering it was one of the ones in the best condition of the arnine fleet at the time of its scrapping.

 

That's all you're going to get out of me...

[DJ MC]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[SubwayGuy]

Would it have been possible to convert the Hi-Vs to Lo-Vs in any way?

 

Anything is possible, but doing that would have defeated the purpose of preserving the car.

 

The IRT Composites were equipped with high voltage propulsion control also. When they were transferred to the IRT's elevated division beginning in 1916, they were refitted with low voltage propulsion control as well as lighter "el car type" trucks and motors. They were basically wooden Lo-V's until they retired. So it can be done.

 

But in the case of a steel Hi-V, that would defeat the purpose of preserving the car. Doing that would be like restoring a deteriorated BU el car with stainless steel siding.

[Roadcruiser1]

So guys do you think it might be possible for the to restore the R14 cars 5871, and 5782 to working order, and attach it to the Train of Many Colors.

[INDman]

So guys do you think it might be possible for the to restore the R14 cars 5871, and 5782 to working order, and attach it to the Train of Many Colors.

 

.

 

Nope, I think they should be scrapped and the parts used on other cars that are not in such bad shape.

[Roadcruiser1]

They are R14's. The last two sole surviving R14's. If we let them go the R14's would be gone forever. So they can't hastily decide their fate. Besides I have read up that they have plans for 5871. The plan is to take it to the NYC Transit Museum. The fate for 5782 is undecided.

[INDman]

They are R14's. The last two sole surviving R14's. If we let them go the R14's would be gone forever. So they can't hastily decide their fate. Besides I have read up that they have plans for 5871. The plan is to take it to the NYC Transit Museum. The fate for 5782 is undecided.

 

And that would be so bad? They are the exact same as the R12s.

[Roadcruiser1]

Wait a minute. I just got more information. Car 5782 isn't an R14. It's one of the two surviving R12's, and 5871 is the sole surviving never reconfigured passenger R14.

[R1103]

I'm not going to say anything here, but I will say this. Everyone that has commented on it has been overthinking it. It had to do with people involved is what I will say, but that's it. Needless to say a lot of people then as now were pissed off (and rightly so) that the car was scrapped, especially considering it was one of the ones in the best condition of the arnine fleet at the time of its scrapping.

 

That's all you're going to get out of me...

 

Shrug :confused:, oh well, but thanks for the info.

[Joe C]

Not being sarcastic do you think there might be more survivors tucked away somewhere. Or are these four cars 5871, 5782, 9542, and 9543 just it. Also this would mean that two out of the four cars available would be the lucky 2 that runs in the TOMC. Though the best solution is to put 5781, and 5782 onto the TOMC, because 9542, and 9543 is in the museum for display.

 

9542 and 9543 are not on display,i think there in the tunnels that lead to the TM.

[DJ MC]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters